Phoenix Development News (3)

[pbenjamin]

Originally Posted by gymratmanaz

is there a timetable?

It is a 10 year plan.

[pbenjamin]

Originally Posted by Arquitect

I know the design group has been very conscious about budget. So I am not too worried about it not being completed.

With a $38 million budget deficit facing the City, it is going to be a hard sell to put any public funds into this any time soon, no matter how budget-conscious the design team was.

[KevininPhx]

Originally Posted by pbenjamin

With a $38 million budget deficit facing the City, it is going to be a hard sell to put any public funds into this any time soon, no matter how budget-conscious the design team was.

That's hardly a problem. $38 million is essentially a line item or two in the budget (e.g., pools, a library). The bigger concern is that 10-year plan. Parks throughout history are one of the first things to get Xed off new administrations' budgets.

This won't happen, but if I were signing off on these things, I'd hand it over to private companies and parcel it out. It would be gone in no time and I'd put some tiny conditions on maintaining a certain amount of green space.

This park may just be too big for the city to manage.

[nickw252]

Originally Posted by KevininPhx

I'd hand it over to private companies and parcel it out. It would be gone in no time and I'd put some tiny conditions on maintaining a certain amount of green space.

This park may just be too big for the city to manage.

I actually like this idea. Keep the dog park and some green space but parcel the rest out. Unfortunately there are alread so many vacant lots in the area that I'm not sure that it'd be developed quickly.

[pbenjamin]

Originally Posted by KevininPhx

That's hardly a problem. $38 million is essentially a line item or two in the budget (e.g., pools, a library).

I think that you are misjudging the political climate. Stanton will be up for re-election next year. People are still pissy about the sales tax on food, which he will be identified with since he didn't quite do what he said he would do in the campaign. He will certainly get opposition from someone like Waring or Diciccio. Phoenix is a large city geographically and a whole lot of voters live in suburban areas. They vote for transit because they can imagine light rail coming their way but they can't imagine themselves going anywhere near Hance Park, once somebody explains to them where that is. The Republic, whose only interest in city affairs seems to be yammering about pensions, will most certainly take the "nice idea but we can't afford it given all of our problems" approach. Putting a lot of money into this proposal might not be the most politically adept move. Despite your trivializing of the budget issue, there has been a fair amount of press about the deficit. They only way I see this getting implemented is with a large influx of private money. There was a time when the leaders of APS, Valley Bank, Phoenix Newspapers and a few others would get together and find a way to get this done. Sadly that day has passed and the real estate industrial complex that runs the local economy doesn't give a rat's backside about downtown or anything near it.

[Jjs5056]

Well, that's a shame. I was under the impression there was at least some funding structure in place.

Can someone shed some light on how the 10 year plan is broken out by phase? Assuming that little has changed from the original plan posted, I think the most crucial area would be the Central overpass, underpass, and entryways. Creating an area that is visible, attractive and safe to visitors would seem to be the most important objective for increasing usage.

For elements like the food truck parking, restaurant, firehouse beer garden, etc. - are those intended to be publicly or privately funded? If the former, then hopefully the buzz around the new design + increase in park patrons from any phase one improvements would encourage some investment there, and the eastern portion of the park could certainly use the increased programming, since the west side at least has the cultural amenities and nearby dog park.

BTW, the changes at Arizona Center were painfully minimal. I will post photos later, but the only real irovements are: expanded patios for both the Corner Bakery and Hooters, and space for what looks to be some back-lit signage all along the 3rd Street facade.

[nickw252]

Originally Posted by pbenjamin

The Republic, whose only interest in city affairs seems to be yammering about pensions, will most certainly take the "nice idea but we can't afford it given all of our problems" approach.

Haha, you're spot-on. What a waste of trees.

[Arquitect]

Originally Posted by gymratmanaz

where do we go to see the plans unveiled?

Here is a link to the presentation:

http://phoenix.gov/webcms/groups/internet/@inter/@dept/@parks/documents/web_content/111101.pdf

[gymratmanaz]

thanks Arquitect

[gymratmanaz]

impressive proposal. Wish it could start now!!!!

[Jjs5056]

The presentation looks great; congrats to those involved.

A few comments/questions:
1) Why were the food trucks moved off Moreland and into the plaza area? Seems like placing them along Moreland and attracting them to do so during Phase I would help bridge the park with First Fridays. Also, would these trucks be there daily? Would they rotate? Who chooses who gets to park on which day?
2) Any particular reason for the removal of the volleyball courts/exclusion of a basketball court or something similar? Seems like those are amenities lacking in the area that are relatively cheap to install/maintain and bring traffic in quickly.
3) Has the city mentioned anything about RFPing any of the adjacent parcels, or how they plan to integrate the historic houses and other sites into the park and when? Are the other cultural institutions on board with the plans? We're all smart enough to understand the importance of developing the real estate around the park to its success, and that isn't something within the design team's hands.
4) Would food&beverage be permanent under the bridge? Could that not be something done almost immediately?
5) The zip line is awesome and is the kind of attraction this park needs; great idea.
6) My only criticisms are:
- still the lack of visibility from Central; in the example image shown, the entries look almost identical to what's there today: small entries to a set of stairs, only under a shade structure in this rendering. The only entrance that "works" for me is Culver/3rd where the elevations have been leveled out.
- placing retail storefronts underground, beneath the summit/plateau; I think using this for parking is genius, but don't understand how retail would work, and think parks are always more vibrant when kept to as few changes in grade as possible.
- the amount of terms is a bit overwhelming; you have the 3 main sections, the Summit, the Arroyo Plaza, the Central Pass, the Arrival Plaza, the Adventure Plaza, etc. I think in some cases, you can get the design speak for itself, though this may just be a case of having to describe the vision in words and wouldn't necessarily be an issue once implemented.

[Jjs5056]

I have 2 sets of photos to post; this set focuses on the main CBD, and other on the Warehouse District, which I think deserves its own discussion based on the article posted the other day.

*Disclaimer: I'm no expert photographer, and combined with an impatient driver and poor sun angle, the pics are pretty terrible. Sorry!*

I will say I was super impressed both afternoons I spent down there this weekend. I typically only go downtown at night, and the difference in daytime activity now vs. 6 months ago is great to see. There's obviously a demand and desire for local, unique culture in this city, as evidenced by the growing success of 3rd-6th Avenues between Roosevelt and Fillmore. It's a shame that the rest of our downtown has been demolished, because this creative class is running out of affordable properties to utilize and adapt. Beyond Metrowest's restoration project on 2nd Ave between Fillmore and Monroe, and The Row on 2nd St, it's going to take investment from big-time developers to fill in the rest of the black holes that fragment the city. And, unfortunately, big-time development usually means high rents, which means vacant retail or chain retail (see Roosevelt Pointe).

Anyway, 'The Local' just opened in the Canvas building, which is great to see, as the momentum seemed to die quickly following the early closures in that center. We didn't stop in, but here's a crappy photo of the new, orange-inspired sign:



Moreland and Portland from 3rd-1st looked like a post-world city, especially having just had brunch at The Vig Sunday and feeling like Phoenix was completely fabulous. Hopefully, once this house is turned into a brewery during The Row's development, some of the other lots will fill in and provide some nice density along the eastern edge of Hance:



But, no development will ever match the beauty and craftsmanship of the houses we lost, many of which had to look similar to this beauty, lost in a sea of dirt and mid-century apartments on Portland:



Meanwhile, Roosevelt looked like Roosevelt - though, somehow more colorful than I last remembered. I appreciate the murals and pop-up art, but something about the street is beginning to seem unapproachable to me. Like, you need to be a certain level of hipster to hang around; it sucks that the City screwed up again and nixed parallel parking along the street, because that would've done wonders in encouraging visitors to actually get out and browse through the stores and galleries. Because, right now, I would think that I was interrupting someone's business. Signage would also go a long way toward making the street more navigable.



Hopefully, The Union actually gets built, because I think the street is in desperate need of housing - for the artists themselves, and for the downtown supporters. Seeing locals on the street would again increase the perception of safety. Is this house being used currently? It's an 8-unit apartment from 1930, and seems perfect for artist housing:
http://www.loopnet.com/Listing/17682319/1009-N-1st-Street-Phoenix-AZ/

Though no photos, the Motor building on Central looks amazing. Any word on tenants?

We then dropped by the Arizona Center, as I hadn't been since 2007 and wanted to check out the upgrades. I got mildly excited when I saw work being done on the double-doors beneath the large AMC logo thinking they were creating a second entrance, but no- he was just sanding down the new "exit only" lettering. In fact, there are 2 sets of double-doors beneath giant AMC logos that are exit only. Finally, we reached the main courtyard near Taylor where there is a giant obelisk with an AMC logo in front of a 3-story glass facade with AMC printed in big letters... psyche! Another set of exit only doors. So, with no signage or direction, we squeezes through the narrow tunnel to grab a bite where we finally saw the ticket counter out of the corner of our eyes. What fucking terrible design.



Once inside, the place was almost busy, I would say. And, all I could think about was how much different our downtown would be if all these restaurants at least had their patios open up to 3rd St and Fillmore. 3rd St from Bliss - US Airways would be urban and entertaining, instead of one long anti-urban fortress. Apparently, they're trying to attract more high-end art boutiques. Um, ok.



The only moderate improvements made were to the patios of the Corner Bakery and Hooters, expanding them along the 3rd St wall and to the sidewalk bushes.





They've also added pieces for what look to be back-lit signage.



Next, in a bad mood via Suburban Center, after passing by Van Buren and the forever cursed retail spots where the Sonoma Grill used to be, we cruised up Adams and I forgot what a pleasant, urban street it is despite the hideous hotel architecture. I love the theater e to believe the lot at and while we may not get Omega, I have to believe the lot behind Orpheum Lofts will be developed eventually. In the meantime, Orpheum Lofts' small-scale retail gives off such a great vibe, and I was glad to see that Nick's 101 is finally being replaced on the corner of 1st Ave/Adams:



I'm excited to see what becomes of the city's efforts to revitalize the area between Central and Symphony Hall. They're RFPing for the vacant, former Alot, lot on Central,for the empty Matador retail spot, and working with both hotels to reorient their retail. An Aloft would still be perfect in that area, IMO, and its XYZ Lounge would add a nice nightlife component. Meanwhile, I hope the Renaissance can somehow redesign their arcade and attract a tenant for the former Starbucks spot. On 1st St, it'll be interesting to see if there is any possibility for the Hyatt to incorporate retail where they have their large corner window now. That'd certainly add to the street scene.



Additionally, I had never noticed that Hanny's had additional space for lease on the upper levels. At over 4,000 square feet, it might be cool to create 4 or so studios, as I can't imagine much else , other than professional offices or a showroom of sorts (which could also be cool - a furniture store with large displays in the window). The space is accessed via elevator from the door on the far west side side of the Adams St frontage. http://azarchitecture.com/listing/hannys-landmark-international-style-building/print/



Lastly, we headed to the warehouse district, which is where my next post will pick up. I'll leave you with this uninspiring, amateur photos of the CityScape apartments I adore for some reason.

[soleri]

What those pictures show is the failure of a particular development model where real-estate hustlers are empowered to clear-cut the forest and then call it a "park". What this means in practice is that there's no natural growth left. The organic model has been systematically uprooted to the point nothing can grow between the lollapalooza projects. You walk around downtown and see very little real-world retail, small shops, or anything human-scaled. It's a tabula rasa downtown, that no longers functions organically. We've been doing this since 1970. Just about all the major parcels have been filled now (the Collier acreage is one big exception). And it' still dead. The little bits of hope downtown are all on the fringes where some old houses and a few buildings have somehow survived. But they're so far apart that you can't reknit the urban fabric. This might as well be Mesa with a vertical element.

[bwaynoh]

[QUOTE=Jjs5056;6517199]
Moreland and Portland from 3rd-1st looked like a post-world city, especially having just had brunch at The Vig Sunday and feeling like Phoenix was completely fabulous. Hopefully, once this house is turned into a brewery during The Row's development, some of the other lots will fill in and provide some nice density along the eastern edge of Hance:




Meanwhile, Roosevelt looked like Roosevelt - though, somehow more colorful than I last remembered. I appreciate the murals and pop-up art, but something about the street is beginning to seem unapproachable to me. Like, you need to be a certain level of hipster to hang around; it sucks that the City screwed up again and nixed parallel parking along the street, because that would've done wonders in encouraging visitors to actually get out and browse through the stores and galleries. Because, right now, I would think that I was interrupting someone's business. Signage would also go a long way toward making the street more navigable.




That actually isn't the Knipe house in your picture that will be part of The Row development. The Knipe house is located south of that location between Portland and Roosevelt on the east side of 2nd St.

Also, parallel parking is included in the new streetscape plan for Roosevelt along the south side of the street as well as back-in angled parking on the north side of Roosevelt between 5th and 7th St

[Jjs5056]

Originally Posted by bwaynoh

That actually isn't the Knipe house in your picture that will be part of The Row development. The Knipe house is located south of that location between Portland and Roosevelt on the east side of 2nd St.

Also, parallel parking is included in the new streetscape plan for Roosevelt along the south side of the street as well as back-in angled parking on the north side of Roosevelt between 5th and 7th St

Thank you for that correction- I should've known that house was in too good of a condition. In that case, I hope that house sees a new life once The Row is completed, either as a single family home or adapted rescue.

As for parallel parking on Roosevelt, do you have a link to the final plans? The last update I saw from the city had removed all street-side parking in favor of 20' sidewalks, and all quotes regarding the streetscape plans have mentioned the wide sidewalks, lane reductions, and shade structures, but never anything about parking.

[Jjs5056]

Originally Posted by soleri

What those pictures show is the failure of a particular development model where real-estate hustlers are empowered to clear-cut the forest and then call it a "park". What this means in practice is that there's no natural growth left. The organic model has been systematically uprooted to the point nothing can grow between the lollapalooza projects. You walk around downtown and see very little real-world retail, small shops, or anything human-scaled. It's a tabula rasa downtown, that no longers functions organically. We've been doing this since 1970. Just about all the major parcels have been filled now (the Collier acreage is one big exception). And it' still dead. The little bits of hope downtown are all on the fringes where some old houses and a few buildings have somehow survived. But they're so far apart that you can't reknit the urban fabric. This might as well be Mesa with a vertical element.

Soleri, I have often felt similarly, and still do to a degree. But, for the pockets where there has been that grassroots organic growth, I think downtown deserves more credit than a vertical Mesa.

The shrinking amounts of land in the core is why I am so crticial of the way the ASU and Biomedical campuses have been allowed to develop. Those buildings needed to be integrated into the urban ecosystem and not shut out the community. Aside from Civic Space, the School of Journalism is the only building that connects with the street level, but 6 story buildings in a city that had its population base blown out isn't going to give the needed density in the longterm. The Law School is a lowrise disaster with 3 blank walls, taking up an entire city block. Plans for 10+ story residential and classroom developments on the University Center garage, next to Walter Cronkite or for the 3rd phase of Nursing don't seem to be anywhere close to happening, and I have little faith they'd integrate into the city any better, essentially making Fillmore-VB, 3rd-Central a segregated campus.

There's a real spirit and energy from 3rd-6th ave, Fillmore-Roosevelt, and it's enraging that the momentum can't carry over to the east or south, because there's literally nowhere for these ideas to come to life.

Roosevelt Row has been our only point of pride for years now, and yet Roosevelt Pointe is the only private investment that has occurred, aside from the Canvas remodel. I hope Union gets built and that other residential projects follow, because connecting 4th-6th Streets with 3rd-6th Aves via Roosevelt would be a big step forward, especially if the area near The Row also develops. But, after that, the creative class is really priced out of the area because even if new projects come on board, the retail rents will be far too high for startup businesses.

It isn't all bad news, though, it's just that the bright spots are all disjointed because of past mistakes. Once Hotel Monroe is complete, that street from 3rd-1st Ave will be great. It's a shame the owners of the roofless Church won't allow a buyer in - a nightclub there, with Crescent Ballroom so close could spur something interesting. Van Buren also has a ton of potential from 7th-1st Ave, if land prices and speculators would allow reuse projects to occur within some of the warehouses. Civic Space park has been successful, though it needs more dense development around it - particularly surrounding the YMCA, and on the Central Station block. Will be interesting to see what, if any, proposals the city receives for that block.

Adams Street, like I mentioned is also turning into a very active and pleasant street from a pedestrian POV. If the City is serious about improving the flaws: the vacancies, empty lots, and hotel designs, this will easily become the most urban stretch of Phoenix.

Finally, the entertainment district, for all of its flaws, has been working pretty well and energized a part of downtown that the City silenced years ago with the wrecking ball. CityScape is a definite success, with true retail, upscale nightlife, an upscale hotel, and multiple residents. Luhrs will soon have a new hotel with its own signature restaurant, Bitter and Twisted will open eventually, and the remaining arcade should hopefully fill in with the increased foot traffic. And, now, there's a chance for something special to happen with the Barrister block.

Meanwhile, The Arizona Center should be blown up and the land sold, because I think it, more than anything has damaged the connected fabric of downtown. There are so many easy ways to improve the design, but clearly that isn't going to happen: an upscale restaurant on Van Buren opening up to the gardens, restaurant patios lining 3rd, moving the theatre marquee to the exterior courtyard, etc. Instead, it's the major divide between the arts scene and the entertainment district, rather than the connector it should be.

Huge rant, but overall, there's positive momentum downtown right now. Can it continue? Probably not. Either they'll need to take a risk and venture into houses/buildings that aren't within a cluster/community, or developers will need to start taking risks and building projects - something we haven't seen since OCPE aside from Roosevelt Pointe really. Regardless, we need to:
1) Start building higher
2) Start adding permanent residents in the right places: along Roosevelt, in the area behind the YMCA, etc. It's a shame the commercial along Central and 1st wasn't built with residential on top
3) Hope ASU moves forward with its other projects and designs them better or...
4) Hope the private sector finally takes a chance on Phoenix again and develops prime pieces of land along Roosevelt, and adjacent to the ASU campus

If you think the main CBD is depressing, wait until I post my warehouse photos. I could cry at the wasted opportunities and miles of destruction.

[Jjs5056]

In fact, just taking a look at the available inventory of retail, our built environment really isn't THAT terrible. We just don't have the needed residents to justify filling many of these spots. Hopefully, the rumors about Portland Place and Artisan Haus 2 turn out to be the real deal, but we need even more than that. I'd love to see the lots on either side Fillmore developed finally, since they can definitely handle a high rise component.

It's also beating a dead horse, but imagine the benefit s restored Westward Ho would have? Is the retail available for lease, if someone really wanted to? It's just a prime location - I don't see why the Security building hasn't ever had luck leasing.

For all its flaws, Phoenix still has a Central Ave that could work as a main boulevard; that'll depend highly on future residential developments and what becomes of the Ho, Security Building, and Central Station.

[soleri]

Originally Posted by Jjs5056

In fact, just taking a look at the available inventory of retail, our built environment really isn't THAT terrible. We just don't have the needed residents to justify filling many of these spots. Hopefully, the rumors about Portland Place and Artisan Haus 2 turn out to be the real deal, but we need even more than that. I'd love to see the lots on either side Fillmore developed finally, since they can definitely handle a high rise component.

It's also beating a dead horse, but imagine the benefit s restored Westward Ho would have? Is the retail available for lease, if someone really wanted to? It's just a prime location - I don't see why the Security building hasn't ever had luck leasing.

For all its flaws, Phoenix still has a Central Ave that could work as a main boulevard; that'll depend highly on future residential developments and what becomes of the Ho, Security Building, and Central Station.

If there's one thing a citizen-based movement might plausibly accomplish, it's returning the Westward Ho to its roots as a great hotel. It's currently contracted with HUD to provide social housing for the disabled. Downtown has very few buildings with bones this good and it's a crime that it essentially functions as a homeless shelter. If you've never been inside, just check with the security guard at the Fillmore entrance. It contains magnificent public rooms that could add immeasurably to a vibrant downtown. The investment required will be high, but I can think of nothing besides the renovation of the Professional Building that could help downtown quite as much. BTW, I read on AZCentral this morning Doug MacEachern, a troglodyte my any standard, extolling the idea of development along the canals. This idea has been floating out there among the architects and activists since the 1970s. It's taken this long for it to finally achieve critical mass among political and civic leaders. I hope the recovery of the Ho doesn't take decades. Seriously, downtown can't wait that long. Bang your drum. Start something. And don't let the guilt-trippers win the debate. You can afford to give the current residents first-class accommodations someplace elsewhere. What you need first and foremost is a sense of urgency.

[HooverDam]

That Hance Park plan is so disappointing, nothings really changed since their last unveiling of it. They haven't addressed any of the parks major issues and in fact have made many of those issues worse. Its odd because they correctly diagnose the issues, but then completely misunderstand how to fix them.

Instead of more visibility, we have less (the butte and plateau further hide the park). Instead of less parking and more properly integrating the park into an urban fabric that includes LRT, bikes, walking, etc. we have vastly more parking. Instead of increasing density around the park by encouraging the city to RFP off excess land, we have the same issues persisting. Instead of more activities (baseball, soccer, basketball, volleyball, boccee, checkers, etc) we have less activities. Almost everything on the western half of their proposal is designed for idle strolling, a fine thing indeed, but what about active sporting uses?

Thats not to say this design will be a complete failure. When you spend $100M+ it's going to be hard to screw up entirely. I'm sure the new Hance Park will be used more than the current one, but is that the acceptable baseline? I keep hearing "world class" thrown about and its laughable to think this design is anything close to that.

[dtnphx]

Phoenix meeting increased demand for urban housing
By Christina Estes


PHOENIX -- More apartments and condos are going up in downtown Phoenix.

According to a city council report, there are approximately 1,200 units under construction or in the early development stages. They are mostly being built in a one-and-a-half square mile area from McDowell Road to Lincoln Street and from Seventh Street to Seventh Avenue.

Dan Klocke, vice president of development for the Downtown Phoenix Partnership, said about 9,000 people call the area home.

"It is everything from the classic empty nesters to young professionals to folks who are moving from an urban style environment, say a Chicago or a Boston or whatever, and want that kind of urban living," he said.

The city report said between 2005 and 2013, more than 3,600 new housing units were built. About 69 percent of those are considered market-rate, which means they rent for roughly $1,000 per month, depending on the size and amenities. Other units are labeled as affordable housing for those with lower-incomes and luxury for those paying higher rents.

"Downtown has truly become a neighborhood as opposed to just a place," said Klocke. "It's a place where people want to work and they want to live."

Members of the Downtown, Aviation and Redevelopment Subcommittee will get an update on the housing market and future development plans at their meeting on Wednesday.