Trillium Line Upgrades & Extension (Stage 2) [Greenboro to Airport/Limebank] | U/C

[DTcrawler]

Originally Posted by Uhuniau

I will also insist, if we do have to do another shutdown to do something like expand Civic/Carling, double-track, electrify, extend to Hull, that adding an infill station at Somerset should be part of the package.

Yes, it's close to Bayview and Corso di Gladstone. Big deal. There are full-ass metros in this world that have stations that close, we can do the same for a very light metro and add better connectivity to a major urban bus axis and the surrounding neighbourhood.

And it doesn't have to be fancy and big.

I posted about this when OCT came out with their plan for bus cuts (erm, I mean "route review"). They added that stupid jog on route 11 to serve Bayview despite that route already serving Tunney's and Parliament stations. I could see a station at Somerset being somewhat beneficial for NB riders on Line 2, but again if you really don't want to walk 5-10 min you could just get off at Bayview and take the 11.

Originally Posted by J.OT13

The big disel trains are slow to get in and out of stations, so I'm not sure I'd go as far as building a Somerset Station. If it was electric, I'd be more open to the idea.

I thought the DEMU powerpacks in the FLIRTs allowed for Line 1- style acceleration/deceleration, with diesel energy being converted into electric power?

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by DTcrawler

I thought the DEMU powerpacks in the FLIRTs allowed for Line 1- style acceleration/deceleration, with diesel energy being converted into electric power?

It does sound like an electric train powered by a diesel generator. I'm not sure how the acceleration and decelaration compares though. These are pretty huge machines compared to the LRTs.

[DTcrawler]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

It does sound like an electric train powered by a diesel generator. I'm not sure how the acceleration and decelaration compares though. These are pretty huge machines compared to the LRTs.

Agreed, I guess getting up to par with the Citadis Spirits would be a stretch but at the very least I'm hoping for a big improvement on the long, drawn out acceleration/deceleration of the LINTs with discernible gear shifts from the transmission.

[lrt's friend]

Originally Posted by DTcrawler

Agreed, I guess getting up to par with the Citadis Spirits would be a stretch but at the very least I'm hoping for a big improvement on the long, drawn out acceleration/deceleration of the LINTs with discernible gear shifts from the transmission.

Remember that Lint trains will operate with Flirt Trains, so even if Flirt trains have better acceleration capabilities, the schedule will be limited to the capabilities of the older Lint Trains.

[kmcamp]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

I think the stations are generaly a decent balance between bare bones and overbuilt (see REM and any Toronto Subway station from the last few decades). I think I would have traded the swooping roof lines for boring full coverage flat roofs though.

For Hurdman, I don't think they needed more money, they just needed to better align the guideway to avoid the curves and build the loop around the station instead of off-set. These measures might even have saved enough money for a proper semi enclosed concourse with benches and next bus screens.

Bayview is a mess. How did they start with a blank slate and come up with that? It's a terrrible layout no matter what we do next (leave it a terminus or extend to Gatineau).

Line 2 stations are all pretty bare bones other than maybe South Keys and Airport, with long platforms and a few bus shelters. Entrances for the new stations are a little above average. And that's fine. What's not fine is the minute improvments to what may be some of the busiest stations on the system (at least on the Line), Dow's and Carleton.

When it comes to Hurdman, I thought the curves where the NCCs fault, nether the city nor RTG wanted the station in that position. The bus loop on the other hand is totally the fault of the city and RTG. If memory serves, OC Transpo built the loop while RTG built the station, which probably is why they are so poorly integrated

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by kmcamp

When it comes to Hurdman, I thought the curves where the NCCs fault, nether the city nor RTG wanted the station in that position. The bus loop on the other hand is totally the fault of the city and RTG. If memory serves, OC Transpo built the loop while RTG built the station, which probably is why they are so poorly integrated

Unsure what the story is theren (at least the alignment part of it). Was it the NCC refusing to move things around, or the City not bothering asking. Less land could have been used with a better alignment, so I would think the NCC would have been all for it. Then again, the NCC wasn't as open to change and reason at the time.

[OTownandDown]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Unsure what the story is theren (at least the alignment part of it). Was it the NCC refusing to move things around, or the City not bothering asking. Less land could have been used with a better alignment, so I would think the NCC would have been all for it. Then again, the NCC wasn't as open to change and reason at the time.

I thought the land directly east/north east of the station is earmarked for a NATIONAL AQUATICS CENTRE!

Cue fireworks and marching band.

Followed by

Tumbleweeds.

[AuxTown]

Ugh....

City report does not include possible opening date for Trillium Line LRT, but offers timeline clues

A report prepared for a joint meeting of the Transit Commission and the LRT Subcommittee on May 31 does not contain any reference to an opening date for the delayed north-south Trillium Line, but it does offer clues into how much longer work could take.

The LRT line that runs from Bayview Station in the north to Limebank Station in the south, with a spur to the Ottawa Airport, was originally supposed to open in August of 2022. It has been delayed several times since then and OC Transpo officials have been hesitant to commit to any firm date when riders could expect to be on board the trains. The most recent indication of when the line might open for riders pushes the date into September at the latest, though officials would not say one way or the other whether a September opening could be achieved.

According to a report prepared for the May 31 meeting, some of the work that still needs to be done isn't scheduled to be completed until the end of June. Final signal and train control testing, communication systems testing, and final integration between the Transit Operations Control Centre and the field devices is expected to be largely complete between now and the end of June. Training is expected to be complete in early June and occupancy certificates for all stations are expected before the end of June. Final fire system testing, testing of the countdown passenger information messages on the station displays, and some residual integration tests are remaining.

Once the training is complete, the next major step is to effectively simulate regular service on the line, increasing the hours trains are running to what they would be once passengers are able to board. This is meant to ensure operators can safety run the system during normal hours but also to make sure the maintenance team can do its work during the shorter overnight windows between each service day.

This is expected to last eight to ten weeks, meaning it could continue well into August.

"Ideally, the system will be operated at the final service plan levels for a period of eight to ten weeks prior to opening to the public. Within this period, a decision will be made to start Trial Running once it has been clearly demonstrated all prerequisites have been met, that the operations and maintenance teams can deliver the required service levels and that the integrated system meets the reliability and performance objectives," the report says.

Trial running is a 21-day period of testing that is required before TransitNEXT — the SNC-Lavalin subsidiary building the line — can hand the system over to the city to open to the public. This is broken down into two parts, a 14-day service reliability test and a seven-day "failure scenario management" period. Before trial running can begin, several criteria must be met:

1) The integrated System Infrastructure has been tested.

2) The complete fleet is fully tested and ready for passenger service.

3) The complete signaling and train control system and associated Transit Operations Control Centre (TOCC) equipment is fully tested and ready for passenger service.

4) There are no outstanding defects (major or minor) affecting rail systems functionality, including track, signals, and communications.

5) There are no major defects, safety defects, or incomplete vehicle modification programs.

6) All stations are substantially complete with only minor deficiencies remaining.

7) TransitNEXT is fully mobilized and ready to commence maintenance, including availability of required maintenance staff, parts, maintenance equipment, Maintenance Management and Performance Reporting System (MMPRS), and completion of training.

8) TransitNEXT has submitted the Maintenance & Rehabilitation Compliance Verification & Validation Matrix.

9) The City is fully mobilized, trained and ready to operate the System.

The 14-day test requires a minimum of 98.5 per cent on-time performance, calculated using a 14-day rolling average of the on-time performance achieved each day. The city defines 98.5 per cent on time performance as "a train departing the terminus station no later than 30 seconds after its scheduled departure time, while respecting a minimum terminus dwell time of three minutes."

The seven-day failure scenario testing will test things like stopped trains, faulty doors and other common issues. This segment does not determine the pass/fail outcome for trial running acceptance, the report says. "Its purpose is to validate the effectiveness of the City and TransitNEXT in implementing failure management standard operating procedures in preparation for revenue service."

Once trial running is finished, there are still some final checks before passengers can start boarding the trains, including final verification reports, a review by the city's independent safety auditor, a certification of fitness to operate from the Canadian Transportation Agency, and the issuance of a railway operating certificate by Transport Canada.

The city will look at three criteria to ensure the Trillium Line is ready to accept passengers:

1) The overall system had been thoroughly exercised with extensive running of nine train operations between January 2024 through May 2024;

2) The system had been operated and maintained at the final service levels and in the final system configuration for a recommended period of eight to ten weeks after completion of training; and,

3) No new or emergent safety or reliability defects arose during the final running period that require additional rectification time before opening the system to the public.

Only at that point would the city be in a position to recommend an opening date to the Light Rail Subcommittee.

The extensive testing and requisite steps to trial running came about after the public inquiry into Stage 1 of LRT, which found changes to the criteria for accepting the system, a failure to soft launch the system in 2019, and "considerable" political pressure to begin operation of the Confederation Line.

The report does indicate that some non-critical work might be delayed even after the system launches. Things such as "final landscaping, some specific roadway works, and some multiuse pathway work" might be deferred, the report says, though "soft and hard landscaping works continue to take place at all stations." Work is also continuing on the pedestrian bridge over the Rideau River near Carleton University, with the installation of light fixtures and bridge approach work.

The joint Transit Commission and Light Rail Subcommittee meeting is scheduled for May 31 at 9:30 a.m. and will also include an update on the cartridge bearing assembly on Line 1 trains and an operations update for rail, bus and Para Transpo services.

https://ottawa.ctvnews.ca/city-repor...lues-1.6897317

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by kmcamp

When it comes to Hurdman, I thought the curves where the NCCs fault, nether the city nor RTG wanted the station in that position. The bus loop on the other hand is totally the fault of the city and RTG. If memory serves, OC Transpo built the loop while RTG built the station, which probably is why they are so poorly integrated

The design flaw was brought up in public consultations and promptly ignored.

[kmcamp]

Originally Posted by OTownandDown

I thought the land directly east/north east of the station is earmarked for a NATIONAL AQUATICS CENTRE!

Cue fireworks and marching band.

Followed by

Tumbleweeds.

I didn't think it was that.I know the land is reserved for something, that's why there's an overpass just east of the station for a future road, but I thought it was just some sort of neighborhood plan. But I swear I had read it was the NCC that insisted the station be to the south of that, but I can't find the reference anymore

[ponyboycurtis]

Originally Posted by Uhuniau

The design flaw was brought up in public consultations and promptly ignored.

While I don't want to get off the topic of this thread I think there are two things that are hard to ignore.

The alignment of the two existing bridges on either side of Hurdman did not do us any favors.

The current position of the SE Transitway relative to the station really forced our hand in regard to the bus stops being off to the side.

The lack of a bus departure screen in the western stairwell area, working washrooms and any type of amenity aggravates me more than anything.

[OTownandDown]

Originally Posted by kmcamp

I didn't think it was that.I know the land is reserved for something, that's why there's an overpass just east of the station for a future road, but I thought it was just some sort of neighborhood plan. But I swear I had read it was the NCC that insisted the station be to the south of that, but I can't find the reference anymore

https://naqc.ca/location/

[ponyboycurtis]

I meant to post this maybe two weeks ago but I'm lazy. We had a mid day flash thunderstorm. I wasn't outside so I don't know how intense it was. I took a walk to South Keys as one does.. and saw this!







Unbelievable!

So for anyone who is familiar with the backside of the station or aren't. There is a parallel tunnel that is just a fenced off empty area. Some type of storage perhaps? It's purpose is unclear. I've often noticed there is standing water on the floor in there. All the way at the back too. Under the platforms basically. So there must be water coming in from the top right?

I thought maybe that area flooded and the water passed under the steel door that links the two tunnels. Not the case. The area in front of the door on the storage side was dry.

I have never seen water in the passageway tunnel before but clearly something is going on here.

There is a trough drain that spans the width of the tunnel as you transition to the outside. I noticed that the drain is actually raised relative to the concrete on the inside of the tunnel. It also looks like someone patched the area leading up to it. Like.. feather out a trowel for a smooth transition. Which of course leaves the interior of the tunnel lower.

So... Did the rain blow in sideways? perhaps. Did the water leak from the top? I can't tell.

But either way there are low spots on the floor and the drain is useless in this case. Really, really disappointing to see. The trough drain being high ESPECIALLY. wtf man.

Side note.. they were spreading topsoil and grass seed on the Juno bridge side of the path. They still need some type of retaining wall on the part closest to the tunnels and are just seeding the farther away part with a shallower grade.

They still need to replace the fence that goes over the culvert and concrete wall. Somebody def wacked it pretty good with a piece of equipment

Asphalt remains obviously. That would be the last thing to be done.

So it's nice to see them starting on that side but I would much rather see them doing the wall and fence rather than dicking around soil and seed. Presumably the same crew that was working on the other side so I suppose they just keep rolling on the same thing.

I wish I filmed a Youtube short. The pictures don't do justice. The puddles where also muddy asF too.

[kmcamp]

The second tunnel is just an emergency exit, from the stairs at the north end of the platform. There's a similar emergency exit tunnel at uOttawa at the south end of the platform.

It would be against fire code to have only one exit

[ponyboycurtis]

Originally Posted by kmcamp

The second tunnel is just an emergency exit, from the stairs at the north end of the platform. There's a similar emergency exit tunnel at uOttawa at the south end of the platform.

It would be against fire code to have only one exit

I am quite certain there is no staircase at the end. It's also fully fenced off side to side and top to bottom with a locked door. All chain-link. It's really just a giant empty cavern with a steel door halfway down linking the two "tunnels".

[kmcamp]

Originally Posted by ponyboycurtis

I am quite certain there is no staircase at the end. It's also fully fenced off side to side and top to bottom with a locked door. All chain-link. It's really just a giant empty cavern with a steel door halfway down linking the two "tunnels".

You can actually see them walk past the emergency stairs at around 3:20

https://youtu.be/wlhxWU3_JZQ?si=EeTOMCAYPj1seNPX

[LRTeverywhere]

Originally Posted by ponyboycurtis

I am quite certain there is no staircase at the end. It's also fully fenced off side to side and top to bottom with a locked door. All chain-link. It's really just a giant empty cavern with a steel door halfway down linking the two "tunnels".

The second tunnel is future provision for a proper active use tunnel through the station, but the work on the transitway side was not funded at this time, will have to be done in the future. I suppose it could also allow for the station to be converted to a fare paid zone in the future.

[ponyboycurtis]

Originally Posted by kmcamp

You can actually see them walk past the emergency stairs at around 3:30

https://youtu.be/wlhxWU3_JZQ?si=EeTOMCAYPj1seNPX

I stand corrected. It certainly makes sense. I guess the fencing will be removed after construction is complete.

I swear there is no staircase at the end. I've peered through the chain-link more than once. There certainly isn't any daylight shining through. Why wouldn't it just be the glassy atrium with firedoors at the top of a staircase?

I am now imagining Mark Sutcliffe Kool-Aid manning through a thin wall at the bottom of the exit stairs and declaring the line open.

I can definitely see occasional anti social type of behavior happening in that exit tunnel. Realistically speaking it will never be used. If this station was downtown people be living and using the washroom there.

LRTeverywhere, I presume that you mean a full cycling/rollerblade carrying through to the possible future transitmall thing that's in the plan for the new development where the theatre is?

That would certain explain the width of the tunnel. It would need more or less continued and protected lanes to Cahill for it to really make sense though. Having South Keys station as a fare paid zone definitely makes sense as well.

I think I see the picture a little more clearly now. Thank you.

[kmcamp]

Now I'm really confused myself, I had always thought those stairs ended up in the second tunnel, but if you can't see them from the bottom where do they end up?

I'm guessing if the second tunnel is for future active use, it must end up somewhere between the two tunnels, which makes sense if it would eventually allow a fully fare controlled station, at which point they would just be normal stairs

[LRTeverywhere]

Originally Posted by ponyboycurtis

LRTeverywhere, I presume that you mean a full cycling/rollerblade carrying through to the possible future transitmall thing that's in the plan for the new development where the theatre is?

That would certain explain the width of the tunnel. It would need more or less continued and protected lanes to Cahill for it to really make sense though. Having South Keys station as a fare paid zone definitely makes sense as well.

I think I see the picture a little more clearly now. Thank you.

Yep, plans for protected lanes on Cahill and accross bank are in the works now, will probably be installed long before we ever install the second half of the tunnel under the transitway.