ATLANTA TRANSIT (Marta, Beltline, Peachtree Streetcar, LovJoy Commuter, etc...)

[Fiorenza]

1% may not seem like a lot of sales tax, but it adds to the overhead cost of living. It would definitely depress economic activity and would remove resources from what I consider to be the productive sector of the economy.

For various reasons Atlanta will not in the future grow much if at all, and with the cost of gas predicted to be at $5, there will be less demands on the roads. You may think masstransit is the answer, but the state of Georgia is not about to put any serious money into it because it cannot efficiently serve 90% of the region's population. We are too spread out, for better or worse.

[mike1986]

Originally Posted by Fiorenza

1% may not seem like a lot of sales tax, but it adds to the overhead cost of living. It would definitely depress economic activity and would remove resources from what I consider to be the productive sector of the economy.

For various reasons Atlanta will not in the future grow much if at all, and with the cost of gas predicted to be at $5, there will be less demands on the roads. You may think masstransit is the answer, but the state of Georgia is not about to put any serious money into it because it cannot efficiently serve 90% of the region's population. We are too spread out, for better or worse.

Fulton and Dekalb Counties have had a one cent sales tax for MARTA for over 30 years now and it hasn't depressed their economic activity. Other counties across the country have implemented similar sales taxes and it hasn't depressed their economic activity either. I don't know where you are getting this idea from?

Also, within the areas that have already "grown", there is plenty of room to densify and build a less spread out environment (lots of infill opportunities). Mass transit can work here... MARTA is already in the top 10 in terms of ridership and a robust commuter rail system would be a great fit for our metro area, as well as HOT lanes and some sort of rail line (light rail?) across the perimeter.

And you are right, Atlanta won't grow much in the future IF WE DON'T DO ANYTHING ABOUT OUR INFRASTRUCTURE PROBLEMS.

[Fiorenza]

Fulton and Dekalb Counties have had a one cent sales tax for MARTA for over 30 years now and it hasn't depressed their economic activity.

Ya think? Is that why retail is doing so great in Fulton and Dekalb? Is that why I see all those Fulton/Dekalb tags in Gwinnett retail venues?

Atlanta won't grow much in the future IF WE DON'T DO ANYTHING ABOUT OUR INFRASTRUCTURE PROBLEMS.

Tell me again, what's so great about growth?

[mike1986]

Originally Posted by Fiorenza

Ya think? Is that why retail is doing so great in Fulton and Dekalb? Is that why I see all those Fulton/Dekalb tags in Gwinnett retail venues?



Tell me again, what's so great about growth?

Are you serious? Really, are you? If people live on the border of Gwinnett and Fulton/Dekalb, a store they shop at may be in Gwinnett and vice versa. If you live near the border, people will go to the closest store whether it is in Gwinnett or Fulton or Dekalb. It is about convenience - it has nothing to do with the sales tax and it hasn't stopped Fulton and Dekalb from growing. I would like to remind you that Fulton and Dekalb have recently been adding more people than Gwinnett and Cobb.

And you tell me again, what is so great about stagnation or decline?

[Fiorenza]

Fewer Americans Bought Hybrid Cars in 2010; Green ‘Movement’ Fades, Harris Poll Finds

[echinatl]

Originally Posted by Fiorenza

Fewer Americans Bought Hybrid Cars in 2010; Green ‘Movement’ Fades, Harris Poll Finds

Aww I call BS on this entire article. And CNS News, —!? "The Right News. Right Now" HAHAHAHAHAHHA. Where are you finding this stuff??

Do you think more fuel efficient non hybrid cars being introduced to the market have anything to do with this? Hybrid cars are also generally more expensive, you dont think the economy has had an affect on high price items? Hybrids are going to be bandaids until full battery powered vehicles get out there, it's the future. But right now they are a good fit for a lot of people.

[Fiorenza]

the green jobs fallacy

[echinatl]

Originally Posted by Fiorenza

the green jobs fallacy

So they use 1 example of a business that couldn't compete to try to drive the point across that green jobs promotion is a fallacy? There are other solar companies in the US doing well. What's your point? Stop spreading this trash around.

[cybele]

Well, here is a good one, that Everygreen thing must have just been a bad situation. They orto put one down here in Georgia where we have low taxes and so forth.

While One Big Solar PV Plant Is Closing, Three New Ones Are Expected to Open

[echinatl]

Originally Posted by cybele

Well, here is a good one, that Everygreen thing must have just been a bad situation. They orto put one down here in Georgia where we have low taxes and so forth.

While One Big Solar PV Plant Is Closing, Three New Ones Are Expected to Open

There are so many great reasons to go "green" that don't involve having to believe in climate change we're guaranteed to continue moving in that direction.

[Fiorenza]

In the absence of massive subsidies from soon-to-be-bankrupt federal and state governments, "green" is a joke.

[Fiorenza]

UAW idiots

[BlindFatSnake]

Originally Posted by Fiorenza

All I'm saying is, the US and Atlanta are in decline. The deficit is not just a theory. We can no longer afford the discretionary items like infrastructure improvements.

The Atlanta fall in income, employment and real estate value is worse than any other metropolitan area in the country except Detroit. I think the situation will not turn around - and we better accept it. That's my opinion.

Chcken Little, the sky is NOT falling..

I'm beginning to think you and Cybele are one and the same: Or at least the ying and the yang of assbackward thinking; or, the mirrored images of each other (the left cheek and the right cheek); or, simply a twin pair of oxymorons living out the remainder of your miserable, insolent lives being cantankerous old bitties.

Fiorenza and/or Cybele ponder this: 4 major light rail lines (extending deep into the suburbs), a downtown multi-modal station, and a commuter line under construction simultaneously, what would that do for the Atlanta economy?
House Bill 277 allows for such grand infrastructure projects, and as long as the 10-county Atlanta Regional Commission District votes yes, such projects cannot be stopped by the state.

What are your (or y'all) thoughts???

Peace out dude...

[Fiorenza]

If the regional 1% measly sales tax passes, which I doubt, what percentage of it do you think would be directed to mass transit? 10% or less. This is primarily a highway road-building-lobby-driven measure. The mass transit industry isn't that significant. The road builders will throw Marta just enough of a bone to try and pick up the intown puppets. But it won't work.

[jacksonart55]

I hardly think that infrastructure improvements are discretionary, especially it'll all have to be renovated/replaced sometime in the future. Forget growth, a city with crumbling infrastructure can't even survive, and that obviously can't be good for the region if it's largest city begins to lose luster.

I love this city, and the only thing I want to see for it is growth and prosperity. Not only will we benefit, but the entire region will too. A stable base leads to stable building.

Also, even if this 2012 transportation bill doesn't benefit transit that much, what choice do we have? The status quo is NOT acceptable, and something has to change. The future of Transportation, not only just the Mass kind, in Atlanta needs this kind of help, no matter how small or large it is, and without this bill, we well definitely wither. If Atlanta goes, Georgia does too, and any rural representative in the state has sense enough to see that. They won't let this bill fail.

[Fiorenza]

Sure, everybody wants to see the legacy Atlanta be maintained. Everybody wanted to see the continuation of classical Rome, and remnants of it survive to the present. Everybody wants to see Detroit, New York, Chicago etc. stay the way they have been. It's the Hapsburg Mentality - everything has been this way for 300 years, thus it will never change.

Everything in Atlanta will change, and not for the better. Just the facts.

http://www.businessinsider.com/gerald-celente-trends-2011-1

[echinatl]

Originally Posted by Fiorenza

Sure, everybody wants to see the legacy Atlanta be maintained. Everybody wanted to see the continuation of classical Rome, and remnants of it survive to the present. Everybody wants to see Detroit, New York, Chicago etc. stay the way they have been. It's the Hapsburg Mentality - everything has been this way for 300 years, thus it will never change.

Everything in Atlanta will change, and not for the better. Just the facts.

For someone so open and believing in "change" occurring in Atlanta, you are aggressively against changing any of the systems or technologies that if left unchanged, would probably help your dismal view of the future actually happen.

And they're not facts, they're your opinions.

[jacksonart55]

Everything in Atlanta will change, and not for the better. Just the facts.

I accept that. But I don't think this is Atlanta's time, and this is where we differ.

[Fiorenza]

Sometimes taxing income away from people actually makes the situation worse, especially if the tax method is regressive.

[echinatl]

Originally Posted by Fiorenza

Sometimes taxing income away from people actually makes the situation worse, especially if the tax method is regressive.

And yet there are examples of countries with higher tax rates outperforming the US, does this make your argument invalid, no, because every situation is different, and you can't say "If we do this, this will definitely happen." because that's just not how the world works.