ATLANTA | Development Thread V

[arctk2014]

Originally Posted by jpk1292000

For student housing, this looks good.

...especially true for being precast construction....

[Ant131531]

Originally Posted by Atlanta3000

I would love know how these dorms will be priced compared to GA Tech's: Square on Fifth and University House projects. If they are only marginally different, I would be pissed to be a student at GA State. GSU's new dorm is night and day different in terms of architecture and amenities compared to GA Tech's new housing projects.

This building resembles an office building compared to a traditional dorm. You would have thought they would have incorporated an outdoor balcony into each unit. Also, first floor retail would have been nice too.

Outside of GA State's new Law building, I cannot think of one other notable structure on that campus. I take that back - their 5000 unit Prison (dorm) is quite notable from the connector. It is really a shame this school is treated as second class citizens compared to other GA schools.

Those are done by private firms though. You have to sign 12 month leases so it's basically an apartment building, except near campus.

[ATL_J]

Originally Posted by Atlanta3000

I would love know how these dorms will be priced compared to GA Tech's: Square on Fifth and University House projects. If they are only marginally different, I would be pissed to be a student at GA State. GSU's new dorm is night and day different in terms of architecture and amenities compared to GA Tech's new housing projects.

This building resembles an office building compared to a traditional dorm. You would have thought they would have incorporated an outdoor balcony into each unit. Also, first floor retail would have been nice too.

Outside of GA State's new Law building, I cannot think of one other notable structure on that campus. I take that back - their 5000 unit Prison (dorm) is quite notable from the connector. It is really a shame this school is treated as second class citizens compared to other GA schools.

As far as I know, they're not the same thing. While GSU is partnering with Corvias Campus Living, it is still a GSU dorm operated under a public-private partnership. Whereas, University House & Square on Fifth appear to be purely private enterprises providing alternatives to student housing. A more apt comparison would be to One 12 Courtland.

I don't think GSU is treated as second class citizens, but you have to understand that GSU is coming from an entirely different path than GT. Georgia Tech's endowment is roughly $1.9 billion, whereas GSU's is $133 million. With that said, the newer GSU buildings are very nice IMO. The Petit Science Center & the GSU Humanities-Law Building are both very nice buildings (which you mentioned).

[Atlanta3000]

Originally Posted by ATL_J

As far as I know, they're not the same thing. While GSU is partnering with Corvias Campus Living, it is still a GSU dorm operated under a public-private partnership. Whereas, University House & Square on Fifth appear to be purely private enterprises providing alternatives to student housing. A more apt comparison would be to One 12 Courtland.

I don't think GSU is treated as second class citizens, but you have to understand that GSU is coming from an entirely different path than GT. Georgia Tech's endowment is roughly $1.9 billion, whereas GSU's is $133 million. With that said, the newer GSU buildings are very nice IMO. The Petit Science Center & the GSU Humanities-Law Building are both very nice buildings (which you mentioned).

Just so I understand you correctly, are you staying the cost (to the student) of GSU's new dorm is comparable to GA Tech's Square on Fifth and University House? Are you also saying they are architecturally equal to that of of GA Tech's? I must be looking at the wrong picture for the GSU dorm because the one I see looks like something from circa 1990 and should be priced at half the cost of GA Tech's new dorms.

For a University of 32,000 and founded in 1913, you would think you could have mentioned more than two buildings with notable architecture. Not trying to be nasty here, but I have seen nicer architecture at Gwinnett Technical College and they have a significantly lower endowment than GSU's.

[Atlanta3000]

Originally Posted by Ant131531

Those are done by private firms though. You have to sign 12 month leases so it's basically an apartment building, except near campus.

GSU's new dorm is being built and managed by a Private Firm: Corvias Campus Living.

http://www.ajc.com/news/news/state-regio...sen-to-operate-states-privatized-/nh55p/

[scania]

Originally Posted by Atlanta3000

I take that back - their 5000 unit Prison (dorm) is quite notable from the connector. It is really a shame this school is treated as second class citizens compared to other GA schools.

Keep in mind this was once Tech's also, and at the time was considered to be really cool. The entire concept of dorms having a living room with a kitchen, was relatively a new concept for college dorms.

[Ant131531]

Originally Posted by Atlanta3000

GSU's new dorm is being built and managed by a Private Firm: Corvias Campus Living.

http://www.ajc.com/news/news/state-regio...sen-to-operate-states-privatized-/nh55p/

Tech also has the luxury of being located next to the hottest neighborhood in the city so of course, naturally Tech is going to have better looking highrise student apartment buildings.

GSU is located in downtown and no one really cares about downtown at the moment.

The sad truth is, Tech is a far more important than GSU and has done far more for the Atlanta area than GSU has so it deserves better. Tech will catapult Atlanta into the high Tech world so it needs to treat it's students well.

[Atlanta3000]

Originally Posted by Ant131531

Tech also has the luxury of being located next to the hottest neighborhood in the city so of course, naturally Tech is going to have better looking highrise student apartment buildings.

GSU is located in downtown and no one really cares about downtown at the moment.

The sad truth is, Tech is a far more important than GSU and has done far more for the Atlanta area than GSU has so it deserves better. Tech will catapult Atlanta into the high Tech world so it needs to treat it's students well.

GA Tech cannot pump out enough students to satisfy the needs for IT professional in Atlanta. It will take all of Atlanta's schools (including community colleges and high schools) to meet the need. Not to mention, recruiting Millennial recent grads outside of Atlanta.

I work in software so I have have a good handle on this area (not to be a know it all).

[scania]

Originally Posted by Ant131531

Tech also has the luxury of being located next to the hottest neighborhood in the city so of course, naturally Tech is going to have better looking highrise student apartment buildings.

GSU is located in downtown and no one really cares about downtown at the moment.

The sad truth is, Tech is a far more important than GSU and has done far more for the Atlanta area than GSU has so it deserves better. Tech will catapult Atlanta into the high Tech world so it needs to treat it's students well.

WOW!!! Do you really believe what you just said? Just because a high rise is in Midtown, doesn't mean that it will be/should be better than a building in Downtown. That's like saying because Buckhead demands the most rate per square footage, that the best high rises will be in Buckhead. As far as Tech will catapult Atlanta into the high Tech world...honestly, there's a lot more research people on here need to do if that's what you believe.

[briantech]

The crane at Square on 5th has been dismantled and carted away.

[ATL_J]

Originally Posted by Atlanta3000

Just so I understand you correctly, are you staying the cost (to the student) of GSU's new dorm is comparable to GA Tech's Square on Fifth and University House? Are you also saying they are architecturally equal to that of of GA Tech's? I must be looking at the wrong picture for the GSU dorm because the one I see looks like something from circa 1990 and should be priced at half the cost of GA Tech's new dorms.

For a University of 32,000 and founded in 1913, you would think you could have mentioned more than two buildings with notable architecture. Not trying to be nasty here, but I have seen nicer architecture at Gwinnett Technical College and they have a significantly lower endowment than GSU's.

I'm not sure what you don't understand. The two apartment towers going up are completely private endeavors catering to students. They're having to compete with a variety of options in Midtown and other surrounding neighborhoods that GT students, should they decide to live off campus, can choose from. They are thus designed and priced appropriately. To add, a GSU student should, if they wanted, live in these apartments. The new GSU dorm is a public-private partnership, but it is a GSU dorm part of GSU student housing.

So to reiterate, I have no clue where you got the idea that I said they are architecturally equivalent, the cost to live in GSU dorms would be much cheaper than staying in these private apartments (Square on Fifth / University House), the towers going up in Midtown are not GT dorms, & the tower going up in downtown is a GSU dorm.

In regards to GSU campus, I guess you don't know the history of GSU if you're surprised about their building assets. For much of it's early history it was simply a night school and did not come into its own until the late 1960s, early 1970s. It's campus served it's purpose and not until relatively recently was it much more than a commuter school.

With that said, GSU has come along way and the buildings they're constructing now reflect that. You seem to think that only new architecture can be notable. While the Petit Science Center, GSU Humanities-Law Building, and the Aderhold Learning Center are all nice, newer buildings, GSU also has: the Robison College of Business housed in the old Citizens & Southern National Bank Building, the Haas-Howell Building, the old Suntrust building, the Standard Building and others.

[testarossa50]

+1 to the above reply. This criticism of the GSU dorm project is ludicrous and not grounded in any reality.

[RocketSurgeon]

Originally Posted by scania

Just because a high rise is in Midtown, doesn't mean that it will be/should be better than a building in Downtown. That's like saying because Buckhead demands the most rate per square footage, that the best high rises will be in Buckhead.

You don't think there's a relationship between market prices and project quality?

Originally Posted by briantech

The crane at Square on 5th has been dismantled and carted away.

The crown is lit as well--it's starting to look complete! I'm a bit disappointed they went with that same cool white color everyone else has been using, though... it'd be nice to have a little more variety at night.

[jayden]

Originally Posted by micropundit

(10th Street)


( Courtland/ McGill )




Max Neiswander, Luke Kvasnicka and Roger DeWeese won the Atlanta Bridgescape Competition, the Midtown Alliance announced Friday.

“sin(uosity),” designed by the Max Neiswander and Luke Kvasnicka, won for the 10th Street Bridge in Midtown.“Organic Canopy,” designed by Roger DeWeese, won for the Courtland/McGill Bridge in downtown Atlanta.


http://www.bizjournals.com/atlanta/news/...-atlanta-bridgescape-competition.html#g1

I can NOT.

[scania]

Originally Posted by RocketSurgeon

You don't think there's a relationship between market prices and project quality?

Yes and no. Location has a lot to do with market prices. So with respect to his/her statement, because something is built in Midtown, doesn't mean it will/should be better than Downtown. I'm sure this board wouldn't say the buildings built in Buckhead are better. But Buckhead demands the highest rate for apartments. I'm very familiar on how these things work. Though the oil industry is my main check, I've several properties across the country. My main home is actually here in LA (Palos Verdes Estates). I'm only in Atlanta 3 to 4 months out of the year...that's when I typically participate. The 3 condos I have at Plaza Midtown doesn't quite equal up to the one home I have in LA. The quality is indirectly better at Plaza Midtown.

[arctk2014]

Originally Posted by scania

Yes and no. Location has a lot to do with market prices. So with respect to his/her statement, because something is built in Midtown, doesn't mean it will/should be better than Downtown. I'm sure this board wouldn't say the buildings built in Buckhead are better. But Buckhead demands the highest rate for apartments. I'm very familiar on how these things work. Though the oil industry is my main check, I've several properties across the country. My main home is actually here in LA (Palos Verdes Estates). I'm only in Atlanta 3 to 4 months out of the year...that's when I typically participate. The 3 condos I have at Plaza Midtown doesn't quite equal up to the one home I have in LA. The quality is indirectly better at Plaza Midtown.

I'm more or less agreeing with you but just wanted to add that comparing California real estate to Georgia real estate is one thing but to compare Midtown to Downtown (or even Buckhead) has a host of other factors too - including comparables, submarket drivers, access to amenities (grocery stores, transit), quality of life, walkabilty, parks, etc. By far Midtown excels in providing these over Buckhead and Downtown. Plus Midtown's growth model is a LOT more sustainable than Buckhead will be when it comes to transit and walkability. Putting Buckhead up on the pedestal based upon today's rental rates now doesn't mean that it's desirable in the long-term - and using today's downtown environment as a statement is short-sighted since it has a lot of other potential to excel (much of Downtown ATL was what Midtown was like not too long ago).

Also would like to add that Steelworks supposedly is getting the highest rate ($/SF) in apartments ITP while Avalon has had the highest in the region (there are many other underlying factors here)...shocking - I know- but it's mainly because they are the newest apartment complexes in an already "built-out" environment (supply and demand) or there aren't any other comparables that are in similar locations (usually due to age of the apartments nearby and/or the lack of apartments nearby).

[Verge]

Originally Posted by scania

Yes and no. Location has a lot to do with market prices. So with respect to his/her statement, because something is built in Midtown, doesn't mean it will/should be better than Downtown. I'm sure this board wouldn't say the buildings built in Buckhead are better. But Buckhead demands the highest rate for apartments. I'm very familiar on how these things work. Though the oil industry is my main check, I've several properties across the country. My main home is actually here in LA (Palos Verdes Estates). I'm only in Atlanta 3 to 4 months out of the year...that's when I typically participate. The 3 condos I have at Plaza Midtown doesn't quite equal up to the one home I have in LA. The quality is indirectly better at Plaza Midtown.

There is no direct correlation between design quality and rent (or neighborhood desirability)-- the only correlation is between rent and the amount of money spent on the building-- which SOMETIMES can lead to a better building.. There are many other factors-- quality and outlook of the developer (some wouldn't know decent design if it bit them) and the architect ('real' architects don't pull the same design out of a drawer and re-label it). In the case of this conversation, we are comparing apples to oranges-- a private development vs a public-private partnership still governed by state protocols and regulations. A better comparison would be Downtown's One12 building-- its private. While GSU is the largest school in the GA system at 52,000 (32,000 downtown), Ga Tech is one of the most important schools in the country (maybe the world) at only 23,000--

[GeorgiaPeanuts]

Modera Midtown was issued its Land Dev Permit. It could start site prep at any time now.

[Verge]

I also take issue with the 'No one cares about Downtown' statement-- Downtown is extremely important to not only the City, but to the whole Metro region. It has not developed (re-developed?) as quickly as other urban areas (Midtown, Buckhead, Eastside or Westside) but is now undergoing a renaissance of sorts with new attractions and more interest in Downtown properties and new development. We should all be rooting for Downtown--

[ATLSkyPalaceOwner]

Originally Posted by briantech

The crane at Square on 5th has been dismantled and carted away.

Actually are both cranes for the Spring St projects gone? I can't see the other one...

And demo is progressing on 1010 W. Peachtree. The Building Formerly Known As Checkers is in rumble. So despite the (apparent) slow progress they really are moving on it.