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  #5441  
Old Posted Mar 30, 2014, 7:48 PM
osmo osmo is offline
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Originally Posted by blueandgoldguy View Post
Not true. Montreal, Toronto and now Ottawa (a relatively small city by NHL standards) receive the largest local or regional tv monies, even more than the New York teams. Ottawa, for example, signed a recent tv deal that will pay them over $30 million per year. Some of the regional tv deals in the US cities that don't care about hockey are pretty small as well. For example, Phoenix, a city of 4 million, gets a measly $5 million per season for regional rights.

The new Canadian TV package with Rogers will see the Canadian teams get a disproportionately larger amount than the American teams. 65% for the American teams and 35% for the Canadian teams.

While Winnipeg will continue to rely heavily on the gate, the larger national tv contract plus a new local tv contract in a few years should reduce that.
Ottawa is a anomaly. TSN grossly overpaid for the regional rights as there is little logic to how Ottawa, which has one of the "smallest" media market shares in Canada gets double the amount they are receiving from Rogers from the national rights (around 12-13 million per year). TSN was desperate, and the Senators held them for ransom.

The Senators have always struggled being sandwiched in between Montreal and Toronto media markets, and they can't compare to the scope that cities such as Vancouver, Montreal, Toronto get in regards to media size share. The current price they received has little reflection as nobody can rationalize that the Ottawa Senators regional media is more valuable then the Montreal Canadians, but currently the price says that its equal to them which is far from the case.
     
     
  #5442  
Old Posted Mar 30, 2014, 8:12 PM
Danny D Oh Danny D Oh is offline
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Originally Posted by king10 View Post
genuinely curious. did they work saturdays and sundays and double daily shifts at IGF. thats currently occurring at THF. if you look at the webcam today (sunday) there are workers on site.

They're really serious about opening this thing on time. I can see it opening partially finished but still operable by the first scheduled game. I can see all amenities and it being 100% operable by labour day
Yes they did.

The two big problems in terms of timelines with IGF was that the Bombers made a bunch of changes when they took over the plans from Creswin (which wasn't necessarily a bad thing as the original design was not functional for a 2010s football facility) and the steel arches/roof.

If we had the winter we've had in 13-14 in 12-13, the Bombers would not have played a game in the new facility in 2013, that's how tight it was even being a year late.

Looking at where Hamilton is, hard to see it being ready before Labour Day. Basically a benchmark for the Bombers was if they couldn't get the field in before the ground froze in 2012, they wouldn't be able to start the season in IGF in 2013. It's a little different given the climates, but Hamilton doesn't look close to getting the field in, along with a lot of structural work left. At this point last year, the finishing touches were being done on IGF and they just barely managed to get a conditional occupancy permit for the pre-season game on June 12.
     
     
  #5443  
Old Posted Mar 30, 2014, 8:18 PM
Danny D Oh Danny D Oh is offline
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Originally Posted by osmo View Post
Ottawa is a anomaly. TSN grossly overpaid for the regional rights as there is little logic to how Ottawa, which has one of the "smallest" media market shares in Canada gets double the amount they are receiving from Rogers from the national rights (around 12-13 million per year). TSN was desperate, and the Senators held them for ransom.

The Senators have always struggled being sandwiched in between Montreal and Toronto media markets, and they can't compare to the scope that cities such as Vancouver, Montreal, Toronto get in regards to media size share. The current price they received has little reflection as nobody can rationalize that the Ottawa Senators regional media is more valuable then the Montreal Canadians, but currently the price says that its equal to them which is far from the case.
Just curious, did you look into what the Habs get for regional rights?

From what I understand, they are getting in the range of $90 million a season just for regional rights ($68 million from RDS, $20ish million from TSN for English rights).

They can pay all their players and coaches and still have a bit left over with that. Looking at the regional TV deals that MLB teams have signed recently, paying under $500,000 per game for regional rights isn't that crazy.

The Jets made the mistake of signing a 10 year media rights deal with TSN in 2011, so they'll be getting significantly less than all other Canadian markets.
     
     
  #5444  
Old Posted Mar 30, 2014, 8:40 PM
king10 king10 is offline
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Originally Posted by Danny D Oh View Post
Yes they did.

The two big problems in terms of timelines with IGF was that the Bombers made a bunch of changes when they took over the plans from Creswin (which wasn't necessarily a bad thing as the original design was not functional for a 2010s football facility) and the steel arches/roof.

If we had the winter we've had in 13-14 in 12-13, the Bombers would not have played a game in the new facility in 2013, that's how tight it was even being a year late.

Looking at where Hamilton is, hard to see it being ready before Labour Day. Basically a benchmark for the Bombers was if they couldn't get the field in before the ground froze in 2012, they wouldn't be able to start the season in IGF in 2013. It's a little different given the climates, but Hamilton doesn't look close to getting the field in, along with a lot of structural work left. At this point last year, the finishing touches were being done on IGF and they just barely managed to get a conditional occupancy permit for the pre-season game on June 12.
not sure why the field would have to be laid before the winter? as elly already alluded to, it takes 27 days to prep the ground and another 27 days to lay the field (referenced from field turf itself). heck my former high school just spent $1.5 million and had a new field turf field laid in less than a month. given field turfs conservative time estimates, field construction wouldn't have to begin until mid may. those are the cold hard numbers from the installer themselves, not an arbitrarily benchmark to Winnipeg which is a completely different project that should not even be used for comparison

also by your winnipeg "benchmark" ottawa will also not be ready by labour day because the field has not yet been laid and much structural work is left to do on the new build side..... or are you using different arbitrary "benchmarks" for ottawa
     
     
  #5445  
Old Posted Mar 30, 2014, 8:57 PM
blueandgoldguy blueandgoldguy is offline
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Originally Posted by osmo View Post
Ottawa is a anomaly. TSN grossly overpaid for the regional rights as there is little logic to how Ottawa, which has one of the "smallest" media market shares in Canada gets double the amount they are receiving from Rogers from the national rights (around 12-13 million per year). TSN was desperate, and the Senators held them for ransom.

The Senators have always struggled being sandwiched in between Montreal and Toronto media markets, and they can't compare to the scope that cities such as Vancouver, Montreal, Toronto get in regards to media size share. The current price they received has little reflection as nobody can rationalize that the Ottawa Senators regional media is more valuable then the Montreal Canadians, but currently the price says that its equal to them which is far from the case.
MY point still stands. Those Canadian teams still receive more tv money from the regional deals than the American ones which was your claim all along.
     
     
  #5446  
Old Posted Mar 30, 2014, 9:11 PM
Danny D Oh Danny D Oh is offline
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not sure why the field would have to be laid before the winter? as elly already alluded to, it takes 27 days to prep the ground and another 27 days to lay the field (referenced from field turf itself). heck my former high school just spent $1.5 million and had a new field turf field laid in less than a month. given field turfs conservative time estimates, field construction wouldn't have to begin until mid may. those are the cold hard numbers from the installer themselves, not an arbitrarily benchmark to Winnipeg which is a completely different project that should not even be used for comparison

also by your winnipeg "benchmark" ottawa will also not be ready by labour day because the field has not yet been laid and much structural work is left to do on the new build side..... or are you using different arbitrary "benchmarks" for ottawa
Because the ground is frozen here often well into April, this year likely into May. I assume they have all the excavating done that they will need to have done to install the field in Hamilton and Ottawa (if they don't they are screwed). We're about 3 months away from those fields needing to be fully installed and playable if they are going to start the season there. It takes a minimum 2 months just to install. The Bombers ended up having to pay for a little extra work done because there were problems with drainage early in training camp. If everything is currently prepped and planned 100% perfect, nothing interferes and no changes are necessary, the timelines for June/July could fit.

I was part of a fieldturf installation here at my football club, we previously had field hockey turf installed in 1998 and switched to a synthetic turf in 2009-2010. We did it similar to the Bombers with a late fall install and continued prep in the spring. Those field turf timelines are accurate in terms of having the field in, but to have it at playing quality for professional football, you're looking at another month of grooming and preparation.
     
     
  #5447  
Old Posted Mar 30, 2014, 9:22 PM
blueandgoldguy blueandgoldguy is offline
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Originally Posted by Danny D Oh View Post
Just curious, did you look into what the Habs get for regional rights?

From what I understand, they are getting in the range of $90 million a season just for regional rights ($68 million from RDS, $20ish million from TSN for English rights).

They can pay all their players and coaches and still have a bit left over with that. Looking at the regional TV deals that MLB teams have signed recently, paying under $500,000 per game for regional rights isn't that crazy.

The Jets made the mistake of signing a 10 year media rights deal with TSN in 2011, so they'll be getting significantly less than all other Canadian markets.
I forgot the Jets deal was that long. Too bad but in 7 years they should be able to sign for a substantial upgrade with either TSN or Sportsnet. Cable providers know people are pulling the plug on cable with all the new media choices available like Netflix for example. That's why there has been a recent spike with the TV money involved in signing pro sports teams to contracts with the regional broadcasters. For many TV viewers, sports are the primary reason not to cut the cable and the broadcasters realize this. Look at some of the regional tv deals signed recently - LA Dodgers receive $150 million per year, LA Angels receive $150 million per year, as mentioned above the the Habs receive in the neighbourhood of $90 million per year, Texas Rangers receive $80 million per year...these are just some of the recent ones. When the local tv contracts are up for the smaller markets, moreso Canadian NHL markets then American NHL markets, expect to see huge increases as well. Not as big as the larger cities of course, but probably in the range of what the Ottawa Senators received. That is the new standard.
     
     
  #5448  
Old Posted Mar 30, 2014, 10:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Danny D Oh View Post
Because the ground is frozen here often well into April, this year likely into May. I assume they have all the excavating done that they will need to have done to install the field in Hamilton and Ottawa (if they don't they are screwed). We're about 3 months away from those fields needing to be fully installed and playable if they are going to start the season there. It takes a minimum 2 months just to install. The Bombers ended up having to pay for a little extra work done because there were problems with drainage early in training camp. If everything is currently prepped and planned 100% perfect, nothing interferes and no changes are necessary, the timelines for June/July could fit.

I was part of a fieldturf installation here at my football club, we previously had field hockey turf installed in 1998 and switched to a synthetic turf in 2009-2010. We did it similar to the Bombers with a late fall install and continued prep in the spring. Those field turf timelines are accurate in terms of having the field in, but to have it at playing quality for professional football, you're looking at another month of grooming and preparation.
How deep do they have to excavate to install a field? I don't believe they've done that at THF yet, but I can't recall everything that was done last spring and summer. They may have done some work on the drainage system when they were putting in the foundations of the stands - I seem to remember mention that it was an advantage that the site had servicing in place, though I imagine they would have had to replace some older pipes and install new ones on the south half of the site where the small soccer stadium used to be.

Perhaps that is the biggest risk causing the potential 6-week delay. They seem to be moving along fast on the structure.
     
     
  #5449  
Old Posted Mar 30, 2014, 11:18 PM
Danny D Oh Danny D Oh is offline
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Originally Posted by ScreamingViking View Post
How deep do they have to excavate to install a field? I don't believe they've done that at THF yet, but I can't recall everything that was done last spring and summer. They may have done some work on the drainage system when they were putting in the foundations of the stands - I seem to remember mention that it was an advantage that the site had servicing in place, though I imagine they would have had to replace some older pipes and install new ones on the south half of the site where the small soccer stadium used to be.

Perhaps that is the biggest risk causing the potential 6-week delay. They seem to be moving along fast on the structure.
Really depends on the plan for drainage and other specifics to the site as far as I know.

For the Bombers, the field is sunk about 10 feet below grade, so there was a large excavation on the site in general. It was dug up by the time they started constructing the bowl so there wasn't much left to do when they started on the field.

For my club, we already had drainage setup and a concrete base so we just had to rip out the old turf and make some slight adjustments to the drainage for the fieldturf. I was on the board at that point, so I heard all the reports, but I'm not an engineer so I was doing this through a lot of it.
     
     
  #5450  
Old Posted Mar 31, 2014, 12:16 AM
elly63 elly63 is offline
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also by your winnipeg "benchmark" ottawa will also not be ready by labour day because the field has not yet been laid and much structural work is left to do on the new build side..... or are you using different arbitrary "benchmarks" for ottawa
Yes, people seem to be. Hamilton gets shat upon for some unknown reason and Ottawa gets a free ride.
     
     
  #5451  
Old Posted Mar 31, 2014, 1:11 AM
king10 king10 is offline
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Originally Posted by Danny D Oh View Post
Because the ground is frozen here often well into April, this year likely into May. I assume they have all the excavating done that they will need to have done to install the field in Hamilton and Ottawa (if they don't they are screwed). We're about 3 months away from those fields needing to be fully installed and playable if they are going to start the season there. It takes a minimum 2 months just to install. The Bombers ended up having to pay for a little extra work done because there were problems with drainage early in training camp. If everything is currently prepped and planned 100% perfect, nothing interferes and no changes are necessary, the timelines for June/July could fit.

I was part of a fieldturf installation here at my football club, we previously had field hockey turf installed in 1998 and switched to a synthetic turf in 2009-2010. We did it similar to the Bombers with a late fall install and continued prep in the spring. Those field turf timelines are accurate in terms of having the field in, but to have it at playing quality for professional football, you're looking at another month of grooming and preparation.
so by your own admission you admit that both projects are completely different as the ground is still frozen well into April in Winnipeg while not in hamilton, yet you still chose to pass judgement on Hamilton's field completion based on Winnipeg as a "benchmark" and past example...

also if Hamilton's field won't be completed in time Ottawa's most definitely won't be seeing as their first game is a week or so before Hamilton's
     
     
  #5452  
Old Posted Mar 31, 2014, 1:42 AM
elly63 elly63 is offline
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In the Hamilton update video, the first sentence almost, the site super says the turf area will start up in the next few weeks.
     
     
  #5453  
Old Posted Mar 31, 2014, 2:42 AM
Danny D Oh Danny D Oh is offline
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so by your own admission you admit that both projects are completely different as the ground is still frozen well into April in Winnipeg while not in hamilton, yet you still chose to pass judgement on Hamilton's field completion based on Winnipeg as a "benchmark" and past example...

also if Hamilton's field won't be completed in time Ottawa's most definitely won't be seeing as their first game is a week or so before Hamilton's
Whatever, you have an agenda, we get it. I mentioned Ottawa being in the same position in my second post, but the discussion here is based on the pictures just released in Hamilton.

It's less than 4 months to the first game. There is still equipment on the field area working on the structure of the stadium. You can't start working on the field until that work is completed. It takes 3 months to construct, install and prepare a synthetic field for professional football with infill. The timelines are extremely narrow. That's all. Any setbacks or necessary redesigns at this point and it won't be ready.

At least you'll have a functional football stadium and not a football stadium built for postcard pictures like the one we got in Winnipeg.
     
     
  #5454  
Old Posted Mar 31, 2014, 2:49 AM
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THF should really have been a 20-22 month project. But the Cats were insistent on the compressed schedule
     
     
  #5455  
Old Posted Mar 31, 2014, 3:03 AM
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The Cats definitely picked their own poison.

I'll be ecstatic if it's all ready for the first game, but quite fine if it's not but they're able to play in a "functionally complete" stadium. We made do with very little in Guelph last year, and it worked.
     
     
  #5456  
Old Posted Mar 31, 2014, 6:27 AM
elly63 elly63 is offline
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Seeing as people want to compare Winnipeg with Hamilton here's a re-post from seven months ago.

Lessons for Hamilton from Winnipeg’s new stadium
Drew Edwards thespec.com Aug 30, 2013

WINNIPEG - The most impressive element of the new Investors Group Field in Winnipeg is unquestionably the massive roof, its two sections of ornately-designed, curved steel covering almost eight acres and stretching almost 200 feet over the seats below. It's swooping profile is the iconic image used in much of the branding.

But the roof also added approximately $35 million to the cost and was the central factor in a year-long delay in opening the facility.

The new Hamilton stadium, due to open in time for the 2014 CFL season next July, will have no such roof, one of several important differences between Tim Hortons Field and the Investors Group version in Winnipeg.

One is cost. Tim Hortons Field has a budget of $148 million, while IGF was budgeted at $200 million before the delay and additional, costs which are expected to push the final tally closer to a quarter of a billion dollars. Money in Winnipeg is undeniably tight: for example, the press box is still unfinished — it's currently situated outdoors — and will have to be enclosed before the Bombers can hold a Grey Cup.

In addition to the roof, the Winnipeg stadium also has close to 10,000 more seats than the 22,500 planned in Hamilton. That may sound like a good thing, but where those seats are located is key: while the Hamilton design emphasizes seating between the 20-yard lines, IGF has extensive end zone seating. The Bombers have yet to sell out a game this season — their winless home record likely isn't helping — but the vast majority of the empty seats have been located in the end zone, where visibility for CFL games is poorest.

One of the design features of the new Hamilton facility that has received the most attention is social areas located behind each zone, places where fans are expected to congregate and watch the game in an atmosphere that's been likened to a sports bar. Winnipeg has those areas as well — they were packed Aug. 24 against Ticats — but they are much further from the field, sitting behind row upon row of end zone seats.

There's also a major difference on how high end ticket buyers will experience the game. The club seats in Winnipeg — known as the Pinnacle Club — feature both a seating area and a communal gathering spot where fans can eat and socialize. But those two areas are separated by a concourse: there's no way to see the action unless seated. In Hamilton, that gathering spot has been designed to allow for a view of the field of play.

One of the possible explanations for the construction delay and some of the oversights in the Winnipeg facility is the relative inexperience in both the architect and the builder in constructing sports facilities. Both firms were required to be Manitoba-based by the terms set by the provincial government, the primary financial backer (more on that in a minute.)

The Hamilton stadium, meanwhile, is being built by an international consortium that includes by Cannon Design, which was involved in the B.C. Place renovation, the Richmond Olympic Oval and the new Landsdowne Park in Ottawa. The builder is Bouygues Construction, a huge multinational based in France. It has built everything from bridges to soccer stadiums, to the containment shelter for the nuclear reactors in Chernobyl.

The Ticats have also spent the better part of two years touring stadiums across North America in attempt to gather the best fan experiences and incorporate them into Tim Hortons Field. They've also hired a number of consultants to advise them, including Jim Cima, who has been heavily involved in the construction of pro stadiums and arenas in Philadelphia, New Jersey and Minnesota among several others.

There are also significant differences in how the stadiums will be financed. Investors Group Field was built with the help of a $22.5-million provincial grant, a $7.5-million city grant and what amount to $170 in provincial loans. The Bombers plan to use revenue from the football team to repay $95 million of that money, while property taxes from new developments at the former Canad Inns Stadium site are expected cover the balance.

That means the Bombers must prioritize their finances to pay for their new building on an ongoing basis, and hope that the developments at Canad Inns produce as expected (it's a series of big box stores.) Because the Bombers are community-owned with no deep-pocketed owner behind them, the responsibility will fall to the taxpayers should the team fail to meet their commitments.

In Hamilton, the financing is more clear. It is budgeted at $145.7 million with the city is contributing $54.3 million, the province $22.3 million and federal government paying the remaining $69.1 million.

The Ticats have committed to pay the city $1.2 million per year for 20 years in exchange for use of the stadium, including $450,000 in rent and $750,000 per season in exchange for naming rights as part of a memorandum of understanding signed in February 2011. A final agreement is still being worked on.

Last weekend, while the Ticats were busy beating the Bombers on the field, representatives from the football team and the city of Hamilton were touring the Winnipeg stadium and talking to their counterparts about the challenges they had encountered. Winnipeg has a magnificent new facility — with a spectacular roof — but Hamilton may still end up with something both more economically and more sporting for fans.
     
     
  #5457  
Old Posted Mar 31, 2014, 3:07 PM
Fatty McButterpants Fatty McButterpants is offline
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If anyone is looking for a classic case of cutting costs and cutting corners, check out the half-new-half-old-as-hell Ottawa stadium. It looks like something a child made out of mismatched legos. The one side was rebuilt from scratch, but only because it had to be. The other side is a horribly dated steel monstrosity with a single tier of seating. Boooooring.
     
     
  #5458  
Old Posted Mar 31, 2014, 3:48 PM
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If anyone is looking for a classic case of cutting costs and cutting corners, check out the half-new-half-old-as-hell Ottawa stadium. It looks like something a child made out of mismatched legos. The one side was rebuilt from scratch, but only because it had to be. The other side is a horribly dated steel monstrosity with a single tier of seating. Boooooring.
Get out your cheque book Fatty, how much can we put you down for?
     
     
  #5459  
Old Posted Mar 31, 2014, 4:25 PM
elly63 elly63 is offline
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Originally Posted by Fatty McButterpants View Post
If anyone is looking for a classic case of cutting costs and cutting corners, check out the half-new-half-old-as-hell Ottawa stadium. It looks like something a child made out of mismatched legos. The one side was rebuilt from scratch, but only because it had to be. The other side is a horribly dated steel monstrosity with a single tier of seating. Boooooring.
Always good to hear from skyscraper's uninformed whine community. Strange how I've always found people who claim things are boring tend to lack the imagination to see the beauty in anything, any howser, here's an opposing viewpoint.

Early stadium design wins kudos from panel
Don Butler The Ottawa Citizen May 1, 2010

If Rob Claiborne has his way, a sculpted “stadium in the park” will replace the rotting hulk of Frank Clair stadium by 2013.



Claiborne is the architect chosen to design the stadium as part of the redevelopment of Lansdowne Park. He works for Cannon Design, the firm behind the much-admired Olympic Oval in Richmond, B.C.

His conceptual design for the new Frank Clair stadium has already won kudos from experts on the review panel overseeing the design of the Lansdowne Park plan.

George Dark, the renowned urban designer who chairs the panel, calls Claiborne’s design “quite cool. There’s quite an imaginative stadium being cooked up here.”

Another panel member, Rick Haldenby, the head of the University of Waterloo’s architecture school, is even more effusive.

If Claiborne’s design is accepted by city council on June 23, Haldenby says, “it’s going to be an instant architectural feature in Canada — the most interesting stadium in Canada by far.”

Claiborne knows he’s got something special. He describes his design, which he’s been working on since December, as a “gift to the city of Ottawa. I’m just thrilled, because people seem to be enjoying it.”

Its most striking feature is a sinuous $7.5-million “veil” of glued laminated Alaskan yellow cedar that rises up from behind new southside stands and curls over the top, creating a flowing system of enclosure and roofing.



Claiborne uses the same veil motif at the entrances to the northside stands. It recurs as well behind the end zone scoreboard, creating a bandstand that could be used during outdoor concerts in Lansdowne Park’s proposed “front lawn” urban park.

“I always saw this project being done in wood,” Claiborne says, proudly showing off his plans in Cannon Design’s 12th floor offices overlooking University Avenue in Toronto.

In part it’s a reference to Ottawa’s lumber-town past, but it also fits Claiborne’s daring concept of a stadium in the park. To do that, he says, “you have to be much more natural.”

Claiborne chose Alaskan yellow cedar for the veil because it withstands the weather well.



“It will turn a beautiful silvery colour over time, but in all our conversations with the manufacturers, they’re quite comfortable that this will maintain its structural integrity.”

In Claiborne’s design, the southside stands seem to emerge organically from a steep grassy berm that rises seven metres from the Queen Elizabeth Driveway. “You can actually see the park bending up, merging into the stadium,” the architect says.

It’s all part of his concept of “laminar space, a space that literally flows. The parklands become sculpted, undulating, flowing. That became really important to me.”

The wooden frames of the veil are part of that idea of flow, he says. At the concourse level of the southside stands, the public can walk or ride bicycles right through the veil, even on game days.

“Typically a stadium’s going to have a very clear border, a buffer,” Claiborne says. “There’s a public side, and there’s a stadium side. Not the case here. It’s not just lip service about being in the park. It is in the park.”

Lansdowne Park, he says, has never really been a park. “It was a fairgrounds, it was a carnival site, it was a series of venues, but it was never actually parkland. Now, for the first time, it’s a park.”

To improve spectator sightlines and enhance the stadium’s bowl appearance, Claiborne proposes to lower the current playing field by about one metre. “That one’s still a cost issue,” he cautions, “because it’s expensive to lower the field.”

On a pragmatic level, lowering the field makes it easier to widen it to 75 yards, the standard for FIFA soccer games. The current field is only 70 yards wide.

Under Claiborne’s plan, the remaining southside stands — Dark describes them as a “hideous lump” — would be demolished and replaced by new stands. The existing northside stands would stay, but get a retrofit.

New wider seats would be installed and the heavy metal roof would be replaced by the same translucent fabric used on the southside roof.

Claiborne is considering two possible suppliers for the roof fabric. His preferred choice is a German-Italian company called Vector Foiltec, which made the clear exterior panels for the Beijing Olympics’ aquatic centre, dubbed the Water Cube.

The stadium would have seating for 24,000 — 13,000 in the northside stands and 11,000 in the southside. It would offer three levels of seating — general, club seats and seats in 28 box suites.

For events such as the Grey Cup, temporary end zone seats could be installed, raising the stadium’s capacity to 45,000. Otherwise, the end zones would be grassy berms where people could sit or enjoy a picnic.

Claiborne’s plan calls for a two-storey retail component that would provide improved entrances to the arena and enclose the mammoth steel frames on the north facade of the Civic Centre.

Those sloping steel frames disrupt the view of the Aberdeen Pavilion, with its soft curves, Claiborne explains. “The second you put a vertical face here, it calms the entire vista.”

While the arena, home to the Ottawa 67’s, needs considerable work to address a long list of mechanical, electrical and structural problems, its design would remain essentially unchanged.

“If we turn it into a first-class arena,” Claiborne says, “the ticket prices have to go up considerably. The Ottawa 67’s are a very successful club, but they would be less successful if they had to double their ticket price.”

So far, Claiborne says cost estimates for the project are on target. “We have a budget of $85 million, not a penny more, for the stadium,” he says. “We’re right where we should be.” (The price tag rises to $110 million when “soft costs” such as professional fees are included.)

Dark says Claiborne’s thinking is “quite magical. He’s a smart guy.” Based on the design work he’s seen, Dark says the new stadium has the potential to rival the Richmond Oval as an iconic Canadian sporting venue.

Claiborne isn’t entirely at ease with the word icon, though. “An icon carries so much gravity with it. I would be more comfortable if this was a building people looked at and just had a comfortable, warm feeling about. If it was close to being universally liked, that would make me happy.”

Before joining Cannon Design about a year ago, Claiborne, a California native, worked for years for acclaimed architect Daniel Libeskind. He’s also an adjunct professor at McGill University’s school of architecture.

He’s acutely aware of the controversy surrounding the Lansdowne project.

He has relatives in Old Ottawa South — the area, along with the Glebe, where opposition to the redevelopment is concentrated — “and they hate me. They think I’m the devil because I’m working on Lansdowne Park.”

But Claiborne is hoping opposition will abate once people see his design. “Good architecture can be a great appeasement for everybody. People can actually enjoy it. And that’s the goal.

“It’s a building for the people. I’ve never lost sight of that for a second.”

For now, Claiborne’s stadium is just a concept on paper. But he’s optimistic that by 2013, it will be home to a new Ottawa CFL team.

“I go home every weekend and I’m having a glass of wine with my wife and I say, ‘Carolyn, you’re not going to believe this. This might actually get built’.”
     
     
  #5460  
Old Posted Mar 31, 2014, 5:34 PM
Fatty McButterpants Fatty McButterpants is offline
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Well that's an interesting article ... from 2010. Before I get started let me just clarify that there are things envisioned in this article that never quite came to fruition.

It's very telling how each of these photos are of the NEW south side stands. That side is actually great. If both sides looked like that the whole thing would be pretty amazing. But that's the problem. The other side is not so great. As the article states, "the existing northside stands would stay, but get a retrofit". That's a euphemism for cheap patch job. Well guess what, it looks pretty much the exact same as it did before. Ugly and dated. But with new seats. There are some kinds of ugly you just can't fix.

I am actually quite informed on this. I've seen this place with my own eyes many times during the course of its redevelopment. When I look at the south side, I say to myself "wow, cool". When I look at the north side, I say to myself "well that's just a damn shame".
     
     
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