The Great Canadian Transit Thread

[YYCguys]

Does Trudeau’s latest transit funding announcement (if the funding actually materializes) increase the budget to allow construction of Calgary’s Green Line past 16th to the north and/or past Shepherd to the south and/or reinstate the underground portion across the river? Oddly, I didn’t find any media covering this announcement in recent days and what it means for Calgary.

Also does the funding announcement allow Vancouver’s Broadway line to extend to UBC earlier than expected?

Or will any of this transit funding even be allocated to provinces west of Ontario?

[Doady]

Thanks for the explanation, ScreamingViking. I've often wonder edwhat is going with transit in Hamilton, and the "area-rating" maybe explains a lot. Politics based on division does not help transit. As if the separation of Burlington Transit wasn't bad enough...

What rbt makes sense too. Hamilton being in the shadow of the GTA, even more so than Guelph and Waterloo Region, maybe it is unfair to expect its transit system to be on the same level as Winnipeg and Quebec.

I am happy Hamilton will get LRT, but as I've said rail is not the solution for too low ridership, rail is the solution for too high ridership, so I hope Hamilton figures everything out soon.

The other city I've said should get LRT next is London. Its system gets even more riders that Hamilton, 24.6 million in 2019, but the city is in the Snowbelt, lots of lake-effect snow. That means it cannot rely on articulated buses as much, BRT is not as good an option as it might be for other bigger systems in drier climates like Winnipeg. So I hope they start to think about light rail there too. It might seem crazy for such a small city but they are not in a typical situation with that climate.

[Truenorth00]

Honestly, one of the best things they the feds could do is fund infrastructure for buses and all that goes with bus ridership.

Pay for the infrastructure changes needed to deploy electric buses.

Pay for the renewal or addition of bus depots.

Pay for the incorporation of electronic fare payment everywhere.

Pay for more and better bus stops. More shelters. More notification boards. More heating.

Spending a few billion dollars on the above would do more for most transit users than a lot of the rapid transit projects ever will.

[MalcolmTucker]

Originally Posted by YYCguys

Does Trudeau’s latest transit funding announcement (if the funding actually materializes) increase the budget to allow construction of Calgary’s Green Line past 16th to the north and/or past Shepherd to the south and/or reinstate the underground portion across the river? Oddly, I didn’t find any media covering this announcement in recent days and what it means for Calgary.

Also does the funding announcement allow Vancouver’s Broadway line to extend to UBC earlier than expected?

Or will any of this transit funding even be allocated to provinces west of Ontario?

It will follow population, as it always has.



This money is post 2026, perhaps post 2028. Either way, it lets organizations and provinces start to plan.



Money is not allocated to any projects.

[ScreamingViking]

Originally Posted by MalcolmTucker

It will follow population, as it always has.



This money is post 2026, perhaps post 2028. Either way, it lets organizations and provinces start to plan.



Money is not allocated to any projects.

It's supposed to be dealt out on a project by project basis. But when the chips are down we all know how things tend to get portioned out in a "fair" manner.

And while the $3 billion annual fund doesn't begin until 2026, almost $6 billion is being allocated right away for projects that are ready to be built.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/trudeau-transit-fund-1.5908346

[ScreamingViking]

Originally Posted by YYCguys

Or will any of this transit funding even be allocated to provinces west of Ontario?

I don't see why it wouldn't.

[Doady]

Truedope and the Liberals hate Alberta and all the western provinces, so no way they would ever provide funding to any transit there.

[Innsertnamehere]

Hamiltons lower city population has been in decline for a while.

I suspect this may slow or stop in the 2021 census, but even then I suspect it will keep dropping as the city is rapidly gentrifying with old houses being converted back to single units from rooming houses and duplexes.

Up until this latest funding announcement it’s always been allocated on population to the provinces.. this one is a covid spending package so it will be based on “ready” projects - I suspect most will be minor things like bus purchases, new bus shelters, etc, not shined new transit lines.

[MalcolmTucker]

Originally Posted by ScreamingViking

It's supposed to be dealt out on a project by project basis. But when the chips are down we all know how things tend to get portioned out in a "fair" manner.

And while the $3 billion annual fund doesn't begin until 2026, almost $6 billion is being allocated right away for projects that are ready to be built.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/trudeau-transit-fund-1.5908346

You'd be surprised at how untrue that is. Because if it was true, there'd be huge scandal! Because it is pretty easy to prove.

Now within provinces, it can get all screwed up. But between provinces, it is pretty fair.

Easy to forget how vast the population differences are between the provinces when one is coveting federal funds.

[Innsertnamehere]

Originally Posted by MalcolmTucker

You'd be surprised at how untrue that is. Because if it was true, there'd be huge scandal! Because it is pretty easy to prove.

Now within provinces, it can get all screwed up. But between provinces, it is pretty fair.

Easy to forget how vast the population differences are between the provinces when one is coveting federal funds.

Yup. It's easy to think Ontario gets all the money.. but Ontario is almost 40% of Canada's population.

[YYCguys]

Originally Posted by ScreamingViking

I don't see why it wouldn't.

Because of this...

Originally Posted by Doady

Truedope and the Liberals hate Alberta and all the western provinces, so no way they would ever provide funding to any transit there.

[ScreamingViking]

Originally Posted by MalcolmTucker

You'd be surprised at how untrue that is. Because if it was true, there'd be huge scandal! Because it is pretty easy to prove.

Now within provinces, it can get all screwed up. But between provinces, it is pretty fair.

Easy to forget how vast the population differences are between the provinces when one is coveting federal funds.

I meant at the provincial level. Sub-provincially, yep, totally agree.

And no matter what the current Liberal government engraves on the tablets, a future one (regardless of political stripe) can always smash them and engrave their own.

[ssiguy]

Originally Posted by Doady

The other city I've said should get LRT next is London. Its system gets even more riders that Hamilton, 24.6 million in 2019, but the city is in the Snowbelt, lots of lake-effect snow. That means it cannot rely on articulated buses as much, BRT is not as good an option as it might be for other bigger systems in drier climates like Winnipeg. So I hope they start to think about light rail there too. It might seem crazy for such a small city but they are not in a typical situation with that climate.

I completely disagree and i'm glad London isn't getting light rail.

I fail to understand this fascination with rail when BRT can provide the same service at a vastly lower cost, can be expanded far easier and cheaper, and can run interlining getting rid of unnecessary transfers. I often think that city's that want LRT are doing so just for ribbon cutting opportunities and this childish notion of 'look Mom, we have LRT too'.

Rail will always provide a far nicer ride than standard buses but that the difference greatly declines with BRT with dedicated lanes. A good chunk of the reason buses are often uncomfortable is not due to the bus itself but rather the roads. The buses have to go down regular roads with potholes and very uneven paving. BRT lanes don't suffer from this and hence offer a far smoother ride. The difference in quietness is also being reduced as electric buses become the norm.

You also have to take into account the geography of the city. London spreads out in all directions due to not being up against a major river or along a waterfront. This means that 10km from the downtown may find you in near farmland but not so in cities that stretch longer along waterfront. KW is different because the metro area is very linear due to Waterloo, Kitchener, and Cambridge being along a straight north-south alignment. London also suffers from very thin and disconnected roadways unlike Kit/Ham.

[Truenorth00]

And with electric buses, the ride quality for BRT can be made a bit better. I also think BRT is better for London, and a good stepping stone to LRT in the future, if demand warrants it.

[MalcolmTucker]

London's LRT was going to be like a worse version of Waterloo's. And Waterloo's wasn't justifiable at the time. It is hard to justify in smaller centres.

[ScreamingViking]

It's also about the corridor, not just the overall ridership. In Hamilton, the LRT is proposed to run along the city's busiest transit corridor -- capacity is the issue, despite all the talk about development impacts and such. A BRT could be a solution too, but people opposed to the LRT don't really think of BRT the way it needs to be -- they see "just run more buses" rather than the dedicated bus lanes it must involve for the rapid bus service to thrive.

BRT may really be a cheaper, more flexible short-to-medium term solution for many cities, but if it gets to a point of being so popular that bus congestion becomes an issue (like what was the case in Ottawa) then an upgrade to a rail-based service is warranted. The tricky part is forecasting when that may occur and whether it just makes sense to go all-in on LRT from the get-go. COVID-19 has made that a whole lot trickier.

[Metro-One]

Originally Posted by YYCguys

Does Trudeau’s latest transit funding announcement (if the funding actually materializes) increase the budget to allow construction of Calgary’s Green Line past 16th to the north and/or past Shepherd to the south and/or reinstate the underground portion across the river? Oddly, I didn’t find any media covering this announcement in recent days and what it means for Calgary.

Also does the funding announcement allow Vancouver’s Broadway line to extend to UBC earlier than expected?

Or will any of this transit funding even be allocated to provinces west of Ontario?

The only project that I think will receive the funding it needs from this announcement in BC (western Canada??) will be the second phase of the Expo Line Extension to Langley so that the project can be built in a single phase starting next year.

Reasons for this are as follows:

Despite being phased the detailed design for the Expo Line extension is currently being done for the full build out to Langley, so it will be shovel ready.
The provincial government has promised their share for full funding to Langley.
It makes logistical sense to build the full 16km length as a single project rather than two 8km phases.

[Reecemartin]

The Ottawa O-Train has had its problems, it’s a weird and wacky system - and yet we think it has a bright future, here’s why.

https://youtu.be/uhvTxAvDu7A

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by bradnixon

Apparently the new open payment system is in operation at one fare gate at Rideau Station, starting today.

Accepts Visa/MC/Apple Pay & Google Pay.

• Video Link

https://www.octranspo.com/en/news/article/new-way-to-pay-at-rideau-station/

To be rolled out to the rest of the O-Train stations and buses later this year.

We're behind Vancouver and maybe other cities, but good step forward.

[Coldrsx]

Prairie Sky Gondola before the Urban Planning Committee today here in Edmonton.

-18 months and 9mil to be shovel ready
-18-24 months to construct

Could be operational by spring 2024.

Reminder of what the route looks like and how amazing it would be a central connector.


https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmonton/...udy-heads-to-city-council-vote-1.5443773