Canada Line | Completed

[SpongeG]

i took a pic but it didn't really show up - at YVR they put a sticker over the sign at the station - you can see a much larger one below the new one - why did they do that?

[lightrail]

Originally Posted by deasine

Like I said, it's slower for a variety of reasons:
1) Future Stn at 57th
2) It needs to make sure it gets to the destination in 25/26 minutes (terminus depending. I'm 100% sure the trains themselves are more than capable of getting there earlier, so it just doesn't speed up as much.
3) There are a lot more "hills" from Langara-49th to Bridgeport than 29th to Metrotown. I have to give it to you here that if LIM and Conventional Rail were put to the test in the exact conditions, LIM would win. Anyways, 29th to Metrotown are gradual hills vs the ones on the Canada Line.

But even so, the LIM can tackle grades much faster than conventional wheel traction, both accelerating and braking. With wheel traction, there's always the possibility of wheel slip and this is actually worse for lighter vehicles (less weight, equals less wheel traction). With LIM it doesn't matter - the magnets pull the train along and the wheels just guide the train.

[deasine]

Originally Posted by SpongeG

i took a pic but it didn't really show up - at YVR they put a sticker over the sign at the station - you can see a much larger one below the new one - why did they do that?

I mentioned this way past on my Inaugural Experiences post, but basically, YVR did the signage at the Airport and the one they used didn't match the ones by the Canada Line because the train icons were too close to the stn and all the proportions were just messed up.

Originally Posted by lightrail

But even so, the LIM can tackle grades much faster than conventional wheel traction, both accelerating and braking. With wheel traction, there's always the possibility of wheel slip and this is actually worse for lighter vehicles (less weight, equals less wheel traction). With LIM it doesn't matter - the magnets pull the train along and the wheels just guide the train.

Well there's no argument with that, but do we need to invest LIM on a line where it doesn't necessarily have to interline with the current SkyTrain? No. Really, LIM technology is expensive, and I would go for cheaper conventional rail when possible.

I'm not so worried about the ticket vending machine problem and not so sure why people are over reacting with it-it's new and almost all of the time, there is a problem with new things. The ticket machines on expo & Millennium Lines had there fair share of issues, just maybe not as big as problematic as the ones now. Either way, those aren't permanent, stationary items that will require lots of money to replace, not that we should be paying for them to be replaced anyway if they can't be fixed.

I would be concerned about our door problems with a few of the trains. When I was at the OMC today, I was in this conference room and the entire time, I was hearing the SkyTrain door closing chime for ten minutes, rather annoying mind you. Overhearing a few people in the control room, which is underwhelming (I would say a third of the size of the SkyTrain control room, maybe less), apparently, there are a few trains still with the door problems. At the train yard, they were opening and closing all the doors of the problem train for another ten minutes and there were technicians, three of which looked like they were from ROTEM Korea. This door problem, I don't think, is a small problem, because Hong Kong's MTR Tung Chung Line, which used trains by ROTEM, pulled trains out of service because of delays and door safety issues. There was a delay this morning (thankfully I wasn't caught in that) and the platform signs were flashing "Trains have been resumed to normal service. We apologize for the inconvenience this may have caused you," and I have a feeling it had something to do with the doors.

Anyways, as promised:

The problem train I believe (the RiverRock one)

Photography by Deasine - Hosted on Picasa Web Albums - Creative Commons Protected


Photography by Deasine - Hosted on Picasa Web Albums - Creative Commons Protected


Photography by Deasine - Hosted on Picasa Web Albums - Creative Commons Protected

I didn't actually notice this, but the OMC is really in the middle of no-where. Ironically, it's easier to drive to the OMC than to transit. However, the bike bridge was really close and I decided to walk on it on the way home from the OMC.


Photography by Deasine - Hosted on Picasa Web Albums - Creative Commons Protected


Photography by Deasine - Hosted on Picasa Web Albums - Creative Commons Protected


Photography by Deasine - Hosted on Picasa Web Albums - Creative Commons Protected

[lightrail]

Originally Posted by deasine

I mentioned this way past on my Inaugural Experiences post, but basically, YVR did the signage at the Airport and the one they used didn't match the ones by the Canada Line because the train icons were too close to the stn and all the proportions were just messed up.



Well there's no argument with that, but do we need to invest LIM on a line where it doesn't necessarily have to interline with the current SkyTrain? No. Really, LIM technology is expensive, and I would go for cheaper conventional rail when possible.

Expensive to install, but cheaper to maintain. The down time and maintenance cost for LIM skytrain is really very low as there's not much that can break or wear-out - no moving parts, expect the wheels. On conventional traction, there's a lot that needs maintaining. So, theoretically, Canada Line trains will cost more to maintain then Expo and Millennium. We'll get more kilometres between breakdowns and more years of service out of LIM then conventional traction - the MK1s are still running 24 years later with the original LIM systems.

We tend only to think of immediate costs and not the operation and maintenance when making political decisions on technology. Same with the buses - we could spend more on buying a Benz bus that will last30 to 40 years and be reliable, but instead we buy New Flyer that might last 20 years.

The more I think about it, the more I think the socreds where way ahead in thinking when it came to skytrain. Everything about it makes it work and the return on the initial investment is enormous - over $5 billion as a direct result of Skytrain.

[deasine]

Originally Posted by lightrail

Expensive to install, but cheaper to maintain. The down time and maintenance cost for LIM skytrain is really very low as there's not much that can break or wear-out - no moving parts, expect the wheels. On conventional traction, there's a lot that needs maintaining. So, theoretically, Canada Line trains will cost more to maintain then Expo and Millennium. We'll get more kilometres between breakdowns and more years of service out of LIM then conventional traction - the MK1s are still running 24 years later with the original LIM systems.

We tend only to think of immediate costs and not the operation and maintenance when making political decisions on technology. Same with the buses - we could spend more on buying a Benz bus that will last30 to 40 years and be reliable, but instead we buy New Flyer that might last 20 years.

The more I think about it, the more I think the socreds where way ahead in thinking when it came to skytrain. Everything about it makes it work and the return on the initial investment is enormous - over $5 billion as a direct result of Skytrain.

It will cost more definitely, but you have to see we only have certain amount of funds from the start. This project is different, but sometimes, it's a matter of whether we want to introduce infrastructure NOW or we use a different technology and do it LATER because of the cost.

The cost to maintain isn't by TransLink, but rather to ProTransBC wouldn't it?

[Waders]

An article at Metronews Ottawa http://www.metronews.ca/ottawa/comment/article/290741--envious-over-vancouver-s-light-rail-system

[lightrail]

Re door problem - I was on the River Rock train on day one and one door was making a loud bang before closing. Hopefully they're under warranty

[mr.x]

^ was it the same train that couldn't properly close one of its doors on opening day?

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by officedweller

Good point - like a hard drive spinning...

I got burned by the CC system last night (having used Tripsavers for my other trips). Three tries, two machines, didn't work for me. The lack of prompts is ridiculous. So I used a $20 for the trip, lordy, it was like winning the slots getting the change Can't they get it to dispense some bills?!

[lightrail]

From Canadian Architect

The Kasian designed YVR Airport Rapid Transit Station offers the world a window to the spectacular natural beauty of British Columbia.

He must mean the sea of cars in the parking lot and the concrete apron and runways and smell of jet fuel that is so British Columbia that you can see from the station platform.

As the starting point of the new Canada Line rapid transit route, the YVR Airport Station features the largest green wall in North America, sweeping west coast views, and a direct connection to the city of Vancouver.

“The YVR Airport Station is all about connections,” says Don Kasian, principal at Kasian Architecture, Design and Planning. “This will be one of the first impressions visitors get of British Columbia and Canada. The project takes every opportunity to get people to and from Vancouver quickly and safely, but also connects them emotionally to the city and the entire province.”

Wrapped in structural glass, the station platform reinforces visual connections between the land, sea, and sky of BC – the key elements that make up the Vancouver Airport Authority’s (YVR) thematic master plan. The $25-million YVR- Airport Station sits 18 metres off the ground straddling Grant McConachie Way, the main roadway in and out of YVR. From the platform, visitors can see across the main airport runways to the North Shore Mountains.

Humm - amazing feat, considering you're facing south on the platform and the North Shore Mountains are, surprisingly, north of the airport. Not to mention the bulk of the International Terminal blocks the view if you happen to look up while having your credit card rejected for the fifth time by the ticket machines.

On the north side of the building, connected to Chester Johnson Park, a 17-metre-high and 12-metre-wide green wall offers a living gateway for passengers entering the YVR Airport Station. Designed by landscape architect Randy Sharp, the wall is composed entirely of local flora, including bergenia, fern, common nana and white and green euonymus.

“The green wall helps YVR Airport Station tell a story that is entirely unique to the region,” says Kasian. “When the local plants in the wall bloom it will be an absolutely spectacular sight. Combined with views of the North Shore Mountains, the station reflects of the incredible natural beauty of BC.”

Bookending the YVR Airport Station are the airport’s main control tower and the “Link” international terminal expansion building, another of the many Kasian-designed pieces of YVR. Completed in 2007, the $125-million, six-storey, all-glass building connects Canada Line passengers to the airport’s main terminal. It includes a 40-foot-high Haida totem pole created by celebrated First Nations artist Don Yeoman, visual references to the northern lights, and a waterfall flowing over natural stonework.

http://www.canadianarchitect.com/issues/ISArticle.asp?aid=1000339197

[SpongeG]

Originally Posted by whatnext

I got burned by the CC system last night (having used Tripsavers for my other trips). Three tries, two machines, didn't work for me. The lack of prompts is ridiculous. So I used a $20 for the trip, lordy, it was like winning the slots getting the change Can't they get it to dispense some bills?!

did u look at the pad or the screen? when my friend tried it we waited and waited for the screen to do something and nothing finally we noticed the pad was like purchase ok or something

not helpful at all

[SpongeG]

Originally Posted by lightrail

From Canadian Architect



He must mean the sea of cars in the parking lot and the concrete apron and runways and smell of jet fuel that is so British Columbia that you can see from the station platform.



Humm - amazing feat, considering you're facing south on the platform and the North Shore Mountains are, surprisingly, north of the airport. Not to mention the bulk of the International Terminal blocks the view if you happen to look up while having your credit card rejected for the fifth time by the ticket machines.



http://www.canadianarchitect.com/issues/ISArticle.asp?aid=1000339197

when you walk from the building to the station - assuming you use the link path - you get a great view of the mountains - its pretty awe inspiring i must say

[mr.x]

Originally Posted by deasine

I mentioned this way past on my Inaugural Experiences post, but basically, YVR did the signage at the Airport and the one they used didn't match the ones by the Canada Line because the train icons were too close to the stn and all the proportions were just messed up.



Well there's no argument with that, but do we need to invest LIM on a line where it doesn't necessarily have to interline with the current SkyTrain? No. Really, LIM technology is expensive, and I would go for cheaper conventional rail when possible.

I'm not so worried about the ticket vending machine problem and not so sure why people are over reacting with it-it's new and almost all of the time, there is a problem with new things. The ticket machines on expo & Millennium Lines had there fair share of issues, just maybe not as big as problematic as the ones now. Either way, those aren't permanent, stationary items that will require lots of money to replace, not that we should be paying for them to be replaced anyway if they can't be fixed.

I would be concerned about our door problems with a few of the trains. When I was at the OMC today, I was in this conference room and the entire time, I was hearing the SkyTrain door closing chime for ten minutes, rather annoying mind you. Overhearing a few people in the control room, which is underwhelming (I would say a third of the size of the SkyTrain control room, maybe less), apparently, there are a few trains still with the door problems. At the train yard, they were opening and closing all the doors of the problem train for another ten minutes and there were technicians, three of which looked like they were from ROTEM Korea. This door problem, I don't think, is a small problem, because Hong Kong's MTR Tung Chung Line, which used trains by ROTEM, pulled trains out of service because of delays and door safety issues. There was a delay this morning (thankfully I wasn't caught in that) and the platform signs were flashing "Trains have been resumed to normal service. We apologize for the inconvenience this may have caused you," and I have a feeling it had something to do with the doors.

Well, that can't be good at all. It does sound like quite a serious problem.

This is from Wikipedia:

"Hong Kong's MTR ROTEM K-Stock trains have come under criticism when it was first put into service due to delays and door safety issues. There have been incidents where passengers have been injured by its doors and other service reliability issues have led to MTRCL "minimising the number of Korean trains for passenger service until a higher reliability of the systems concerned is achieved".



BTW, how did you get an OMC tour? :p

[BCPhil]

http://www.ctvbc.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local...090825/20090825/?hub=BritishColumbiaHome

Ticket machines flummox some Canada Line riders
Updated: Tue Aug. 25 2009 20:47:54
ctvbc.ca

The new Canada Line is the most expensive infrastructure project in B.C. history. But it seems the people who built it forgot to include something pretty basic -- a set of instructions for people trying to buy a ticket, especially with a credit card.

The new ticket dispensers are designed to read chip cards. So the days of the quick swipe are gone.

Some ticket buyers are finding the machines a challenge to use.

Anthony Dioniga considers himself a pretty tech-savvy guy. But on Tuesday, he struggled to get a ticket for the Canada Line.

"I couldn't figure that out," he laughed.

Turns out, if you pull out your credit card before a yellow light goes on, it's no good.

Ditto if you leave the card in the slot too long.

TransLink officials stand by the machines.

"Are there better machines out there? My understanding is we went with the ones that can read the chip technology," said spokesman Drew Snider.

But, he adds, clearer instructions are on their way.

With files from CTV British Columbia's St John Alexander

I also consider myself a tech-savvy guy (I'm trouble shooting a blown Motherboard right now). It took me at least 3 times to figure the machines. And I was using a chip card.

Why does it mater when you pull out a chip card? It is supposed to be reading the chip, not the stripe.

[GeeCee]

Chip cards require you to enter a PIN instead of signing. I'm not sure what the case is with low dollar value transactions (you might notice that you no longer need to sign for credit card transactions at some retailers such as fast food, etc, if the total transaction is under a certain amount), but the proper procedure is to insert the card with the chip, enter your PIN, and then remove the card when prompted to do so (after authorization is received).

Visa's instructions: http://www.visa.ca/chip/cardholders/howtouseachipcard/

That being said, I used a chip credit card as the machines at Waterfront would not accept my debit card and it did not prompt me to enter my PIN. The credit card still has a magstripe though, so I'm not sure if the transaction was processed through the chip or through the magstripe. My regular magstripe-only credit card wouldn't work either and an attendant was nowhere ot be found.

[Distill3d]

^my girlfriend had the same issue at YVR last night as we were getting on the train. She couldn't use her MasterCard that doesn't have the chip and PIN, nor would it accept my American Express that did (doesn't surprise me there...), luckily the attendant was there to hand her a transfer that was good for 3 hours.

[GeeCee]

Originally Posted by Distill3d

luckily the attendant was there to hand her a transfer that was good for 3 hours.

The transit fairy!!

[twoNeurons]

Those machines are retarded. The lack of a cash button, while good should be indicated on the screen ( "Deposit Cash or choose an option below" )

The onscreen buttons give no feedback. On current machines, when you press a button, it depresses, letting you know where you hit. The new ones just change the screen.

Not only that, but I couldn't figure out the credit card thing. We're all pretty savvy here, and we know how it works even and we're having trouble. Time to go back to the drawing board with that one.

It SCREAMS of a complete lack of user testing.

[Mac Write]

Here is Translinks How To video on how to use the new TVM's and how they work with no problems.
• Video Link

[GeeCee]

Great, all they need to do now is post that video on the machines.