Edmonton Public Transit

[mcc16]

That is crazy to see tracks! These must be for the Kingsway/ royal alex station. Aren't the tracks usually one of the last things to go in?

[SHOFEAR]

Is it not extremely odd to see them place the tracks before the concrete is poured?

[MalcolmTucker]

I would guess it is for sound control in the curve, in any case odd.

[oiler-dude]

Perhaps they're laying the track in that section now so that Kingsway can fully open, without having to be ripped up again to install the crossing?

IIRC, the track for the entrance to Southgate (just south of 51ave) was laid on the road crossing months before any other track was laid, so that the crossing was fully complete.

My only guess.

[Hardhatdan]

Originally Posted by SHOFEAR

Is it not extremely odd to see them place the tracks before the concrete is poured?

Yes, on the last extension the mass pour of concrete was completed and then the precision pour was done next where the degree of accuracy was something like +/- 1/8". However, on the last section this was only done at the tunnels, the road crossing were not concrete, they were sub-grade, sub-ballast, ballast (I think) then capped over with asphalt. This looks like a new design, where the track is laid with top of rail flush to top of concrete, where concrete is used for the entire section of the crossing. Seems alot more expensive to me...note all stainless steel (too shiny for galvanized) rebar.

[MalcolmTucker]

Road crossings in Calgary are made with wooden ties covered with removalable concrete panels to ease maintenance. I doubt something this fancy was needed.

[Hardhatdan]

Originally Posted by MalcolmTucker

Road crossings in Calgary are made with wooden ties covered with removalable concrete panels to ease maintenance. I doubt something this fancy was needed.

You are right, it very much isn't required and from the SLRT, road crossing were wood ties as well.
However a few things, LRT design criteria in Edmonton is a 100 year lifespan so alot of what people see or might consider excessive is a product of that (such as all SS or Epoxy coated rebar), that said, that still does not come without maintenance. However, this may have been done in an attempt to reduce future maintenance outages at a major road crossing by "overbuilding".
I would really like to know why the shift in philosophy, but I doubt we will ever have the luxury.

[MalcolmTucker]

I would really like to know why the shift in philosophy, but I doubt we will ever have the luxury.

The province funding capital but not maintenance is the likely culprit, with no civic contribution to incent cost control.

[feepa]

looking at the 105th avenue pit - is it really needed that wide - or is there some future roughed-in station planning going on here?!? Seems awfully wide from the pictures and even in person for just two sets of tracks coming pretty much straight out...

[Coldrsx]

Logistics and safety my guess. They could have shored but it would be more time an mo money. Instead cut back.

[CMD UW]

Originally Posted by Coldrsx

Logistics and safety my guess. They could have shored but it would be more time an mo money. Instead cut back.

Correct. If you have the room use it.

[Hardhatdan]

Originally Posted by CMD UW

Correct. If you have the room use it.

For excavations deeper than 25' (I believe) the shoring is required to be designed and stamped by a professional engineer. There is also potential issues with it being considered a confined space, provided there is only one point of egress (mute point here with the slopped entrance). That said, if space allows the excavation will be cut back at 45deg which takes care of the requirement for engineered or expensive box shoring and allows ready access to both sides of the concrete formwork which will form the tunnel/portal walls increasing the productivity for the formwork crew. Bulk excavation to cut the 45 is relatively cheap, especially if there is room for the spoil pile by the trench, so it doesn't have to be trucked away, and it can be used for backfill after form stripping.

[Mikemike]

Originally Posted by Hardhatdan

This looks like a new design, where the track is laid with top of rail flush to top of concrete, where concrete is used for the entire section of the crossing. Seems alot more expensive to me...note all stainless steel (too shiny for galvanized) rebar.

The old crossings on the NE line are in really rough shape after 30 years. One was replaced recently in a weekend, on 95st.
This crossing is curved, so there are big issues with movement that would likely kill a tie and ballast crossing quickly. This design looks to be based on a streetcar design used in toronto to keep the tracks quieter and reduce maintenance. At least there it's designed so that the upper layer can be replaced easily and the lower level is supposed to last practically forever.

[Coldrsx]

Downtown LRT meeting tonight

LRT Recommendation - The project team is sharing the details of its recommendation for the area located between 95 and 97 Street, and 102 and 102A Avenue. Feedback from the session will be gathered for report to Council.

Date: Wednesday, October 5, 2011
Location: Winspear Centre
Address: 4 Sir Winston Churchill Square (southeast door)
Time: 4 - 8pm
No RSVP required, staff will be available throughout the evening.

http://www.edmonton.ca/transportation/ets/lrt_projects/downtown-lrt-connector.aspx

[rapid_business]

Listen up, Ottawa: Transit is our No. 1 need
We need fierce provincial leaders to push for a 'new urban age'

BY DAVID STAPLES, EDMONTON JOURNAL OCTOBER 12, 2011

Premier Alison Redford has talked the transit talk, but today it's imperative she appoint passionate advocates for public transit to cabinet for Alberta's Infrastructure and Transportation ministries.

Redford comes across as genuinely enthusiastic and perhaps even visionary when it comes to the province finally getting completely behind transit in Alberta's cities. Her inspirational rhetoric means little, though, if we see the same kind of Progressive Conservative cabinet ministers who don't use transit and also fail to understand how it can help transform and boost Calgary, Edmonton and the province's other cities.

"I think that finally it's going to be a new urban age in Alberta," says Don Iveson, a leading transit advocate on Edmonton city council and the chair of the Capital Region Board's transportation committee. "But the question will be: does that permeate to Municipal Affairs or into some other areas as well, like Housing and Justice and Transportation. I'll be looking to see if the people in those portfolios have a pedigree in understanding the issues that larger urban centres face."...<cont.>

http://www.edmontonjournal.com/news/Listen+Ottawa+Transit+need/5536387/story.html

[Coldrsx]

Good article, although i'd rather we get the LRT expanded within the AHD to each area prior to catering to park and rides.

[rapid_business]

City report recommends against LRT turnstiles
4:40 pm
Click here to email Scott Johnston
10/13/2011

A city report says installing turnstiles at LRT entrances would cost two-and-a-half times more in staffing and maintenance than it would save in lost revenue from riders skipping out on paying their fare.
The report concludes that there is no business case to support installing turnstiles.
While fare evasion would drop by a third from 4.5 per cent to 1.5 per cent, it would cost more than $5 million a year to save $2 million in lost revenue. And that doesn't include the $15 million in up front capital costs.... <cont.>

http://www.inews880.com/Channels/Reg/Loc...tm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

[Shodan]

'Old-style' north LRT line will frustrate many

Edmonton Journal

Sunday, October 16, 2011

I participated in a mock LRT crossing protest on Oct. 7 at 107th Avenue and 105th Street.

Between 4: 30 and 5: 15 p.m., about 20 people blocked the west crosswalk on 107th Avenue for the duration of the pedestrian walk lights. We didn't inconvenience the east-west traffic at all, but the lineup in the northbound lane of 105th Street stretched to 104th Avenue and beyond.

Our purpose was not to annoy commuters, although we did that regrettably well.

We instead aimed to provide a realtime demonstration of what Edmontonians can expect if the proposed deeply flawed north LRT route is allowed to proceed...

Rob McDonald, Edmonton
© Edmonton Journal 2011

Copyright © 2011 CanWest Interactive, a division of CanWest MediaWorks Publications, Inc.. All rights reserved.
CanWest Interactive, a division of CanWest MediaWorks Publications, Inc.. All rights reserved.

http://www2.canada.com/components/print.aspx?id=af78a71f-3669-4038-9000-c919ccfa82c8&sponsor=

[MalcolmTucker]

Of course, a shallow "cut-andcover" trench would incur more capital cost than a surface line. Transportation services personnel, quoted in television coverage of our protest, explained that an underground extension here would be "too expensive."

That is silo thinking at its worst. Where in the department's formula is the cost of generations of motorist inconvenience? Where is the depreciated value of the owner-occupied condo buildings on 105th Street north of 107th Avenue?

Where in this letter is the close to 100% odds the writer is a unit owner in one of the the owner-occupied condo buildings on 105th Street north of 107th Avenue?

Who else would organize such a protest but a condo board?

I have sympathies for them since this wasn't designated (to my knowledge) as a potential corridor until somewhat recently, but thems the breaks. They should have attempted to sell as soon as they heard of the potential development - but now they are likely locked in until construction is done and it hopefully turns out better than the expect.

Were these people around 2, 3 years ago - or did they suddenly realize this project was real once construction crews started showing up?

[feepa]

^ they were around, but didn't make much stink. I gather now that the project has started, they will ramp up the rhetoric. I know this isn't the first time they have raised concerns though...
For the city, it would probably be cheaper to buy up the land owners on one side of 105th street,and build the tracks there and leave the road rather than to tunnel.

The people living north of 107th ave on 105th have a tiny bit of my support. They are not within convenient walking distance to an LRT station, they will lose their road, and also have to deal with the noise of trains, and I'm going to guess their little 3-4 story woodframe walkups don't have much to isolate the sound of the street as it is.