LOS ANGELES | Downtown Project Rundown 3.0

[RAlossi]

Originally Posted by Just-In-Cali

^...well...then lets just stop. Stop all of it. No more time or effort need be put into Downtown Los Angeles. Lets focus on making the Valley more suburban chique! Eh?
My, I would expect that statement from others (im looking at you ed, downtowner, and others) but im surprised it came from you RAlossi.

Yeah, because that's exactly what I said in my comment above.

Anyway, I hope this actually spurs some discussion about the future of Downtown. It may one day be a collection of cool -- though disparate -- neighborhoods, but probably won't become that vital central city we've been yearning for. Not when its very geographic heart is a rotten blight.

It feels so weird saying that considering what I've done in the past, but that's what living at 6th and Los Angeles has opened my eyes to. The 1st of every month, the welfare checks come in, the dealers follow, the drugs get smoked, and the crazies flood the Historic Core, screaming in the middle of the night.

I now realize that that culture -- the drugs, the prostitution, the insane -- will NEVER be going away, not while government agencies and "nonprofits" get so much benefit from maintaining the status quo (read: funding).

[LosAngelesBeauty]

^ I have always wanted the Jewelry District to GO AWAY for the very reason you just stated. It completely cuts off the Historic Core from the Fidi and is completely detrimental to the long term success of Downtown LA becoming a part of LA where neighborhoods and districts meld into each other organically, creating that kind of wonderful feeling you get in NY.

Plus, the Jewelry District SHOULD BE the beginnings of the a retail district akin to 3rd St (not the Promenade) and Melrose and some chains thrown in there for good measure. Something like a Soho. It should NOT be what is right now, which is a district that takes up WAY TOO MUCH space and serving such a niche group of buyers looking for rings and bracelets.

GO AWAY JEWELRY DISTRICT!!!

[RAlossi]

It's not just that. It's the safety factor, with all these projects in such proximity to the center of the narcotics trade in the city. Hell, the Civic Center might as well be the Prison District with the insanity at Twin Towers and Men's Central Jail - Oh, look, a shiny new women's jail! Just what Downtown really needs.

It unnerves me that I got physically threatened by a guy calling my husband and me "Faggot" -- and finding ourselves completely alone on an empty, dark sidewalk in the evening. God forbid anyone actually leave their loft after 6:00pm!

It unnerves me that I see Crips and 18th Street Gang tagging in the neighborhood more and more. Then two people got shot on Skid Row the other morning.

It unnerves me that I got mugged walking down Main Street -- while I was walking home with two friends! They had insisted on walking me home, luckily for me. We didn't get two blocks before it happened.

It unnerves me that criminals get released from Twin Towers and just make their way down into the Historic Core -- then proceed to threaten me for not giving them money. This is all in addition to the normal everyday harassment and racist, homophobic bullsh*t that comes with living Downtown.

I don't want this thread to stray from development - just had to get it off my chest. This isn't normal, and as you can probably tell, I'm beginning to lose it.
Before, things like this were acceptable (ha!) because of the possibility of change. I love Downtown, I just don't know how much more of this I can stand.

[tommaso]

Originally Posted by RAlossi

Yeah, because that's exactly what I said in my comment above.

Anyway, I hope this actually spurs some discussion about the future of Downtown. It may one day be a collection of cool -- though disparate -- neighborhoods, but probably won't become that vital central city we've been yearning for. Not when its very geographic heart is a rotten blight.

It feels so weird saying that considering what I've done in the past, but that's what living at 6th and Los Angeles has opened my eyes to. The 1st of every month, the welfare checks come in, the dealers follow, the drugs get smoked, and the crazies flood the Historic Core, screaming in the middle of the night.

I now realize that that culture -- the drugs, the prostitution, the insane -- will NEVER be going away, not while government agencies and "nonprofits" get so much benefit from maintaining the status quo (read: funding).

Yeah this stuff is all very interesting. And I'll begin by saying that DTLA is flawed at worst and exciting at best! Very controversial statement, I know. However, we all know that there are more dead spots in various parts of downtown than there are in some of the worst cell phone networks. That's saying a lot and not very much. Whether it is the annoying empty lots that may be used for parking, or some ugly buildings that are neither residential nor safe looking, DT Los Angeles is full of holes of what some would call urban blight (and that's relatively speaking). The nicer and decent parts of downtown which have already been identified, are respectable examples of what a flourishing urban area can look like (and you can pick the parts of downtown you like best and that's the kind of nice stuff I'm talking about). And then you have the undeveloped, the underutilized and the skid row-ish, the 'I don't want to be there' type junk. You get the drift. We, and I mean those of us who root for a real quality city atmosphere in downtown, can not stand for anything short of massive improvement to our downtown area.

Suffice it to say that downtown Los Angeles is so rich and diverse that our buildings and streets here are used to represent New York City (Manhattan) in many movies! Yes, I said it, MANHATTAN! Wow! That should be our cue here to Angelenos who have a stake in the downtown of ours, to now say that 'hey! our downtown is just as nice as anybody else's. Now let's treat it with the respect it deserves and clean it up and make a viable city out of it.' And that's really what we are trying to do with downtown Los Angeles, make a city out of it, but it just takes too long to develop to the extent that we need it to become developed. Erecting one large building at a time will not get the job done, and I will add that 5 buildings at a time is not enough either.

So then what is the solution we all are looking for here? Answer: strategize and decide once and for all that downtown Los Angeles is the center of the universe (metaphorically speaking), develop it and market it into the greatest city on Earth! The weather in Los Angeles is perfect, so now let's develop our downtown to fully take advantage of our greatest asset. What could be better than living the city life in perfect weather? You got it friends, NOTHING! I'm a guy who knows like many other knowledgeable city-dwellers that the correct and best way to develop the City of Los Angeles is along the Pacific Ocean. That never happened, so lets just work with what we have and turn downtown into the place we all want it to be, A REAL WORLD CLASS CITY!

[milquetoast]

Yayy! And maybe we'll develop that wonderful New York feeling

Thank God! Finally, right? So organic ....

[LAsam]

I can feel a ColeMonkee smackdown coming!

[BrandonJXN]

Now I see why I don't post as much. Not only because of the resession and lack of new projects, but people bitching and moaning too damn much.

I'll go back to lurking until you boys grow up. Los Angeles is flawed like every city on earth.

RAlossi, you would most likely get called a faggot if you and your husband were to walk down any major street hand in hand. And I'm gay before any of you say anything.

Citywatch, powerlines exist in every city on earth. Burying them will not make LA any better or any worse.

Ed, LA is your home. Quite complaining about it and try and enjoy it. I live in Tucson Arizona for comparison. I have a right to complain about where I live.

And colmonkee, Sakura Crossing's color is not that bad. Lol.

[RAlossi]

Uh-oh, I've pissed off the 'armchair urbanist'. You can go back and re-read my original comment, or not, doesn't matter. The point I'm trying to make, which was perhaps a little skewed by a couple late-night cocktails, is that development, safety, investment and quality of life are all interrelated. You don't get that vital urban experience without increasing all of those. My issue is whether Downtown will be able to find that sweet spot in the next decade or so.

[LosAngelesBeauty]

^ I feel ya RAlossi on the safety issue in DTLA. When I was living there at the Pegasus, I ALMOST got mugged myself at 4th/Broadway and was threatened TWICE at the Yoshinoya at 7th/Olive, which thank Zeus, is now closed.

[colemonkee]

colemonkee smackdown cometh. Many posts have been deleted. Keep it classy San D-- errrr, LA forumers. I'm off to Coachella this weekend, and if I get back to a bunch of bitchy posts, there will be suspenders, errrr, suspensions.

[Quixote]

The May Company Garage after a good scrubbing and then some. I had no idea they were rehabilitating this baby. Nice.


From Flickr, by ericrichardson

[citywatch]

Originally Posted by ThreeHundred

powerlines exist in every city on earth. Burying them will not make LA any better or any worse.

In the middle of ralossi's disturbing descriptions of his encounters with & observations of crime & his equally worrisome skepticism about the hood's future, & you somehow bring my name into the thread?!!

Even more of an odd segue, cuz I'm bothered that if someone like ralossi finds his patience with the hood wearing thin, then what will be the reaction of those ppl who are 10 times likelier to eventually wander off to the burbs or to a comfy, safe hood dozens of miles to the west or north?

And ralossi mentions armchair urbanists. Nothing more hollow & fake than such ppl (meaning those resting comfortably---& safely!---in armchairs far, far removed from the inner city) being idealistic & dreamy eyed about the dark, depressing side of urban life----& not changing their politics or belief system one iota---when viewing the world from the safety & comfort of a gated house in the palisades or Bev hills, or Hermosa beach or malibu.

btw, threehundred, I was wandering through the streets of paris, london, vienna, berlin, rome, copenhagen, brussels & barcelona the other day, & I swear I saw sights very similar to this all over the place:



omar omar

Sakura Crossing's color is not that bad.

But it's not too good either. However, since I recall the yrs & yrs & yrs I'd drive by that location & be bothered by the huge deadzone that once was there (& still makes up a good portion of the block to the north & west), I can live with it.

I just wish the other apt bldg that was supposed to breakground early this yr (or was it early last yr?) directly to the NE of the sakura finally was under construction. One less gap in the hood. Plus the drawing of that bldg makes me think its paint job will be a bit better than sakura's.

[citywatch]

Originally Posted by LosAngelesBeauty

^ I have always wanted the Jewelry District to GO AWAY for the very reason you just stated. It completely cuts off the Historic Core from the Fidi and is completely detrimental to the long term success of Downtown LA becoming a part of LA where neighborhoods and districts meld into each other organically, creating that kind of wonderful feeling you get in NY.

I'm not sure I fully understand your dislike of that type of retailing in the hood. Would you rather the jewelry district be replaced by a bunch of swap meets & T shirt, counterfeit DVD shops, like what's all over broadway, or bail bond businesses, similar to what has popped up in Little tokyo over the yrs & caused lots of complaints?

BTW, LAB, I notice your posting alot about pasadena in the LA/CA forum, which I'm guessing is the hood you now call home. I think that part of soCal makes for a good model for other cities locally to pattern themselves after. In fact, if more of SoCA was like pasadena (instead of the hoods around rosemead, which is where I had to spend some time several months ago----ugh!), this part of the country would be primo.

Pasadena is still a largely burban---or mostly single family house or smaller bldg---type of hood, but it's more or less consistently nice, or, at worse, OK. So I think if DTLA were surrounded by hoods like pasadena, &, in turn, if pasadena were just a few blocks from DTLA, that would be ideal.

[edluva]

Originally Posted by colemonkee

colemonkee smackdown cometh. Many posts have been deleted. Keep it classy San D-- errrr, LA forumers. I'm off to Coachella this weekend, and if I get back to a bunch of bitchy posts, there will be suspenders, errrr, suspensions.

have fun at coachella. i am jealous

threehundred - and i don't have a right to complain about the place i live in. right.

[RAlossi]

Re: Sakura Crossing, the color on the rendering is actually a bit different from the color now that it's finished. I agree that the color scheme isn't bad... the greens are more hunter green than teal. It's got a nice contrast that kind of struck me as I walked past. It's still mostly stucco though...

[LosAngelesBeauty]

Originally Posted by citywatch

BTW, LAB, I notice your posting alot about pasadena in the LA/CA forum, which I'm guessing is the hood you now call home. I think that part of soCal makes for a good model for other cities locally to pattern themselves after. In fact, if more of SoCA was like pasadena (instead of the hoods around rosemead, which is where I had to spend some time several months ago----ugh!), this part of the country would be primo.

Yes, I love Pasadena and am very happy living here. If DTLA could feel like Pasadena, then we should be so lucky.

[yakumoto]

Shamelessly stolen from another thread:



BEHOLD THE FURY OF THE OVERHEAD WIRES!!!!

[RuFFy]

I can't bring myself to agree with you guys that LA is not a city and will never have an urban feel because I think it already does. I haven't lived in LA since 2006.. but before that I was there since I was born in 1980. When I was born, this was LA's skyline: AON, 611 Wilshire, Bank of America, Transamerica, City National Plaza and Union Bank. That's it. Take a look for yourselves. From the Summer of 1980.



Call it an optical illusion, if you want.. but we have come a long way.
Adding to that, 19 years ago our rail system carried 0 passengers. No Metrolink, no blue line, no red, no gold, no extensions, no NOTHING. Today we transport 300k weekday boardings on rail. To put it in perspective in 19 years we've found a way to move the entire population of the City of Tampa every day. Which brings me to my next point. If the Jewelry district's a wall between better districts (I guess) isn't it important to remember that before 1999 South Park wasn't a district we'd care for at all? And having developed the New Jerk thick skin I'll tell you guys that part of urban living is taking it, and dealing it back. I can't tell you guys how many times I shoved people, pushed them into a subway car, made an annoying comment when they decided to pull out their metro card at the turnstile, and SO many other not so friendly Pasadena-like things. Oh, and about the homeless. My NY winter ritual consisted of spraying cologne on my scarf daily so if there was a homeless on the train I'd be able to avoid throwing up by smelling my good self. Living Urban means you get to smell everyone else's fart, literally. All the good and the bad shiiat comes with the experience, including being called a homo as you walk hand in hand with someone of the same sex. Did I mention how many stupid people there are in urban areas?

[BrandonJXN]

My God..is that a Datsun?

And I agree with Ruffy on the fact that living in a downtown (ANY downtown) means you have to learn how to deal with the dregs of soceity. Not to say that the motley crew isn't in the suburbs but they are most known for roaming around a urban enviorment. I live in the desert. You would think that it would be too hot for the cripples and crazies to bother people but they do. Tucson has a very large homeless population. And it's amplified by the huge drug problem that this city has. And while I don't live in downtown Tucson (I live about 4 miles away from it), I go there all the time and I too get bugged when someone asks me for some change or a cigeratte (which I can't really blame them as a pack of Marlboro Smooths are almost 8 bucks out here). I just grin and bear it. You knew that DTLA was iffy when you moved there. But isn't it better now then when you moved there 3, 4, 5 years ago? DTLA is urban. Sometimes it smells.

[Just-In-Cali]

It blows my mind seeing that pic! The first time I saw the skyline, was in 1990...and it still wasnt as sparce as that.
Ruffy...that was genious!!!! You are absolutly right. It takes a person that has lived here and other places like NY to see that despite their great differences, they can both be called great cities, just of different breeds.
I'm sure our "favorites" in here will take exception, but the reality is utopia cant be found in NY or Chicago any more than it can be found in LA. Its just a matter of learning the heartbeat of your specific hometown and finding the parts that give you pleasure. And if you CANT find any in your town...then please...LEAVE it.