Metro Vancouver Transit Discussion

[paradigm4]

Originally Posted by Waders

From TransLink's Statutory Annual Report :

Source: http://www.translink.ca/en/About-TransLi...racks-Stategic-Plan-Accomplishments.aspx

I like the option to replace all the old MKI car with new MKII car. It will make all skytrain car uniform. Line can then be drawn on the platform floor to indicate the location of train door and I can wait at the same spot.

Interesting to note a blurb from a recent post by Steve Munro, one of the major transit bloggers and advocates in Toronto.

"The SRT will continue operating until after the Pan Am Games in 2015 at which point it will close for reconstruction. Second-hand Mark I ICTS cars will be purchased from Vancouver to supplement the existing fleet in the interim."

[Millennium2002]

Originally Posted by The_Henry_Man

I think Translink should replace all the current LED signs on the E/M-Line platforms and replace them with the C-Line Mitron ones. Mitron LED signs are awesome, easy to see, clear, and the "time to depart" information allows passengers to decide whether they need to run towards the trains in a hurry or not. On the other hand....

I don't think the M-Line LEDs need to be replaced... but they probably need to be adapted.
As for the E-Line LEDs, they might need a replacement soon.

[Mac Write]

If we gutted the Mark I cars, could they be re-configured to increase capacity (and while maintaining same seating levels)? Maybe widend side shells?

[jsbertram]

If you're going to do structural changes such as widening the car bodies, you might as well melt down the Mk I aluminum shells into billets and feed them into the assembly line to make MK IIs.

However, you could take the forward- and rear-facing sets, remove a set, and make the rest center-facing bench seats to get more standing room. You still won't get as much seating/standing room as a Mk II, but it can (slightly) increase the overall capacity by a few bodies.

I've heard Chicago wants to experiment with a few cars that have seats that are locked folded-up during rush hours so a car is standing room only. I hope we don't get that crazy.

[jsbertram]

Originally Posted by paradigm4

Interesting to note a blurb from a recent post by Steve Munro, one of the major transit bloggers and advocates in Toronto.

"The SRT will continue operating until after the Pan Am Games in 2015 at which point it will close for reconstruction. Second-hand Mark I ICTS cars will be purchased from Vancouver to supplement the existing fleet in the interim."

I wonder how they are going to placate the people used to seeing a driver on the Scarborough RT cars, when they get on the driver-less SkyTrain cars?

[jsbertram]

Originally Posted by The_Henry_Man

I think Translink should replace all the current LED signs on the E/M-Line platforms and replace them with the C-Line Mitron ones. Mitron LED signs are awesome, easy to see, clear, and the "time to depart" information allows passengers to decide whether they need to run towards the trains in a hurry or not. On the other hand....

SkyTrain missed an opportunity with the new Rotem cars on the C-Line. Rather than have the yellow LED somewhere else on the car, they should have put a LED sign over each door so when you are looking at the door it will say "Brighouse" or "YVR airport" or "Waterfront", without having to look somewhere else on the side of the car, or the platform signs, or having to make sure you catch the front of the train when it arrives.

I've stopped counting how many times I have been at Waterfront Station heading home, only to hear someone who has seen the train as it's arriving showing "Waterfront" on the front window and wondering if there's a mistake - "I thought this was the platform for the Airport train?!??!" "Where does this waterfront train go to?"

Perhaps between VCC and Waterfront the outside LEDs should change to the terminal of the next trip so when the train arrives at Waterfront the outside LEDs are already signed up for Brighouse or Airport so people waiting at Waterfront can see what train it is.

Or they can just read the LED signs over the platform.

[jsbertram]

Originally Posted by allan_kuan

I don't think the M-Line LEDs need to be replaced... but they probably need to be adapted.
As for the E-Line LEDs, they might need a replacement soon.

If you're going to replace the platform LEDs, why not make them colour so messages for Expo Line have a blue background, and messages for Millennium Line have a yellow background. If you can't use background colours, then perhaps yellow or blue edges around the message for that line. Alerts can still be red. General messages wouldn't have colour highlighting.

Aren't LCDs or Plasma displays bright enough now to be used instead?

Which reminds me.
Move the F*CK*NG advertising LCDs somewhere else SO THEY DONT BLOCK THE PLATFORM MESSAGE LEDs.

[Mac Write]

Why not feed the train info into the LCD TV's full screen when the train is arriving. I can't for the life of me read that small ticker at the bottom of the TV. Way too small (and reading the LED display from a distance is the same thing for me, I have to be like 10ft away to read it).

[Gordon]

I still find that the platform LED boards in some of the above ground stations( Stadium & Main Street) to be not bright enough to read from any distance on bright days.

[TransitJack]

Not sure if it's been mentioned already, but I noticed that some of the recently retired New Flyer 40' High floor buses were moved to a vacant lot on River Dr near the Canada Line OMC. You might be able to see them from the C Line bridge if you look east a few hundred metres.

This was last week though, not sure if they are still there or what the plan is for them.

[TransitJack]

Originally Posted by jsbertram

I look on this as: would you spend $1500 on an old car with no rust and 20KMs and another $1000 making it your daily rider, or $50,000 on a brand new vehicle that's already lost 1/3 of its value as soon as it hits the street.

As much as I like shiney new things, I've got better plans for the $47,000 not spent on a new car. In ten years the fixed up car may be a beater, but by then I'll be looking for another no-rust low-miles daily rider.

If we can rebuild/refurbish the Mk Is at 1/2 or 1/3 the cost of new Mk IIs, why wouldn't you? I can live with freshly scrubbed 'old Mk I' cars if it means the next major purchase of Mk II cars can be delayed by 15-20 years. The Scarborough cars have been lightly used because their ridership has only reached around 40K passengers per day, so they may actually be in better shape than Vancouvers Mk Is.

Perhaps use that as a sweetener for the UBC Skytrain line - whatever we can save by rehabbing the old Mk I cars can be used to lower the cost of building the UBC line. Even a few % in budget savings when spending billions can make a difference when making 'go no-go' decisions.

I'm just not too sure it would make a very good media splash. "Translink buys Toronto's rejected trains"... hard to spin that successfully in Vancouver on two counts. Drew Snider would have his work cut out for him

[jsbertram]

Originally Posted by TransitJack

I'm just not too sure it would make a very good media splash. "Translink buys Toronto's rejected trains"... hard to spin that successfully in Vancouver on two counts. Drew Snider would have his work cut out for him

"TransLink saves money by refurbishing original Expo SkyTrain cars"

"We can save over $100 million by refurbishing the original cars instead of purchasing new SkyTrain cars right now"

"Doing this will postpone the need for purchasing new cars by 10 to 15 years, or whenever the proposed Surrey Extension is completed."

"If NYC can take their 35-year-old subway cars and put them thorough a scheduled mid-life refurbishing program to get another 25 years of service out of them, we should be able to do the same with our original Expo SkyTrain cars that are only 25 years old, and haven't been subject to the same service conditions as exist in NYC"

just a few pull-quotes that Drew can use in his PR campaign.

[jsbertram]

Originally Posted by TransitJack

Not sure if it's been mentioned already, but I noticed that some of the recently retired New Flyer 40' High floor buses were moved to a vacant lot on River Dr near the Canada Line OMC. You might be able to see them from the C Line bridge if you look east a few hundred metres.

This was last week though, not sure if they are still there or what the plan is for them.

I read somewhere that around 100 of the retired New Flyer trolleys were sold to Argentina (can't remember what city), and that city's transit staff came to Vancouver to hand-pick the units they wanted to buy.

Perhaps these are the dregs of the retired fleet, and they are now about to be chopped up and melted down to be recycled into rebar?

No doubt one has been saved for the local transit historical society, so we'll see one in all it's retro-80s glory during special transit events.

[Mac Write]

Those are the dessiel buses that were just retired, not the trolley buses.

[jsbertram]

Originally Posted by Mac Write

Why not feed the train info into the LCD TV's full screen when the train is arriving. I can't for the life of me read that small ticker at the bottom of the TV. Way too small (and reading the LED display from a distance is the same thing for me, I have to be like 10ft away to read it).

Those TVs are for advertising.
No way Lamar will interrupt $advertising$ with useful info.

[Millennium2002]

Originally Posted by Mac Write

Those are the dessiel buses that were just retired, not the trolley buses.

No. TransLink did give some retired trolleys to Mendoza in Argentina, where they got a makeover before hitting the streets there. Check out the link to Trolebuses Menodicios (or something like that) in the Buzzer blog.

[Mac Write]

I know, but they were asking about the deseil buses just retired last month. The Trolleys were sold 2 years ago.

[tybuilding]

Originally Posted by jsbertram

"TransLink saves money by refurbishing original Expo SkyTrain cars"

"We can save over $100 million by refurbishing the original cars instead of purchasing new SkyTrain cars right now"

"Doing this will postpone the need for purchasing new cars by 10 to 15 years, or whenever the proposed Surrey Extension is completed."

"If NYC can take their 35-year-old subway cars and put them thorough a scheduled mid-life refurbishing program to get another 25 years of service out of them, we should be able to do the same with our original Expo SkyTrain cars that are only 25 years old, and haven't been subject to the same service conditions as exist in NYC"

just a few pull-quotes that Drew can use in his PR campaign.

The Mark I cars don't seem too bad to me. What are they looking to refurb?

[BCPhil]

Originally Posted by tybuilding

The Mark I cars don't seem too bad to me. What are they looking to refurb?

Yeah, in all seriousness, the only thing that makes them look 25+ years old is the color scheme on the inside. Other than that they are in perfect shape. If red and blue with brushed steel trim were the "it" colors again, the MKI's would look like new.

Unless we standardize trains on the MKII size, so that platform doors and signs can be installed (but honestly I don't see the point), the MKIs will be around for another 30 years.

I don't even see why they need to be refurbed yet. Unless the LIM equipment needs it or if the science of micro computing has come that much further that new computers would be more efficient/safer.

[cabotp]

A refurb is more than just a new paint job.

Are the MK I structurally sound. Do they need to be repaired for safety reasons. That would be a big reason for a refurb. It doesn't mean that every MKI would need to be refurbed. But they all would need to be inspected.