Edmonton Construction 9 (2008-08)

[bulliver]

That was an awesome speech Ken. Thanks for saying the things that we've all been thinking but couldn't or wouldn't say quite so eloquently.

Exactly. That was perfect, thanks!

[Jasper and one o nin]

absolute gold, Mr Cantor. nice work

[EdmTrekker]

Ken is THE man.
Ken, thank you for standing up for future generations of Edmontonians.

[ue]

ken, awesome speech. you have made some excellent points.

i'm glad to see those new retail spots popping up like coco and bistro praha. those places in oliver will really add 'more' to the area. and bistro praha will really increase foot traffic on 4th...i think. and that place on 101/whyte will also be nice as east whyte can use some more types of retail/restaurant/etc.

[Kevin_foster]

Good speech Ken! Well put!!

[Kevin_foster]

Originally Posted by Coldrsx

and that's the thing... one big "problem" with downtown is that we don't have enough chains (retail and rest) to bring in the crowds... and while i will be the first to say that is a blessing and a curse, it is needed and our downtown will eventually be better off for it.

So, let me read between the lines... dug up from the perverted; alpha male portion of my brain:

We need more boobies downtown

[Wooster]

Originally Posted by Coldrsx

Hit up the update for jasper avenue's redesign. Very very nice. More or less:

Hits
-5 lanes instead of 7
-moving those 'shelters' from jasper onto the streets to reduce clutter
-moving the corona lrt entrance from on jasper to 108st beside the new rexall
-CP bridge returns for pedestrian bridge at 110st
-trees, trees, trees


Misses:

-dedicated bike lane
-diagonal crosswalks at 109, 105, 101
-no left turn lanes at 109st

Dedicated vs. wide curb lane is something that has been a debate. Right now the concept accommodates bikes in a flexible wide curb lane. Keep in mind that a wider dedicated bike lane does eat into the sidewalk space, so there's a trade-off to consider.

I really do think the scramble idea should and will be explored. Good suggestion. The arterials would be the logical locations.

The no left turn in the drawing at 109 is an oversight. It's still in the higher level conceptual stage while buy in is achieved with the basic 5 lane configuration. More detailed street design is upcoming this summer and into the fall, where the specific conditions will be tested against the model that was put forward.

[christopherj]

Originally Posted by tony0911

^ You need the chains to draw people and get traffic flow, people will then rotate between indies and chains.....but the indies do not draw enough traffic on their own.

Or more accuratly, chains draw people in, but the indies KEEP them coming!

[Coldrsx]

"Dedicated vs. wide curb lane is something that has been a debate. Right now the concept accommodates bikes in a flexible wide curb lane. Keep in mind that a wider dedicated bike lane does eat into the sidewalk space, so there's a trade-off to consider."

do it on the south side which isn't as prone to patio potential

"I really do think the scramble idea should and will be explored. Good suggestion. The arterials would be the logical locations. "

they better be or i have some comeupins ready - 101,105,109


"The no left turn in the drawing at 109 is an oversight. It's still in the higher level conceptual stage while buy in is achieved with the basic 5 lane configuration. More detailed street design is upcoming this summer and into the fall, where the specific conditions will be tested against the model that was put forward."

please forward me the invoicing address:>

cheers

[newfangled]

A dedicated and separated bike lane could be put on 103 Ave (or 102 Ave, or even 105ave) today with minimal traffic disruption. It could easily go from 127st all the way east to the trail along the NELRT tracks.

If they combine a bike lane with the Jasper revamp it will probably just go from 97st to 110st and then stop, because the city loves arbitrary boundaries.

We really need an E-W bike route, but I wish they'd just do it rather than dicking around trying to fit it into the Jasper.

[240glt]

102 ave has a bike/bus/taxi lane all the way from 100 to 109 st on either side. It works okay but the problems are that A) The lights are not sequenced for bikes so you end up stopping every other block and B) People turning right off 102 ave block the cycling lane and create a bit of a dangerous condition when you try to ride to the left of the curb lane.

I don't know if dedicated bike lanes would make a difference. For me the biggest difference would be to fix the lights. As for Jasper, It can be biked now relatively easily but you have to be able to deal with a lot of traffic. The busses make it tougher as well. If there was more space available between parked cars, as well as at the intersections where the sidewalk curves out towards the street (which is a bit of a choke point for bikes) It would make it more rideable.

[newfangled]

^ For people who are chickens (like me, and more importantly like my gf) the 102ave lane isn't enough. On a saturday after the farmers' market it's fine, but we'd never go there any time near rushhour. The buses and right turns make it way too complicated between about 102st and 97st.

I just want a nice little painted box that says "this is mine." A concrete divider would be even better, and 103ave would have plenty of room for either. And once you're in Oliver it's better because it has a lot less traffic, and fewer 4-way stops.

You're right about the lights, although I don't know what any of the lights are synchronized too. They're bad for bikes, but they're terrible for pedestrians. If you're not willing to jaywalk all the minor intersections, then as a pedestrian you will have to stop at every block. As a driver they have you stopping every few blocks too, though.

(oh, and my best frame-of-reference would be Montreal, where the bikelane isn't on St. Catherine's or Sherbrooke or Rene Leveque, but on the more minor Maisonnueve)

[noodlenoodle]

Originally Posted by newfangled

^ For people who are chickens (like me, and more importantly like my gf) the 102ave lane isn't enough. On a saturday after the farmers' market it's fine, but we'd never go there any time near rushhour. The buses and right turns make it way too complicated between about 102st and 97st.

I just want a nice little painted box that says "this is mine." A concrete divider would be even better, and 103ave would have plenty of room for either. And once you're in Oliver it's better because it has a lot less traffic, and fewer 4-way stops.

You're right about the lights, although I don't know what any of the lights are synchronized too. They're bad for bikes, but they're terrible for pedestrians. If you're not willing to jaywalk all the minor intersections, then as a pedestrian you will have to stop at every block. As a driver they have you stopping every few blocks too, though.

(oh, and my best frame-of-reference would be Montreal, where the bikelane isn't on St. Catherine's or Sherbrooke or Rene Leveque, but on the more minor Maisonnueve)

I know that my walk to work on 100 Ave vs Jasper Ave is about 5 minutes shorter due to the lower quantity of lights. My roommate walks down 102 and shares the same benefit, but it's mostly due to the lack of lights. I still stop at all the lights that exist.

[Channing]

Why not close down 102nd ave from say 99th to 109th to vehicle traffic. Make it pedestrian/bike only. Make it so only the major avenues, say 101, 105, 109 be the only streets that go N/S past 102nd. All the others dead end at 102nd. That means you can walk/bike so much faster through that part of downtown.

And we can have patios.

And then we can run low floor train from 99th to 109th along 102nd. (And it can extend all the way to 124th along 102nd too)

[Shodan]

Muttart blooms with new look
Landmark river valley conservatory reopens Saturday after $6.3M renovation

Hanneke Brooymans
Edmonton Journal

Friday, June 26, 2009

The original renovation budget of the Muttart Conservatory was shattered by the economic boom, requiring an extra infusion of provincial cash to complete the project.

After 15 months and $6.3 million worth of work, the conservatory will reopen its doors to the public on Saturday.

The project was originally slated to cost $3.2 million, but bids received in early 2008 came in much higher than expected, said David Saunders, co-ordinator of capital projects for the city. The project moved forward thanks to a$3-million municipal sustainability initiative grant from the province, he said. That pushed the province's total contribution up to $3.8 million.

The city was allocated $91.8 million in sustainability funds in 2008 and was given approval from the minister of municipal affairs in last August to use some of that money for the Muttart, said Jerry Ward, a ministry spokesman.

Another reason the cost came in higher was because additional work was tacked on to the project to take advantage of the first total conservatory shutdown since it opened in 1976, Saunders said. Increasing wheelchair accessibility in the tropical pyramid was the biggest addition, costing$500,000, he said. That pyramid also has a new waterfall, stone work and plants.

The extra work also meant the renovations took much longer than the eight to 10 months initially expected.

One of the first signs of renewal that greets visitors is a miniature engraved pyramid at the entryway. It sits in front of an elegant new courtyard featuring cascading wall-mounted waterfalls and planters full of red, pink and purple flowers.

The gift shop, courtyard and cafe can now be accessed by people who are just passing through the river valley, without requiring them to pay entry to the rest of the conservatory, said Judith Rohovie, director of the facility.

There are also three new classrooms-- one is a "wet" classroom that allows children to plant and explore botany in more gritty, hands-on detail.

Luke Bristow, 8, returned to the wet classroom to fetch the small tropical plant he'd transferred to a pot earlier. Overall, Luke was impressed with the renovations.

"I've been here before and there's been a lot of cool changes," he said, his digital camera full of plant snapshots.

Ed Muttart, 79, leaned down from his six-foot-plus height to chat with some of the children.

"I'm really impressed with the classrooms that they've added," said Muttart, a member of the family for which the facility was named.

"This was the original intention when we first built it, that there would be classrooms for children to come to. Unfortunately, they seemed to have disappeared in the process. Now there are three beautiful classrooms. And in the one that they call the wet classroom they've got tables that you can crank lower for small children and higher for people like me."

Muttart reflected on what he hopes the conservatory will provide to the people who visit.

"I guess overall I hope it gives people who come here a spiritual connection with creation. That they can come here and feel peaceful, if they're under stress, if they're unhappy, if their hearts are broken, they can come here and get healed."

[email protected]-Global fashion in the Muttart's pyramids / Saturday in LifeStyle
© The Edmonton Journal 2009

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[Coldrsx]

^way too many congestion issues with that IMO. I do like the idea of 1 lane (curb during peak) being bike. As for low floor, we have LRT so close why not run it down 104ave.

[Coldrsx]

^^went by last night... the new entrance is very impressive

[IKAN104]

Originally Posted by Channing

Why not close down 102nd ave from say 99th to 109th to vehicle traffic. Make it pedestrian/bike only. Make it so only the major avenues, say 101, 105, 109 be the only streets that go N/S past 102nd. All the others dead end at 102nd. That means you can walk/bike so much faster through that part of downtown.

And we can have patios.

And then we can run low floor train from 99th to 109th along 102nd. (And it can extend all the way to 124th along 102nd too)

I like it. (As long as traffic remains manageable with all those closures - some simple studies would determine that)

One thing is for sure. If you have dedicated bike paths with concrete dividers, to keep the cars at bay, you will see more people biking downtown. People just are not comfortable sharing the busy streets with cars. And since you can get ticketed for biking on the sidewalk it's just easier to drive.

[noodlenoodle]

Originally Posted by Coldrsx

^way too many congestion issues with that IMO. I do like the idea of 1 lane (curb during peak) being bike. As for low floor, we have LRT so close why not run it down 104ave.

104 is already such a huge barrier to cross N/S as it is, throwing even a low-floor LRT down it would just exacerbate it. 104 should be streetscaped after Jasper and 105 get their due into something a little more inviting and pedestrian friendly, hopefully including a little bit of work @ Oliver Square.

I've grown rather fond of the split 102/103 alignment for a low-floor LRT heading west. There should be enough room for LRT, one way traffic and a bike trail (perhaps as part of a widened multi-use trail incorporating sidewalk or just on one of 102/103?)

[Coldrsx]

^most cities i have been to DO NOT have a barrier and just a dedicated lane. Sure it would help but man up.