LOS ANGELES | Downtown Project Rundown 4.0

[Illithid Dude]

Originally Posted by alki

It seems in too many American cities, the development of office skyscrapers and hotels automatically preclude first floor retail. Until we get over that cutural perogative, there will not be just dead spaces in American downtowns but dead areas that cover blocks of a DT area.

I think that cultural prerogative has ended. Most new office buildings now have some form or retail in them. Walking around Vancouver or Toronto in particular this is noticed, as both cities have multiple new office towers with ground floor retail. The issue is, office towers are not commonly built buildings in America nowadays, so the opportunity to make examples of this practice is not often found.

Sorry if I am writing a little dry right now, but I have just finished writing a lab report and am still somewhat on that 'scientific writing' mindset.

[Trojan]

I was walking downtown today from my gym at 7th and Olive over to get coffee on Spring St., which is something I haven't done in a while. It was nice to see the green bike lane, but otherwise the walk wasn't too pleasant. I know that downtown has been progressively getting better but my walk was still uncomfortable because of the homeless. One lady was barking like an animal at a trash can and she had shit stains on her butt and some other similar characters. Although I know the homeless don't pose much of a threat, I still felt uncomfortable and not very safe. I like downtown a lot but I can see why other people don't like the area too much yet. Got a lot to work on in DT. Will all the jewelry stores go away you think along 7th or are those going to be institutionalized?

[Trojan]

To add to that, Caffe Primo on Flower is ridiculous. I hope the place closes down and changes ownership. I paid $18 for lunch which turned out to be a sloppy piece of lasagna, a side salad that came with no dressing and a coke in a plastic cup. Waste of a great space under Pegasus.

[colemonkee]

^ I hear you on 7th Street. The renaissance that has improved 7th Street really ends at Olive, and from Olive to Broadway it gets a little dicey. It's those stretches that need to be sewn up, and in my opinion, eventually will. But I think it will take some time. 6th Street is another corridor that could be cleaned up to connect the Historic Core with the Financial District and the Standard.

I'm disappointed to hear a bad review of Cafe Primo. That is a prime space, and hopefully they improve the service. Downtown actually has a lot of options in that area for weekday lunch and dinner, so if they don't improve, they'll go out of business in 6-12 months. Unless they're a front for something else.

[DistrictDirt]

Originally Posted by colemonkee

^ I hear you on 7th Street. The renaissance that has improved 7th Street really ends at Olive, and from Olive to Broadway it gets a little dicey. It's those stretches that need to be sewn up, and in my opinion, eventually will. But I think it will take some time. 6th Street is another corridor that could be cleaned up to connect the Historic Core with the Financial District and the Standard.

I'm disappointed to hear a bad review of Cafe Primo. That is a prime space, and hopefully they improve the service. Downtown actually has a lot of options in that area for weekday lunch and dinner, so if they don't improve, they'll go out of business in 6-12 months. Unless they're a front for something else.

We need to find a solution to the Skid Row issue, no question. As DTLA gets nicer and more affluent, these encounters such as the one Trojan described are going to be thrown into starker relief. If things don't change, it WILL be the limiting factor to DTLA's growth and prosperity. We're not there yet- not by along shot, but its coming.

[BrandonJXN]

That's one thing I think people fail to really grasp. Downtown is a cool neighborhood that's only going to get cooler and more organic feeling. But there is so much that needs to be done other than open up a cool trendy restaurant in order for DTLA to truly be great. The homeless is a huge issue. Probably THE issue blocking downtown truly being a great place to be but that's an issue that can be debated about until a Lebron ring.

[Illithid Dude]

Originally Posted by ThreeHundred

That's one thing I think people fail to really grasp. Downtown is a cool neighborhood that's only going to get cooler and more organic feeling. But there is so much that needs to be done other than open up a cool trendy restaurant in order for DTLA to truly be great. The homeless is a huge issue. Probably THE issue blocking downtown truly being a great place to be but that's an issue that can be debated about until a Lebron ring.

Eh, I've never been bothered by the homeless population. I'd say there are just as many homeless people in Venice or Santa Monica as there are on Spring or 7th. Actually, I think that people in L.A. are much more accustomed to homeless then other cities. For some reason, I see more homeless people in L.A. then anywhere else. Must be the weather...

[BrandonJXN]

Originally Posted by Illithid Dude

Eh, I've never been bothered by the homeless population. I'd say there are just as many homeless people in Venice or Santa Monica as there are on Spring or 7th. Actually, I think that people in L.A. are much more accustomed to homeless then other cities. For some reason, I see more homeless people in L.A. then anywhere else. Must be the weather...

I also don't freak out when I see the homeless. I have no idea what can be do about that situation though.

But I'd rather be homeless here than homeless in say Detroit or Buffalo.

[sopas ej]

Originally Posted by Illithid Dude

Eh, I've never been bothered by the homeless population. I'd say there are just as many homeless people in Venice or Santa Monica as there are on Spring or 7th. Actually, I think that people in L.A. are much more accustomed to homeless then other cities. For some reason, I see more homeless people in L.A. then anywhere else. Must be the weather...

Originally Posted by ThreeHundred

I also don't freak out when I see the homeless. I have no idea what can be do about that situation though.

But I'd rather be homeless here than homeless in say Detroit or Buffalo.

Me three. I don't freak out when I see homeless people either; it's the reality of large American cities. The fact that there's homeless people at all, speaks of a larger problem that needs to be addressed in this country, much larger and more important than how "urban" a neighborhood is or that there's a parking lot on the corner, or how "uncomfortable" a homeless person might make somebody, but that's another topic altogether. If someone is only used to encountering the same kinds of people that make up their comfort zone, and not all kinds and/or different kinds of people, then maybe an American urban environment isn't for them.

[RonPalmer]

Now that downtown LA has become a neighborhood, why don't they move all the services that attract the homeless population somewhere else (the weather is just as good everywhere else in LA ) There are underused and unused industrial spaces in the area of Avalon and Slauson, the city is trying to figure out what to do with those, why not provide services and housing for the people who currently live around skid row? Not only would that make downtown a much more desirable place, but you could also re-adapt the current downtown shelters and hotels into efficiencies for budget travelers and lofts, and not have to worry about the residents getting displaced.

[citywatch]

Originally Posted by alki

You keep pointing out parking lots as dead spaces but bldgs can be dead spaces as well.

I don't disagree, alki. however, when it comes to deadness or badness, I think it's a matter of degrees. so as unfriendly as is the part of dt you describe, I suspect more ppl will be more turned off by areas that are outright rundown, vacant----including big gap parking lots----& fugly.

Plus everyone has different reactions to some place or area. for instance, notice how forumers like trojan are more bothered than others by an area with lots of homeless ppl. That too is a matter of degrees, since the homeless tend to stand out more in dtla, not just cuz there's more of them here than elsewhere (the downside to having nice weather), but cuz the sidewalks of LA at the same time often aren't packed with the types of ppl---meaning those with $$----that make up a big part of the best cities in this country & elsewhere.

but since I don't wanna make this thread become too much of a downer again, i'm gonna post this pic of the newly opened Artisan house. All the other photos of it have shown a mostly empty place, so it looks different (& more friendly) when full of ppl....


hollywoodreporter.com

I don't hesitate to say the hood still has lots of gaps & deadzones, so the suggestion that things would be better with more stores & other ppl friendly businesses is a given. But it's a chicken or egg problem. how can more stores open in dtla when there aren't enough customers to support those stores? or how do you make more ppl want to walk throughout more parts of dt when not enough businesses are willing or able to open enough good places to shop or eat in?

But some may say I'm being too skeptical, & they may be right. So I'll leave off with something I've just read in the hollywood reporter. It's left me with a image going through my mind right now.....

It involves another new business in the hood, but on the opposite side of dt from where the artisan house is located. It's attracting at least a few customers like a woman who is one of the biggies of the british acting community. She won an oscar a few yrs ago for portraying british royalty. the thought of her schlepping to a saloon in a gritty----or "off the beaten path"----part of dtla means anything is possible....

Actor Rio Hackford (Toby on HBO’s Treme) -- who appears next with Vince Vaughn and Bruce Willis in Stephen Frears’ Lay The Favorite, which screens at Sundance in January -- may just be the ultimate L.A. barfly. His father, director Taylor Hackford, hung out with Charles Bukowski -- and often so did he. (“My earliest memories, as a kid, were being at the [race]track and the dives downtown with the two of them.”)

Hackford eventually moved to New Orleans, opening nostalgic neo-dives Pal’s Lounge and One Eyed Jack’s, as well as another outpost of a similar sensibility in San Francisco called Homestead. Now he’s returned to L.A., backed by downtown bar baron Cedd Moses (Seven Grand, the Golden Gopher), and has recently completely renovated what he describes as a former "down-and-dirty pool hall” known as Monty west of the 110 freeway into a grand old-timey saloon where the soundtrack runs from Merle Haggard to Curtis Mayfield and the most appropriate drink order is simply a whiskey—straight up.

THR: Well, (Monty is) not that off-the-beaten path. Los Angeles Center Studios is just a few blocks to the northeast.

Hackford: Yeah, a lot of the Mad Men guys have been coming in when they get off of work. It’s a safe haven. Nobody bugs them.

THR: Who else has been in?

Hackford: Vince. My dad and step-mom. He and Helen [Mirren] were just in last weekend.

igossip.com


bestweekever.tv


globalgiants.com

[alki]

[QUOTE=Illithid Dude;5508933]I think that cultural prerogative has ended. Most new office buildings now have some form or retail in them. Walking around Vancouver or Toronto in particular this is noticed, as both cities have multiple new office towers with ground floor retail. The issue is, office towers are not commonly built buildings in America nowadays, so the opportunity to make examples of this practice is not often found.{/QUOTE]

Idon't think its ended but I think its ending......esp in cities like Chicago, NYC, SFO and Boston. I think its one of the reasons the DTs in those cities are so dynamic.

I am not as familiar with Canadian cities but you're right.......Vancouver office bldgs typically have retail at their base.

Sorry if I am writing a little dry right now, but I have just finished writing a lab report and am still somewhat on that 'scientific writing' mindset.

Are you in a grad program?

[alki]

Originally Posted by citywatch

I don't hesitate to say the hood still has lots of gaps & deadzones, so the suggestion that things would be better with more stores & other ppl friendly businesses is a given. But it's a chicken or egg problem. how can more stores open in dtla when there aren't enough customers to support those stores? or how do you make more ppl want to walk throughout more parts of dt when not enough businesses are willing or able to open enough good places to shop or eat in?

This is a bit of a dilemma for DT. There seems to be good growth in residential housing, average growth of hotels and virtually no growth in office demand. In fact, there is little office growth throughout the LA metro. Offices generate a lot of food traffic and consumers. That means DT needs to start poaching..........I mean encourage companies from other office submarkets to relocate DT....like Gensler is doing.

It involves another new business in the hood, but on the opposite side of dt from where the artisan house is located. It's attracting at least a few customers like a woman who is one of the biggies of the british acting community. She won an oscar a few yrs ago for portraying british royalty. the thought of her schlepping to a saloon in a gritty----or "off the beaten path"----part of dtla means anything is possible....

That place looks impressive........and the crowd eating there even more so. Twelve years ago, you would never see that many people dining in all of DT let alone in one restaurant.

[Illithid Dude]

Originally Posted by alki

This is a bit of a dilemma for DT. There seems to be good growth in residential housing, average growth of hotels and virtually no growth in office demand.

Once again, sounds like Vancouver, whose downtown is mostly residential.

Originally Posted by alki

Are you in a grad program?

If you could call high school that.

[213]

To add to that, Caffe Primo on Flower is ridiculous.

An odd place, for sure. On my last visit they wouldn't sell me an apple from a bowl on the counter ("They're just for display"), while the beer neon and ESPN seem off-kilter with the earthy Euro-vibe that I thought was their concept. They seem to do good business, but living a block away they're scarcely on my radar...

[pesto]

How about the Italian Kitchen and Boston Deli? Or am I the last person on earth that remembers those two.

[LosAngelesBeauty]

Originally Posted by Trojan

I was walking downtown today from my gym at 7th and Olive over to get coffee on Spring St., which is something I haven't done in a while. It was nice to see the green bike lane, but otherwise the walk wasn't too pleasant. I know that downtown has been progressively getting better but my walk was still uncomfortable because of the homeless. One lady was barking like an animal at a trash can and she had shit stains on her butt and some other similar characters. Although I know the homeless don't pose much of a threat, I still felt uncomfortable and not very safe. I like downtown a lot but I can see why other people don't like the area too much yet. Got a lot to work on in DT. Will all the jewelry stores go away you think along 7th or are those going to be institutionalized?

In my opinion, the best way to figure out how to "get rid" of the more-increasingly irrelevant Jewelry District is by getting in more other retailers, such as Brigade LA or Michael Antonio, both of which are now on 7th Street.

The gym at the LA Athletic Club that you are a member of is the best location for the next building to target for new retailers. If we can get all new retailers to take over the LA Athletic Club's retail spaces, akin to those two I already mentioned, then it could really help spark a new trend within the Jewelry District itself, which has been hit hard by the current high prices for gold ($1800 an ounce?).

[Trojan]

Originally Posted by BrighamYen

In my opinion, the best way to figure out how to "get rid" of the more-increasingly irrelevant Jewelry District is by getting in more other retailers, such as Brigade LA or Michael Antonio, both of which are now on 7th Street.

The gym at the LA Athletic Club that you are a member of is the best location for the next building to target for new retailers. If we can get all new retailers to take over the LA Athletic Club's retail spaces, akin to those two I already mentioned, then it could really help spark a new trend within the Jewelry District itself, which has been hit hard by the current high prices for gold ($1800 an ounce?).

I agree. The sidewalk on the Olive side of the corner of LAAC should also have a better streetlight and some type of permanent bus stop with seating because there are always at least a dozen people waiting for the bus in the dark next to the retail underneath LAAC.

[LosAngelesBeauty]

Originally Posted by Trojan

I agree. The sidewalk on the Olive side of the corner of LAAC should also have a better streetlight and some type of permanent bus stop with seating because there are always at least a dozen people waiting for the bus in the dark next to the retail underneath LAAC.

That's a great idea. Unfortunately, because so many ppl do wait at that bus stop, the future business that goes into that corner space (now an optometrist), must do something to aesthetically cover up the window facing the bus stop on Olive St.

[Vangelist]

So now Helen Mirren is being used as some sort of litmus test of what downtown should attract as we wish the homeless would just vanish elsewhere, inconvenient as they are to our neighborhood walks? This thread never stops. I love the perpetual conscious and otherwise classist statements!

Speaking of people walking, the art walk last night, just from observing it on a street level as I went across the street to eat something, seemed really dead - especially from its peak crowds in oh, 2008-2009. I think it was already starting to wane last year with the decision to try and make it quarterly, and the dead baby freak accident-incident killed off whatever was left of its status as a monthly event. Few local artists actually made money from it, and it's mostly a street festival thing now that restaurant owners exploit. Without the food trucks everywhere it almost looked like just another night in the city which is saying something positive actually: you don't need a monthly "event" to see people walking the streets of the Old Bank District. At this point in downtown's redevelopment, every night in this area of town is filled with pedestrians and patrons of local businesses, and the weekends are the busiest. The art walk served its purpose, and I'm not sure if it's even needed anymore, but it was still somewhat depressing to see how few people were milling around compared to years past. I guess that era, exciting as it was to see people flock to and rediscover the city center, is now over

I wish the Historic Core had a movie theater larger than the Downtown Independent; I'm still missing the Laemmle on Fig. The Regal only serves one corner of downtown, with one type of film (commercially big) for one type of audience; the DI features really small pictures. We're missing that venue that features the medium-sized releases