Stadiums & Arenas of Canada, Part 3

[trolledbypro]

Originally Posted by elly63

Why isn't there a second NHL team in the GTA?

Brodie Brazil (who's an excellent sports podcast host) did a video on this recently:
https://youtu.be/OkY5h86CHaw?si=PWHRMegmxfFbKylU

Essential he thinks the Leafs would never allow it.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by someone123

I don't really understand this point.

The Wanderers as far as I know set up a temporary stadium with their own funds, began playing, and became popular as people attended the games.

The CFL team promoters were I believe asking for hundreds of millions upfront for a large stadium to be built in a suburban location. The exact plans were somewhat nebulous, and no actual team was formed.

When they did host actual CFL games in NS they sold out very quickly and were well attended. I believe that a more Wanderers-like plan for a larger bare bones multi-use stadium on public land in the city centre would have been successful and is still viable.

The largest crowd the Wanderers have had is 7049, the CFL team will need 20k. Touchdown Atlantic has drawn over 10k the three times it has been in NS (SMU 2x and Acadia) I'm assuming they were all sellouts using temp seats to fill the small stadiums.

Moncton, which would be part of the fan base, has drawn 20, 20, 15 and 10k. The first three using temp seats.

I don't excuse the old ownership group and I'm glad it fell through before it got closer to anything happening but the CFL needs a larger facility that could have several uses in the community like every other city owned stadium. It isn't a CFL stadium even though they may be the impetus for getting one built.

I haven't seen too many regrets of any of the other Canadian cities who have built stadiums far bigger and more "opulent" for lack of a better word than Halifax is ever likely to build.

[trolledbypro]

Originally Posted by ericmacm

Hard to say - there was a pretty serious push from Bronfman and Devimco in 2019 for the Tampa Bay/Montreal split cities plan. There were designs produced for a stadium in Bassin Peel, but the MLB killed the plan a few years later and there has been no publicly known activity on the file since. Expansion remains up in the air as the Rays and A’s (moreso the Rays) are still being sorted out. I’d imagine that they are likely just sitting on the plans now and trying to slowly garner corporate interest/support.

Worth noting that Stade Olympique, after the renovations, will be in a fixed rectangular configuration moving forward that will not allow baseball anymore. Sending a team back there was a non-starter to begin with, but it is impossible now. It would have to be a brand new purpose-built stadium.

My dream for Montreal is that we see Bell utilize its sports assets (owning TSN and a portion of the Canadiens) and start a similar model to MLSE in Montreal with the Bronfmans and Molsons. All three could pool resources to secure the MLB and NBA. However, I don’t consider this likely to happen at all.

MLB likes it when things are done quietly. So far, Nashville has the most "buzz" but that doesn't mean they have the ingredients.

I don't want to bring up Brodie Brazil again but he doesn't think Nashville has the ingredients:
https://youtu.be/07_BA52oShM?si=bXLhmFayEKmFnpAI
They spent too much on the Titans and Predators recently.

My biggest concern with Montréal is, where do you build a stadium? Is Peel Basin still available, given that most of it hasn't been developed and seems to be stalling. Would the Molson Brewery site or Royalmount site work?

[someone123]

Originally Posted by elly63

I haven't seen too many regrets of any of the other Canadian cities who have built stadiums far bigger and more "opulent" for lack of a better word than Halifax is ever likely to build.

The feelings on the Regina stadium seem mixed. The province kicked in money and they had to raise property taxes as well as add a ticket surcharge: https://leaderpost.com/news/local-ne...-funding-model

I think it is reasonable for Halifax to spend perhaps $100-150M today on a basic stadium. Maybe put in 10,000 permanent seats, washrooms, etc., and some bleachers reused from what's there now.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by someone123

The feelings on the Regina stadium seem mixed. The province kicked in money and they had to raise property taxes as well as add a ticket surcharge: https://leaderpost.com/news/local-ne...-funding-model

I think it is reasonable for Halifax to spend perhaps $100-150M today on a basic stadium. Maybe put in 10,000 permanent seats, washrooms, etc., and some bleachers reused from what's there now.

That article was from three years ago when the team wasn't doing as well and we were still recovering from the pandemic, morale was low. I'm pretty sure if asked whether they would rather have the stadium or not what the answer would be. You're always going to find naysayers.

I know the stadium operators think it was overbuilt and wish instead of 33k seats, they had around 30k and more gathering areas. As it is they are still drawing 7k more per game than the big Canadian cities in MLS.

It would be hard pressed to have a decent CFL sized stadium where one side was a have not area for 150 million. And without the CFL, spending any type of big money for the Wanderers who average 6k per game is crazy.

The Hamilton stadium cost 145 million in 2014 with 22.5k seats. I don't know what that would cost today but you want to go too much less than that.

If Halifax is not willing to do what other cities have done, it looks like a stadium for the Wanderers not much bigger than they already have.

[ericmacm]

Originally Posted by trolledbypro

MLB likes it when things are done quietly. So far, Nashville has the most "buzz" but that doesn't mean they have the ingredients.

I don't want to bring up Brodie Brazil again but he doesn't think Nashville has the ingredients:
https://youtu.be/07_BA52oShM?si=bXLhmFayEKmFnpAI
They spent too much on the Titans and Predators recently.

My biggest concern with Montréal is, where do you build a stadium? Is Peel Basin still available, given that most of it hasn't been developed and seems to be stalling. Would the Molson Brewery site or Royalmount site work?

The proposed plan was to have the stadium located on the Wellington Basin parcel (owned by Canada Lands Company) but the plan as it currently sits has no stadium anymore for obvious reasons. I am unfortunately not as familiar with Montreal as I would like to be so I am not exactly sure where else a stadium would work, but there seems to still be some nearby land available that could be assembled into a parcel and redeveloped.

I largely agree that Nashville won’t be getting a team. The New Titans Stadium and Bridgestone Arena renovations will constitute almost $2B in public funding, needless to say that there will be zero public funding for a baseball stadium. The Orlando bid that was very prominent also imploded over the past month or so when the lead investor jumped over into the new Rays ownership group. I think Portland and SLC are the strongest candidates but they’re both in the west. I think the only other somewhat serious contender in the east would be Raleigh, but I can’t say I’ve seen much over there in terms of stadium planning.

[Calgarian]

Originally Posted by trolledbypro

Brodie Brazil (who's an excellent sports podcast host) did a video on this recently:
https://youtu.be/OkY5h86CHaw?si=PWHRMegmxfFbKylU

Essential he thinks the Leafs would never allow it.

Pretty much this, also I think Buffalo and Detroit have say as well. I think the GTA should absolutely have another team, maybe 2! Hamilton came close when Balsille tried to but the Penguins then the Coyotes, but the league stepped in. If Greater NYC can have 3 team, then Toronto also should.

[EnvisionSaintJohn]

Originally Posted by trolledbypro

MLB likes it when things are done quietly. So far, Nashville has the most "buzz" but that doesn't mean they have the ingredients.

I don't want to bring up Brodie Brazil again but he doesn't think Nashville has the ingredients:
https://youtu.be/07_BA52oShM?si=bXLhmFayEKmFnpAI
They spent too much on the Titans and Predators recently.

My biggest concern with Montréal is, where do you build a stadium? Is Peel Basin still available, given that most of it hasn't been developed and seems to be stalling. Would the Molson Brewery site or Royalmount site work?

If they're still going to be called the Expos, I think they should build the ballpark within Jean Drapeau Park, where Expo 67 was hosted... and bring back the expo express!



The Molson Brewery site could be a very interesting location for a ballpark, but is there room for one there with other developments planned for the site?

[EnvisionSaintJohn]

Originally Posted by someone123

The feelings on the Regina stadium seem mixed. The province kicked in money and they had to raise property taxes as well as add a ticket surcharge: https://leaderpost.com/news/local-ne...-funding-model

I think it is reasonable for Halifax to spend perhaps $100-150M today on a basic stadium. Maybe put in 10,000 permanent seats, washrooms, etc., and some bleachers reused from what's there now.

I really think a CFL expansion to the maritimes will never work if it's going to be Halifax only. Good rivalries are what make the CFL interesting, and Moncton/Halifax could be a rivalry that rivals the Saskatchewan/Winnipeg rivalry, especially if they name the team after New Brunswick and not Moncton.

I don't know if either Moncton or Halifax are prepared to spend close to what Regina paid for their arena, for a league with as limited appeal as the CFL. I think people would be very opposed to public money being spent on such projects, and I don't think any of the local billionaires in either province have any interest in bringing the CFL to the maritimes.

However, if the maritimes want to get more serious about soccer, it would be good for Moncton and Halifax step up and build 25k+ stadiums that could host both CFL and international soccer matches, international friendlies, and yes, even CPL games. Plus, it's not like such stadiums couldn't be used for concerts and other events.

New Brunswick is hosting the 2029 Canada Summer Games, could Croix-Bleue Medavie Stadium be permanently expanded and upgraded to a CFL level post Canada Games? For a league as marginal in popularity as the CFL, they seem to have extremely high standards for arenas and expansion franchises.

New/ upgraded stadiums in Victoria, Moncton, and Halifax could be good for the CFL and the game of soccer in Canada. Eventually, I think the CPL will be a more popular league than the CFL, and there will be far more professional soccer teams in Canada than CFL teams. Soccer and Canadian football use a similar enough sized field for teams to share stadiums. Canada is getting a lot better at soccer, and I think it makes sense for governments to step up and invest in things like stadiums if we want to be taken more seriously as a soccer national by the footballing world.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by EnvisionSaintJohn

For a league as marginal in popularity as the CFL, they seem to have extremely high standards for arenas and expansion franchises.

Nice trolling, but it's the same song, time to change your tune. You really have to stop with the generalized lying and/or disinformation that you constantly post. I know there's a few NFL and soccer people who like to troll the CFL but that's really greasy, especially at this time.

Judging by the poll below, is the NBA marginal? Where does that leave soccer? They don't even make the posted results.

Recent poll indicates two positive demographic trends for CFL
John Hodge 3downnation.com October 20, 2025

A poll from The Strategic Counsel earlier this year indicated that 58 percent of Canadians are fans of the NHL. The same survey found that 32 percent of Canadians were CFL fans behind the NFL (37 percent) and MLB (34 percent) and ahead of the NBA (29 percent).

[Calgarian]

Stop calling people trolls and saying they are spreading misinformation just because you disagree with them.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by Calgarian

Stop calling people trolls and saying they are spreading misinformation just because you disagree with them.

He is spreading misinformation which I constantly have to correct using sources other than me. You should speak, when it comes to trolling.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by EnvisionSaintJohn

I think the CPL will be a more popular league than the CFL

I have to give you credit for chutzpah. Just wondering where this growth will come from after seven years of the same.

Compare and contrast

Winnipeg Blue Bombers sell-out entire regular season 32,343 per game

CPL 2025 Attendance

[J.OT13]

PWHL not happy with Lansdowne 2.0's downsized arena. I think they'll end up playing in LeBreton Flats. 2.0's nearly $500 million project will just push out one of its major tenants.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottaw...park-9.6952279

[Ozabald]

Originally Posted by Calgarian

Pretty much this, also I think Buffalo and Detroit have say as well. I think the GTA should absolutely have another team, maybe 2! Hamilton came close when Balsille tried to but the Penguins then the Coyotes, but the league stepped in. If Greater NYC can have 3 team, then Toronto also should.

Detroit would have no say unless a second Ontario team was located in London; as there would be no territorial infringement with a second team in the GTA. A team in the eastern GTA would be far enough away from Buffalo's territory; though likely too far away from the larger population centres of the Horseshoe.

Mississauga would be an ideal location. There's lots of land with all the dead parking lots around Square One which could be developed into an arena/residential district. Easy highway access to the 403, there's a GO Station (bus) and Mississauga Transit hub at Square One; and soon to be LRT station. Plus, there's around 1.3M people in just Mississauga and Brampton alone. All that's missing currently is a suitable hotel; which obviously would be part of an arena development. Money talks and I'm sure if the price is right, the Leafs would be ok with a Mississauga team.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

PWHL not happy with Lansdowne 2.0's downsized arena. I think they'll end up playing in LeBreton Flats. 2.0's nearly $500 million project will just push out one of its major tenants.

I don't think they'll need to worry about it.

Season Team Home Games Avg Attendance

2023-24 PWHL Ottawa 12 7,496
2024-25 Ottawa Charge 11 6,969

[Calgarian]

What's going to happen to the Canadian Tire Centre? Could the Charge play there if it's going to sit empty?

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by elly63

I don't think they'll need to worry about it.

Season Team Home Games Avg Attendance

2023-24 PWHL Ottawa 12 7,496
2024-25 Ottawa Charge 11 6,969

That's an average. They sold out the 10k Civic Centre a few times.

Originally Posted by Calgarian

What's going to happen to the Canadian Tire Centre? Could the Charge play there if it's going to sit empty?

We don't know yet. The Sens haven't presented any plans. I doubt they'll keep it as an arena competing with LeBreton. The location remains a problem for sports.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

That's an average. They sold out the 10k Civic Centre a few times.

Last season the Charge's top attended game at TD Place Arena at Lansdowne park was 8,576. They also had home crowds of 8,424, 8,295, and 8,096 in the regular season, and drew crowds of 8,206, 8,011, and 7,282 in the playoffs. Overall, Ottawa's home attendance average, excluding playoff games was 6,888. If you add Ottawa's four home playoff games, the attendance average rises to 7,006.

So do they create ticket scarcity and play in the smaller arena or play in a half empty arena where people feel they can get tickets any time possibly creating apathy.

It also has to be questioned whether this relatively new found fascination with women's pro leagues continues. I followed and defended women's sports long before it became fashionable, I'm not convinced it is sustainable long term.

Like the CPL, I want it to succeed but I know history as well. Society has changed but it is also experiencing a backlash to that change. I have no evidence either way whether it will continue to be successful or if the new car smell will wear off. The PWHL numbers were similar to the CPL numbers and the question remains will men keep supporting it. See Bill Burr

[trolledbypro]

Originally Posted by EnvisionSaintJohn

If they're still going to be called the Expos, I think they should build the ballpark within Jean Drapeau Park, where Expo 67 was hosted... and bring back the expo express!



The Molson Brewery site could be a very interesting location for a ballpark, but is there room for one there with other developments planned for the site?

It comes down to ownership group, stadium financing and market viability. Unfortunately I haven't heard anything about Montréal having any luck with any of these 3 things. Do you think there's a chance of any public financing? Hopefully the silence is due to a bunch of NDAs.
This question is valid for Raleigh and Nashville too. Salt Lake and Portland have public money and ownership more or less figured out.