Stadiums & Arenas of Canada, Part 3

[jonny24]

Originally Posted by craner

By “bleachers” do you mean benches and not individual seats ?

I would imagine they could salvage the seats from the existing north side grandstand for re-use in the new one.

That's exactly what they are doing.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

So the stands' capacity will go down from 14k to 12.4k, yet somehow capacity remains the same. I guess the two-sided suites in the arena and new fan deck on the arena side, maybe a bunch more standing room elsewhere. The new north side will have seats. I'm just being dramatic.

There was always a provision for standing room in the North stands akin to some of the "newer" stadiums in Canada that have "party zones"

Not sure why you were trying to be dramatic and seemingly denigrate the new structure as "bleachers" It will be fine, just hope that somebody doesn't screw it up and wait ten more years.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by jonny24

That's exactly what they are doing.

Do you have a confirmation on that (reusing seats), it seems pretty precise at this stage. By that time they will be 16 years old but considering the Olympic Stadium seats haven't been replaced, it's understandable. But then again would you want worn seats on a brand new structure.

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by elly63

There was always a provision for standing room in the North stands akin to some of the "newer" stadiums in Canada that have "party zones"

Not sure why you were trying to be dramatic and seemingly denigrate the new structure as "bleachers" It will be fine, just hope that somebody doesn't screw it up and wait ten more years.

I'm sure the new facilities will give fans a far better experience than what we have now. Standards today are dramatically different than what they were sixty years ago. Even the capacity question at this point doesn't bother me too much; the PWHL will either grow to the point that even the current Civic Centre could be too small, or lose a bit of that initial excitement and settle into the smaller arena proposed for 2.0.

Although I would have preferred renovating our current facility for environmental, nostalgic and historical purposes (along with preserving the current park aspect as it exists), that ship has sailed. With construction starting imminently, it will have progressed enough by next municipal election a year from now that stopping the project won't be possible.

Originally Posted by elly63

Do you have a confirmation on that (reusing seats), it seems pretty precise at this stage. By that time they will be 16 years old but considering the Olympic Stadium seats haven't been replaced, it's understandable. But then again would you want worn seats on a brand new structure.

They will only have 14 years of usage, and many of them will have been partially weather protected. With fewer seats in the new stands, we'll be able to pick the ones that are in best shape. It will also match the south side's vintage.

I don't know if they'll actually reuse the seats, but I hope so. Would be nice to salvage a few things from the renovation a decade ago.

[jonny24]

Originally Posted by elly63

Do you have a confirmation on that (reusing seats), it seems pretty precise at this stage. By that time they will be 16 years old but considering the Olympic Stadium seats haven't been replaced, it's understandable. But then again would you want worn seats on a brand new structure.

Yes...

GENERAL NOTES:
-EXISTING NORTH STANDS SEATS ARE TO BE
REMOVED PRIOR TO DEMOLITION, STORED DURING
THE DURATION OF THE PROJECT, CLEANED, AND
REINSTALLED. EXISTING DAMAGED SEATS ARE TO BE
FIXED AND PRESERVED.
-PLEASE REFER TO SPECIFICATIONS FOR NEW
EXTERIOR FIXED SEATS AND SEAT COUNT
BREAKDOWN
-FOR NEW FIXED SEATS, PROVIDE SEATS THAT ARE
EXTERIOR GRADE AND ARE SUITABLE FOR OPEN AIR
ASSEMBLY

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by jonny24

Yes...

GENERAL NOTES:
-EXISTING NORTH STANDS SEATS ARE TO BE
REMOVED PRIOR TO DEMOLITION, STORED DURING
THE DURATION OF THE PROJECT, CLEANED, AND
REINSTALLED. EXISTING DAMAGED SEATS ARE TO BE
FIXED AND PRESERVED.
-PLEASE REFER TO SPECIFICATIONS FOR NEW
EXTERIOR FIXED SEATS AND SEAT COUNT
BREAKDOWN
-FOR NEW FIXED SEATS, PROVIDE SEATS THAT ARE
EXTERIOR GRADE AND ARE SUITABLE FOR OPEN AIR
ASSEMBLY

Great to hear!

[craner]

Yes - glad they are being re-used - and as was said - they are the same vintage as the south grandstand.

[elly63]

Lnk

Originally Posted by jonny24

Yes...

GENERAL NOTES:
-EXISTING NORTH STANDS SEATS ARE TO BE
REMOVED PRIOR TO DEMOLITION, STORED DURING
THE DURATION OF THE PROJECT, CLEANED, AND
REINSTALLED. EXISTING DAMAGED SEATS ARE TO BE
FIXED AND PRESERVED.
-PLEASE REFER TO SPECIFICATIONS FOR NEW
EXTERIOR FIXED SEATS AND SEAT COUNT
BREAKDOWN
-FOR NEW FIXED SEATS, PROVIDE SEATS THAT ARE
EXTERIOR GRADE AND ARE SUITABLE FOR OPEN AIR
ASSEMBLY

Where is that from. Link?

[jonny24]

Originally Posted by elly63

Where is that from. Link?

I don't think I can link you to a company server....

Sheet NS-A9-901 of the Arch set, if you find a way to access that.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by jonny24

I don't think I can link you to a company server....Sheet NS-A9-901 of the Arch set, if you find a way to access that.

Thanks for that, I like to have things documented so there will be a record so when a year or two down the road, when memories fade, there will be the facts. For some reason I can't seem to find the place where I posted documents before, where I think it might be. I'll find it sooner or later.

[SteelTown]

Update on TD Coliseum, they are working on the exterior lights.




Source: Reidfenwick @ https://urbantoronto.ca/forum/thread....32788/page-51

[J.OT13]

From Wikipedia, what it used to look like. Not dramatically different.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TD_Coliseum

[EnvisionSaintJohn]

Originally Posted by SteelTown

Update on TD Coliseum, they are working on the exterior lights.




Source: Reidfenwick @ https://urbantoronto.ca/forum/thread....32788/page-51

Had to google Rezilience... interesting.

Originally Posted by J.OT13

From Wikipedia, what it used to look like. Not dramatically different.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TD_Coliseum

Yup, but it does look considerably nicer, despite being pretty much the exact same shape. The nighttime / lights are doing the heavy lifting, but the next exterior panels look more modern.

Hamilton absolutely deserves an NHL team. It's BS that the New York Metropolitan area can have 3 NHL teams, but the GTHA can't have two.

Territorial rights in the NHL are way too restrictive, and I bet many transplanted Canadians in Toronto would be far more willing to support a new team in the area not called the Leafs.

I've got 2 close friends in Toronto that would never stop supporting their teams (Flames and Oilers) but would probably adopt the Hamilton team as their second teams, but would never consider the Leafs their seconds team haha.

[J.OT13]

Hope to see some daytime images to better compare.

I am glad the arena was renovated so that the GTHA could have two modern NHL sized facilities. I'm also glad that the earlier design wasn't retained. That would have been bad.



https://www.theglobeandmail.com/busi...tion-in-first/

New York has three NHL teams, LA has two. I wouldn't mind seeing one in Hamilton. Quebec City as well, of course. Would love 10 teams in Canada, but I'm not sure we have another city that could support that. Maybe one of the Saskatchewan twins?

[elly63]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

New York has three NHL teams, LA has two. I wouldn't mind seeing one in Hamilton. Quebec City as well, of course. Would love 10 teams in Canada, but I'm not sure we have another city that could support that. Maybe one of the Saskatchewan twins?

Maybe this is a simplistic question but I have been wondering lately why we don't have a cross country Canadian hockey league for non NHL cities, a notch below the NHL in caliber.

I'm just putting it out there without much thought behind it. Is there a glaring reason why this hasn't happened?

Looking at kind of an AHL level that is above juniors and university but below NHL. I know the AHL has had a Canadian division but nothing like a truly Canadian league. I don't think I've ever heard of anyone trying to organize one, we certainly have the facilities.

Looking at the discrepancy in the size of the buildings there would likely be the need for some sort of revenue sharing

Videotron Centre Quebec City 18,259
TD Coliseum Hamilton 17,383
SaskTel Centre Saskatoon 15,195
Scotiabank Centre Halifax 10,595
Place Bell Laval Quebec 10,000
Canada Life Place London 9,100
Avenir Centre Moncton 8,800
Kitchener Memorial Auditorium Kitchener 7,268
Save-On-Foods Memorial Centre Victoria 7,006
Abbotsford Centre Abbotsford 7,000
WFCU Centre Windsor 6,500
TD Station Saint John 6,308
Mary Brown's Centre St. John's 6,247
Brandt Centre Regina 6,200
Peavey Mart Centrium Red Deer 6,000

[EnvisionSaintJohn]

Originally Posted by elly63

Maybe this is a simplistic question but I have been wondering lately why we don't have a cross country Canadian hockey league for non NHL cities, a notch below the NHL in caliber.

I'm just putting it out there without much thought behind it. Is there a glaring reason why this hasn't happened?

Looking at kind of an AHL level that is above juniors and university but below NHL. I know the AHL has had a Canadian division but nothing like a truly Canadian league. I don't think I've ever heard of anyone trying to organize one, we certainly have the facilities.

Looking at the discrepancy in the size of the buildings there would likely be the need for some sort of revenue sharing

Videotron Centre Quebec City 18,259
TD Coliseum Hamilton 17,383
SaskTel Centre Saskatoon 15,195
Scotiabank Centre Halifax 10,595
Place Bell Laval Quebec 10,000
Canada Life Place London 9,100
Avenir Centre Moncton 8,800
Kitchener Memorial Auditorium Kitchener 7,268
Save-On-Foods Memorial Centre Victoria 7,006
Abbotsford Centre Abbotsford 7,000
WFCU Centre Windsor 6,500
TD Station Saint John 6,308
Mary Brown's Centre St. John's 6,247
Brandt Centre Regina 6,200
Peavey Mart Centrium Red Deer 6,000

It would be nice. The only reasons i can think of are the presence of the AHL and how NHL centric most Canadian hockey fans are.

I think it would be great to see the Canadian teams leave the AHL and for this new, Canadian league to fill in the gap between the AHL and NHL.

Feel like Thunder Bay is a huge omission from your list. It blows my mind that Thunder Bay has never had a team in the OHL or the AHL, like wtf! Saint John and Moncton were much smaller than Thunder Bay when they had NHL teams, and both cities still have QMJHL teams. Thunder Bay should absolutely have an OHL team, but I bet the rest of the teams don't want to travel there.

[elly63]

Thunder Bay hasn't had an AHL team because of the isolation and travel costs and the arena was a dump (built in 1951)

I've just been looking at the refurb they did in 1995 and it looks pretty good. I was in the building before that and it looked every inch of 1951.

Although the city proper was bigger, Moncton had the larger Metro area (Riverview/Dieppe)

The Fort William Gardens seats only 4680 and I stopped my list at 6000 and there are 21 other arenas between the FWG and the rink in Red Deer.

The FWG was where a young Paul Shaffer would go to meet up with The Guess Who and befriend them on their trips there from Winnipeg.

Go Twins, Wally Presenger

[elly63]

Makes me wonder how many Canadians play abroad and could be enticed home. As an example there are supposedly 68 playing in the KHL

Why not start our own Canadian pro leagues

[Djeffery]

This just seems like an idea that would have happened already if there was a demand for it. Part of the problem would be most of these arenas are controlled by a hockey tenant already. Canada Life Place doesn't have another hockey tenant in it unless the London Knights say so, and they won't, and I suspect most of these other arenas are the same. With the exception of course of a place like Quebec City, where the Q team couldn't prevent an NHL team from coming in.

Aside from that though, I question how hockey mad Canada really is. We like NHL hockey, and some places really like their affordable CHL hockey. Laval draws really well in the AHL, the next highest team is Toronto, 4000 less per game on average. Abby, Calgary and Manitoba are give or take around 4000 per game and of course Belleville has a small arena at just less than 3000 a game. It could be said the AHL is the highest level of hockey outside the NHL, but even if we look at the KHL or other European leagues, I don't know how these second tier Canadian cities compete for players at similar type of attendance figures as the AHL gets considering the AHL doesn't pay their players. And I'm not convinced a league like this would draw like the AHL.

[jonny24]

Originally Posted by Djeffery

This just seems like an idea that would have happened already if there was a demand for it. Part of the problem would be most of these arenas are controlled by a hockey tenant already. Canada Life Place doesn't have another hockey tenant in it unless the London Knights say so, and they won't, and I suspect most of these other arenas are the same. With the exception of course of a place like Quebec City, where the Q team couldn't prevent an NHL team from coming in.

I suspect that if such a league were to happen, it would most likely be involving the current tennants - i.e. a London Knights Senior team.