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  #5921  
Old Posted Nov 27, 2012, 8:23 PM
Dale Dale is offline
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Originally Posted by simms3_redux View Post
Sounds like the stadium deal is a result of misaligned interests. Tax money raised from bed tax, use TBD.

Residents of Atlanta:
Would like quality of life improvements or budget increases

Hotels/Public Uses:
Would like all of that money spent on themselves via new stadium

Personally I would rather see the money go to something else, but my voice is just one of a few million saying the same thing. What do we matter?
simms, where the hell have you been ?

I asked about the supposedly grandiose Coca-Cola renovation plans a page or two back. Apparently, they were neither grandiose or ready to go anytime soon.

Someone did post the recent article about some consolidation efforts and a renovation cost of "at least $90-million", hardly enough for a reclad of the sort we were expecting.
     
     
  #5922  
Old Posted Nov 27, 2012, 9:50 PM
testarossa50 testarossa50 is offline
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If we do get a new stadium (an idea I'm still cool on), I hope that they at least don't cut corners. Build something magnificent; something that will rival Jerryworld. The last thing I want to do is spend a bomb on something "meh".

Has anyone done a project list in a while? There's a ton of stuff going on; so much it's hard to keep track. Off the top of my head:

Downtown: CFB HOF, Civil Rights Museum, Streetcar (UC), possible stadium, ~18 floor student housing project, hotel refurbishment/rebranding which escapes me, Times Square South (probably dead)

Eastside: Ponce City Market (UC), too many medium-sized apartment complexes for me to keep track of

Midtown: Proton Therapy Center, adjacent apartments, 77 12th (22 floors, UC), Skyhouse (23 floors, UC), apartments next to Viewpoint, Hyatt rebranding (UC), dual-branded hotel (nearing completion), a couple projects at Tech, sportsplex thing at AS

Westside: Apartments across from White Provisions, Piedmont West outpatient center on Howell Mill (~9 floors)

Buckhead: Buckhead Atlanta, Outpatient Medical Center at Piedmont (4 floors, UC), apartments next to St Regis (~8 floors, UC), apartments at Dante's (~10 floors), office building project next to Sovereign, apartment building behind Terminus, apartment building behind Phipps

Perimeter: announced ~20 floor office building for Cox (UC?)

Airport: Porsche HQ (UC)

Even if most of the proposed but not UC stuff doesn't pan out, that's still a whole lot of stuff we're getting in the next couple years. It'll be nice when these projects finally start coming online.
     
     
  #5923  
Old Posted Nov 28, 2012, 1:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by testarossa50 View Post
If we do get a new stadium (an idea I'm still cool on), I hope that they at least don't cut corners. Build something magnificent; something that will rival Jerryworld. The last thing I want to do is spend a bomb on something "meh".

Has anyone done a project list in a while? There's a ton of stuff going on; so much it's hard to keep track. Off the top of my head:

Downtown: CFB HOF, Civil Rights Museum, Streetcar (UC), possible stadium, ~18 floor student housing project, hotel refurbishment/rebranding which escapes me, Times Square South (probably dead)

Eastside: Ponce City Market (UC), too many medium-sized apartment complexes for me to keep track of

Midtown: Proton Therapy Center, adjacent apartments, 77 12th (22 floors, UC), Skyhouse (23 floors, UC), apartments next to Viewpoint, Hyatt rebranding (UC), dual-branded hotel (nearing completion), a couple projects at Tech, sportsplex thing at AS

Westside: Apartments across from White Provisions, Piedmont West outpatient center on Howell Mill (~9 floors)

Buckhead: Buckhead Atlanta, Outpatient Medical Center at Piedmont (4 floors, UC), apartments next to St Regis (~8 floors, UC), apartments at Dante's (~10 floors), office building project next to Sovereign, apartment building behind Terminus, apartment building behind Phipps

Perimeter: announced ~20 floor office building for Cox (UC?)

Airport: Porsche HQ (UC)

Even if most of the proposed but not UC stuff doesn't pan out, that's still a whole lot of stuff we're getting in the next couple years. It'll be nice when these projects finally start coming online.
This isn't a project list exactly that's traditional put together on this board, but another user had put together this Google map marking all the current and proposed developments: http://tiny.cc/yiihow

If you see something not on the list, please inform.

Last edited by ATL_J; Nov 28, 2012 at 1:44 PM.
     
     
  #5924  
Old Posted Nov 28, 2012, 1:33 PM
Midtown_DD Midtown_DD is offline
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That's a really great map, thanks!
     
     
  #5925  
Old Posted Nov 28, 2012, 2:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Zanarkand A East View Post
Stadium deal between GWCCA and Atlanta Falcons expecter by December 31! Hopefully, it's the site at Northside and Ivan Allen, and that area gets a ton of new development!

http://www.bizjournals.com/atlanta/morni...na=e_atl_rdup&s=newsletter&ed=2012-11-27
I am all for a new stadium, but it pisses me off that taxpayers have to foot 300 million, Arthur Blank could pay for it in cash. He ought to take into consideration what his partner did on the Aquarium. Build it as a gift for the city, he, (Blank), is a stingy sob anyway.
     
     
  #5926  
Old Posted Nov 28, 2012, 2:31 PM
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That's a really great map, thanks!
One tiny update re: the map is that the Site Plan associated with the "Fuqua Development" on Glenwood was recently rejected by the City of Atlanta who told the Developer to "try again".

This follows vocal and organized neighborhood opposition to the project, which in the original Site Plan showed a big box retailer widely rumored to be WalMart.

This tract incidentally borders the future Beltline (Bill Kennedy Way) in this part of town.
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  #5927  
Old Posted Nov 28, 2012, 3:14 PM
clexmond clexmond is offline
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Originally Posted by Midtown_DD View Post
That's a really great map, thanks!
I've been working on this along with ATL_J. If anyone else is interested in contributing send me your google docs email in a forum message.

Also, any way we could get this pinned somewhere?
     
     
  #5928  
Old Posted Nov 28, 2012, 3:33 PM
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Originally Posted by SteveD View Post
One tiny update re: the map is that the Site Plan associated with the "Fuqua Development" on Glenwood was recently rejected by the City of Atlanta who told the Developer to "try again".

This follows vocal and organized neighborhood opposition to the project, which in the original Site Plan showed a big box retailer widely rumored to be WalMart.

This tract incidentally borders the future Beltline (Bill Kennedy Way) in this part of town.
We're aware, but I imagine the project is "still in play" and they'll come back with another proposal. We'll see. If it fades into obscurity we can remove it.
     
     
  #5929  
Old Posted Nov 28, 2012, 3:47 PM
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Originally Posted by bigstick View Post
I am all for a new stadium, but it pisses me off that taxpayers have to foot 300 million, Arthur Blank could pay for it in cash. He ought to take into consideration what his partner did on the Aquarium. Build it as a gift for the city, he, (Blank), is a stingy sob anyway.
I'm 100% for the new stadium and I don't get the opposition towards the City of Atlanta using a Hotel / Motel Tax, which unless you're frequenting hotels in the city often, you're not paying for (not you specifically, but the local taxpayer).

Sure, Blank could foot the bill himself, but the Falcons and the events that would be held at the stadium would also greatly benefit the city as well, so I find no reason why the city can't provide some money towards this project. I understand the Georgia Dome is "fine now", but you don't wait to begin working on a new stadium once the current stadium is obsolete, you do it before that point.

Currently the Georgia Dome can't attract many of the events the city, Arthur Blank, and I imagine a lot of people (including myself) would enjoy to host (Super Bowls, non-friendly soccer matches, etc.). A new stadium would not only be able to compete for these events, but to continue to bring in the events we've grown accustomed too (NFL games, NCAA Final Fours, bowl games, etc.).

The construction of the new stadium would also allow us to correct the current stadium's issue of not addressing the local community and creating a huge divide between the west side neighborhoods and downtown. The Mayor has already said this would be a priority (take it for what its worth). I'm all for a stadium more integrated within the urban fabric of the surrounding community.
     
     
  #5930  
Old Posted Nov 28, 2012, 3:52 PM
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Abandoned downtown hotel to be new home to student housing

A prized downtown Atlanta lot that’s now the home to an abandoned hotel and a rental car facility will be transformed into a new student housing complex.

Bull Realty said Wednesday it brokered the $7.9 million sale of the 1.5 acre site at 70 John Wesley Dobbs Avenue to an affiliate of Ambling University Development Group.

The developers plan two phases that would create hundreds of new student apartments down the street from where Georgia State University plans to build new business and law schools.

The first part would renovate the old Ramada Hotel on the site into a 138-unit complex that would open in summer 2013. A new tower featuring 108 additional units would open in summer 2014, along with a new parking deck.







http://www.ajc.com/news/business/abandoned-downtown-hotel-to-be-new-home-to-student/nTHNf/

Last edited by micropundit; Nov 28, 2012 at 5:55 PM.
     
     
  #5931  
Old Posted Nov 28, 2012, 4:38 PM
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Originally Posted by micropundit View Post
A prized downtown Atlanta lot that’s now the home to an abandoned hotel and a rental car facility will be transformed into a new student housing complex.

Bull Realty said Wednesday it brokered the $7.9 million sale of the 1.5 acre site at 70 John Wesley Dobbs Avenue to an affiliate of Ambling University Development Group.

The developers plan two phases that would create hundreds of new student apartments down the street from where Georgia State University plans to build new business and law schools.

The first part would renovate the old Ramada Hotel on the site into a 138-unit complex that would open in summer 2013. A new tower featuring 108 additional units would open in summer 2014, along with a new parking deck.






http://www.ajc.com/news/business/abandoned-downtown-hotel-to-be-new-home-to-student/nTHNf/

Go GA State, they are single handily saving the DT core.
     
     
  #5932  
Old Posted Nov 28, 2012, 4:49 PM
Dale Dale is offline
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Go GA State, they are single handily saving the DT core.
It's like I said before. It's time to change the name from 'CBD' to Georgia State. So, you'd have Buckhead, Midtown and Georgia State.
     
     
  #5933  
Old Posted Nov 28, 2012, 6:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Dale View Post
It's like I said before. It's time to change the name from 'CBD' to Georgia State. So, you'd have Buckhead, Midtown and Georgia State.
I prefer the "Georgia_State-Centennial_Olympic_Park-Marietta_Corridor statistical area".


"Downtown" is so 1990's.
     
     
  #5934  
Old Posted Nov 28, 2012, 7:05 PM
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Originally Posted by briantech View Post
I prefer the "Georgia_State-Centennial_Olympic_Park-Marietta_Corridor statistical area".


"Downtown" is so 1990's.
I see, the old GSCOPMCA designation. I can see it catching on.
     
     
  #5935  
Old Posted Nov 28, 2012, 9:29 PM
testarossa50 testarossa50 is offline
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Summer 2013 is quite aggressive. Either way, seems good to know that project has legs.

clexmond--awesome map indeed. One thing the map is missing is the new OPM center at Peachtree Street and Peachtree Valley. It looks to be nearing completion.
     
     
  #5936  
Old Posted Nov 28, 2012, 9:48 PM
smArTaLlone smArTaLlone is offline
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Originally Posted by bigstick View Post
I am all for a new stadium, but it pisses me off that taxpayers have to foot 300 million, Arthur Blank could pay for it in cash. He ought to take into consideration what his partner did on the Aquarium. Build it as a gift for the city, he, (Blank), is a stingy sob anyway.
Keep in mind that the stadium will cost around $1 billion. Blank along with the NFL ($150 million I think) will fund the rest. The Aquarium didn't cost $1 billion and what he will spend on the stadium is certainly not cheap.
     
     
  #5937  
Old Posted Nov 28, 2012, 11:08 PM
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Originally Posted by ATL_J View Post
Currently the Georgia Dome can't attract many of the events the city, Arthur Blank, and I imagine a lot of people (including myself) would enjoy to host (Super Bowls, non-friendly soccer matches, etc.). A new stadium would not only be able to compete for these events, but to continue to bring in the events we've grown accustomed too (NFL games, NCAA Final Fours, bowl games, etc.).
This just isn't true. The dome continues to host a number of very high profile events. The SEC championship, Chick-Fil-A bowl and Chick-Fil-A kickoff games every year, and the NCAA Final Four next year (already hosted twice in the past decade), just for example.

We will eventually need a replacement stadium, and I'm fine with some hotel/motel tax being spent on it, but now is not the time. Maybe 10-15 years from now. There are just WAY better things the city could do right now with $300 million, even when limited to things that directly impact tourists. Improved sidewalks and streetscapes, expand the Ambassador program, fund MARTA renovations, expand the streetcar out to the Beltline, improve police/security, deal with the Ptree/Pine shelter problem, fund more events in Centennial Park, better signs and wayfinding, better crosswalk infrastructure, tourism advertising and promotion, etc etc etc

I also have zero faith in a new stadium being "integrated" into the surrounding neighborhoods. Football stadiums are too large for that to occur. I can't think of any NFL stadium in the entire county that is well integrated into an urban environment. They all are either suburban or surrounded by parking lots or park space. The concept only really works with smaller (baseball, basketball, hockey) stadiums. If even NYC, DC, Boston, etc can't have an urban NFL stadium, I don't think Atlanta can pull it off. Just look at the Falcon's own estimates for how many parking spaces will be needed for the new stadium.

And as for the economic benefit, check out the peer-reviewed literature. Most of it says that taxpayer subsidized stadiums either have no effect or a negative effect on the local economy.
     
     
  #5938  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2012, 12:15 AM
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I see, the old GSCOPMCA designation. I can see it catching on.
Downtown sounds the best.
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  #5939  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2012, 2:32 AM
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This just isn't true. The dome continues to host a number of very high profile events. The SEC championship, Chick-Fil-A bowl and Chick-Fil-A kickoff games every year, and the NCAA Final Four next year (already hosted twice in the past decade), just for example.

We will eventually need a replacement stadium, and I'm fine with some hotel/motel tax being spent on it, but now is not the time. Maybe 10-15 years from now. There are just WAY better things the city could do right now with $300 million, even when limited to things that directly impact tourists. Improved sidewalks and streetscapes, expand the Ambassador program, fund MARTA renovations, expand the streetcar out to the Beltline, improve police/security, deal with the Ptree/Pine shelter problem, fund more events in Centennial Park, better signs and wayfinding, better crosswalk infrastructure, tourism advertising and promotion, etc etc etc

I also have zero faith in a new stadium being "integrated" into the surrounding neighborhoods. Football stadiums are too large for that to occur. I can't think of any NFL stadium in the entire county that is well integrated into an urban environment. They all are either suburban or surrounded by parking lots or park space. The concept only really works with smaller (baseball, basketball, hockey) stadiums. If even NYC, DC, Boston, etc can't have an urban NFL stadium, I don't think Atlanta can pull it off. Just look at the Falcon's own estimates for how many parking spaces will be needed for the new stadium.

And as for the economic benefit, check out the peer-reviewed literature. Most of it says that taxpayer subsidized stadiums either have no effect or a negative effect on the local economy.

Amen. There is very little proof that stadiums provide a net positive financial/economic benefit to their host cities. College football programs are one thing, and while many derail college athletic program spending (especially as it pertains to football), there is a reason such top universities as Stanford, USC, Duke, Vanderbilt, Michigan, and others have hefty programs. People don't move to cities for football teams/stadiums, but people do base college choice decisions on a scale of "college life" vs academics.

I commend Blank for putting up hundreds of millions of dollars of his own to do this, it is certainly a lot more than Bernie has thrown at any individual project, but Bernie has thrown more money at education/universities and healthcare and the beloved Aquarium, which is probably a larger quality of life attraction in Atlanta than the football stadium. Blank does have the Alfred Blank Foundation and I would definitely not be one to complain or nitpick where he has put his own fortune in our community, though I am opposed to taxpayer subsidies for a new stadium *right now*.

Where it hasn't been proven that stadiums have a positive impact on their communities, it HAS been proven time and time again that there is a tangible net positive economic and intangible impact that comes with better public transit such as streetcars and light rail (fixed rail). Add to that our generally poor infrastructure in the city, from our roads to our bike lanes, which are pathetic, to the lack of any timing of lights for vehicles and the lack of any useful pedestrian crosswalk signals (even on the stopped side of a one-way they don't automatically signal to walk unless the button is pressed).

I could go on about the countless better ways to spend taxpayer money, but I'll stop. If I lived anywhere near the proposed stadium "on the wrong side" per se, I would be livid. No matter what they say, any new football stadium will be just as divisive as the current stadium. Such is the nature of football stadiums ANYWHERE.

And let's face it, Superbowls are generally found in retrospect to be big time financial losses to cities that host them and most demonstrate no net positive economic impact. There have been a few superbowls of late that have reversed the trend, I believe Indy being one of them. It worked for Indy for several reasons, but it probably won't work for Atlanta, nor does Atlanta need a superbowl for that exposure (we already have). For events such as those, Atlanta tends to overspend and there is nothing to gain from them that the city doesn't already have.

Ok rant over.
     
     
  #5940  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2012, 3:17 AM
jpk1292000 jpk1292000 is offline
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Originally Posted by simms3_redux View Post
Amen. There is very little proof that stadiums provide a net positive financial/economic benefit to their host cities. College football programs are one thing, and while many derail college athletic program spending (especially as it pertains to football), there is a reason such top universities as Stanford, USC, Duke, Vanderbilt, Michigan, and others have hefty programs. People don't move to cities for football teams/stadiums, but people do base college choice decisions on a scale of "college life" vs academics.

I commend Blank for putting up hundreds of millions of dollars of his own to do this, it is certainly a lot more than Bernie has thrown at any individual project, but Bernie has thrown more money at education/universities and healthcare and the beloved Aquarium, which is probably a larger quality of life attraction in Atlanta than the football stadium. Blank does have the Alfred Blank Foundation and I would definitely not be one to complain or nitpick where he has put his own fortune in our community, though I am opposed to taxpayer subsidies for a new stadium *right now*.

Where it hasn't been proven that stadiums have a positive impact on their communities, it HAS been proven time and time again that there is a tangible net positive economic and intangible impact that comes with better public transit such as streetcars and light rail (fixed rail). Add to that our generally poor infrastructure in the city, from our roads to our bike lanes, which are pathetic, to the lack of any timing of lights for vehicles and the lack of any useful pedestrian crosswalk signals (even on the stopped side of a one-way they don't automatically signal to walk unless the button is pressed).

I could go on about the countless better ways to spend taxpayer money, but I'll stop. If I lived anywhere near the proposed stadium "on the wrong side" per se, I would be livid. No matter what they say, any new football stadium will be just as divisive as the current stadium. Such is the nature of football stadiums ANYWHERE.

And let's face it, Superbowls are generally found in retrospect to be big time financial losses to cities that host them and most demonstrate no net positive economic impact. There have been a few superbowls of late that have reversed the trend, I believe Indy being one of them. It worked for Indy for several reasons, but it probably won't work for Atlanta, nor does Atlanta need a superbowl for that exposure (we already have). For events such as those, Atlanta tends to overspend and there is nothing to gain from them that the city doesn't already have.

Ok rant over.
I couldn't agree more. It annoys me immensely that this $300 million in taxpayer funding will go to build a new stadium when the Dome is fine the way it is now, and I'm a Falcons fan. $300 million spent on regional infrastructure would have much better return on the investment. I think that building the new stadium with a primary goal of attracting a Super Bowl doesn't seem worth the payoff. Atlanta already hosts so many major college sports championships in the Dome, it doesn't really need the visibility that the Super Bowl would bring.

I haven't been following every last detail of the plan to build the new stadium, but it feels like it's almost a done deal. The momentum is there, and it's going to get rammed down our throats whether we like it or not.
     
     
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