PHILADELPHIA | Highrise Development Thread IX

[wondertwinalpha]

wouldnt those on Market and 20th be closer isnt the Rittenhouse closer than this too

The Sonata at 18th and Market is 0.7mi - 14 min. walk. The Rittenhouse is .8mi - 17 min walk, so yes.

Also - I believe Drexel has plans for a Hotel right at like 31/32 and Market/JFK

Good! My point was that we need some hotels close to the station. Many cities have them across the street from the train station or very close. Clustering amenities, including hotels, around transit hubs is a good thing.

[PHL10]

Originally Posted by summersm343

8th and Walnut tower (possible Liberty office building)

Any idea where? Now that HUP built on top of the garage on the SW corner, things seem full at that corner unless they demo the low rise commercial building on the NE corner.

[summersm343]

Originally Posted by theWatusi

That's some very optimistic speculation.

Think about it. 300 units for 30 floor apartment tower? 5 is 1,500 apartments. That won't even be half of amount of new employees working at CITC. And I assume a lot of them will be getting hefty paychecks and will likely buy condos in the city. Some will choose to live in the suburbs, yes, sure. However, these will be mainly tech and media related jobs, and most people working in those types of fields tend to choose urban settings over the suburbs. SLS is 47 floors, albeit half of which is a hotel, sooo 27 floors roughly with 125 condos? 1706 Rittenhouse is 31 floors and 31 condos. The newly proposed 500 Walnut is 26 floors and 40 condos.

With a current 2% vacancy rate in Center City, I'm predicting at least a couple of apartment buildings and condo buildings to be built as a direct result of CITC being built.

Are you thinking differently?

[summersm343]

Originally Posted by PHL10

Any idea where? Now that HUP built on top of the garage on the SW corner, things seem full at that corner unless they demo the low rise commercial building on the NE corner.

That parking lot right there. Last I heard LPT was attempting to acquire the property.

[Philly Fan]

Originally Posted by PHL10

Any idea where? Now that HUP built on top of the garage on the SW corner, things seem full at that corner unless they demo the low rise commercial building on the NE corner.

There was talk a few years ago about the Walnut Street Theatre building a tower on the parking lot next door to the theatre, to include additional performance and rehearsal space (perhaps a theatre in the round) on the lower floors and apartments for seniors above that. It that, or a similar proposal, gets going again, there could be lots of additional development on that block in the not-to-distant future.

EDIT: Just saw summers' post. Do you mean the same lot next to the theatre?

[cubanChris]

Originally Posted by summersm343

Think about it. 300 units for 30 floor apartment tower? 5 is 1,500 apartments. That won't even be half of amount of new employees working at CITC. And I assume a lot of them will be getting hefty paychecks and will likely buy condos in the city. Some will choose to live in the suburbs, yes, sure. However, these will be mainly tech and media related jobs, and most people working in those types of fields tend to choose urban settings over the suburbs. SLS is 47 floors, albeit half of which is a hotel, sooo 27 floors roughly with 125 condos? 1706 Rittenhouse is 31 floors and 31 condos. The newly proposed 500 Walnut is 26 floors and 40 condos.

With a current 2% vacancy rate in Center City, I'm predicting at least a couple of apartment buildings and condo buildings to be built as a direct result of CITC being built.

Are you thinking differently?

I'm no expert on %'s of company employees that live in the city VS the suburbs but even my optimistic guess would probably have your figures inverted – with 1000 (of the 3000 new employees) living in the city VS 2000 commuting in from surrounding counties.

I realize they're supposed to be tech jobs and skewing younger... but that is what I'd imagine Watusi meant by the optimistic assumption.

Happy to be proven wrong!

[Skyscraper.Phanatic]

I would agree with The Watusi, if CITC does add 4,000 jobs, many of those people will prefer to buy a ground level townhouse instead of remaining up in the air so to speak after work. The Comcast CITC may mean 3-4 new condo/apt. towers at best. many people like a good ol' rowhouse with a back yard.

[summersm343]

Originally Posted by Philly Fan

EDIT: Just saw summers' post. Do you mean the same lot next to the theatre?

Yes, that same lot. No idea why LPT is trying to acquire it. More expansion for Penn Medicine maybe?

[PHL10]

Originally Posted by summersm343

That parking lot right there. Last I heard LPT was attempting to acquire the property.

Got it - the one that's mid-block next to the Walnut Street Theater.

[summersm343]

Originally Posted by Skyscraper.Phanatic

I would agree with The Watusi, if CITC does add 4,000 jobs, many of those people will prefer to buy a ground level townhouse instead of remaining up in the air so to speak after work. The Comcast CITC may mean 3-4 new condo/apt. towers at best. many people like a good ol' rowhouse with a back yard.

1,000 of those employees are currently already housed in office towers around Philadelphia and will be consolidated into this new tower. 2,000 jobs will be moving from out of state or from the suburbs. 1,000 will be newly created jobs.

[theWatusi]

Originally Posted by summersm343

1,000 of those employees are currently already housed in office towers around Philadelphia and will be consolidated into this new tower. 2,000 jobs will be moving from out of state or from the suburbs. 1,000 will be newly created jobs.

And of those new jobs you'd have to assume that most of the people they hire are already living in the area. Those coming from out of state can find plenty of existing housing.

I just don't see the demand for several residential towers from the Comcast expansion alone.

[summersm343]

Originally Posted by cubanChris

I'm no expert on %'s of company employees that live in the city VS the suburbs but even my optimistic guess would probably have your figures inverted – with 1000 (of the 3000 new employees) living in the city VS 2000 commuting in from surrounding counties.

I realize they're supposed to be tech jobs and skewing younger... but that is what I'd imagine Watusi meant by the optimistic assumption.

Happy to be proven wrong!

Originally Posted by Skyscraper.Phanatic

I would agree with The Watusi, if CITC does add 4,000 jobs, many of those people will prefer to buy a ground level townhouse instead of remaining up in the air so to speak after work. The Comcast CITC may mean 3-4 new condo/apt. towers at best. many people like a good ol' rowhouse with a back yard.

You're thinking 2,000 people working in tech and media related fields will chose the suburbs over the city? You're wrong my friend. Come back to 2014, not 1984. I'm willing to bet at least 2,000 will chose the city. I would be shocked if even 1,000 people chose to live in the burbs. These are going to be young, well educated, likely single professionals. They will have good paychecks and disposal income, and will likely want a nightlife.

As for a rowhome? No, I doubt it. Most of these types of young professionals (like myself) could not give a rats ass about a yard, and want a condo tower or an apartment tower, with a maintenance crew and a management company.

[summersm343]

Originally Posted by theWatusi

And of those new jobs you'd have to assume that most of the people they hire are already living in the area. Those coming from out of state can find plenty of existing housing.

I just don't see the demand for several residential towers from the Comcast expansion alone.

You don't see demand for housing from a 1,000 footer housing 3000 new employees to Center City in a market that currently has a 2% residential vacancy rate?



okay... guess we just see things differently.

[Philly Fan]

Originally Posted by summersm343

Yes, that same lot. No idea why LPT is trying to acquire it. More expansion for Penn Medicine maybe?

I doubt that (Penn Medicine expansion). Maybe this is part of the original Walnut Street Theatre plan I mentioned? Could be a deal in the works to develop it on behalf of the theatre, with the residential space above. I can't imagine that the theatre would want to own and operate a residential tower, as long as it was able to own or control the theatre space on the lower floors.

On the other hand, that proposal could be dead at this point, and this is something completely different (including the possibility of an office tower).

[theWatusi]

Originally Posted by summersm343

These are going to be young, well educated, likely single professionals. They will have good paychecks and disposal income, and will likely want a nightlife.

As for a rowhome? No, I doubt it. Most of these types of young professionals (like myself) could not give a rats ass about a yard, and want a condo tower or an apartment tower, with a maintenance crew and a management company.

Have you ever been to Conshohocken, Manyunk, or East Falls? The places are crawling with "young, well educated, likely single professionals"

Some will choose CC, no doubt. But no developer is going to throw up several buildings based on your logic alone.

[Kidphilly]

Originally Posted by summersm343

1,000 of those employees are currently already housed in office towers around Philadelphia and will be consolidated into this new tower. 2,000 jobs will be moving from out of state or from the suburbs. 1,000 will be newly created jobs.

so 500 would live in the burbs - maybe 250 seeking apts (some of current porposals would obviously absorb) and 250 spread around many outside of DT/CC

While new jobs is good no single venture will generate many specific cranes - now if tech off shoot offs come peripheral locations may become more in demand but think the crane generation from one entity is a tad over-zealous - but hey more optimists are good thing for the city

Reading over on PS one would think its 1984...

[summersm343]

Originally Posted by theWatusi

Have you ever been to Conshohocken, Manyunk, or East Falls? The places are crawling with "young, well educated, likely single professionals"

Some will choose CC, no doubt. But no developer is going to throw up several buildings based on your logic alone.

Yes I have... and the people who choose those places (most of the time, not all of the time) either work in the burbs, or cannot afford to live in Center City. Those working at CITC, again, will have good paychecks.

[summersm343]

Originally Posted by Kidphilly

so 500 would live in the burbs - maybe 250 seeking apts (some of current porposals would obviously absorb) and 250 spread around many outside of DT/CC

While new jobs is good no single venture will generate many specific cranes - now if tech off shoot offs come peripheral locations may become more in demand but think the crane generation from one entity is a tad over-zealous - but hey more optimists are good thing for the city

Reading over on PS one would think its 1984...

My assumption was that 2,000 employees chose Center City. Whether this is correct or not, I was just stating what COULD happen. IDK why I got attacked for this. At 300 units for each tower that would be 5 towers and 1,500 of those employees. That's still 500 people looking for housing, so let's say they take up existing units. That's still 5 towers... pretty significant. Not saying my number of 5-7 is EXACT, I was just stating what COULD come from CITC being built. Don't see how 3 or 4 towers at best is any different than 5 towers. What is one more tower?

Sorry guys!

[Kidphilly]

Originally Posted by summersm343

My assumption was that 2,000 employees chose Center City. Whether this is correct or not, I was just stating what COULD happen. IDK why I got attacked for this. At 300 units for each tower that would be 5 towers and 1,500 of those employees. That's still 500 people looking for housing, so let's say they take up existing units. That's still 5 towers... pretty significant. Not saying my number of 5-7 is EXACT, I was just stating what COULD come from CITC being built. Don't see how 3 or 4 towers at best is any different than 5 towers. What is one more tower?

Sorry guys!

is all good - just think some fair balance

[MikeNigh]

Originally Posted by Skyscraper.Phanatic

I would agree with The Watusi, if CITC does add 4,000 jobs, many of those people will prefer to buy a ground level townhouse instead of remaining up in the air so to speak after work. The Comcast CITC may mean 3-4 new condo/apt. towers at best. many people like a good ol' rowhouse with a back yard.

Most of the people I know here who work up in the air and live in the city also prefer to live in high rises.