Immigration levels

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by chowhou

- snip -

Your point? Mine still stands.

[chowhou]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

Your point?

The point is that if the building requirements get stricter every four years, a company that builds prefabricated construction materials is kneecapped, as their product may become illegal to use in four years.The entire point of a prefabricated construction industry is that a standardized set of prefabricated materials can be used by projects to rapidly build structures and manufacturing prefabricated materials can be cheaper than doing custom builds due to the economy of scale. As soon as the pre-fab company loses the benefit of the economy of scale due to having to redesign and retool every four years, that all goes out the window.

But that's all neoliberal dogwater, don't pollute your brain with economics. Someone once told you that deregulation was a right wing idea, so it must be bad. Don't forget that!

Mine still stands.

Your point was that developers are building anyway. I guess you love the status quo. Housing right now is perfect, you're right, let's not change a thing.

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by chowhou

(more rhetoric)

Your point was that developers are building anyway. I guess you love the status quo. Housing right now is perfect, you're right, let's not change a thing.

The point is that you got tripped up over sorting out the difference between prefabs and standardized modular homes and still don't have any more concrete examples of the building code needlessly holding back construction. All we're doing is slinging prose at each other - should I put you on the record as being pro-earthquake?

If I loved the status quo, I wouldn't be celebrating our biggest construction boom in history (Canada in general peaked in '76, but last year was BC's largest ever). You want to trade one problem for several more in order to get an even bigger boom, that's on you.

[chowhou]

Interesting projection.

Once again, if you're content to have equal construction starts to a time when we had half the population, not to mention that back then there was far more greenfield development than today, I guess I can't argue with that.

[Migrant_Coconut]

The country in general is back to '76 levels of starts, no thanks to Eastern Canada. BC is building more than it ever has, and (at the current rate) will likely double that in the next ten years, all without devolving the building code or going into the ALR. Rome wasn't built in a day.

[chowhou]

Do you know that it means when the population doubles but housing starts only go up 30%? I'll leave you to try to figure out whether that means more or fewer homes per person.

You sound like a conservative NIMBY. What we're doing is fine. I'm fine. Why change?

[Migrant_Coconut]

Which is a large part of why we're in the housing crisis, and why we're on track to increase housing starts to 2-3x above '76 by the next decade. Still not seeing the need to roll back fifty years' worth of earthquake safety standards, TYVM.

Call me whatever you want - "build first, ask questions later" has worked out very poorly for the PRC (that's not a race thing, that's an example of piss-poor high-quantity deregulated construction).

[dreambrother808]

A majority of Canadians say the country should accept fewer immigrants in 2025 than it did in 2024, with nearly three-quarters saying immigration should be reduced until housing becomes more affordable, according to a Nanos survey for CTV News.

https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/most...rvey-1.7044594

[AlessioSBT]

Originally Posted by chowhou

Likewise, this is just a way to rationalize why your solution is better than anyone else's. You're a victim of the same mentality you're criticising. You're saying, "A is a problem that the government is not fixing. B is a problem that the government is not fixing. I don't feel like the government will change A, so they must change B!". This is the same argument that rent control advocates make, "We're not going to help reduce rents otherwise, so we might as well have rent control. Who cares if it disincentives construction of new rentals, they're illegal to build anyway!"

Sure, we could have the government enact your policy and reduce immigration levels (and the Canadian economy), or we could have the government enact policy to handle the housing crisis by deregulating the over regulated housing and construction sector.

I, for one, will continue to push for policy that helps all Canadians regardless of immigration rates.

?
I don't feel anything, the government at this moment did not fixed the housing problem.
I am talking about reality right now, you are talking about hypothetical situations and opinions.

Again, that's not how reality works.

There's no reason why one more person should enter in the country until we have a house ready and available for that person. At this moment that house doesn't exist.

[chowhou]

Originally Posted by AlessioSBT

?
I don't feel anything, the government at this moment did not fixed the housing problem.
I am talking about reality right now, you are talking about hypothetical situations and opinions.

Again, that's not how reality works.

There's no reason why one more person should enter in the country until we have a house ready and available for that person. At this moment that house doesn't exist.

You're the one not talking about reality, because clearly all these immigrants coming to Canada are not finding themselves out on the street and are finding housing somewhere. Reality is not as simple as what you're talking about.

[AlessioSBT]

Originally Posted by chowhou

You're the one not talking about reality, because clearly all these immigrants coming to Canada are not finding themselves out on the street and are finding housing somewhere. Reality is not as simple as what you're talking about.

They are not.
They are living in 10 in a 2bedroom. In Brampton they found 20/30 people in one basement.

The reality is really simple and there's nothing to discuss about it, it's full of numbers everywhere, the entire country is talking about the housing crisis, literally every single news in the last few years is about the housing crisis,. It's a fact, it's not an opinion and it's not a discussion.

The solutions on the other hand are not simple and definitely need discussions.

[chowhou]

Originally Posted by AlessioSBT

They are not.
They are living in 10 in a 2bedroom.

The reality is really simple and there's nothing to discuss about it, it's full of numbers everywhere, the solutions are not simple and definitely need discussions.

I have no idea why we are trying to negate reality in this discussion.

Correct, so in other words, housing does exist for the immigrants coming to Canada, but housing demand seems to be rising faster than supply is. It sounds like we both agree on the reality there.

So why not advocate for supply? It's not like we're deporting the existing immigrants anyway... demand is never going down now.

[AlessioSBT]

Originally Posted by chowhou

Correct, so in other words, housing does exist for the immigrants coming to Canada, but housing demand seems to be rising faster than supply is. It sounds like we both agree on the reality there.

So why not advocate for supply? It's not like we're deporting the existing immigrants anyway... demand is never going down now.

25 people in a basement is "housing does exist"?
https://nowtoronto.com/news/weve-see...-more-housing/

[chowhou]

Originally Posted by AlessioSBT

20 people in a basement is "housing does exist"?

Yes. Why does that bother you? It's not you living there. You're of course taking the most extreme case but it's still permanent housing.

SROs are housing, rooming houses are housing, living with roommates is housing, not everyone has to be living alone in their own private 3000sqft residence.

[AlessioSBT]

Originally Posted by chowhou

Yes. Why does that bother you? It's not you living there. You're of course taking the most extreme case but it's still permanent housing.

SROs are housing, rooming houses are housing, living with roommates is housing, not everyone has to be living in their own private 3000sqft residence.

And after this comment i'd say there's no need for more discussions. The level of entitlement of someone saying "i don't care of the situations of others, i'm good and therefore the problem doens't exist" is off the charts.

You basically said that reality is only things that affect you. Like, i don't even know how to discuss with this base. But at least for me i don't think it's possible to discuss, so all good i guess.

[chowhou]

Originally Posted by AlessioSBT

And after this comment i'd say there's no need for more discussions. The level of entitlement of someone saying "i don't care of the situations of others, i'm good and therefore the problem doens't exist" is off the charts.

You basically said that reality is only things that affect you. Like, i don't even know how to discuss with this base.

To be clear, your solution to people living 25 to a basement is, "I don't care about their situation, let's just not add more."

I am pro-housing choices. I don't look down upon people living in cheaper housing options that I would not choose to live in. I want there to be greater housing supply in this country, but not all of that supply is going to be supply that I'll want to live in.

Why does it bother you if people live in cheap rooming houses?

[AlessioSBT]

Originally Posted by chowhou

To be clear, your solution to people living 25 to a basement is, "I don't care about their situation, let's just not add more."

Maybe i skipped the math class. In what universe when you have 25 people in a basement adding more people is not worst then not adding more people?

[chowhou]

Originally Posted by AlessioSBT

Maybe i skipped the math class. In what universe when you have 25 people in a basement adding more people is not worst then not adding more people?

Correct, I'm not sure what class you skipped but you are saying that 25 is bad, yet you have no solution to reduce that number.

I'll say it again, why does it bother you that rooming houses exist?

[AlessioSBT]

Originally Posted by chowhou

To be clear, your solution to people living 25 to a basement is, "I don't care about their situation, let's just not add more."

I am pro-housing choices. I don't look down upon people living in cheaper housing options that I would not choose to live in. I want there to be greater housing supply in this country, but not all of that supply is going to be supply that I'll want to live in.

Why does it bother you if people live in cheap rooming houses?

LOL "option"
Ah yes, now i understand. You think that those 25 people chose to live in 25 there. The disconnection with reality is even worst than i thought.
Do you realize that is literally illegal to live in 25 tin a basement yes?

[chowhou]

Originally Posted by AlessioSBT

LOL "option"
Ah yes, now i understand. You think that those 25 people chose to live in 25 there. The disconnection with reality is even worst than i thought.

This is not what an option means. Please get off your high horse.

SROs are a housing option.

Rooming houses are a housing option.

Studio apartments are a housing option.

Mansions are a housing option.

This is basic housing policy.

Do you realize that is literally illegal to live in 25 tin a basement yes?

Thank god we make so many forms of housing illegal in this country.