Majority Of US Prefers Communities With Big Houses, Even If Local Amenities Are Far

[M II A II R II K]

Majority Of Americans Prefer A Community With Big Houses, Even If Local Amenities Are Farther Away


August 2, 2023

By Ted Van Green

Read More: https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/...ven-if-local-amenities-are-farther-away/

A majority of Americans (57%) say they would prefer to live in a community where “houses are larger and farther apart, but schools, stores and restaurants are several miles away,” according to a Pew Research Center survey conducted March 27-April 2, 2023. About four-in-ten (42%) would prefer a community where “houses are smaller and closer to each other, but schools, stores and restaurants are within walking distance.”

- The share of the public that prefers more spread-out communities is roughly similar to two years ago, when six-in-ten Americans said this. Public preferences were more evenly divided on this question in fall 2019, a few months before the coronavirus outbreak. As in the past, there are differences in these preferences by party, age, education, race and ethnicity, and community type. --- While a majority of adults ages 30 and older would prefer communities with larger homes over those with more walkability, adults under 30 are somewhat more likely to express the opposite preference.

- About three-quarters of Americans who describe their own communities as rural (74%) say they would prefer to live in places where houses are larger and farther apart, but also farther from schools, stores and restaurants. A narrower majority of suburban Americans (56%) also say they would prefer places with larger houses. --- In contrast, more Americans who currently live in urban areas (57%) say they would prefer a community with smaller houses that are within walking distance of schools, stores and restaurants. --- Among urban, suburban and rural residents, Republicans are much more likely than Democrats to want to live in communities where houses are larger and more spread out.

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[Steely Dan]

Ultimately, there are two basic kinds of people:

- House over location people.

- Location over house people.


While I've always been an ardent "location" person, the former are clearly a majority in sprawl-tacular America.

When we were home-shopping for our "forever" home 6 years ago, I spent untold hours on Google maps for every promising property we looked at measuring out walking distances to schools, parks, transit stops, grocery stores, pharmacies, restaurants, etc.

"Walking distance to important daily stuff" was far and away my #1 priority.

But for the typical American, if you succumb to the fact that you're gonna be driving your kids to school every single goddamn morning for a couple decades anyway, then what real difference does it make if school is 2 miles away or 5 miles away? Get the biggest fucking house you can!!!



Quick anecdote time: my cousin and his wife are on the exact opposite end of the spectrum from me. They bought an outrageously GIGANTIC vinyl box out in a former cornfield on the extreme western edge of exurban Chicagoland. When I asked my cousin'swife about school for their three kids she was like "oh, it's only 15 minutes away, not bad at all".

I just smiled politely.

[Investing In Chicago]

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

Ultimately, there are two basic kinds of people:

- House over location people.

- Location over house people.


While I've always been an ardent "location" person, the former are clearly a majority in sprawl-tacular America.

When we were home-shopping for our "forever" home 6 years ago, I spent untold hours on Google maps for every promising property we looked at measuring out walking distances to schools, parks, transit stops, grocery stores, pharmacies, restaurants, etc.

"Walking distance to important daily stuff" was far and away my #1 priority.

But for the typical American, if you succumb to the fact that you're gonna be driving your kids to school every single goddamn morning for a couple decades anyway, then what real difference does it make if school is 2 miles away or 5 miles away? Get the biggest fucking house you can!!!



Quick anecdote time: my cousin and his wife are on the exact opposite end of the spectrum from me. They bought an outrageously GIGANTIC vinyl box out in a former cornfield on the extreme western edge of exurban Chicagoland. When I asked my cousin'swife about school for their three kids she was like "oh, it's only 15 minutes away, not bad at all".

I just smiled politely.

There is a third category, which I most certainly fall into: House AND Location people, i'm not sacrificing either of those when considering a place to live.

[Steely Dan]

Originally Posted by Investing In Chicago

There is a third category, which I most certainly fall into: House AND Location people, i'm not sacrificing either of those when considering a place to live.

Yes, rich people like you can have your cake and eat too.

(Although i highly doubt where you live reaches a high enough urban walkability bar for my tastes)

But as a regular person, I was speaking about regular people, who have to balance the house/location equation.

[Investing In Chicago]

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

Yes, rich people like you can have your cake and eat too.

(Although i highly doubt where you live reaches a high enough urban walkability bar for my tastes)

But as a regular person, I was speaking about regular people, who have to balance the house/location equation.

I get that, but a shit load of people in Chicago have beautiful homes in great locations. Also, yes, Downtown Wayzata, MN is certainly not Lincoln Square, it is walkable, but that shouldn't be the bar living here. There are other benefits of living where I live, though I do miss the urbanity at times. It does give off a "center of Minnesota" vibe at least.

[Steely Dan]

Originally Posted by Investing In Chicago

I get that, but a shit load of people in Chicago have beautiful homes in great locations.

But the dichotomy presented in this thread was between “places where houses are smaller and closer to each other, but schools, stores and restaurants are within walking distance" vs. "places where houses are larger and farther apart, but schools, stores and restaurants are several miles away".

There are not very many chicagoans who live in "houses that are larger and further apart", regardless of how nice some of the interiors might be in places like Lincoln Park.


Everything else being equal, places where homes are further apart inherently have amenities further spread apart as well, and are thus less walkable than places where the homes are close together.

Regular Americans have to balance those two competing forces, and according to the results of this poll, more Americans lean towards the "house" side of the spectrum, which really shouldn't be surprising given the almost unbelievable amount of auto-centric sprawl that surrounds American cities both great and small.

[iheartthed]

Then why are dense, walkable cities so much more expensive than places dominated by houses with large lots that are car dependent.

[Steely Dan]

Originally Posted by iheartthed

Then why are dense, walkable cities so much more expensive than places dominated by houses with large lots that are car dependent.

Generally because places that still have fully intact and truly dense/walkable/functional urbanism are so preciously rare in the US.

We threw so much of it in the trash can during the white flight of the urban dark ages.

Remember, roughly 4 in 10 Americans still lean towards the location side, and there's not enough of it to go around, largely because we've made it legally impossible to build more of it in most places.

[Innsertnamehere]

Originally Posted by iheartthed

Then why are dense, walkable cities so much more expensive than places dominated by houses with large lots that are car dependent.

Because walkable housing probably represents 5-10% of American housing stock and 42% of people want it.

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

Generally because places that still have fully intact and truly dense/walkable/functional urbanism are so preciously rare in the US.

We threw so much of it in the trash can during the white flight of the urban dark ages.

Remember, roughly 4 in 10 Americans still lean towards the location side, and there's not enough of it to go around, largely because we've made it legally impossible to build more of it in most places.

I don't think Americans have enough perspective to give an educated answer to the question. Most Americans have never really experienced living in a walkable community, so of course they don't value it. This is kind of a trash poll for that reason.

[Steely Dan]

Originally Posted by iheartthed

I don't think Americans have enough perspective to give an educated answer to the question. Most Americans have never really experienced living in a walkable community, so of course they don't value it. This is kind of a trash poll for that reason.

Even if there is some skew in the results because a great deal of Americans haven't ever lived in a truly urban walkable neighborhood, I still wouldn't call the poll trash. It still has value as a reflection of what Americans at least think they prefer.

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

Even if there is some skew in the results because a great deal of Americans haven't ever lived in a truly urban walkable neighborhood, I still wouldn't call the poll trash. It still has value as a reflection of what Americans at least think they prefer.

I think that type of poll framing is often wielded by special interests to push back against changes or trends that they don't like. For instance, if you ask all of society whether we need to have bike lanes most will say no because they won't ever use them. But if you ask people that have perspective biking in cities, you'll get a more thoughtful response.

[Steely Dan]

And if you poll a bunch of vegans about whether the US government should continue to subsidize the meat industry, you'll almost certainly get wildly different results than the american public at large.

And yet knowing where the nation at large stands on the issue still has value, even if the vast majority of Americans have never gone vegan before.

[iheartthed]

Back in the 1940s when most Americans actually did live in walkable communities you would have probably gotten an equally distorted response favoring walkable urban areas. Most people prefer the type of communities with which they are familiar.

[Klippenstein]

Public preferences were more evenly divided on this question in fall 2019, a few months before the coronavirus outbreak.

I wonder which populations shifted their opinions.

[SnowFire]

Originally Posted by iheartthed

I don't think Americans have enough perspective to give an educated answer to the question. Most Americans have never really experienced living in a walkable community, so of course they don't value it. This is kind of a trash poll for that reason.

The college experience is probably a big thing in that. It may be the first experience for someone from suburbia of such a thing. The typical college demographic plays out in the poll results.

[dktshb]

Originally Posted by iheartthed

I don't think Americans have enough perspective to give an educated answer to the question. Most Americans have never really experienced living in a walkable community, so of course they don't value it. This is kind of a trash poll for that reason.

Bingo. I think if all Americans actually spent time abroad and experienced a truly urban city I believe this statistic would be reversed. Probably a small majority of American's have never experienced anything but a suburban upbringing.

Plus a lot of America's urban centers have bad elements that you do not see in Europe and whether or not accurate are associated with crime, drug use and homelessness.

I am actually surprised 42% do desire a truly urban lifestyle. i would have thought it would be more around 30%.

[3rd&Brown]

Originally Posted by iheartthed

I don't think Americans have enough perspective to give an educated answer to the question. Most Americans have never really experienced living in a walkable community, so of course they don't value it. This is kind of a trash poll for that reason.

1000%. These are the same people who go to Paris or Madrid on a vacation and rave about how it was so cool and "unamerican" because you could walk to everything..."and everyone was so stylish and healthy and the markets and restaurants!". "And people actually live there!"

Yeah, asshole. It's that way in the city you live 35 miles outside of as well.

[jmecklenborg]

Originally Posted by SnowFire

The college experience

My alma mater still requires all freshman and sophomores to live in the dorms and they can't bring their cars. This is a very unusual situation for a U.S. university, and is a big reason why it has such a strong alumni network - nobody got to go be a hermit. You were basically forced to make friends and the parties came to you - tons of beer was brought into the dorms.

But now I think it's hurting enrollment, as it's not hard to see that most big state schools are spending huge money building new housing with parking garages so that wealthy out-of-state students can bring their expensive cars and enjoy drive-to urbanism.

Where I live (not my alma mater!), developers have built several 200+ unit apartment buildings with underground parking since 2010 and the university uses them and hotels as "dorms". These kids are living in luxurious apartments (a separate bathroom for each room, pools, underground parking) that were absolutely inconceivable just 20-30 years ago outside of the very wealthiest schools.

[dave8721]

Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere

Because walkable housing probably represents 5-10% of American housing stock and 42% of people want it.

^Correct answer as to why urban housing is so expensive

-Also this shows that many who live in more suburban areas would actually prefer to live in more urban ones but live in the suburbs involuntarily. I live in a more suburban location because there really aren't any feasible urban options in South Florida for a family of 4 that can't afford to drop $1.5 million on a home, and doesn't want to live in a ghetto. If you want to pay a reasonable price, your options are a 700 square foot 1 bedroom urban condo or a 2k square foot home in a suburban location, nothing really in between.