Stadiums and Arenas of Canada part 2

[Corndogger]

Originally Posted by Berklon

When I say "blow it up", I don't really mean do a complete tear-down. I'm aware of the issues surrounding the stadium and other dependencies. Basically, I'm saying to bring it down to the lowest possible form so that it no longer resembles a stadium. Turn it into something that actually generates revenue for the city and is useful.

The amount of money spent on this stadium is absurd. Even with a packed house, the atmosphere for football, soccer and baseball is horrible. It's just not worth saving.

How desirable is the area for developers? Maybe the best thing to do would be to tear down the stadium, lease the land for development, and build a new stadium elsewhere. If there's a subway station there you'd think the area would be highly desirable for office and/or residential development.

[Migs]

Some images from last nights closing ceremonies for Taylor Field/Mosaic Stadium in Regina. What an event for a truly Canadiana facility.


















Images via Riders, TSN, & Johani Jutrus

The whole closing event is available here in HD

http://www.riderville.com/2016/10/29/thank-you-rider-nation-2/

[VIce]

Originally Posted by Migs

Is the lens choice really distorting the jets there? Those don't look much like CF-18s. Or did the Air Force send some trainers/Snowbirds?

[Migs]

Originally Posted by VIce

Is the lens choice really distorting the jets there? Those don't look much like CF-18s. Or did the Air Force send some trainers/Snowbirds?

There were 2 flypasts. The first one (pictured here) are Hawk jets from Moose Jaw. The 2nd fly past was the Snowbirds.

[EpicPonyTime]

Originally Posted by VIce

Is the lens choice really distorting the jets there? Those don't look much like CF-18s. Or did the Air Force send some trainers/Snowbirds?

There were two flybys, right after the anthem and then another a few minutes after that. I am not certain about what type the first flyby was (this looks like a photo of the first), but the second was definitely the Snowbirds, so it's possible the first one was as well.

EDIT: Welp, Migs beat me to it by a minute.

[EpicPonyTime]

Originally Posted by Corndogger

How desirable is the area for developers? Maybe the best thing to do would be to tear down the stadium, lease the land for development, and build a new stadium elsewhere. If there's a subway station there you'd think the area would be highly desirable for office and/or residential development.

I don't think there is a chance Montreal would turn the land over to developers. It's the legacy project from the Olympics. The aquatic centre and Tower have to be considered part of the same building as the stadium and right next door you have the Biodome, Stade Saputo and the gardens. I can't see an effort to redevelop the stadium site which wouldn't inevitably call into question the entire Olympic Park, which poor reputation of the games aside is a great addition to Montreal.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by EpicPonyTime

I don't think there is a chance Montreal would turn the land over to developers. It's the legacy project from the Olympics. The aquatic centre and Tower have to be considered part of the same building as the stadium and right next door you have the Biodome, Stade Saputo and the gardens. I can't see an effort to redevelop the stadium site which wouldn't inevitably call into question the entire Olympic Park, which poor reputation of the games aside is a great addition to Montreal.

The Montreal games don't have a poor rep per se worldwide, and had many memorable characters: Nadia Comaneci, Bruce Jenner, Sugar Ray Leonard, etc.

I've also never heard anything negative about the sporting/event organization either.

It's really just the construction program for the facilities that was extremely bad. Admittedly this is not a small deal but the bad rep is mostly limited to Quebec/Canada.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by Acajack

The Montreal games don't have a poor rep ùper se worldwide, and had many memorable characters: Nadia Comaneci, Bruce Jenner, Sugar Ray Leonard, etc. I've also never heard anything negative about the sporting/event organization either. It's really just the construction program for the facilities that was extremely bad. Admittedly this is not a small deal but the bad rep is mostly limited to Quebec/Canada.

You speak the truth. After the massacre of 72 some people wondered if there would be another Olympics, aside from what you stated Montreal did well. And the financial issues were lessons well learned for Los Angeles and later Calgary, so in some ways Montreal saved the Olympic movement.

[Coldrsx]

Great shots from TF, truly a hallowed place.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by Acajack

The Montreal games don't have a poor rep per se worldwide, and had many memorable characters: Nadia Comaneci, Bruce Jenner, Sugar Ray Leonard, etc.

If anyone is interested here are the official Olympic reports on the Montreal Games. Very interesting reading with a fair amount of photos from the times and listings of all participants, venues, etc.

Olympic Official Report Montreal 1976 Volume One Part 1
Olympic Official Report Montreal 1976 Volume One Part 2
Olympic Official Report Montreal 1976 Volume Two
Olympic Official Report Montreal 1976 Volume Three

[esquire]

Originally Posted by elly63

The Olympic Stadium Fact or Fiction

Surely you recognize the self-serving nature of these "facts" propogated by the bureaucracy where everyone makes a living from the continued existence of Olympic Stadium.

If there was a government agency whose entire function was to burn mounds of $50 bills in old oil drums, you can bet that they too would have a press release explaining how vitally important their role was.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by esquire

If there was a government agency whose entire function was to burn mounds of $50 bills in old oil drums, you can bet that they too would have a press release explaining how vitally important their role was.

I have a friend who is number 2 at a large government agency. He is accountable for every penny he spends from the price of plane tickets and hotels for business trips to buying a pack of gum. The idea of pissing money into the wind without accountability is another myth, that's why we hear when there are abuses.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by elly63

If anyone is interested here are the official Olympic reports on the Montreal Games. Very interesting reading with a fair amount of photos from the times and listings of all participants, venues, etc.

Olympic Official Report Montreal 1976 Volume One Part 1
Olympic Official Report Montreal 1976 Volume One Part 2
Olympic Official Report Montreal 1976 Volume Two
Olympic Official Report Montreal 1976 Volume Three

My dad had lots of fun at the Vieux-Munich that summer.

[Chorduroy]

Getting back to the Heritage Classic in Winnipeg for a second, 2 issues I see:

1.) WAY too early in the season for an outdoor game. Although, I'm sure the spectators appreciated not being in -30. But that absolutely affects interest levels.

2.) CFL stadiums are too big for hockey. It just looks clunky with such a tiny footprint. That's why the Big House (and other American fields) looked "better" - spectators are closer to the ice. I still think outdoor games look goofy though, no matter what stadium is used. Wish they'd do away with them.

Pete Blackburn is a sh*t disturber at the best of times. I wouldn't take too much of what he said about IGF or the CFL in general too seriously.

[red-paladin]

Is it actually true that the football / soccer atmosphere in the Olympic stadium is hopeless? Or is it something that is propagated by people that have never been there? I understand that baseball is problematic because the balls can hit the roof.

[Peter North]

Originally Posted by red-paladin

Is it actually true that the football / soccer atmosphere in the Olympic stadium is hopeless? Or is it something that is propagated by people that have never been there? I understand that baseball is problematic because the balls can hit the roof.

The more empty seats, the worse the atmosphere. And vice versa. That goes for any sport. That's why Commonwealth and BC Place are such poor CFL facilities. They are severely oversized for their primary tenants. I'm sure Olympic Stadium is a great place to watch any game ... when it's full.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by red-paladin

Is it actually true that the football / soccer atmosphere in the Olympic stadium is hopeless? Or is it something that is propagated by people that have never been there? I understand that baseball is problematic because the balls can hit the roof.

I don't think so. I've been to tons of events there (baseball, football, soccer, concerts) and there is nothing wrong with the atmosphere when there is a good crowd.

There are similar stadiums in Europe like Parc des Princes in Paris, Olimpico in Rome, or Olympiastadion in Berlin, and they seem to be OK. The difference is probably that home clubs there all draw 40,000+ to most of their matches, whereas both of Montreal's teams (Alouettes, Impact) average about half that. The Big O is fine with 40,000 people in the stands, and even acceptable with crowds just under 30,000.

When I think about it, Commonwealth in Edmonton isn't that different either. But the Eskimons consistently draw 30,000 or more on average. It gives a decent atmosphere most of the time, although the more it's full, the better it feels.

It wasn't actually that bad a baseball stadium either when there were at least 25-30,000 in the stands. Of course, almost all of the stadiums of its kind (multi-purpose) in MLB have been replaced. There used to be ton: Veterans, Busch, Riverfront, Astrodome, Three Rivers, etc.

[Barnes]

Originally Posted by red-paladin

Is it actually true that the football / soccer atmosphere in the Olympic stadium is hopeless? Or is it something that is propagated by people that have never been there? I understand that baseball is problematic because the balls can hit the roof.

I wouldn't say it's hopeless. It's not ideal because of how the stadium was reconfigured to be better for baseball but even then, it's not bad. The playing surface was terrible but that could be addressed by pouring more money into better field turf.

It's a huge stadium and doesn't do as well with smaller crowds I guess you could argue. The upper deck is high as there are the loges and those weird sections with the red seats between the the two main decks. When it's not full, atmosphere can suffer.

I used to work for the Expos and can't recall a ball hitting the roof. It's probably happened but it wasn't am epidemic. Speakers off a foul occasionally and Henry Rodriguez and Darryl Strawberry have both hit homers off the concrete ring.

[GlassCity]

Originally Posted by Peter North

The more empty seats, the worse the atmosphere. And vice versa. That goes for any sport. That's why Commonwealth and BC Place are such poor CFL facilities. They are severely oversized for their primary tenants. I'm sure Olympic Stadium is a great place to watch any game ... when it's full.

BC Place's atmosphere isn't bad because it's too big, it's because Vancouver fans are generally quieter and sit on their hands for all but the most intense moments of a game. I can tell you that big games with 35,000 people in the stands have plenty of atmosphere and the empty seats don't make much of an impact. I'm sure Commonwealth is the same. I hate this defeatist attitude to our stadiums.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Barnes

I wouldn't say it's hopeless. It's not ideal because of how the stadium was reconfigured to be better for baseball but even then, it's not bad. The playing surface was terrible but that could be addressed by pouring more money into better field turf.

It's a huge stadium and doesn't do as well with smaller crowds I guess you could argue. The upper deck is high as there are the loges and those weird sections with the red seats between the the two main decks. When it's not full, atmosphere can suffer.

I used to work for the Expos and can't recall a ball hitting the roof. It's probably happened but it wasn't am epidemic. Speakers off a foul occasionally and Henry Rodriguez and Darryl Strawberry have both hit homers off the concrete ring.

I've never worked for the Expos but used to follow them very closely. I remember those homers, the balls off the speakers, and also Willie Stargell's homer that basically hit the furthest seat of the very top row of the stadium.

I can't recall a ball being hit straight up and hitting the roof however.