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  #61  
Old Posted Aug 2, 2024, 3:20 AM
rdaner rdaner is offline
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Also rental buildings are much slower to fill than a condo building. Don’t know why.
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  #62  
Old Posted Aug 2, 2024, 9:53 AM
sailor734 sailor734 is offline
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Originally Posted by rdaner View Post
Also rental buildings are much slower to fill than a condo building. Don’t know why.
Many condo projects are largely pre-sold. A significant number of units are sold with deposits placed before construction even begins. ....I don't think there is a similar legal process for "pre-renting" apartments that are yet to be built.

I know Fundy Quay claims to have a waiting list of 300 but that may be just expressions of interest rather than a contractual commitment like a condo presale.
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  #63  
Old Posted Aug 2, 2024, 10:41 AM
DyAm00394 DyAm00394 is offline
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Project Card is posted on CCD Canada. Says slated to begin in October 2024.

Quote:
“Starting Date (estimated): 2024-10
Location: MONCTON (NB)
Size: $19,600,000.00
Stage: 3-Planning or drawing
Published: 2024-08-02
Last Update: 2024-08-02

Work type: New construction
Sector: Private
Category: 4-Residential
Subcategorie: 4B-Residential Development
Disciplines: Architecture, Civil, Electricity, Equipment, HVAC, Building mechanic, Structural, Other

DESCRIPTION:

NEW MIXED-USE RESIDENTIAL BUILDING

Located in Moncton, this project (Tours Gateway, Tour 1, Tower 1) estimated at $19 600 000 is in the planning stage. It is slated to begin in October 2024. Based on a surface spread over 17 floors, works concern the construction of a multi-unit residential building with commercial space, as part of the Gateway project.”
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  #64  
Old Posted Aug 2, 2024, 11:03 AM
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This confirms Gateway will be built in stages, just like the Three Sisters.
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  #65  
Old Posted Aug 2, 2024, 11:38 AM
sailor734 sailor734 is offline
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Originally Posted by MonctonRad View Post


This confirms Gateway will be built in stages, just like the Three Sisters.
I'm sure this makes financial sense....moving different crews and equipment from one build to the next as they proceed through the various stages. Almost an assembly line approach.
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  #66  
Old Posted Aug 2, 2024, 12:32 PM
new kid in town new kid in town is offline
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I love this project and developer for actually pushing through with efficiency. Makes for a nice cluster of high-rises, especially in an area outside of main street.
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  #67  
Old Posted Aug 2, 2024, 12:59 PM
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WhipperSnapper WhipperSnapper is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rdaner View Post
Also rental buildings are much slower to fill than a condo building. Don’t know why.
They do indeed. 70% leased or better is a good number however, there's another 150 units that will become available in the next couple of months and another 150 units in a year from now. Two thirds of the project remains undelivered with tower 1 fully leased . With good lease numbers for tower 2, I can then see Gateway starting in the spring than this speculatory October start presented by the developer. That's purely on leasing than the complexities of the capital invested in the Three Sisters and how to get it out if the developer isn't already a proxy for a large pension fund.
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  #68  
Old Posted Aug 2, 2024, 1:11 PM
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Originally Posted by WhipperSnapper View Post
if the developer isn't already a proxy for a large pension fund.
This is an interesting thought.

Lafford is an exceptional developer with a very good track record, but, his current projects are an order of magnitude greater in scale than his previous work. Between the Three Sisters and Gateway, that's close to $100M in development costs. I imagine he must have an angel investor of some kind.
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  #69  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2024, 1:22 PM
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Uh oh.............

Social activist opposes construction of 17-storey towers
Social activist calls for moratorium on development to study environmental and social impact of proposed 17-storey apartment buildings on waterfront
Author of the article:Alan Cochrane
Published Aug 07, 2024 • Last updated 19 hours ago • 3 minute read
https://tj.news/moncton-miramichi/so...-storey-towers (paywall)

Quote:
A group of citizens headed by social activist Jean-Claude Basque is calling on the City of Moncton to put a moratorium on the proposed downtown Gateway project – twin 17-storey apartment buildings along the waterfront – and carry out an environmental and social impact study.

In a news release Wednesday, Basque said the area along the trail is highly vulnerable to flooding and the proposed twin towers would interfere with the network of green spaces along the Petitcodiac River.

“It is a jewel not only for the citizens of Moncton but for all citizens of the region. It must be protected, and it must remain public. It must be expanded rather than be shrunk,” said Basque, who was spokesperson for the Common Front for Social Justice for more than 20 years.


The wing-nuts are starting to crawl out of the woodwork. Hopefully city council will ignore him, but this guy is an experienced social justice activist. He could give them a whole lot of grief...........
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  #70  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2024, 1:38 PM
adamuptownsj adamuptownsj is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MonctonRad View Post
Uh oh.............

Social activist opposes construction of 17-storey towers
Social activist calls for moratorium on development to study environmental and social impact of proposed 17-storey apartment buildings on waterfront

The wing-nuts are starting to crawl out of the woodwork. Hopefully city council will ignore him, but this guy is an experienced social justice activist. He could give them a whole lot of grief...........
Bury him in the foundation for good luck.
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  #71  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2024, 1:49 PM
jnaygull jnaygull is offline
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Let's hope that this gets dismissed quickly. I believe the densification of our downtown is much more environmentally friendly, and socially, our area desperately needs housing.
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  #72  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2024, 2:13 PM
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We should post guards to make sure he doesn't plant any tomatoes along the property line adjacent to the Hal Betts Sportsplex.
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  #73  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2024, 2:47 PM
jonny golden jonny golden is offline
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In a news release Wednesday, Basque said the area along the trail is highly vulnerable to flooding and the proposed twin towers would interfere with the network of green spaces along the Petitcodiac River.
Really? I guess that's why Moncton has invested so much public money into the river front. They moved Treitz Haus literally right on the river bank! There's condo buildings etc. and flooding has never been an issue. He loses a lot of credibility with this statement.

There's no way the city will interfere with Mr. Lafford's plans.
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  #74  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2024, 2:57 PM
adamuptownsj adamuptownsj is offline
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I missed his comment demanding a PUBLIC TENDER for the purchase of a scrubland brownfield ditch between the warehouse and the ballfields.
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  #75  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2024, 3:05 PM
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Originally Posted by adamuptownsj View Post
I missed his comment demanding a PUBLIC TENDER for the purchase of a scrubland brownfield ditch between the warehouse and the ballfields.
As I said, this fellow is an experienced social justice activist, and therefore skilled in legal disruptive and obstructionist processes. He also has media on speed dial, and numerous contacts with a number of other other social justice activists and organizations. This could get very bad.

Unfortunately Lafford and the city will have to tread very carefully.

In retrospect, they should have expedited the whole process (land sale, public consultations, rezoning and approval) and completed the whole damned thing within two weeks rather than let things drag out all summer. This has just given the SJWs time to organize.
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Last edited by MonctonRad; Aug 8, 2024 at 3:18 PM.
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  #76  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2024, 3:18 PM
SevenSquared SevenSquared is offline
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I know quite a few people who were previously very supportive of the work done by Basque's group who are absolutely livid about this. Talk about setting fire to your group's credibility.

This is, unfortunately, NB activism in a nutshell. Many of those who run these organizations are absolutely awful at knowing how to pick their battles, incapable of reading the room.

Didn't see Basque complaining when low and medium density housing was being built in similar topography on the outskirts of the area over the last few decades. But now that a serious developer is moving ahead with a high-profile project in a more urban, walkable (read: environmentally sustainable) part of the city, the guy suddenly has an issue with it vaguely citing - of all things - environmental concerns.

Give me a break.
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  #77  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2024, 3:55 PM
SevenSquared SevenSquared is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MonctonRad View Post
As I said, this fellow is an experienced social justice activist, and therefore skilled in legal disruptive and obstructionist processes. He also has media on speed dial, and numerous contacts with a number of other other social justice activists and organizations. This could get very bad.
Overwhelmingly, those who oppose these types of developments in Moncton are the furthest thing one can be from "SJW" types. Especially in this city.

I'm fairly certain Basque has received plenty of backlash from allies and supporters over this, and I'm hopeful he will pivot and focus his energy towards the actual root causes of housing affordability and accessibility issues. That "DONATION" button on the NBCFSJ website will undoubtedly get a whole lot less action if he doesn't change course.
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  #78  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2024, 4:02 PM
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Originally Posted by SevenSquared View Post
That "DONATION" button on the NBCFSJ website will undoubtedly get a whole lot less action if he doesn't change course.
One can only hope.

Thanks for your input.

As an experienced social activist, he could still make trouble for this prestige riverfront development. He has the contacts and the organizational capabilities. But, as you say, if he follows through, he may substantially impair his abilities for private fundraising from the corporate sector, and, he would probably find that the city is suddenly less cooperative with his entreaties as well. He could really shoot himself in the foot. Let's all hope he has sober second thoughts, and returns to his day job of advocating for socially inclusive housing.
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Last edited by MonctonRad; Aug 8, 2024 at 4:14 PM.
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  #79  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2024, 5:15 PM
DyAm00394 DyAm00394 is offline
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New CBC article about the opposition: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-b...erns-1.7287564
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  #80  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2024, 5:35 PM
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Originally Posted by DyAm00394 View Post
New CBC article about the opposition: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-b...erns-1.7287564
Quote:
a group of local residents is calling for a moratorium so that an environmental and social study can be completed.

Thirty-four people signed a petition on the issue that was sent to the city on Wednesday. One of them was Omer Chouinard.

Chouinard, a retired environmental studies professor at l'Université de Moncton, said the site should be used to expand the area's green space — not reduce it.

"It was sold with no consultation of the public," he said in an interview. "It's a natural environment and cultural environment that you have to protect."
Quote:
Along with the petition, the citizen group sent a 10-page document outlining the issues they have with the project, including flooding risk and public safety, urban densification by a small number of companies and environmental protection.
Quote:
They point out that a 2017 report said the space south of Assomption would remain public. The group believes access to the Petitcodiac River is "a vested right that must not be infringed."

(City councillor Charles) Leger on the other hand said the city is staying true to its intent for the land that was most recently outlined in the municipal plan.

"What's more important, I think at least for me, is taking a look at what the project looked like," he said about renderings that were provided to the city.

"I'm the first to say that we should certainly limit buildings that block the sight lines to the river," Leger said.

"This particular project is interesting because it lines up with Foundry [Street] so it'll be, in some ways, an extension of the street leading right to the riverfront."
Quote:
Leger said the Gateway Towers design, which allows the general public to access the riverfront, was "one of the biggest requirements from staff to the developer, and also from council."

For a developer to gain access to zoning permits, Leger said there are certain environmental criteria it needs to meet first.

He said it's during this process that most of the concerns being raised by the group will be assessed.
In essence, the fight is over the stub of Foundry Street extending southward from Assumption Blvd, as well as the adjacent wooded ditch that the city recently sold to JN Lafford.

You can see the land in question in this photo from the CBC article:



Quote:
City council is set to vote on rezoning the land on Aug. 19 after the builder presents plans and renderings for the site, according to Leger.

If the project moves forward, it will be reviewed by the city's planning advisory committee, which is made up of volunteers appointed by city council who approve certain development applications.

Leger said the public will get a chance to address council in person with any comments or concerns in late September or early October.
So, while city council is unquestionably in favour of this project, the process will carry on for at least another 10 weeks, giving this citizen's committee several chances to influence the decision making process.

I have very little doubt that the project will proceed, but, we are dealing with an organized citizen's committee here with at least a couple of high profile members. This is more than just a couple of ladies with a tomato plant, and, they were able to lop four floors off the Tomato Building at Main & Vaughan Harvey.

I remain concerned.
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