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  #1  
Old Posted May 24, 2009, 10:20 PM
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Denver Four Seasons Hotel & Private Residences (Part 3)

-Four Seasons Hotel & Residence:
45-stories, plus three smaller "lantern decks". It is currently designed to top out at 565'-10" to the Crown,
with the spire extending above that for a structural height of 640'-10" -- it will cost $350 million - which will make it
the most expensive privately funded building ever built in downtown Denver. Currently Under-Construction
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Last edited by SnyderBock; Jun 17, 2009 at 3:31 AM.
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  #2  
Old Posted May 24, 2009, 11:19 PM
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thanks snyder..
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  #3  
Old Posted May 25, 2009, 1:40 AM
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Most excellent, thanks Snyder. We need to get some Denver mod representation stat.
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  #4  
Old Posted May 26, 2009, 4:20 AM
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Have you guys seen this yet?

http://www.1111towerinsider.com/

Pretty cool stuff, especially the videos. The also have a flikr account (http://www.flickr.com/groups/1111tower), although I have to admit that we have a bigger and better collection of photos here.

Also, this page has a badass time lapse:
http://residences.fourseasons.com/private_residences/denver/

Last edited by The Dirt; May 26, 2009 at 4:48 AM.
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  #5  
Old Posted May 26, 2009, 8:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dirt View Post
Have you guys seen this yet?

http://www.1111towerinsider.com/

Pretty cool stuff, especially the videos. The also have a flikr account (http://www.flickr.com/groups/1111tower), although I have to admit that we have a bigger and better collection of photos here.

Also, this page has a badass time lapse:
http://residences.fourseasons.com/private_residences/denver/
That is about as good as it gets my friend, thank you for sharing that website with the rest of us. Wish I was a trust fund kid, I would be in one of the 3 or 4 bedroom condos!!!
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  #6  
Old Posted Jun 7, 2009, 3:48 AM
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^The fact that the cheapest unit in this building is still for the better part of a million dollars makes me kinda sad. Most people will never even have the option of living there, which makes this building an emblem of elitism and exclusivity - the opposite of what a city should be.

On the other hand, bringing in wealthy high-profile residents improves Denver's property tax base since the property is very expensive, and ideally much of the money brought in from a neighborhood will be put right back into the neighborhood - so would we see improvements to the sidewalks and streets of this part of town?

Alright, that's just an attempt at an argument, with not that great of an impact. But I do think having these residents here could benefit the neighborhood and Downtown. Since they're filthy rich, they probably won't shop in the vicinity of the building, but they WILL have hired house cleaners, daycare workers and tutors for their children, and other hired staff (I don't know that much about how rich people live). They should also perhaps provide a high-profile voice when they express their interest in keeping the neighborhood looking nice. Ultimately I'm most interested in what the widest number of people will benefit from, since the impact on the skyline would be the same no matter what happens with this building, it wouldn't matter much how expensive the units are to those outside the building. But I have to believe that bringing more money into Downtown is a good thing that will have elusive benefits.
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  #7  
Old Posted Jun 7, 2009, 3:50 AM
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Oh, and some photos from today:







I tried to get shots that show the full impact of the building from up close. At the very least we can count the floors and see how much is left to build (4 stories?)
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  #8  
Old Posted Jun 8, 2009, 7:22 PM
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I count it needing four more stories before the final set of setbacks that would comprise the crown. And the crown will be a couple more floors (I think).
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  #9  
Old Posted Jun 8, 2009, 7:24 PM
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I'm loving the large reflective windows!
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  #10  
Old Posted Jun 8, 2009, 10:32 PM
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yeah, there will be four lantern decks, which will essentially add 4-stories in height to the tower above the roof level.
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  #11  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2009, 6:12 AM
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  #12  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2009, 4:08 PM
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its hard to describe the impact this is beginning to make, particularly as the glass edges upward.. with about 6 more floors to go before the spire, this is quickly becoming my favorite building downtown (and i love the spire)..
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  #13  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2009, 12:57 PM
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The fact that the cheapest unit in this building is still for the better part of a million dollars makes me kinda sad. Most people will never even have the option of living there, which makes this building an emblem of elitism and exclusivity - the opposite of what a city should be.
Work hard Pizzuti and you too could one day afford a unit in that building. Out of pure curiosity, would you still have the same opinion of "evil rich white men" if you were one of them?? I doubt you would be complaining if you had the financial wherewithal to write a blank check for one of these units

I just can't understand where we lost our way as a free capitalist society. Every single day I watch our government and those that have come through the educational system work their hardest to squash hard work, entrepreneurialism, and innovation all because it's not "fair" to those who get left behind. There is a reason why some people get left behind and will never amount to anything - it's just a fact of life.

OK, my rant is over now!

"Liberalism is a mental disorder" - Michael Savage
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  #14  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2009, 1:34 PM
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I agree man. When did America turn into this "everyone deserves a blue ribbon" culture??

"Most people will never even have the option of living there, which makes this building an emblem of elitism and exclusivity - the opposite of what a city should be."

So what should a city be? It is my belief that a city should be built by capitolism guided by light regulation and transparency. I agree it would be nice to have some affordable units downtown, and we will. As soon as it is dictated by the market.

I mean come on dude. where does it stop? I want the 3GS I Phone, and that is definitely "status symbol", but I cant afford one!

So here is the list of things that in order to feel "fair" that I want:

3GS I Phone
A home in the new 4 seasons for 100,000
an OLCD Tv - 50" prefered
free world class health care
free college
a bmw

Ok, now I can feel like I wasn't cheated by those damn rich tricky smart people.
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  #15  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2009, 3:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by citycenter View Post
Work hard Pizzuti and you too could one day afford a unit in that building. Out of pure curiosity, would you still have the same opinion of "evil rich white men" if you were one of them?? I doubt you would be complaining if you had the financial wherewithal to write a blank check for one of these units

I just can't understand where we lost our way as a free capitalist society. Every single day I watch our government and those that have come through the educational system work their hardest to squash hard work, entrepreneurialism, and innovation all because it's not "fair" to those who get left behind. There is a reason why some people get left behind and will never amount to anything - it's just a fact of life.

OK, my rant is over now!

"Liberalism is a mental disorder" - Michael Savage
Did you read the rest of Pizzuti's post, you know, the parts where he acknowledged both the pros and cons of having the wealthy dwell amongst us? To put it to you another way, I bet you would think it was unfair also, if you were truly one of the "other half", and I mean unfair in the general sense, not unfair as in - "I can't afford the Penthouse condo at the new Four Seasons". You are somewhat correct - some people get left behind because of bad choices they make, but there are plenty of others that get left behind by circumstances beyond their control, but very much in the controlling hands of others.
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  #16  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2009, 4:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Fidel Castrobot View Post
I agree man. When did America turn into this "everyone deserves a blue ribbon" culture??

"Most people will never even have the option of living there, which makes this building an emblem of elitism and exclusivity - the opposite of what a city should be."

So what should a city be? It is my belief that a city should be built by capitolism guided by light regulation and transparency. I agree it would be nice to have some affordable units downtown, and we will. As soon as it is dictated by the market.

I mean come on dude. where does it stop? I want the 3GS I Phone, and that is definitely "status symbol", but I cant afford one!

So here is the list of things that in order to feel "fair" that I want:

3GS I Phone
A home in the new 4 seasons for 100,000
an OLCD Tv - 50" prefered
free world class health care
free college
a bmw

Ok, now I can feel like I wasn't cheated by those damn rich tricky smart people.

Before this starts to be a liberal bashing thread, I would defend Puzzuti by saying that I don't really think he proposes that anyone should prevent The Four Seasons from enacting thier business objectives as they see fit. Nor should their be any regulations that make them cater to the middle class. In other words, nobody is throwing capitalism under the bus here because 4S is ultimately responsible to fill the market needs of their clients to maximize their returns.

On the contrary - Puzzuti is only expressing his displeasure that 4S will be a very exclusive location and he's saying "shucks, I wish it were more egalitarian because that would be cool".

It's an opinion... that's all.
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  #17  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2009, 5:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by citycenter View Post
Work hard Pizzuti and you too could one day afford a unit in that building. Out of pure curiosity, would you still have the same opinion of "evil rich white men" if you were one of them?? I doubt you would be complaining if you had the financial wherewithal to write a blank check for one of these units

I just can't understand where we lost our way as a free capitalist society. Every single day I watch our government and those that have come through the educational system work their hardest to squash hard work, entrepreneurialism, and innovation all because it's not "fair" to those who get left behind. There is a reason why some people get left behind and will never amount to anything - it's just a fact of life.

OK, my rant is over now!

"Liberalism is a mental disorder" - Michael Savage
I'm gonna guess a couple things about you... White. Always had opportunity. Probably never been REALLY poor.

It's a lot easier to criticize those in a position that you've never been in, and those who struggle to have the same opportunities with which you have been afforded.

The next 25 years are going to be fun for you.





As for the topic at hand, there are two points to be made. One, there is nothing wrong with exclusivity and high end downtown living... HOWEVER... there should DEFINITELY be more options for people who, say, don't make six figures, or even half of that, to live affordably downtown as well. Not saying that that is the Four Seasons job, after all, that is a name associated with high end and luxury. There does need to be more of a balance downtown, I think.
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Old Posted Jun 10, 2009, 7:07 PM
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Originally Posted by citycenter View Post
Work hard Pizzuti and you too could one day afford a unit in that building. Out of pure curiosity, would you still have the same opinion of "evil rich white men" if you were one of them?? I doubt you would be complaining if you had the financial wherewithal to write a blank check for one of these units
Ok, this is a response to the self-admitted "rant," and once I'm done with this one post I'll drop it regardless of whether you post a response because I think the other people in the forum deserve to have this stay as on-topic as possible.

I never even mentioned "evil rich white men." And I always find the "work hard" diatribe amusing and ill-informed. Here's why:

I made good choices and I'm proud of them. I got good grades in high school, went to college and worked my way through to pay rent and got a decent GPA and two undergraduate degrees. I came from a white, middle-class background and had it easier than most. I could have set myself up to make a lot of money someday, but I chose to become a freelance writer and a high school teacher in low-income urban schools (student teaching this fall as part of a graduate school program - Montbello High School!) because that is my interest. I'm probably not going to be rich.

Do I sometimes resent some wealthy guys? It depends on the individual, but yes, I'm going to have to admit that I occasionally feel it even when I don't want to. I had friends in college who had never had a job because their parents paid for things, who got drunk instead of doing schoolwork so got a 2.5 gpa, who went skiing in Vail every weekend and gave me shit for not going with them but my reasoning was that a season pass would cost an entire month's rent. Then they bragged to me that their brother-in-law hooked them up with a senior-year internship making $22 an hour to type pricetags into an excel spreadsheet for 3 of the 8 hours they were paid for - while I was earning $7 making sandwiches in the best job I can find that let me work from 7-11pm when I don't have class. And by "they" I mean several people whose situations were similar to the one example I gave. OK yes, I sometimes resent that - you can probably tell I do - and once I cussed a roommate out because he said we shouldn't have scholarships for minorities because "where else are we gonna get our trash men and janitors?"

But I don't assume every rich person came from that. It would be unfair for me to take so little information about someone and pretend its fact that he came from weathy parents and never worked hard in his life. I admire people who got there on their own and I really admire people who got there on their own and give back. SIMILARLY, it's extremely unfair to you or somebody else assume someone didn't "work hard" because he or she finds him/herself on the other end of the spectrum.

Beause the thing is, I never resented the rich guys for being rich. Absolutely not; I'd LOVE for my kids to have what they had. I resented them for being holy-fucking-ignorant.

(I have a friend who is a black guy who was on trial a few years ago because an off-duty Denver cop called him a n***** at a bar, and when he drunkenly confronted the also-drunk off-duty cop, the cop lied and said my friend smacked him with a gun. He was in legal trouble for several months, and eventually court determined the cop was lying and the cop got a two-month suspension for it and the charges were dropped. A two-month suspension seems patheticly easy, since my friend was set to go to jail for several years if he was found guilty of "assault with a deadly weapon." He never tried to sue the cops for money though I think he should have. And during the fiasco he had to drop out of college, so lost his athletic scholarship, and never found the inspiration to go back. He just kind of lost it and has no interest in going to school or getting a good job - I think it's a heartbreaking situation. Take that story for what you will.)

Last edited by Pizzuti; Jun 10, 2009 at 7:23 PM.
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Old Posted Jun 10, 2009, 7:58 PM
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Sorry, but I've seen way too many upper management types get away with everything, flush a successful company down the toilet, take credit for someone else's work, blame their failures on their employees, AND get a golden parachute on their way out.

You've got to be kidding me if you think that the majority of the wealthy got there through hard HONEST work. These are the people that squash entrepreneurialism and innovation, and they get bonuses and hefty severance packages for it. I see it every day.

The truth is, we see things the same way. We both think that people who are smart, talented, and hard working should get paid more than those who are not. However, where we differ is that I don't think that all poor people are necessarily stupid, talentless, and lazy. There's plenty of rich stupid, talentless, lazy people. Both groups are responsible for giving birth to smart kids and stupid kids, except that stupid rich kids end up running companies into the ground, while the smart poor kids work extremely hard to climb the economic ladder, and only the most lucky have the chance to do what the stupid rich kids had handed down to them. So, why are we punishing smart people for their parents' mistakes, and why are rewarding stupid people for their parents' success? That kind of system breeds inefficiency and inequality of the wost kind. Do you know how I know? It's because it's already been tried, and it's called feudalism. Look it up - it really sucks.

Okay, my last point. Yes, I think that dumb people deserve what they get. But, I don't want to have to live in a world where the poor are so desperate that I have to live in a gated community, have armed guards, and send my kids to exclusive private schools just so that I don't robbed, killed, or kidnapped. This is what happens when the middle class disappears and all you have are the super poor and the super rich. Yes, these places are capitalist countries, and they aren't all that pleasant even for the rich. You can't have a functioning system where the poor don't have a decent standard of living, and the rich end up spending all their wealth on maintaining a security perimeter around their vast estates and paying off the local police and rigging the judicial system in their favor.

Rant off.
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  #20  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2009, 8:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by citycenter View Post

"Liberalism is a mental disorder" - Michael Savage
I would have had a lot more respect for you if you had decided to be mature about this. Name calling simply makes you appear foolish, and that quote at the end was completely unnecessary.
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