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  #221  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2009, 2:47 AM
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You can see the services under construction (sanitary) along Rideau Valley Drive right now.

here's what's going on (proposed infrastructure master plan)

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  #222  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2009, 12:04 PM
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So it might as well roll over and surrender every time a developer wishes to have the Official Plan changed? Why bother even having an Official Plan if that's the case? Perhaps Council should just let the development industry write the Official Plan and throw in anything else the public wants that doesn't conflict with what the development industry wants.
Why permit amendments to the Official Plan at all then? There are plenty of situations where the municipality screws up majorly (most situations in some cases, unfortunately). And never mind that the consultation process for the OP reviews are a joke in most cases. Not speaking of Ottawa in this case, but if you look at the consultation process for a particular county in my area, they solicited for comments, stuck them in a table, and then pasted staff comments beside them. And that was the extent of consultation. Nevermind that 99% of the staff comments were 'disagree', the process is a joke and completely ineffective. I'd wager that neither the community, nor developers will end up happy with the results, and the proposed OPA is almost certainly going to be appealed as a result.

With the changes to the PPS, it is now no longer possible to adjust the settlement area boundary outside of the 5 year review process. This should be a very effective tool for municipalities to implement their policy.
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  #223  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2009, 5:07 PM
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Denley nailed it today..
http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/ab...627/story.html

OMB is about facts and rules, not politics


BY RANDALL DENLEY, THE OTTAWA CITIZENAPRIL 16, 2009


People who are rushing to blame the Ontario Municipal Board for approving the expansion of Manotick fundamentally misunderstand the OMB's role as an adjudicator of development disputes. The OMB's job is to make decisions based on expert testimony and legal arguments, not public opinion polls.

Municipal Affairs Minister Jim Watson's comment this week that the OMB should be "more reflective of community values" is just feel-good hogwash. If politicians want planning rules that please the public, they should draft them properly in the first place. In the case of Manotick, the city was forced to defend a vague and contradictory secondary plan that was prepared by the former Rideau Township. It didn't stand up to scrutiny, but the city and the people of Manotick had a fair chance to present their arguments. Their failure to win doesn't make the system invalid.

Judicial or quasi-judicial proceedings are decided on the basis of who can make the better factual arguments. Despite Watson's comments, there is no better way to do it. How would an OMB hearing take into account people's subjective feelings?

The idea that the OMB should approve something simply because a city council had done so is another non-starter. The point of an appeal is that both sides get a fair hearing by an impartial third party. People might not like it when they lose, but without recourse to the courts or the OMB, city council could approve a high rise next door to your house and there wouldn't be a thing you could do about it.

City government gets to set the rules for development under broad guidelines from the province. The city determines the expected population increase and decides where and how those people will be accommodated. The balance is that the plan must be reasonable and actually produce the housing units that are required. The OMB is there to make sure that government lives up to its own rules.

In the case of the Manotick expansion, the rules were a lot less clear than they should be. The city plan placed apparent restrictions on development, but didn't do so artfully. The way the document was written, Minto had the right to build 250 houses on its land by 2020, but the houses needed to be on municipal sewer and water services. The cost of bringing the pipes to the development is not justified by that kind of limited growth.

Manotick residents argued that the plan was clearly designed to slow and limit growth. It's a reasonable interpretation. Minto said the plan was designed to allow growth, but it wasn't practical to build under the rules set out. Also a reasonable position. City staff favoured the Minto interpretation, bolstering their argument by pointing out that provincial guidelines dictate that sewers and water pipes be used to capacity and that a mix of housing types be provided, not just single family homes on big lots.

It's also important to note that Minto's land in Manotick is part of the village and has been designated for development for many years. The primary issue was when that development could take place.

Expanding within village boundaries is one of the goals of the city official plan. Between now and 2031, the city anticipates that nine per cent of total residential growth will be in rural areas. That means 7,500 additional units in existing villages. This would increase the number of units in villages by more than 60 per cent and the bulk of that would be in the handful of larger villages with municipal services. Rideau Ward Councillor Glenn Brooks warned this week that the Manotick decision will mean a flood of village development. If so, it will be right in line with city policy. Minto's development is arguably less than Manotick's share of the proposed growth.

If people are worried about an explosion in village population, now's the time to stop it. The city official plan is in front of council for review. That's how democracy comes to bear in planning, by writing rules that reflect the public's wishes, not by giving the city final say on the interpretation of those rules.

It's probably small consolation to people in Manotick, but Minto has put a lot of effort into the design of the houses and the look of its proposed development. It appears that the company is making a sincere attempt to make its development fit with the feel of Manotick's core. Improving Manotick is in Minto's interests. Destroying the village is not. If Minto makes a mess in Manotick, its homes will be difficult to sell. Perhaps more important for this family-run company, pride is on the line. The company has said that its Mahogany community will be special. Now it has to deliver.

Contact Randall Denley at 613-596-3756 or by e-mail, [email protected]

© Copyright (c) The Ottawa Citizen
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  #224  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2009, 7:04 PM
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Something to watch in future for the Cumberland area. Yikes, 4300 homes, another massive development in goal to whack a village-like area - I hope it will not succeeded this one if not another village whacked by development

Quote:

Cumberland residents upset over proposed expansion of urban boundary
By Fred Sherwin
Orléans Online

Residents listen to a city planner explain the rationale behind the possible expansion of the east urban boundary into the former municipality of Cumberland to accommodate the construction of 4,280 new homes. Fred Sherwin/Photo

More than 200 residents packed the Lions Maple Hall in Cumberland Village last night to find out more about the proposed expansion of the east urban boundary beyond Trim Road.

The standing room only crowd heard city planner Leslie Patterson explain that the city is considering increasing the amount of vacant land available for development by 850 hectares, which would give it a large enough surplus to meet the it's needs for the next 22 years.

But to do so will require expanding the city's urban boundary. Staff is currently assessing 11 different possible locations where expansion can take place. The total size of the areas is 2,000 gross hectares,

One of the locations being considered is an area bordered by Cardinal Creek in the west, Old Montreal Road in the north, Ted Kelly Lane and Frank Kenney Road in the east and Innes Road in the south.

The total area being considered is 337 acres and Tamarack homes has either purchased on holds options on most of the land in question except for a couple of pockets here and there including Laporte's Flowers and Nursery, the Capital City Church and a the proposed site of a crematorium owned by Hulse, Playfair and McGarry.

The land is currently zoned general rural which allows for single family dwellings on two acre estate lots. Tamarack wants to rezone the land general urban which would allow the developer to build up to 25 dwellings per acre. Given the size of the area in question it would equate to 4,280 homes that would house up to 12,500 people.

In order for the development to proceed would first require city council to approve the proposal to expand the east urban boundary. The developer, in this case Tamarack, would then have to work with the city in coming up with a subdivision plan containing the necessary infrastructure to support the development and then they would be guided in their ability to build the new homes by existing market pressures.

The Cumberland Village Community Association, and Tamara Belle-Isle in particular, is leading the fight against the proposed expansion of the east urban boundary and Tamarack's plans,

Belle-Isle says the city already has enough vacant land to deal with the demand for new homes for the next 13 years, so why the rush.

During her opening presentation she pointed out a number of concerns Cumberland area residents have over the planned development. In particular, they're worried about the potential impact an additional 12,500 residents will have on local traffic and the water supply for the hundreds of residents living east of the designated area, including Cumberland Village, who have wells.

Her overriding argument was that the east end does not have the necessary infrastructure to support 4,300 new homes. To support her argument she pointed out that the current road system is already inadequate when it comes to being able to deal with the current population.

"We're not against building more single family homes on two acre lots, that's progress. But what we don't want is another Orléans-type development," said Belle-Isle."If you rezone it urban, that will open the floodgates."

Staff's own evaluation of the parcel of land in question rates the ability of the existing transportation network to support future development as zero in a scale of zero to four. Cumberland Ward Coun. Rob Jellett says that alone should raise an enormous red flag over what staff is proposing,

Patterson told the audience that staff plans to recommend that council place a list of future requirements and guidelines in the Official Plan which will have to be met before any development can take place.

Jellett said his first course of action will be to try and persuade his colleagues on city council to reject the proposed expansion of the east urban boundary. At the same time, he wants to try and get the planning department to modify the criteria it uses to evaluate the proposed areas slated for expansion so that they better reflect the issues, especially as they pertain to the existing road network and transportation.

"We need to change the criteria in terms of weighting. When transportation gets a zero, that's a pretty important one, We should be asking ourselves why are we even considering this," said Jellett.

Everyone at the meeting was encouraged to sign a petition calling on the city to defer the expansion of the east urban boundary for at least five years. They were also encouraged to voice their concerns and objections to the city councillors via e-mail and make a point of attending a series of three meetings at city hall on May 11 and 12 during which members of the public can make presentations.

Council will debate and vote on changes to the Official Plan, including the possible expansion of the city's urban boundary, on May 27.
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  #225  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2009, 7:12 PM
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Last edited by waterloowarrior; Apr 17, 2009 at 1:30 AM.
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  #226  
Old Posted Apr 17, 2009, 12:44 AM
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Looks like those Cardinal Creek developers are already cutting down the trees



Community group fuming over tree cutting
by Laura Cummings
View all articles from Laura Cummings
Article online since April 15th 2009, 15:06
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http://www.eastottawa.ca/article-326...e-cutting.html
An area community association is speaking out against the recent cutting of an estimated 20,000 trees on private land, pointing to potential environmental impacts and alleged protected status of some species on the property.
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  #227  
Old Posted Apr 17, 2009, 1:16 AM
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I agree 100% with them, the eastern urban boundary should be frozen indefinitely. How many rural-style lots are not occupied there?

The way they (and I) see it is that the 2 to 4 acre lots do not result in nearly as many tree clearcuts and have better potential for small-scale agriculture and horticulture use. I'd wait until current lots are 85-90% occupied before approving new areas though, and do it case by case.

The areas I would target for development through 2030 and beyond (for residential and mixed local commercial):

Greenbelt infill

There are three areas of the Greenbelt I could see for development:

1) Hunt Club/Hawthorne area (residential west of Hawthorne, industrial east to 417)

2) Bells Corners/Bayshore (mostly high-density residential due to presence of highway and transit corridor)

3) Fallowfield/Merivale area (should be industrial)

Orleans

I would focus development in the area bounded by the following:

East - Cardinal Creek, O'Toole Road
West - Current Greenbelt boundary
North - Ottawa River
South - Mer Bleue swamp, Giroux Road (approximate)

Exception: I would preserve an area for 500m surrounding Navan and Notre-Dame-des-Champs as parkland, to maintain them as villages.

Kanata/Stittsville

I would focus development in the area bounded by the following:

East - Current Greenbelt boundary
West - Carp Road (north of Highway 417), line running from the Highway 7/Hazeldean interchange southward (south of Highway 417)
North - March Road/Dunrobin Road (narrow opportunity)
South - Flewellyn Road

Exceptions: The escarpment area should be off limits to new development west of the Terry Fox Drive corridor. The Ottawa River marshes and lowlands should also be off limits.

Barrhaven

I would focus development in the area bounded by the following:

East - Rideau River
West - Highway 416
North - Fallowfield Road
South - Bankfield Road (west of Prince of Wales Drive)

Exception: The area east of Prince of Wales Drive and south of the Jock River should be off limits to new development that is not appropriate for a village setting in Manotick.

Riverside South/Leitrim

I would focus development in the area bounded by the following:

East - Hawthorne Road
West - Rideau River
North - Leitrim Road
South - Rideau Road

Exception: The central area straddling Bowesville Road and north of Earl Armstrong Road should be off-limits for development, to protect land for a future Ottawa Airport expansion.

Southeast Area

I would focus development in the area mentioned in my own proposal, with those strict standards.
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  #228  
Old Posted Apr 17, 2009, 1:25 AM
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Originally Posted by waterloowarrior View Post
http://www.eastottawa.ca/article-326...e-cutting.html
An area community association is speaking out against the recent cutting of an estimated 20,000 trees on private land, pointing to potential environmental impacts and alleged protected status of some species on the property.
The head of the Community Association, Sean Crossan, is somebody who I'm sure will want to run for Council out that way in the not too distant future. Mr. Crossan has a degree in urban planning (U of Waterloo) which I believe would be a first for a City Council member in Ottawa (if elected). He is very driven.
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  #229  
Old Posted Apr 17, 2009, 2:34 PM
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Exception: I would preserve an area for 500m surrounding Navan and Notre-Dame-des-Champs as parkland, to maintain them as villages.
Good idea but that’s certainly not what is happening with NDC (showing my Orleans roots here), which if you drive through at the moment looks like a tiny goldfish with a giant shark looming over it ready to swallow it up. NDC has no chance of survival and will be swallowed up for sure and unfortunately will likely resemble something like Cyrville (which most people probably don’t know was a village as well just a generation or two ago) one day soon.

Navan may have a better chance of surviving intact, since it is further away from the sprawl of Orleans. It is also tonier than NDC which means it probably has a better community organization network to fight back with.
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  #230  
Old Posted Apr 17, 2009, 2:45 PM
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Good idea but that’s certainly not what is happening with NDC (showing my Orleans roots here), which if you drive through at the moment looks like a tiny goldfish with a giant shark looming over it ready to swallow it up. NDC has no chance of survival and will be swallowed up for sure and unfortunately will likely resemble something like Cyrville (which most people probably don’t know was a village as well just a generation or two ago) one day soon.

Navan may have a better chance of surviving intact, since it is further away from the sprawl of Orleans. It is also tonier than NDC which means it probably has a better community organization network to fight back with.
Well put...whenever I go through NDC (a bit of a different ambience to NDG in MTL) I'm always wondering where the 'there' is to the place...how do you know when you have arrived in NDC..it is a very strung out place (could be due to its franco roots.....good place for some restos ) and the type of place that doesn't want much government interference in how people go about their day to day lives.

I would imagine that the lands around NDC are owned by a slew of numbered companies who are just waiting for the 'big pipe' to come.
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  #231  
Old Posted Apr 17, 2009, 3:03 PM
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Originally Posted by highdensitysprawl View Post
Well put...whenever I go through NDC (a bit of a different ambience to NDG in MTL) I'm always wondering where the 'there' is to the place...how do you know when you have arrived in NDC..it is a very strung out place (could be due to its franco roots.....good place for some restos ) and the type of place that doesn't want much government interference in how people go about their day to day lives.

I would imagine that the lands around NDC are owned by a slew of numbered companies who are just waiting for the 'big pipe' to come.
The three pillars of a traditional French-Canadian community are the elementary school, the church and a caisse populaire, usually located fairly close to one another.

In NDC, there was still something resembling community life up until the late 80s (I went to high school with many people from there and had one close friend from NDC), but the closure of École Notre-Dame-des-Champs in the 90s (if I recall) really dealt it a blow. We all know what has happened (with a few exceptions) to francophone church attendance. Which leaves the caisse populaire, which does maintain a service counter in NDC.

I think in places like this the closing of the village school is the real killer, which doesn’t bode well for a place like Sarsfield, which lost its school (St-Hugues), just a few years ago.
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  #232  
Old Posted Apr 17, 2009, 3:11 PM
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The three pillars of a traditional French-Canadian community are the elementary school, the church and a caisse populaire, usually located fairly close to one another.
And here I thought the main pillars of a french-canadian community were the hockey arena, poutine stand, Mike's restaurat, Ultramar station, Jean Coutu, CLSC and a full service peeler joint.
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  #233  
Old Posted Apr 17, 2009, 4:57 PM
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3 part interview with Brooks, El-Chantiry, and Thompson on Minto... city staff were not good 'advocates' for the city at the OMB.

http://www.cfra.com/chum_audio/Thurs...1.Apr16.09.mp3
http://www.cfra.com/chum_audio/Thurs...2.Apr16.09.mp3
http://www.cfra.com/chum_audio/Thurs...3.Apr16.09.mp3
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  #234  
Old Posted Apr 17, 2009, 6:14 PM
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And here I thought the main pillars of a french-canadian community were the hockey arena, poutine stand, Mike's restaurat, Ultramar station, Jean Coutu, CLSC and a full service peeler joint.
Note that I said “traditional”.

Now for that one, my friend, I will wish you some delicious appies and a warm cappo in some charming Calgary or Kingston resto without a single native francophone in sight!
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  #235  
Old Posted Apr 17, 2009, 6:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
Note that I said “traditional”.

Now for that one, my friend, I will wish you some delicious appies and a warm cappo in some charming Calgary or Kingston resto without a single native francophone in sight!
Good one...I think you know who on the SSP boards is notorious for the 'restos' 'cappos' comments....he who has had some caustic verbal battles with 514 posters.

I didn't know that the cornerstones of a french-canadian community had to be traditional....I was merely referring to the here and now.
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  #236  
Old Posted Apr 21, 2009, 8:07 PM
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Originally Posted by highdensitysprawl View Post
And here I thought the main pillars of a french-canadian community were the hockey arena, poutine stand, Mike's restaurat, Ultramar station, Jean Coutu, CLSC and a full service peeler joint.
Hockey arena - check
poutine stand - check
Ultramar - check (one across the street from the other)
JC - check
CLSC - check
Peelers - check

Where is my Mike's.. I am outraged.
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  #237  
Old Posted Apr 21, 2009, 8:35 PM
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Mattamy's SPIRIT series of homes has designs been launched... now on their pre-registration page they have a new community called 'Grand Vista Circle'
http://mattamyhomes.com/ottawa/tellus/preregister.asp
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  #238  
Old Posted Apr 21, 2009, 11:10 PM
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Barry Weller and Jack Stirling (Minto) are on TalkOttawa right now (Rogers 22) discussing the OMB... repeat at midnight and other times.

Interesting info... the planner the city used in Manotick was the 17th planner they'd approached

edit: All in all, itt wasn't the most cordial discussion

Last edited by waterloowarrior; Apr 22, 2009 at 12:39 AM.
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  #239  
Old Posted Apr 22, 2009, 12:25 AM
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The neighbourhoods surrounding Ottawa just keep on getting bigger and bigger...
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  #240  
Old Posted Apr 22, 2009, 12:43 AM
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Originally Posted by jeremy_haak View Post
Why permit amendments to the Official Plan at all then?
I don't see how your question follows from my comment. I was posting in response to a comment that said we shouldn't fight at the OMB when "we can't win" but since many of the cases like the one in Manotick involve amendments to the Official Plan to follow that advice would be to pretty much surrender the ability to have a meaningful Official Plan at all.

That is not to say that amendments don't have their place. The issue is who gets to decide if the amendment goes through or not.

Quote:
There are plenty of situations where the municipality screws up majorly (most situations in some cases, unfortunately). And never mind that the consultation process for the OP reviews are a joke in most cases. Not speaking of Ottawa in this case, but if you look at the consultation process for a particular county in my area, they solicited for comments, stuck them in a table, and then pasted staff comments beside them. And that was the extent of consultation. Nevermind that 99% of the staff comments were 'disagree', the process is a joke and completely ineffective. I'd wager that neither the community, nor developers will end up happy with the results, and the proposed OPA is almost certainly going to be appealed as a result.
I wonder if the very existence of the OMB doesn't create a perverse incentive to have joke processes. It acts as a crutch to get away from making difficult choices, or, alternatively, a means of creating policy through the backdoor.

In the Manotick case, City staff (and certain councillors) effectively violated city policy by extending central services down to Manotick and shutting the door on alternate servicing mechanisms. That virtually assured a much higher than originally envisaged population so as to recoup the costs of the infrastructure and make it worthwhile. That's what's so frustrating about Manotick: in isolation, the OMB decision was the correct one (the infrastructure is there, after all), but that's only because it relied on a bunch of previous bad decisions to get to that point. But at the end of the day we're probably going to have to build out more road infrastructure or build it sooner than anticipated to serve this development and new/more frequent bus routes will also have to be run. Hopefully this will be a more retirement-oriented community to lessen the need for some of this transportation infrastructure, but time will tell on that one.

Quote:
With the changes to the PPS, it is now no longer possible to adjust the settlement area boundary outside of the 5 year review process. This should be a very effective tool for municipalities to implement their policy.
It should help, but it won't prevent OMB appeals at the time of the 5 year review process either. We'll just get them all in one shot - which is admittedly preferable to having them in dribs and drabs. I'm sure we'll be having a battle royale on this issue in the next year or so. The developers want more land whereas the environmentalists have pointed out that the OMB added more land to the urban boundary of the 2003 OP based on 2021 population projections that we're now not expecting until 2031 at the earliest, thus negating the need for any expansion at all.

At any rate, the Manotick case wasn't about an adjustment of the settlement boundary but what was permitted within it.
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