Canadian Airport Thread II

[Dominion301]

Musqueam First Nation, Vancouver Airport sign historic land lease revenue sharing agreement

This is pretty historic for advancing reconciliation with Indigenous Peoples in Canada. YVR sits on Sea Island in the Fraser River, traditional Musqueam territory. Musqueam will receive from the federal government a portion of the lease money the government collects from YVR.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/musqueam-yvr-land-lease-1.7467233

[Zmonkey]

Originally Posted by casper

So what is in it for Canada?

If TK flies an extra say 1,000 passangers a day between Canada and middle east/east asia. Air Canada perhaps has one or two fewer widebodies in its fleet (and adjusts staffing levels) and maybe Air France or Lufthansa drops one or two flights into Canada to compensate.

Is Canada better off reducing opportunities for business and ties with the EU so we can funnel more people through Turkey, China and UAE? Is our trade and defense alliance with Turkey, China and UAE more important to us than the EU?

There is a reason why we have open skies with some countries and not others.

We get better options and better prices for flights to fastest growing areas we do.

Everyone in Canada is complaining about Trump, than Canada wants more Trump style policies. Canada is known for having the most restrictive air travel in the rich world. Go to any conference in Aviation, its a talking point for any discussion.

We lose nothing doing this, and the EU is not impacted. Yes, there is reasons we have open skies with some countries and not other, most of it over last 20 years is over corporate lobbying.

When did Canada get better access to the UAE, when AC and EK started a partnership. In the meantime the average Canadian pays more, and is part of the reason Canadians have the highest airfare in the rich world on a per mile basis. I want Canadians to pay less. You want Canadians to keep paying worlds highest prices.

We have terrible policy in aviation, and its slowly moving towards what the rest of the rich world does - just slowly. All in a time when we should be doing whatever do find better ways to trade with the world - and aviation is a massive component to that.

[thenoflyzone]

80%+ of the O&D to/from Canada is to markets that have open skies agreements with Canada.

International ticket prices, for the most part, are on par with other countries.

Domestic prices are high. The reason they are high has nothing to do with bilateral agreements between countries. It has to do with other factors, such as low population density, high flight durations, and the federal government's policy to charge rent to airport operators. These are the real issues. These are the real reasons domestic prices are high in Canada. This is why it's cheaper to fly from YUL to Europe than it is to fly from YUL to Vancouver.

Having open skies with Turkey, the U.A.E or Hong Kong won't change a thing.

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by Dominion301

Musqueam First Nation, Vancouver Airport sign historic land lease revenue sharing agreement

This is pretty historic for advancing reconciliation with Indigenous Peoples in Canada. YVR sits on Sea Island in the Fraser River, traditional Musqueam territory. Musqueam will receive from the federal government a portion of the lease money the government collects from YVR.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/musqueam-yvr-land-lease-1.7467233

Online sources put numbers for the Musqueam Band around 1,650. Wouldn’t it have been nice if those millions had been used to benefit all Canadians.

[Dominion301]

Originally Posted by whatnext

Online sources put numbers for the Musqueam Band around 1,650. Wouldn’t it have been nice if those millions had been used to benefit all Canadians.

Look at the big picture. The federal government decades ago took unceded land from the Musqueam Peoples without their consent and built an airport on their land. This is decades of long overdue compensation to Indigenous Peoples for the use of their land. This is what reconciliation is. Not only righting the wrongs of the past but also being partners in the future.

[TorontoDrew]

Originally Posted by Dominion301

Look at the big picture. The federal government decades ago took unceded land from the Musqueam Peoples without their consent and built an airport on their land. This is decades of long overdue compensation to Indigenous Peoples for the use of their land. This is what reconciliation is. Not only righting the wrongs of the past but also being partners in the future.

Well said.

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by Dominion301

Look at the big picture. The federal government decades ago took unceded land from the Musqueam Peoples without their consent and built an airport on their land. This is decades of long overdue compensation to Indigenous Peoples for the use of their land. This is what reconciliation is. Not only righting the wrongs of the past but also being partners in the future.

Reconciliation? For a select few, I guess. As I mentioned the stated number of the Musqueam band is about 1,500. That makes them about .0003% of BC’s population (won’t even bother to figure out what it is if Canada’s) who have been chosen to get millions of dollars paid out by a federal asset. Add that to other federal assets handed over to them by Trudeau and Co and to the other MST nations. Nice work if you can get it. Of course the other bands in BC are SOL but then, they’re not conveniently located in Liberal-held urban ridings.

[casper]

Originally Posted by whatnext

Reconciliation? For a select few, I guess. As I mentioned the stated number of the Musqueam band is about 1,500. That makes them about .0003% of BC’s population (won’t even bother to figure out what it is if Canada’s) who have been chosen to get millions of dollars paid out by a federal asset. Add that to other federal assets handed over to them by Trudeau and Co and to the other MST nations. Nice work if you can get it. Of course the other bands in BC are SOL but then, they’re not conveniently located in Liberal-held urban ridings.

The Musqueam ancestors use to be the custodians of the land the airport sits on. That is it. Other communities have claims on other lands.

[q12]

Halifax Stanfield updated their route map:

[yyzer]

Looks like Etihad are upgauging YYZ to A380 in June.

https://www.facebook.com/photo?fbid=681516430873128&set=a.298717949152980

[zahav]

Originally Posted by Alexcaban

Am I crazy or did I just notice that Westjet is starting YUL-CUN/PUJ/POP/MBJ/VRA this summer.
Is this a Sunwing takeover?

I haven't been checking the scheds for a few weeks, and myself just noticed today before coming on the forum. I noticed YYZ-CUN flights exploded, I thought I made an error in my search because the summer schedule went it went from like 4x per week to 16x per week! And then as I went through all the Caribbean destinations one by one, many had substantial increases. After double checking my CUN numbers, I knew this had to be a Sunwing integration thing. WS has been shrinking YYZ, so a massive uptick was impossible, it's all Sunwing. Funnily enough, Aeroroutes posted a WS update but only mentioned transborder cuts, nothing on the addition of all the sun destinations. Must've come out later, or maybe was just missed?

WESTJET NS25 SELECTED US FREQUENCY CHANGES – 23FEB25
Written By Jim Liu
Published at 0500GMT 25FEB25

WestJet in recent weeks modified operational frequencies on selected US routes for Northern summer 2025 season. Based on schedule listing comparison 15DEC24 vs 23FEB25, selected changes include:

Calgary – Orange County eff 27APR25 Reduce from 7 to 4 weekly (Remains an overall increase from 3 weekly in NS24)
Toronto – Fort Lauderdale eff 27APR25 Reduce from 7 to 6 weekly (5 weekly 26MAY25 – 01SEP25, identical to most of NS24. This route was scheduled 6 weekly in July/August 2025)
Toronto – Las Vegas eff 27APR25 Reduce from 6-7 weekly to 5 weekly (This route was served up to 11 weekly during peak season in NS24)
Toronto – Los Angeles eff 16MAY25 Seasonal service reduces from 7 to 6 weekly
Winnipeg – Los Angeles eff 27APR25 Reduce from 3 to 2 weekly

Despite these changes, selected routes are seeing frequency increase compared to peak season in summer 2024 season. Based on calendar week 29 comparison, WestJet in 2024 (14-20JUL24) operated 429 weekly flights (on one-way basis) from Canada to US. This is expected to grow to 456 weekly in 2025 (13-19JUL25), as of 23FEB25.

SNA being cut speaks volumes to me, it was slashed so quick, even with YVR service being cut entirely, and theoretically would help feed YYC. But doesn't seem so... WS also cut minor amounts of domestic service, namely YYZ-YEG down to 35x weekly, loss of 5-6 weekly. I think YYZ-YYC down by 1 or 2 weekly as well. But nothing drastic, the majority of these sun adds are using WG planes, naturally. With these latest changes, the WS's biggest airport operations change considerably from what was projected before. YYZ will be just 7 flights behind YEG this summer (389 vs. 396), compared to at least 30 weekly flights behind before this update. And although YYZ is 7 flights behind YEG, their capacity is noticeably larger because it's all mainline, YEG is mainline/Encore mix. YVR didn't change at all, it didn't gain nor lose, the WG acquisition was inconsequential here for summer. it seems. And YVR's flight frequency (509 weekly) is still far ahead of both YEG (396 weekly) and YYZ's (389 weekly), who are neck and neck.

But this isn't a surprise at all, it was no secret that with WS absorbing WG, they would add significant flights from YYZ again. It isn't the same thing as WS growing in YEG or YVR, where they are adding new flights and destinations, not just swallowing a carrier and assuming their flights, that's not an overall add. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if it is a net loss to YYZ compared to the peak of when WS and WG operated their own flights.

[Coldrsx]

[Dominion301]

@Coldrsx, is that an old photo of YYC?

[Airboy]

Originally Posted by Dominion301

@Coldrsx, is that an old photo of YYC?

That's Blatchford Edmonton City Centre Airport.

Must be late 60, AGT Tower is up but City Centre Towers look like they are just going up.

[Dominion301]

Originally Posted by Airboy

That's Blatchford Edmonton City Centre Airport.

Must be late 60, AGT Tower is up but City Centre Towers look like they are just going up.

Cool! I've only ever been to Edmonton once.

In other news, Canada and Ghana have reached a first ever bilateral air agreement: https://www.newswire.ca/news-releases/ca...port-agreement-with-ghana-835979021.html

- The right for Canada and Ghana to designate multiple airlines to operate scheduled air services between the two countries.
- The right for those airlines to serve any points in the two countries.
- A capacity of 14 weekly passenger flights and 10 weekly all-cargo flights for the airlines of each country.

[hehehe]

Originally Posted by Dominion301

Cool! I've only ever been to Edmonton once.

In other news, Canada and Ghana have reached a first ever bilateral air agreement: https://www.newswire.ca/news-releases/ca...port-agreement-with-ghana-835979021.html

- The right for Canada and Ghana to designate multiple airlines to operate scheduled air services between the two countries.
- The right for those airlines to serve any points in the two countries.
- A capacity of 14 weekly passenger flights and 10 weekly all-cargo flights for the airlines of each country.

Would AC ever serve YYZ or YUL-ACC? Considering it has worked well for both DL and UA.

[nname]

Originally Posted by hehehe

Would AC ever serve YYZ or YUL-ACC? Considering it has worked well for both DL and UA.

Well, ACC is a destination AC is looking at according to investor day presentation, along with DSS, ABJ, and LOS. But unlike YUL-DSS, ACC is likely too far for the XLR though.

[Dominion301]

Originally Posted by hehehe

Would AC ever serve YYZ or YUL-ACC? Considering it has worked well for both DL and UA.

Maybe from YYZ. YUL to an English-speaking African country wouldn't make any sense.

[hollywoodcory]

WS appears to be scaling back its Transborder schedule one month at a time. They first did March, now this week they did April.

Select flights to LAS, LAX, every Florida destination, JFK, DTW were cut. The only route that saw an overall frequency change was YLW-SEA which was slashed to just 3x weekly from daily.

Additionally during peak summer from June 26-August 30, YYC-KEF has been increased to 6x weekly.

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by hollywoodcory

WS appears to be scaling back its Transborder schedule one month at a time. They first did March, now this week they did April.

Select flights to LAS, LAX, every Florida destination, JFK, DTW were cut. The only route that saw an overall frequency change was YLW-SEA which was slashed to just 3x weekly from daily.

Additionally during peak summer from June 26-August 30, YYC-KEF has been increased to 6x weekly.

Didn’t Flair just reduce a number of US routes too?