Millennium Line - Evergreen Extension | Completed

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by officedweller

The concern is more about the potential for delays due to all the switching involved, but with automation, short trains and dwell times, that's probably a minor issue.

I seem to remember a few years ago there was a rash of "switching issues" around Columbia that caused a number of system-wide issues. As long as they are on top of the areas on the lines that have frequent switching we should be ok. Fingers crossed...

[officedweller]

The original switch control system on the Expo Line is being replaced (outdated software, hardware (think 286)).
It shouldn't be an issue for a new line.

[queetz@home]

Originally Posted by nname

One thing you forget is - traffic. After taking bus to SFU for more than 8 years....<snip>

I think its safe to assume that whatever you and I have experienced in the past or even the present when it comes to the 143 or 145 is an invalid argument when it comes to taking the Evergreen Line existing. All the traffic nitemare, which bus route is more convenient, etc will not be in play from the Summer of 2016 onwards because there will be the long awaited Skytrain line which will alleviate all this mess. The traffic nitemare that you speak of only exists because WE HAVE NO SKYTRAIN!

Hence while the 145 may seem better yesterday or today, doesn't mean it will be better than 143 coming from Burquitlam in August 2016. And as far as we can tell, and what has been brought up here, Burquitlam will make the most sense as the sole transfer point for SFU students, regardless of the trackwork configuration at the Lougheed Station area and the origin of the students in the entire Skytrain network.

So might as well take advantage of it and give a better trackwork configuration that will be easier for the user and less wear and tear to the skytrain system, and also save operating costs by eliminating a redundant shuttle bus route.

[queetz@home]

Originally Posted by officedweller

The cross-platform transfer is also meant to facilitate Surrey-Coquitlam transfers.

Under the LRSP, the "T" Line was supposed to have the wye open to the south, to allow trains to travel from Coquitlam to New West (providing a single transfer to Surrey).
Instead, the line was built with the wye opening to the east, requiring 2 transfers from Coquitlam to Surrey.

So in addition to helping New West passengers transfer to Vancouver-bound trains, the cross-platform transfer also helps passengers from Coquitlam transfer to trains to New West and then transfer to Surrey.

But those same Coquitlam passengers will have to go down and up when they are coming from New West, so to use the original T line plan to justify the convoluted plan...I just don't buy it.

That said, maybe it doesn't have to be that hard. Perhaps they can do some switching of direction of the trains if ease of transfer is their main goal. So assuming Surrey / New West is the more employment centre than Port Moody / Coquitlam (though I think PoMo is really taking off in that regard), maybe during the morning rush, the trains can wrong rail, but at afternoon and night, they can right rail.

In this way, the wear and tear of the switches may go down to more than 50%, which would really add up throughout the years. The public will still be confused, but there seems to be no way around that. At least the transfer will be less painful....

[officedweller]

The morning commute is generally more time-sensitive than the afternoon commute.

The main purpose of the routing is to assign destinations to the platforms and that those destinations do not change - so you will always go to a particular platform for a particular destination.
They'll just read the signs pointing to a platform that say "VCC Clark", "Douglas Lafarge Lake" or, hmm, "Waterfront"?.

Like jsbertram noted, the general public won't notice or care about the switching, and as I noted, wrt wear & tear, there are already switches on the system (at the termini) that operate for every train.

[queetz@home]

Originally Posted by officedweller

The morning commute is generally more time-sensitive than the afternoon commute.

The main purpose of the routing is to assign destinations to the platforms and that those destinations do not change - so you will always go to a particular platform for a particular destination.

Like jsbertram noted, the general public won't notice or care about the switching, and as I noted, wrt wear & tear, there are already switches on the system (at the termini) that operate for every train.

That's not always the case. In cities like Amsterdam, they assign certain platforms to be used for a destination depending on the time of day. But we all know Translink will not make any changes based on what is being discussed here, no matter how convoluted their plans are...

[deasine]

Originally Posted by queetz@home

That's not always the case.

Well this generalisation applies in Vancouver.

As for the platform changing based on operations comment, the same applies for many rail systems in Australia (Melbourne and Sydney). A system like that can be confusing for the average person and there needs to be sufficient digital signage "sites of navigation" (generally near maps, before fare gates).

[officedweller]

People here get confuised with 2 dedicated platforms, let alone 3 changing ones.

[queetz@home]

Originally Posted by officedweller

People here get confuised with 2 dedicated platforms, let alone 3 changing ones.

No kidding, eh? When it comes to transit, they must make things idiot proof even if it means operational inefficiencies and waste of tax dollars.

Moving on, now that the TBM is finished, its interesting to see their mechanism on how they would move the dirt, going down and up a series of conveyor belts into that rectangular box thingy, then have the excavator put the dirt onto dump trucks (which MUST NEVER idle cuz its bad... ).

http://wcs.pbaeng.com/projects/R1_Transit



Presumably, the small cylinder thing at the end is only upward now, and once the TBM penetrates deeper, the conveyor belt will expand and the cylinder end would be horizontal?

[finalcoolman]

Steel girder guideway installation at Lougheed has been completed.

[officedweller]

The cylindrical auger looks like it is permanently angled. That makes sense since the dirt/spoil will fall to the bottom of the cutting face, and the auger will grab it and move it up and out the back of the machine and drop it onto the conveyor belt.

[jsbertram]

Originally Posted by queetz@home

No kidding, eh? When it comes to transit, they must make things idiot proof even if it means operational inefficiencies and waste of tax dollars.

Moving on, now that the TBM is finished, its interesting to see their mechanism on how they would move the dirt, going down and up a series of conveyor belts into that rectangular box thingy, then have the excavator put the dirt onto dump trucks (which MUST NEVER idle cuz its bad... ).

http://wcs.pbaeng.com/projects/R1_Transit



Presumably, the small cylinder thing at the end is only upward now, and once the TBM penetrates deeper, the conveyor belt will expand and the cylinder end would be horizontal?

The overhead conveyor and the muck-screw that feeds the muck conveyor are fixed in place - they don't move up/down nor left/right.

At the end of the conveyor is usually the 'supply train' of a few muck cars so the muck can be sent back out of the tunnel to be disposed. Usually the front of the same supply train has a few cars that hold the ring segments to be installed.

As the TBM is chewing through the rock & creating muck, the muck falls through the cutter head so the muck screw can scoop it up.

The muck screw delivers the muck up to to the conveyor, which in turn sends the muck to the end of the TBM, where it falls off the conveyor into the muck cars.

When the TBM has moved forward enough, it stops digging and the next tunnel ring is set in place.

Before the TBM starts digging again, the supply train is sent out of the tunnel back to the construction pit where the muck cars at the back of the supply train are emptied and the next ring segments are loaded on the ring transport cars at the front of the supply train. When ready, the supply train is sent back into the tunnel and up to the TBM so the muck cars are ready to capture the muck as it falls off the conveyor.

repeat a few thousand times & the tunnel is finished!

[Olden Retreiver]

I can see the benefit of a 3rd track and 3rd platform at Lougheed Station, but planners have gotten the configuration all wrong. The new platform should have been built adjacent to the existing westbound track, with the 3rd track (westbound Evergreen trains from Burquitlam) added to the north side of that new platform. Trains from Braid would come into the middle track (same track they use now) and passengers would exit on both sides: north side to transfer to Evergreen westbound, south side for Evergreen eastbound.

Technically, there would be 4 platforms I guess (2 double sided ones)

No wrong-railing, and no down-and-up transfers for anyone.

[Meraki]

Originally Posted by Olden Retreiver

I can see the benefit of a 3rd track and 3rd platform at Lougheed Station, but planners have gotten the configuration all wrong. The new platform should have been built adjacent to the existing westbound track, with the 3rd track (westbound Evergreen trains from Burquitlam) added to the north side of that new platform. Trains from Braid would come into the middle track (same track they use now) and passengers would exit on both sides: north side to transfer to Evergreen westbound, south side for Evergreen eastbound.

The fact of the matter was that the 3rd platform as-is was already poured with the building of Lougheed station, and they didn't feel it was worth the increased cost to change it.

In their own words, Evergreen isn't going to have "gold plated" stations like the Millennium line got under the NDP. (I can't believe people can say that with a straight face.)

At least we'll have one line with unique, aesthetically pleasing stations. Nothing close to what you'd see in Europe, but at least the MLine is interesting and not a bunch of cheap-as-possible bland stations like we're getting with Canada Line and Evergreen. (Except Gilmore, because that one is indefensible. )

[hollywoodnorth]

Problem with Evergreen Line construction shuts major Coquitlam intersection

http://globalnews.ca/news/1207949/proble...tion-shuts-major-coquitlam-intersection/


ummmmmmmmm not good!

[s211]

I call it an earthquake dry run.

[GeeCee]

http://www.news1130.com/2014/03/14/part-of-evergreen-track-shifts-causes-commute-problems/ has a better picture.

[Olden Retreiver]

Originally Posted by Meraki

The fact of the matter was that the 3rd platform as-is was already poured with the building of Lougheed station, and they didn't feel it was worth the increased cost to change it.

In their own words, Evergreen isn't going to have "gold plated" stations like the Millennium line got under the NDP. (I can't believe people can say that with a straight face.)
.
.
.

Cannot imagine the cost to saw off a block of concrete would be more than the cost of the extra complexities to accommodate what was already built. Plus the reduced functionality of this second-rate design. Have to think there has been some real wrong thinking here.

Related, most station renderings I've seen for Evergreen are generally quite attractive, especially Port Moody and Inlet Centre, which are closest and most important to me. Not "gold plated" but not second-rate. However, as construction progresses at Port Moody, I do see some problems and annoyances. In the new parking lot and bus loop, there is only asphalt and solid concrete curbs - no permeable surfaces or innovative layout. No high-efficiency lighting. Basic 1970s shopping plaza design. Also, I expect the ugly lock-block wall where the guideway goes under Moody Street will become permanent.

[Olden Retreiver]

Originally Posted by hollywoodnorth

Problem with Evergreen Line construction shuts major Coquitlam intersection

http://globalnews.ca/news/1207949/proble...tion-shuts-major-coquitlam-intersection/


ummmmmmmmm not good!

That's a segment that should be essentially complete - rhe gantry has moved on well to the south. Very un-good.

[vivagt]

Originally Posted by GeeCee

http://www.news1130.com/2014/03/14/part-of-evergreen-track-shifts-causes-commute-problems/ has a better picture.

In the picture looks like a hydraulic jack may have failed if it was in there before the movement