Atlantic Canada airport thread

[J81]

Originally Posted by nwalbert

I think you're making my point for me. When Covid happened, Air Canada slashed service nationally. The least influential Liberal MP in the country was Wayne Long and YSJ did not get their service returned. The federal government bailed out Air Canada, my belief is that comes with influence.

YSJ has been operated by AC Jazz staff for the last 8-9 years. YSJ is switching back to an AC operated airport, I assume in anticipation of some sort of growth. This is coming from an Air Canada employee who has always provided me with good info.

Thats a serious stretch! I dont buy any of that.

[sailor734]

It may have more to do with AC doing fewer flights but with larger mainline aircraft rather than the little Jazz Q400's and CRJ's.

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by sailor734

It may have more to do with AC doing fewer flights but with larger mainline aircraft rather than the little Jazz Q400's and CRJ's.

Agreed. Thus has to do with a pilot shortage, economics (fewer flights with more passengers) and aging equipment requiring replacement.

[MonctonRad]

I just discovered something interesting. Those ASL 747 flights from YQM to Liege, Belgium are actually ongoing to China!

Atlas Air and Kalitta Air connect to China from YQM via Anchorage. So, we have flights to China from YQM going both east and west.

YQM literally spans the globe!!!

[Saul Goode]

Originally Posted by nwalbert

I believe that it's fairly clear that the Federal government has significant sway within Air Canada.

Fairly clear? Can you cite even one source or example?

The federal government has effectively zero "sway" with AC.

[theshark]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

Agreed. Thus has to do with a pilot shortage, economics (fewer flights with more passengers) and aging equipment requiring replacement.

Bathurst got shafted too, 2 daily flights to 4 a week…. Would be nice just to have the daily flights back in the morning.

[nwalbert]

Originally Posted by Saul Goode

Fairly clear? Can you cite even one source or example?

The federal government has effectively zero "sway" with AC.

Just google “ does the federal government influence air canada”

Examples include route planning. They provided $500M in cash and a $4B loan less than 5 years ago. The idea that it would come with zero influence seems not realistic to me. But we’re all entitled to our own opinions.

[Pugsley]

Originally Posted by nwalbert

Just google “ does the federal government influence air canada”

Examples include route planning. They provided $500M in cash and a $4B loan less than 5 years ago. The idea that it would come with zero influence seems not realistic to me. But we’re all entitled to our own opinions.

This is why there should be standardized tests and licences issued before people are allowed to use the internet. I googled the same thing and what you read was the poorly crafted AI summary, which was misleading.

They gave a support loan during Covid (aka 5 years ago), as did almost every government globally to the struggling airline industry that was at brink of collapse and laying off all their staff. In terms of route planning, the same Google AI says that

"the government can influence Air Canada's route network and capacity through regulations and policies that affect airport infrastructure and competition."

But that is the same in every country around the world. It does not mean that the Government of Canada does that today w/ Air Canada, it says IT COULD.

Further, this references that it can influence...

"through regulations and policies that affect airport infrastructure and competition."

That doesn't mean Mark Carney or some MP is in the AC offices in Montreal working on their route plan. It means they can apply funding to airport projects to improve capacity that would influence AC to consider more flights (say funding for ramps at YSJ to encourage larger jets) ...OR... force a split or deny a merger of companies that is in violation of competition laws. Like when CP and AC were allowed to merge - they could have denied it and in who knows, maybe they should.

But please, everyone, if you are going to go back and forth on here wasting people's time with theories and opinions guised as "facts", go somewhere on the dark web or get better sources. It is really frustrating to come here and hope to get some news about a new flight route, a development announcement, or serious updates on projects and see a fight about fake news and Air Canada or another fictitious design idea for a project that will NEVER happen and people fighting over it.

There, my rant for the year is over.

So, did anything interesting happen in local airports today?

[nwalbert]

Originally Posted by Pugsley

This is why there should be standardized tests and licences issued before people are allowed to use the internet. I googled the same thing and what you read was the poorly crafted AI summary, which was misleading.

They gave a support loan during Covid (aka 5 years ago), as did almost every government globally to the struggling airline industry that was at brink of collapse and laying off all their staff. In terms of route planning, the same Google AI says that

"the government can influence Air Canada's route network and capacity through regulations and policies that affect airport infrastructure and competition."

But that is the same in every country around the world. It does not mean that the Government of Canada does that today w/ Air Canada, it says IT COULD.

Further, this references that it can influence...

"through regulations and policies that affect airport infrastructure and competition."

That doesn't mean Mark Carney or some MP is in the AC offices in Montreal working on their route plan. It means they can apply funding to airport projects to improve capacity that would influence AC to consider more flights (say funding for ramps at YSJ to encourage larger jets) ...OR... force a split or deny a merger of companies that is in violation of competition laws. Like when CP and AC were allowed to merge - they could have denied it and in who knows, maybe they should.

But please, everyone, if you are going to go back and forth on here wasting people's time with theories and opinions guised as "facts", go somewhere on the dark web or get better sources. It is really frustrating to come here and hope to get some news about a new flight route, a development announcement, or serious updates on projects and see a fight about fake news and Air Canada or another fictitious design idea for a project that will NEVER happen and people fighting over it.

There, my rant for the year is over.

So, did anything interesting happen in local airports today?

Wow!! Someone woke up on the wrong side of the bed. Lol

Like I said previously, we disagree on this. But I don’t come here to argue with folks or prove my intelligence to strangers.

We do agree, Now it would be nice to just go back to discussing the airports and enjoying a long weekend.

[Saul Goode]

Originally Posted by nwalbert

Just google “ does the federal government influence air canada”

Examples include route planning. They provided $500M in cash and a $4B loan less than 5 years ago. The idea that it would come with zero influence seems not realistic to me. But we’re all entitled to our own opinions.

Indeed we are entitled to our opinions, but they're of no value if not grounded in fact.

Your statement that the feds "provided $500M in cash and a $4B loan less than 5 years ago" is not accurate. What was provided was access to those funds, most of which turned out not to be needed. The airline drew down very little of the money and later retired all of its obligations under the agreement, and the very small equity stake the government took to secure the loan facility was subsequently divested - at a profit to taxpayers, it should be noted.

The government has the same regulatory authority over AC as it does over every other Canadian airline, but it has virtually no influence over AC's operational decisions, including routing.

You're free to continue to believe otherwise, but the facts are not on your side.

[nwalbert]

Originally Posted by Saul Goode

Indeed we are entitled to our opinions, but they're of no value if not grounded in fact.

Your statement that the feds "provided $500M in cash and a $4B loan less than 5 years ago" is not accurate. What was provided was access to those funds, most of which turned out not to be needed. The airline drew down very little of the money and later retired all of its obligations under the agreement, and the very small equity stake the government took to secure the loan facility was subsequently divested - at a profit to taxpayers, it should be noted.

The government has the same regulatory authority over AC as it does over every other Canadian airline, but it has virtually no influence over AC's operational decisions, including routing.

You're free to continue to believe otherwise, but the facts are not on your side.

Your statement is incorrect. Air Canada did take massive amounts of money from the federal government. Splitting hairs on the exact dollar amount is not my point. My opinion is that during that time substantial conversations were had between AC and the federal government and that federal government retains substantial sway inside AC via relationships, and the ability to further fund as/when needed.

Your opinion is that business I guess doesn't operate that way. The long history of government and business and lobbyists would certainly be evidence against your opinion. But you're entitled to your opinion and I respect your opinion.

[Saul Goode]

Originally Posted by nwalbert

Your statement is incorrect. Air Canada did take massive amounts of money from the federal government. Splitting hairs on the exact dollar amount is not my point. My opinion is that during that time substantial conversations were had between AC and the federal government and that federal government retains substantial sway inside AC via relationships, and the ability to further fund as/when needed.

Your opinion is that business I guess doesn't operate that way. The long history of government and business and lobbyists would certainly be evidence against your opinion. But you're entitled to your opinion and I respect your opinion.

There is no splitting of hairs going on here and no expression of opinion - just fact. With respect to the COVID-era funding which you raised, what I've posted is 100% factually correct. You could easily confirm that to yourself with very little effort.

The simple fact is that the federal government has no more "sway" over day-to-day operational decisions at Air Canada, including routing, than it does with any other airline. AC has complete freedom in that regard. That was part of the bargain in de-regulation and privatization. It could not operate and compete in the market otherwise.

Believe what you will. I'm done.

[nwalbert]

Originally Posted by Saul Goode

There is no splitting of hairs going on here and no expression of opinion - just fact. With respect to the COVID-era funding which you raised, what I've posted is 100% factually correct. You could easily confirm that to yourself with very little effort.

The simple fact is that the federal government has no more "sway" over day-to-day operational decisions at Air Canada, including routing, than it does with any other airline. AC has complete freedom in that regard. That was part of the bargain in de-regulation and privatization. It could not operate and compete in the market otherwise.

Believe what you will. I'm done.

Yes, the facts are exactly what I posted, not sure why you bothered to challenge them when a simple google search will lead you to the same facts.

The Federal government obviously has sway inside every airline in Canada and most regulated businesses inside the country. I am surprised anyone would feel differently. The fact that they used to own and operate AC and have VERY recently bailed them out with billions of dollars certainly adds to that level of influence.

You can believe what you like, and are entitled to your opinion, I would like to return to the discussion of airports. Enjoy your holiday Monday.

[DyAm00394]

Saint John Airport mourns loss of president, CEO
https://www.country94.ca/2025/05/20/saint-john-airport-mourns-loss-of-president-ceo/

"Sandy (Alexander) Ross, the president and CEO of the Saint John Airport, has died.

Ross passed away on Monday after a brief illness, the airport announced Tuesday.

“Sandy leaves behind a legacy of leadership, innovation, and deep commitment to our community,” Board Chair Susan Harley said in a statement.

Harley said Ross has played a pivotal role in revitalizing air service in the region since joining the airport in January 2022.

That includes the launch of new regional routes that reconnected Saint John with key destinations and in advancing a vision of growth, sustainability and long-term impact.

Harley added that Ross was a strong advocate for the important role YSJ plays in the economic development of the region.

“Beyond his professional accomplishments, Sandy was a respected colleague and friend whose warmth and integrity touched everyone who had the privilege of working with him,” she said.

Vice-president Greg Hierlihy will serve as interim CEO while the board searches for a permanent successor".

[dhottawa729]

Originally Posted by DyAm00394

Saint John Airport mourns loss of president, CEO
https://www.country94.ca/2025/05/20/saint-john-airport-mourns-loss-of-president-ceo/

This is very sad news and gave me pause. I had the pleasure of meeting him in-person last summer to share my ideas for the airport’s modernization/expansion and we had kept in almost constant communication ever since. We had some great discussions and it was evident that he was truly passionate about the airport and so this must be a devastating loss for YSJ.

[EnvisionSaintJohn]

Originally Posted by DyAm00394

Saint John Airport mourns loss of president, CEO
https://www.country94.ca/2025/05/20/saint-john-airport-mourns-loss-of-president-ceo/

Very Sad. He really did try to improve the airport, and he pulled off some significant new routes. Deepest condolences and best wishes to his friends and family.

[EnvisionSaintJohn]

From Reddit:



Granted this is a Tuesday, but still, a little disappointing to see.

While many people in the Saint John Region have no problem driving to Fredericton or Moncton for cheaper flights, it seems very few from Fredericton and Moncton would ever consider YSJ, or even realize that Saint John has the cheapest route to Montreal in NB at the moment... which also includes both a free carry on bag, and free checked bag.

There's no reason that this flight to Montreal should not even be half full, on basically the first day of summer and before Montreal gets brutally hot and humid... especially not at these low prices and generous luggage policies aimed at people making a shopping trip out of it.

At these fares, it basically is a steal, and it really shouldn't be that hard of a sell.

[bingun]

Originally Posted by EnvisionSaintJohn

From Reddit:



Granted this is a Tuesday, but still, a little disappointing to see.

While many people in the Saint John Region have no problem driving to Fredericton or Moncton for cheaper flights, it seems very few from Fredericton and Moncton would ever consider YSJ, or even realize that Saint John has the cheapest route to Montreal in NB at the moment... which also includes both a free carry on bag, and free checked bag.

There's no reason that this flight to Montreal should not even be half full, on basically the first day of summer and before Montreal gets brutally hot and humid... especially not at these low prices and generous luggage policies aimed at people making a shopping trip out of it.

At these fares, it basically is a steal, and it really shouldn't be that hard of a sell.

Images like this concern me, and they don't bode well for the future. I know it varies by airline and flight, but I was always told the plane needed to be at least 80% sold for them to make any money.

[nwalbert]

Originally Posted by bingun

Images like this concern me, and they don't bode well for the future. I know it varies by airline and flight, but I was always told the plane needed to be at least 80% sold for them to make any money.

I have done the route, including the Halifax route a few times. I have never seen as few as 5, however I have never seen greater than 50% either. Hopefully they are able to give it some time and it does catch on.

[bridgeoftea]

Originally Posted by nwalbert

I have done the route, including the Halifax route a few times. I have never seen as few as 5, however I have never seen greater than 50% either. Hopefully they are able to give it some time and it does catch on.

The Montreal flight is a bit of a shame. It absolutely makes sense from an SJ perspective to fly instead of drive. It would still be cheaper even with the Uber to the city from YUH. The Halifax one for me, still needs to be cheaper for it to make sense.

For my needs the SJ->Halifax needs to come out cheaper than gas and parking for the flight and uber to downtown.
Maybe if gas was at the 2.00/L it would make more sense than where it's at right now. The other thing right now they don't have any "Leave Friday and return Sunday night" where you can make a weekend trip out of it.

What I will be looking at is the potential of using it as a hopper flight to Halifax for farther destinations.