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  #2961  
Old Posted Mar 27, 2008, 5:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shmakim View Post


Wednesday there's a story about green building initiatives and Thursday there's a story about the whole project being pulled?

I wonder if there's some kind of compromise that can be reached between the Sask party and the project... like phased funding and a later completion date.
Maybe if we could make it more of a rural project. Include a pasture perhaps, or maybe a dirt road, where the underprivledged could learn their children to drive, like the rest of us done <insert banjo music here>
     
     
  #2962  
Old Posted Mar 27, 2008, 2:48 PM
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/\ Good one.

It would be a shame to see this project scrapped. It sure sounds as if this move is purely political. I guess we'll see over the next few day if there is any fall out. There certainly seems to be different versions of the truth regarding the financing of this project ( see SP story today).

Quote:
Originally Posted by SP
When the new government took a look at the project, "there were a number of difficulties with it," Gantefoer said.

Fundraising from private donors was supposed to contribute between $12 million and $14 million toward the total cost, but he was told only about $75,000 had been collected -- raising concerns about whether the province would end up on the hook for a shortfall, he added.

That's simply wrong, Calvert said in a phone interview.

"The whole project is $11.5 million -- total -- and $8 million was the money in the bank."
Someone isn't telling the truth. Any guesses?
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  #2963  
Old Posted Mar 27, 2008, 3:12 PM
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Originally Posted by circle33 View Post
/\ Good one.

It would be a shame to see this project scrapped. It sure sounds as if this move is purely political. I guess we'll see over the next few day if there is any fall out. There certainly seems to be different versions of the truth regarding the financing of this project ( see SP story today).



Someone isn't telling the truth. Any guesses?
Well, considering the current government is taking money back that was spent out of the 2007 budget, when they have a $1.5 billion dollar surplus.....I'm guess the Sask Party might be spreading some misinformation.

This is a really bad situation, Station 20 would be a great and necessary addition to Saskatoon and it just doesn't make sense for the government to go back on a previous years committment, especially one that could give a much needed shot in the arm to the west side of Saskatoon.
     
     
  #2964  
Old Posted Mar 27, 2008, 4:55 PM
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From the government website....Sept. 4, 2007 news release

Quote:
The Government of Saskatchewan committed $8 million to the project, as part of a $100 million plan to revitalize Saskatchewan neighbourhoods which was announced in February. In August, the City of Saskatoon approved the land transfer to Station 20 West. A fundraising campaign is being launched to cover the remainder of the estimated $12.6 million cost of construction. Station 20 West is expected to open in 2009.
Calvert's math seems to trump Gantefoer's.
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  #2965  
Old Posted Mar 27, 2008, 6:01 PM
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So Wall hasn't been doing much for business or cities with this new budget has he? I don't think this province needed change, well, maybe if i lived Outlook.
     
     
  #2966  
Old Posted Mar 27, 2008, 9:31 PM
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And the rural-urban divide continues to strengthen!
     
     
  #2967  
Old Posted Mar 28, 2008, 2:14 AM
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In CTV's report on the fallout over Station 20 West this evening, Premier Wall was questioned about the reasoning behind pulling the funding. He explained that the provincial government is not in the business of building "malls" or financing stores to compete with others in the area.

🞵🞵🞵!?! Has he looked at this project at all?? This is NO mall. That is for sure. And he doesn't want to finance a grocery store that would compete with other stores? What other stores?!? There are no grocery stores left in the core. No competition to be found. Those core neighborhoods need that grocery store and the other services to be located in the CEC.

Premier Wall appears to be completely blind and ignorant to that. He doesn't have a clue about what this project is about. His apparent lack of understanding and appreciation for Station 20 West is very frustrating. A mall, my 🞵🞵🞵.
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  #2968  
Old Posted Mar 28, 2008, 3:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Country View Post
In CTV's report on the fallout over Station 20 West this evening, Premier Wall was questioned about the reasoning behind pulling the funding. He explained that the provincial government is not in the business of building "malls" or financing stores to compete with others in the area.

🞵🞵🞵!?! Has he looked at this project at all?? This is NO mall. That is for sure. And he doesn't want to finance a grocery store that would compete with other stores? What other stores?!? There are no grocery stores left in the core. No competition to be found. Those core neighborhoods need that grocery store and the other services to be located in the CEC.

Premier Wall appears to be completely blind and ignorant to that. He doesn't have a clue about what this project is about. His apparent lack of understanding and appreciation for Station 20 West is very frustrating. A mall, my 🞵🞵🞵.
Okay remove your emotional attachment to the development for a second.

Why would the provincial government finance a grocery store? It makes ZERO sense. And furthermore, if you were a business (within direct area or not) and the provincial government was financing your competition or like-business, what would your thoughts about that be?

Yes it's crappy that they're backing out of it...but the reality is, the government never should have been involved in the first place, IMO.
     
     
  #2969  
Old Posted Mar 28, 2008, 3:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Chaps View Post
Okay remove your emotional attachment to the development for a second.

Why would the provincial government finance a grocery store? It makes ZERO sense. And furthermore, if you were a business (within direct area or not) and the provincial government was financing your competition or like-business, what would your thoughts about that be?

Yes it's crappy that they're backing out of it...but the reality is, the government never should have been involved in the first place, IMO.
I see that my loose summary of the Premier's comments on the project (from memory) may have been misleading.

Just to clarify, the funding for the Community Enterprise Centre was not destined to directly fund the grocery store. The grocery store ("Good Food Junction") is being planned and developed independently by CHEP (www.chep.org) to be located in the CEC and will inevitably be a rent paying occupant.

Premier Wall did comment that he does not want to instigate competition with existing stores. The problem is there are no grocery stores in the core neighborhoods to compete with. As a result, this planned grocery store is sorely needed and would benefit from being part of the "one stop shop" for basic and community services that Station 20 West is aiming to provide.

The government money was towards the construction of the overall facility, which is to include several community services (not shopping mall-like clothing stores or Tim Hortons'). Provincial investment in an urban renewal project is certainly valid and has been practiced before.

My frustration was definitely obvious in my last post. I just did not like how Wall characterized the whole thing as a mall. That's misleading and unfair to those who have worked to develop the Station 20 West concept.
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  #2970  
Old Posted Mar 28, 2008, 4:06 AM
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Really unfortunate to hear about the Station 20 West un-funding. Station 20 is exactly what the downtown needs, and could support. Sad...

At least Cameco has found it's piece of land (close to River Landing) and is actively pursuing it's new tower.
     
     
  #2971  
Old Posted Mar 28, 2008, 4:12 AM
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Originally Posted by CtrlAltDel View Post
At least Cameco has found it's piece of land (close to River Landing) and is actively pursuing it's new tower.
Is there something you know that we don't?

All our knowledge is based on speculation and SP articles forecasting new office towers in the near future. Have anything to share with us?
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  #2972  
Old Posted Mar 28, 2008, 4:15 AM
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I can't say much more than that (there's not a whole lot to tell yet, to be honest) but it is indeed a go.
     
     
  #2973  
Old Posted Mar 28, 2008, 4:55 AM
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Re: Station 20 West

A completely ignorant, short sighted, politically motivated decision by Wall and company.

It has been reported that the Sask. Party has other priorities, like upgrading the fire alarm system at St. Pauls hospital. Why are we not able to commit funding to both projects? I don't believe our financial position is so dire that we have to slash funding for innovative social development projects in order to dedicate funding towards routine maintenance at our hospitals

The Saskatchewan Party wishes to display it's conservative fiscal management and has made a choice to target a project with obvious NDP support, but why? Who are they trying to please by axing funding, do they have suggestions as to who might make up for the funding shortfall? No they don't, because it is not the government's responsibility. It may be true that it is not the government's responsibility, but it is in the best interest of our city and this province that innovative social support services receive financial and political support less we continue to ignore the less wealthy members of society.

Now we wait to hear whether alternative funding sources can be accessed, or perhaps the government might choose to re-consider it's position.

The government's position establishes an undesirable uncertainty for future projects, where else might they cut funding?
     
     
  #2974  
Old Posted Mar 28, 2008, 5:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CtrlAltDel View Post
I can't say much more than that (there's not a whole lot to tell yet, to be honest) but it is indeed a go.
Sounds promising Please inform us as much as you can! I look forward to a real, not fantasy, Cameco tower rendering.
     
     
  #2975  
Old Posted Mar 28, 2008, 5:19 AM
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Originally Posted by SASKFTW View Post
A completely ignorant, short sighted, politically motivated decision by Wall and company.
You can say that again. Painting this project like a run-of-the-mill commercial development is a sleazy ploy to win over the uninformed public. Does Wall even know what CHEP is?
     
     
  #2976  
Old Posted Mar 28, 2008, 5:29 AM
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Originally Posted by CtrlAltDel View Post
I can't say much more than that (there's not a whole lot to tell yet, to be honest) but it is indeed a go.
Good news, thank you!

We're not looking at too big a deal here are we? ....just 30 floors or so? Nothin' special, right?
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  #2977  
Old Posted Mar 28, 2008, 5:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Country View Post
Good news, thank you!

We're not looking at too big a deal here are we? ....just 30 floors or so? Nothin' special, right?
Nothing to see here folks, move along now
     
     
  #2978  
Old Posted Mar 28, 2008, 3:35 PM
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Quote:
20th Street 'mall' not a priority: gov't
Lori Coolican and James Wood, The StarPhoenix
Published: Friday, March 28, 2008

Health Minister Don McMorris says broken hospital fire alarms and mould-infested care homes -- not political games -- are the motive for the Saskatchewan Party government's decision to pull $8 million in funding from Station 20 West, a non-profit development under construction in Saskatoon's inner city.


But Premier Brad Wall added another reason, saying the new government has a philosophical problem with devoting provincial funds to the project, likening it to a "shopping mall."

Meanwhile, organizers say they'll keep trying to change the government's mind and will explore all avenues to keep the project alive.

"Since I've been in the minister's office in the last four months we realized that there's some huge capital needs in the province, as well as in Saskatoon. So we felt that it's more important right now -- a priority is to make sure that the acute-care facilities that we have here in Saskatoon, for example, are equipped properly," McMorris told a crush of reporters in Saskatoon Thursday morning.

"You know, the chillers at RUH, they need to be replaced, the fire alarm doesn't work at St. Paul's (Hospital), there's a CT scan that needs to be added. There are a number of challenges, immediately -- safety challenges -- that we hold the liability on," he said.

"For example, a fire alarm -- I mean, they've hired more people (and) it's a human fire alarm now -- that's just not acceptable in today's standards, so we have decided to move the money from Station 20 to make sure that our facilities are properly equipped. So that was a decision that was made by our government."

Withdrawing financial support for the project was not a political decision, McMorris insists.

"I can tell you that we didn't look at where it was being built, we looked at it as, what is the need of our infrastructure as far as health care is concerned. We have a lot of long-term care homes that the roofs are leaking and there's mold growing in the rooms and they're having to move patients out. Those are priorities."


The non-profit groups behind Station 20 West "needed to raise about $4 million," McMorris said. That's a far cry from the $12- to $14-million private fundraising goal suggested Wednesday by Finance Minister Rod Gantefoer, whose office later confirmed he'd been mistaken about the numbers.

Nevertheless, McMorris said organizers were having "limited success" collecting donations.

At a press conference later in the day, Station 20 West project manager Paul Wilkinson said organizers needed to raise about $3.5 million on their own, and had already received commitments worth about $1 million. They knew they would be able to obtain a mortgage to cover a further $1 million, and felt confident a public fundraising campaign could net the remaining $1.5 million within the next few months, Wilkinson said.

"We have a large number of very significant partners in this project."

The University of Saskatchewan's college of dentistry had planned to open a clinic at Station 20 West to offer low-cost care using faculty and senior students as part of their training. The West Side Community Clinic also planned to move there, along with some public health programs for immunization, addictions and mental health. The Child Hunger and Education Program (CHEP), Good Food Junction Co-op grocery store and Elizabeth Fry Society were also expected to join the multi-purpose centre.

"Everyone believes the project is critical to improving the health and well-being of the core neighbourhoods," Wilkinson said. "We're not folding."

In Regina, Premier Brad Wall acknowledged the concept of the project was "problematic" for the Saskatchewan Party. He dismissed Station 20 West as essentially a "mall development" in an interview Thursday.

"I believe that this particular project was supposed to have about $3 million from the private sector in it and $75,000 had been raised over a number of months," he said.

"We ought not to be in the mall business and it's just, it's a different approach. We don't think that the government of Saskatchewan should be opening up basically a mall development, where we'd be competing with grocery stores, competing with others who are already renting (facility space) now to community clinics in the area."

Wall noted an affordable housing development which formed part of the Station 20 West concept "is going to continue." The 55 duplex units are near completion.

NDP Leader Lorne Calvert said the discrepancy in the numbers put forward by Gantefoer, Wall and McMorris raises basic questions about the government.

"Just set aside partisan considerations here. You're making decisions about people's lives and apparently you don't even have the numbers," he said. "It's either a question of competency or this is a smoke-and-mirrors excuse."


Calvert bristled at Wall's description of the project as a mall and at Wall's opposition to a grocery store.

"I know the premier has a problem with any kind of community-based economic development initiative. This is a private-sector co-op, no different than any other co-op that you would find in a small town or a large town," he said.

"Maybe (Wall) thinks everyone should shop at Wal-Mart. I guess that's his concept. Well, I'm sorry, the folks that I met on 20th Street yesterday maybe have little kids and carriages and they can't get over to the Wal-Mart. Even the Giant Tiger is a reach for some of them. And anyway Giant Tiger is not particularly a grocery store."

Calvert said he hoped the government wasn't playing politics, but said he was beginning to get that feeling.

The Station 20 project is across the street from Calvert's Saskatoon Riversdale constituency, in the Saskatoon Centre constituency of his fellow NDP MLA David Forbes.

"This is all affecting the inner-city of Saskatoon, represented by New Democrats," he said. "Surely not even Brad Wall can deny the need."

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Incompetency or partisan politics, which is it? Maybe it is both, oh Sask. Party how far you've come

We all enjoy hearing what the Canada West Foundation has to say about economic issues, but how often do they voice their perspective on social issues affecting Western Canada's cities? Let us listen to what they have to say.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Addressing Street Level Social Issues in Western Canada's Big Cities
.............The time has come for all actors, public and private, to recognize that key social problems are uniquely urban problems, and that they must be dealt with in an urban context. One barrier is that many social problems go largely unseen or ignored, at least until they reach a difficult and possibly irreversible boiling point. The quality of life in large cities is surprisingly fragile. As numerous American cities illustrate, if social problems fester unchecked, cities can become ghettos surrounded by gated suburbs. The challenge is to act quickly, before street level social problems spiral out of control or, where such decline already exists, to act decisively based on the best information available. Indeed, many North American cities have reportedly seen success in avoiding significant street level social problems by adopting a proactive approach.

A second barrier in dealing with urban social problems is that there is no single government or agency responsible for dealing with social needs. Cities are multi-jurisdictional sites, and the federal, provincial and municipal governments, as well as the nonprofit and corporate sectors, each have a role to play. This can be a barrier to progress, as senior governments can be tempted to "pass the buck" on complex social problems, and municipal governments currently lack the resources, capacity and expertise to assume full responsibility for these problems.

Finally, a lack of information about the full extent of street level social problems, the current responses to them, and the best practices for addressing them is a third barrier. Information exists, but it is often difficult for policy-makers and stakeholders to pull together and make sense of it while putting out daily fires. Anecdotes abound, but resources and coherent strategies are not always readily accessible.

Western Canadians and their decision leaders need a better, more fulsome understanding of street level social problems in our large urban centres and the best practices for addressing them. We need to know not only what the problems are, but also the implications of these problems for our cities. Western Canadians need a greater understanding of which governments are responsible to address which particular urban social problem, where government responsibility ends, how the nonprofit and private sectors can contribute positively, and what efforts are (or are not) being taken to improve urban society and by whom. And, western Canadian policy-makers and stakeholders need information to learn from one another. What works, and what doesn't, in dealing with particular street level problems? Are there best practices to address the unique problems faced by big cities that can be shared so that each city does not need to "reinvent the wheel?" ...........
Source

CWF's position on urban issues certainly suggests there might be more to the Saskatchewan Party's decision than simply a reallocation of health funding.

Now a question for the Saskatchewan Party, was the decision to pull funding worth the costs?

Completely unacceptable.
     
     
  #2979  
Old Posted Mar 28, 2008, 10:07 PM
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whoa CtrlAltDel when did u hear this info on cameco

u can't be mean and hide the good details

what lot downtown?
how tall?
when will we see the plans?

please tell some more info at least 1 question
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  #2980  
Old Posted Mar 29, 2008, 12:32 AM
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Animation flyover of Station 20 West
http://www.station20west.org/flyover-popup/index.html

Screenshots captured from flyover animation





Source

Quote:
Main Level

* inside and outside multi-purpose gathering areas
* full-service grocery store
* community kitchen
* gathering areas for community celebrations and educational activities
* shared loading, recycling and cold storage areas.

Second Level

* community health and education
* possibility for drop-in childcare
* linked to the main level through an open stairwell and elevator inside the building and a terraced, landscaped park area on the outside of the building has direct access to the exterior gathering space.

Third Level

* Quint Development Corporation
* CHEP Good Food Inc.
* community outreach programs
* staff areas and shared meeting rooms





Environmental Technology

1. Natural ventilation via solar chimney

2. Geothermal environmental system: ground source heating and cooling loops tied to radiant heating and cooling systems

3. Passive solar pre-heating unit for fresh air intake

4. Solar panels for hot water heat and energy transfer

5. A bio-wall to enhance indoor air quality
Energy Efficiency

6. High quality, triple glazed, operable windows

7. Maximum use of natural lighting through window placement and light sensor switches

8. Much higher levels of insulation (R-40 walls and R-60 roof)

Waterless urinals (not shown)
Smart Ideas

9. Heat reclaim and energy transfer for all exhaust air and hot water

10. Showers and secure bicycle storage for staff and volunteers to encourage zero-emission transportation

11. Heat pumps designed to integrate building heating and food cooling requirements

12. On-site rainwater retention for cooling, irrigation and toilet operation

Features:
How Station 20 West stands out

Integration of programs and services

* sharing and co-operation—partner organizations
* making the very best use of our resouces

Social Enterprise Model

* A not-for-profit business with financial, social and environmental benefits
* A complimentary mix—of community organizations, public institutions, businesses and co-ops

Environmental sustainability

* state-of-the-art building methods
* minimal energy and water usage
* promoting pollution-free transportation

Place-making—an example for Canada

* A gathering place for everybody, strengthening our community
* The Samuel and Saidye Bronfman Foundation realized the potential of Station 20 West as a national demonstration site for place-making and donated the initial development funds.
Source

A Facebook group has developed in support of the Station 20 West project - Friends of Station 20 West

Last edited by Ruckus; Mar 31, 2008 at 11:04 PM. Reason: Inaccurate statement
     
     
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