Confederation Line (Stage 1) | In Service 1.0

[Truenorth00]

At some point we're going to have start discussing getting new LRVs that are actual long trains and built for our climate.

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

At some point we're going to have start discussing getting new LRVs that are actual long trains and built for our climate.

Hopefully if we build Stage 3, we'll be looking for new trains.

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Hopefully if we build Stage 3, we'll be looking for new trains.

Honestly, these LRVs suck. Especially on reliability. I think it would be good for us to actually cut a deal with an OEM to develop one in the late 2030s, with a long test cycle and then have them enter into service in 2040 and beyond. Getting 20 years out of the existing fleet is enough.

[lrt's friend]

This is the weakness of PPPs. The consortium assumes some risks but needs to make money too. So, there is reluctance to dump barrels of money to fix the design of the trains. So, will the flaws of the train design be fully resolved? I doubt it. The possibility of replacing the trains with a compatible model is unlikely if it increases overall costs. Going to high floor trains or a light metro is out of the question, because of the cost of the new trains and retrofitting the entire line and the years of service interruptions.

[BanjoUnchained]

Line 1 won't start running until noon on Sunday for "Stage 2 integration work and software updates". I assume it is the east extension, though I thought they had completed the integration work.

[acottawa]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

This is the weakness of PPPs. The consortium assumes some risks but needs to make money too. So, there is reluctance to dump barrels of money to fix the design of the trains. So, will the flaws of the train design be fully resolved? I doubt it. The possibility of replacing the trains with a compatible model is unlikely if it increases overall costs. Going to high floor trains or a light metro is out of the question, because of the cost of the new trains and retrofitting the entire line and the years of service interruptions.

As I recall, the rolling stock industry was consulted fairly early in the process and they were unanimous in their recommendation that the city should use light metro vehicles. The city insisted on using trams that were not suited for this use. I am not sure a PPP is to blame.

[lrt's friend]

Originally Posted by acottawa

As I recall, the rolling stock industry was consulted fairly early in the process and they were unanimous in their recommendation that the city should use light metro vehicles. The city insisted on using trams that were not suited for this use. I am not sure a PPP is to blame.

The poor choice of vehicles is a separate issue. We can't blame the consortium. We have no right to bankrupt them, but we are now seeing the down side of PPPs. There is not infinite money to resolve design flaws

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by acottawa

As I recall, the rolling stock industry was consulted fairly early in the process and they were unanimous in their recommendation that the city should use light metro vehicles. The city insisted on using trams that were not suited for this use. I am not sure a PPP is to blame.

Yes. I attended some of the public consultations. Distinctly remember several suggesting that Ottawa use light metros given the passenger volumes and frequencies being considered. The idea to use light rail was because Ottawa wanted a hybrid operation with street running in the suburbs. But that idea died after the VIA bus crash. Then they went fully segregated and grade separated across the system. But kept the Light Rail requirement since design was already underway. Would also add that the previous LRT plan probably added some anchoring bias.

Back then so much of the public genuinely questioned if Ottawa even needed rail transport.

[Hybrid247]

The decision to go with a low floor design instead of a light metro design is one that irks me everyday, but that aside, the issues affecting the current fleet should not be happening regardless. We shouldn't have to be dealing with wheel assemblies failing so early in their service life because they can't handle normal track curvature. I think Alstom is to blame for a lot of this. They delivered absolute lemons and they are refusing to accept responsibility to fix the issues. Frustrating.

These trains are supposed to have a 30-year service life. While I love the idea of engaging another manufacturer to design and build a new fleet of tailor made trains, I just can't see it happening before the 2040s, especially with the politics in this town.

[OCCheetos]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

Yes. I attended some of the public consultations. Distinctly remember several suggesting that Ottawa use light metros given the passenger volumes and frequencies being considered. The idea to use light rail was because Ottawa wanted a hybrid operation with street running in the suburbs. But that idea died after the VIA bus crash. Then they went fully segregated and grade separated across the system. But kept the Light Rail requirement since design was already underway. Would also add that the previous LRT plan probably added some anchoring bias.

Back then so much of the public genuinely questioned if Ottawa even needed rail transport.

The idea died before the VIA bus crash. The decision to fully grade-separate Stage 2 (and beyond) was made months before the crash happened, and ironically, the decision was made entirely because of concerns about the would-be capacity of a system with grade crossings which was obviously raised beforehand. The 2013 TMP, which included an at-grade Carling tram anyway, was approved in the months following the VIA crash. The timeline just doesn't add up.

It never had anything to do with the VIA crash, it wouldn't make sense even if it did, and I hope some day we'll stop seeing people cite that as a cause because it was not at all related.

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by OCCheetos

The idea died before the VIA bus crash. The decision to fully grade-separate Stage 2 (and beyond) was made months before the crash happened, and ironically, the decision was made entirely because of concerns about the would-be capacity of a system with grade crossings which was obviously raised beforehand. The 2013 TMP, which included an at-grade Carling tram anyway, was approved in the months following the VIA crash. The timeline just doesn't add up.

It never had anything to do with the VIA crash, it wouldn't make sense even if it did, and I hope some day we'll stop seeing people cite that as a cause because it was not at all related.

I stand corrected on the history. Good rehash of the timeline. Thank you.

Either way, the fixation on LRT really hurt us. If they had genuinely been open to the idea of building a light metro, we'd have probably ended up with a much better system. Just look at the REM. It's what 5% more per km? Look at what they get for that. Enclosed, climate controlled stations. Automated operations. It's what 21st century public transport should be.

[ponyboycurtis]

Rhetorical question, but did we pick LRT because that is what Calgary and Edmonton have and they are easily to most comparable cities? Ignoring the fact that their systems launched what.. 30 years prior?

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by ponyboycurtis

Rhetorical question, but did we pick LRT because that is what Calgary and Edmonton have and they are easily to most comparable cities? Ignoring the fact that their systems launched what.. 30 years prior?

I think it's some combination of a fixation on LRT from the cancelled plan prior and the weird idea that a lot of Ottawa residents and politicians had that Ottawa was not big enough for heavier mass transport.

[OTSkyline]

I thought our system could be turned to automated/driverless fairly easily, no?

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by OTSkyline

I thought our system could be turned to automated/driverless fairly easily, no?

The trains can drive themselves, but because it's low floor it can't safely be done. It's a weird system in so many ways. Maybe someone has more insight.

[rocketphish]

Line 1, 2 problems disrupt travel early Thursday
3rd train problem this morning is closing platforms at St-Laurent, Cyrville

CBC News
Posted: Jan 08, 2026 7:18 AM EST | Last Updated: 1 hour ago

Line 1 trains are having problems for the second morning in a row, while Line 2 trains were not running between Dow's Lake and Carleton stations earlier Thursday because of a switch problem.

The active problem is on Line 1, where a stopped train is closing eastbound platforms at St-Laurent and Cyrville stations.

All trains are using the westbound platform and riders have to change trains at St-Laurent, according to OC Transpo, which first posted about this on social media around 8:10 a.m.

Earlier, the agency first posted about the Line 2 switch problem around 6:20 a.m., not long after service started for the day.

R2 replacement buses were brought in between Carleton and Bayview stations. That problem had been fixed by 7:30 a.m., according to OC Transpo.

Line 1 also had a problem around launch on Thursday. OC Transpo posted there was a stopped train and platform closures around the west end of its tunnel under downtown until around 6:15 a.m.

The transit agency also said there was a stopped train and platform closures in that same area of Line 1 from about 8:15 to 9 a.m. Wednesday morning.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/line-1-2-train-ottawa-lrt-problem-9.7037691

[Kitchissippi]

With all these problems and some with no clear solutions, I find it odd that Quebec City is getting the same trains for their tramway.

[Richard Eade]

If I’m reading this article correctly, Line 1 had:

• A stopped train near the west end of the tunnel on Wednesday morning;
• A stopped train near the west end of the tunnel on Thursday morning; and
• A stopped east-bound train somewhere between the west portal into St. Laurent (just east of the switch to west-bound tracks) and Blair on Thursday morning.

Haven’t there been past reports of power issues between Pimisi and Lyon? I wonder if there is a transition between overhead wire to overhead power bar? (I can’t remember if wires continue through the tunnel, or if power bars/rails are used.) I believe that there is also a Traction Power Sub Station (TPSS) beside that tunnel portal. That would indicate that there is a power transition there from one TPSS to another. That transition may also be problematic.

The stopped east-bound train, this morning, would not have been an overhead power problem (since that would have affected west-bound track operation also). This was, likely, just a random train problem. That happens.

The article reads as if OC Transpo broke Line 1 into two parts; by short-turning the east-bound train at St. Laurent, and re-timing the eastern segment, St. Laurent to Blair, such that it used the St. Laurent west-bound platform between other trains. Such a scheme might allow full frequency, but it forces all riders to transfer between trains (as the article implies). If OC Transpo was able to use such flexibility, Kudos to it.

For Line 2, since they removed all of the rail anyway, why didn’t they put some switches UNDER COVER?

• The switch just north of Beech should have been under Beech;
• The switch north of Carleton (the problem this morning) should have been under the Carleton parking structure;
• The switch south of Carleton would remain uncovered;
• Two bridges over the VIA Rail track should have been built so the switch could be under the Airport Parkway; and
• The switch north of Walkley should have been under Walkley.

Unfortunately, all other switches, from the half-diamond south, would remain exposed.

Putting switches under cover does not guarantee their smooth operation, but it could help, and if it doesn’t cost much more (except for the additional bridge, of course), it should have been done.

(FULL DISCLOSURE: The suggestion of putting the switches under cover is a hind-sight view. I did not think of it until now. However, I would hope that companies who were supposed to be professionals at designing rail systems would have thought of such things. But, apparently not.)

[Richard Eade]

Originally Posted by Kitchissippi

With all these problems and some with no clear solutions, I find it odd that Quebec City is getting the same trains for their tramway.

They have also been accepted by Metrolinx. But remember, Ottawa has been the testing ground for the new trains for, what, five-and-a-half years now. Apart from the Wheel Bearing Assembly, all of the other big issues (that we know of) have been corrected. If the bogie gets a redesign (Now that others are using the vehicle, there might be more pressure on Alstom to do the redesign.) the Citadis Spirit should be quite a good light rail vehicle.

[roger1818]

Originally Posted by Richard Eade

They have also been accepted by Metrolinx. But remember, Ottawa has been the testing ground for the new trains for, what, five-and-a-half years now. Apart from the Wheel Bearing Assembly, all of the other big issues (that we know of) have been corrected. If the bogie gets a redesign (Now that others are using the vehicle, there might be more pressure on Alstom to do the redesign.) the Citadis Spirit should be quite a good light rail vehicle.

Are Metrolinx seeing the same issues with the Wheel Bearing Assembly that we are?