AUSTIN | Transportation Updates

[SecretAgentMan]

Originally Posted by M1EK

Likewise, I hope readers of this forum will consider carefully SAM's words above - in which he presumably expects you to listen to the words of anonymous cowards who expect to be considered 'experts' more than the words of those who are willing to identify themselves but are mere 'readers'.

I was referring to Jarrett Walker. Unlike some people, I would never be so presumptuous as to call myself an expert.

[SecretAgentMan]

Originally Posted by M1EK

Yes, up Lamar after the Triangle is likely what they mean by "northwest extension up Lamar".

There's problems with using Nueces up there too - it's on tap for phase II of the bicycle boulevard (if it ever happens). Very bad combination to have the bike boulevard treatments on a street with rail transit.

Biggest advantage of Guadalupe (other than "only one block closer") is visibility - for the businesses and for the campus. If the train is hidden off the beaten track, fewer people will decide to use it (based on other cities' experiences).

I'm with wwmiv on this one. Visibility is only an issue for first-time users and tourists. Most subways have this same challenge, but it is easily resolved with signage pointing pedestrians towards the station.

The bike boulevard through West Campus is being planned for Rio Grande, where the existing bike lanes are.

The connection to Guadalupe at Nueces and jogs at 24th and MLK will require some creative signal phasing, but it is not insurmountable. The jog on MLK from Lavaca to Guadalupe would be far worse, as it is already a problem for existing traffic.

My biggest concern with this plan is the decision to use 17th and 18th to make the east-west connection. It is understandable, because they carry very little traffic, but I would like to see them consider 15th instead. 15th / Enfield is probably the best opportunity to serve the Brackenridge Tract with rail. It does get busy at times, but I would not exactly characterize it as congested, like MLK between Lavaca & Guadalupe. 15th is plenty wide enough to accommodate an exclusive central median trackway, and still maintain two travel lanes in each direction. I guess that is two travel lanes less than Leffingwell wants to see going into the bond election.

[M1EK]

Originally Posted by SecretAgentMan

I was referring to Jarrett Walker. Unlike some people, I would never be so presumptuous as to call myself an expert.

That's good to hear explicitly, since everything you've ever said here before reads like an attempt to assert expertise (from behind the veil of anonymity) as an appeal to authority over yours truly.

[M1EK]

Originally Posted by SecretAgentMan

I'm with wwmiv on this one. Visibility is only an issue for first-time users and tourists. Most subways have this same challenge, but it is easily resolved with signage pointing pedestrians towards the station.

Visibility isn't about being able to find the train if you already know you're interested - it's about SEEING the train gliding past while you're stuck in traffic.

The bike boulevard through West Campus is being planned for Rio Grande, where the existing bike lanes are.

No decision has been made on the route for Phase II; but it's more reasonable to assert that Nueces would be the facility since it's the road being used in Phase I.

My biggest concern with this plan is the decision to use 17th and 18th to make the east-west connection. It is understandable, because they carry very little traffic, but I would like to see them consider 15th instead. 15th / Enfield is probably the best opportunity to serve the Brackenridge Tract with rail. It does get busy at times, but I would not exactly characterize it as congested, like MLK between Lavaca & Guadalupe. 15th is plenty wide enough to accommodate an exclusive central median trackway, and still maintain two travel lanes in each direction. I guess that is two travel lanes less than Leffingwell wants to see going into the bond election.

Interesting that somebody with so much more supposed expertise than yours truly would assert that the 15th/Enfield corridor is the best opportunity to serve the Brackenridge Tract. Yes, there's plenty of width on 15th, but then you have 4 narrow traffic lanes on Enfield for a few more miles - and heavily, heavily, heavily congested during rush hour (as packed as Guadalupe although moving slightly better - but still way too bad to even contemplate running in shared traffic).

If you ask this uninformed ranting reader who somehow still has the guts to identify himself publically, the best way to serve the BT would be using right-of-way in the area of the UP tracks, then using Lake Austin Boulevard. We talked about this in the OWANA neighborhood plan back in the late 1990s.

[hookem]

So it's March 1st.. do we have rail yet?

Based on CapMetro's site, we should be seeing this (from http://www.capmetro.org/news/news_detail.asp?id=8275):

NEWS FACTS

* Capital MetroRail is slated to roll out of the station for passenger service later in March, but beginning March 1, the Capital MetroRail trains will be operating during the morning and afternoon commute to complete final system and schedule testing. Freight trains will travel down the tracks at other times, day and night. Area drivers should always expect a train from either direction.

..

* Beginning March 1, train traffic will increase significantly, and MetroRail trains travel faster and quieter than locomotives.

Can anyone verify that this is happening? Someone should at least be seeing a bunch more trains... unless...

[M1EK]

MetroRail schedules, including the all-important shuttlebus schedules (ex: UT to MLK station), are out; and I did a short crackplog here: http://mdahmus.monkeysystems.com/blo...es/000632.html

In short, Capital Metro enablers like SecretAgentMan have brought us a service that not only precludes good light rail on the 2000 corridor, but is going to be objectively slower than existing express bus service.

if you're leaving UT for Leander and want to take the first available trip after 5:00, the express bus that currently takes you 68 minutes is on tap to be replaced by a shuttle-bus plus Red Line option that will take you either 71 or 76 minutes, depending on if you feel like taking your chances on maybe not fitting on the second shuttle bus for the 5:40 trip heading up to Leander.

[Scottolini]

Wouldn't it be totally awesome if instead of some half-assed commuter rail line, which operates during weekday rush-hours only, we had an actual urban light-rail system running at high-frequency 7 days a week? I might actually be excited, and go ride it.

[TXLove]

Originally Posted by Scottolini

Wouldn't it be totally awesome if instead of some half-assed commuter rail line, which operates during weekday rush-hours only, we had an actual urban light-rail system running at high-frequency 7 days a week? I might actually be excited, and go ride it.

Agreed! I could care less about this bs of a commuter rail line! I was once excited about this but now could care less about these trains

[M1EK]

Days of Reckoning, Part II

Today's entry: Somebody who fell for the "TOD" hype and moved into Crestview Station so they could walk to the Red Line and take it to work at UT. Morning commute this time around; assume they want to get in comfortably before 9:00AM. Note that the Red Line shuttle drops off on San Jacinto; the two bus options here drop off on Guadalupe; the typical UT office is, if anything, closer to Guadalupe than San Jacinto.

Spoiler: Even the local bus beats the Red Line, because of the shuttle-bus trip. Yes, even though that local bus travels through half of the congestion on the Drag.

In short, Capital Metro enablers like SecretAgentMan have brought us a service that not only precludes good light rail on the 2000 corridor, but is going to be objectively slower than existing express bus service and even local bus service in this example.

[JAM]

Originally Posted by Scottolini

Wouldn't it be totally awesome if instead of some half-assed commuter rail line, which operates during weekday rush-hours only, we had an actual urban light-rail system running at high-frequency 7 days a week? I might actually be excited, and go ride it.

I'm looking forward to the day that the commuter rail operates with extended hours so that I can reverse commute. As the schedule stands, the last train departs for D.T. before I get off work. The current schedule leaves me stranded at work.

[M1EK]

Originally Posted by JAM

I'm looking forward to the day that the commuter rail operates with extended hours so that I can reverse commute. As the schedule stands, the last train departs for D.T. before I get off work. The current schedule leaves me stranded at work.

Apologies if you've answered before, but where exactly do you work that's within walking distance of a Red Line stop? The only major employer that's even close is IBM (to the Kramer station) and they're not all that close.

[JAM]

Originally Posted by M1EK

Apologies if you've answered before, but where exactly do you work that's within walking distance of a Red Line stop? The only major employer that's even close is IBM (to the Kramer station) and they're not all that close.

I don't. I plan to leave a car there to complete the last few miles. Unfortunately, with current schedule, half time time or more, I'll have to use it to drive home anyway.

[Nickelplate]

Originally Posted by M1EK

Apologies if you've answered before, but where exactly do you work that's within walking distance of a Red Line stop? The only major employer that's even close is IBM (to the Kramer station) and they're not all that close.

Hospira which has approx. 1500 employees is right across the street from the Howard lane stop. Unfortunately there is no stop near my house to utilize this service. Also with the current limited schedule, use after work is unavailable too.

[M1EK]

Originally Posted by Nickelplate

Hospira which has approx. 1500 employees is right across the street from the Howard lane stop. Unfortunately there is no stop near my house to utilize this service. Also with the current limited schedule, use after work is unavailable too.

Huh. Even though I lived up north for a year and worked up there for a couple more, I never noticed this site. Well, there you go; one additional major employer within walking distance (unpleasant walk though it will be).

[BlueEyes_Austin]

Originally Posted by M1EK

I haven't been involved in these meetings at all (family obligations; real job) but the image makes it look like they're considering going up San Antonio St in West Campus, which is an interesting angle (not the right thing for the long-run, but close enough to Guadalupe to be better for most UT offices than the San Jacinto route).

I constantly see you making the claim that Guadalupe is the closest connection for UT, better than San Jac, but that doesn't make any sense. A Guadalupe stop is great for people at the Tower but a large number of UT staff, faculty, and students are in mid campus and east campus. A station at San Jac almost certainly has a shorter average walking distance for the UT community as a whole than a station at Guadalupe.

[Nickelplate]

Originally Posted by M1EK

Huh. Even though I lived up north for a year and worked up there for a couple more, I never noticed this site. Well, there you go; one additional major employer within walking distance (unpleasant walk though it will be).

Trying to cross there is definitely difficult. Policy is no smoking on company grounds, so the employees go across the street (walking or by car) to the train station parking lot to smoke. Thats about all the use that site is getting right now.

[M1EK]

Originally Posted by BlueEyes_Austin

I constantly see you making the claim that Guadalupe is the closest connection for UT, better than San Jac, but that doesn't make any sense. A Guadalupe stop is great for people at the Tower but a large number of UT staff, faculty, and students are in mid campus and east campus. A station at San Jac almost certainly has a shorter average walking distance for the UT community as a whole than a station at Guadalupe.

The center of office gravity on UT's campus is closer to Guadalupe than San Jacinto; and even upcoming construction in the 5 year plan is more west of Speedway than east (we discussed it here at one point; here's the thread - the stuff near SJ is buildings that won't have people; gas turbine and thermal storage, for instance). UT makes noises about wanting SJ to be the new center of campus, but their actions have not matched those words (not yet, anyways).

And I'm not the only one who made that claim; see comments in this post at Capital MetroBlog.

from "Robert":

“To improve access to the campus, increase ridership, and operate through a more pedestrian-friendly area, adjust Route 5 to operate via San Jacinto Boulevard instead of Guadalupe Street.” This would be a disaster. Quite a lot of the #5’s ridership–myself included–consists of UT students and staff who are destined for the engineering complex, the communications buildings, the west mall, or the six-pack–all very dense clusters on campus. The proposed changes would drop them off a good deal farther away from their destination, and at the bottom of a hill–not at all pedestrian-friendly. This seems, like the proposed switch from Congress to Guadalupe/Lavaca downtown–to be the general principle: move the bus routes away from the places people need to go, and into areas that are less congested. That is not a plan for increased ridership.

From Lee Nichols (Chronicle writer):

As a frequent user of No.5, I too am mystified by the move from Guadalupe to San Jacinto. Although that would benefit me going to UT sports events, it seems like Guadalupe is a more natural destination for most riders.

[BlueEyes_Austin]

That's hardly evidence, M1EK.

Here's a map of the campus:

http://www.utexas.edu/maps/

Let's make the reasonable assumption that the San Jac station is at or near the circular drive--you know, the major existing transport node on campus.

Essentially, anything that is east of the Tower is closer to the potential San Jac station than a Guadalupe station. Only portions of area 2 and area 1 are unambiguously better off under the Guadalupe proposal.

The campus doesn't need to "recenter" around San jac to make a San Jac station the best choice...it already is.

[M1EK]

Originally Posted by BlueEyes_Austin

That's hardly evidence, M1EK.

Here's a map of the campus:

http://www.utexas.edu/maps/

Let's make the reasonable assumption that the San Jac station is at or near the circular drive--you know, the major existing transport node on campus.

Essentially, anything that is east of the Tower is closer to the potential San Jac station than a Guadalupe station. Only portions of area 2 and area 1 are unambiguously better off under the Guadalupe proposal.

The campus doesn't need to "recenter" around San jac to make a San Jac station the best choice...it already is.

Not really. For one thing wrt commuter rail, there's no indication they plan to go into the circle or have any other stops on San Jacinto (see the map here - stops without timepoints are usually indicated by black dots; there's none here).

Areas 1 and 2 are closer to Guadalupe - those are Communication and Tower (both heavy offices/classrooms). Area 3 (Perry Castaneda Library) is more accurately a 'both'. Area 4 (Engineering) has 'both' (but note there's no stops further up San Jac where it bends to the west, according to the shuttle map). Also note, again, the comment from the person in engineering at UT stating they prefer Guadalupe.

Area 6 (Fine Arts) - fine, closer to San Jac. Areas 7-11 all closer to San Jac too, but hardly any travel demand to those areas during the week. And notice - hardly any big buildings in those sections. Basically, yeah, more land area of the 'campus' is closer to San Jac, but not the buildings people are actually going to (remember, this discussion is about people going to work, not really students - there's almost no useful interaction students, even ones living off-campus, could possibly have with the Red Line).

Like Lee Nichols points out, if you're going to sporting events (or even to some dorms) San Jacinto is great; but if you pay attention to what's in those areas of campus, MOST of the offices and even classrooms are closer to Guadalupe than San Jac.

[wwmiv]

Let's compromise and say that they are relatively equal in their impact to campus itself, but that Guadalupe is much better overall because of the many students living in West Campus. However, seeing that BOTH are being pursued, why is this an issue?

I'm more interested in talking about the paths of future extensions.

I do believe that Guadalupe is a few notches above San Antonio (though I also believe that San Antonio is a fine choice). The extension northward along Lamar should eventually go at least to 2222 (where there is a bunch of land ripe for VMU redevelopment).

M1EK, I know that you believe that the current commuter rail precludes this, but I believe that it may be the city's intention to extend this line all the way to Airport in the hopes of using that area as a transfer station.

The extension talked about to Hancock could theoretically be taken even further up Cameron Road. Does anyone remember that lovely form based zoning article that mentioned Cameron (as well as the more obvious Airport/Highland Mall area) as a possibility for this?

The SoCo extension should go at least to St. Edwards. There really is no need for it any further than that and there probably never will be in terms of urban rail. However, depending on the future of the San Antonio-Austin commuter rail line, it could be extended on a commuter basis to San Marcos.

Going down Lamar, I believe the optimum would be to end at West Gate.

I'm assuming the overall plan with the Barton Springs Rd. line is to have it actually GO to Zilker? Why not include that at start-off? It's a huge draw and would make the overall plan more viable long-term in that it could build better community support for extensions.

My last comment is the Brackenridge tract. It looks on the map as if they just want to forget about going there on street and are going on the current rail route until MoPac. Not sure that this is a good idea. It would be better if it were in street on fifth or sixth. Again, just my opinion.

That's it for now. M1EK, any comments on viability?