Stadiums & Arenas of Canada, Part 3

[Calgarian]

Originally Posted by elly63

Saying LOL after your lies doesn't make them right

That's just me laughing at you, you say funny things lol.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by Calgarian

That's just me laughing at you, you say funny things lol.

Yeah, I find your fairy tales funny.

[elly63]

Does anybody know if this date is still accurate

The Arena at TD Place, as it stands, is hosting its last World Juniors — and that's good for Ottawa
A celebration is in order, both for the storied building's 57-year past and the exciting future of its reincarnation a stone's throw from the current location.
Don Brennan Ottawa Citizen December 27, 2024

When the grand plan is rubber-stamped on October 22, 2025, the wheels will immediately be set in motion on Lansdowne 2.0, the construction of a spectacular new facility that will be a much-needed new home for the Ontario Hockey League’s 67’s, as well as the Ottawa Charge of the Professional Women’s Hockey League and the Ottawa BlackJacks of the Canadian Elite Basketball League, while providing upgraded seating and added viewing points for the Canadian Football League’s Ottawa Redblacks, as well as the Atletico Ottawa of the Canadian Premier League and the newly born Ottawa Rapid FC, a professional women’s soccer team in the fledgling Northern Super League.

[Hackslack]

Originally Posted by Calgarian

I told you, equalization is how Alberta tax dollars end up in Quebec. If you choose to not look into that, I leave that to you. I'm not going to debate it as it will just turn into an argument. You may want to argue endlessly, but I don't and I'm sure that the rest of the people here don't want it either.

You do realize that MLS plays twice the number of games the CFL does right? So while the Alouettes may get 4000 more people to a game than the Impact (or whatever they're called now), they only have 9 home games compared to 17, therefore the MLS team gets way more fans. You completely missed the point though, the CFL does not have the same profile as MLS, not even close. There are MLS franchises worth over $1B, I doubt the entire CFL brand is worth that, let alone any single franchise. CFL is hanging on by a thread, despite slightly higher gate attendance than MLS in Montreal lol.

CFL is hanging on by a thread? Honestly where do you get that information, or is that another big boy exercise?

How many years now have we heard that too, must be coming up on at least 50 years…

[Calgarian]

Think the Oilers have a similar deal as the Flames got regarding the old arena. It's not allowed to compete with the new one, so Rexall just sat vacant forever. Think demo is underway or is about to be?

[Calgarian]

I get my information by watching the CFL, reading articles and generally paying attention to what's happening. Here's some reading for all you keyboard warriors out there. https://globalnews.ca/news/11263497/...ial-struggles/

So the question would then be, where do you get your information? only having 2 of 9 teams making money seems to not be a recipe for success to me, but you're so smart, prove me wrong.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by Calgarian

I get my information by watching the CFL, reading articles and generally paying attention to what's happening. Here's some reading for all you keyboard warriors out there. https://globalnews.ca/news/11263497/...ial-struggles/

So the question would then be, where do you get your information? only having 2 of 9 teams making money seems to not be a recipe for success to me, but you're so smart, prove me wrong.

Ahh, now I see the point of the trolling.

Before the pandemic 8 of the 9 teams made money. At this moment the league has the wealthiest group of owners in its history. Rich people like to be around other rich people. Forbes estimated Als' owner Pierre Karl Peladeau's net worth at $2.4 billion which begs the question why would he involve himself in a money losing venture if that were really true

The TSN TV contract covers the player' salaries so the gate and other sources of revenue cover expenses.

By a strange coincidence, the only two teams that are said to make money are the only two that are publicly owned and have to publish their financials.

I have a difficult time believing a steady franchise like Hamilton with no attendance issues is suddenly not profitable, the same with the Lions whose attendance has increased each year by 3000 per game for the last three seasons and this season by 1000 over last season's.

So aside from the disinformation (lies) you posted previously, you finally google some sourced information. Here's another, the November 9 1987 issue of Sports Illustrated was telling us the CFL was dying. That was 38 years ago and yet the league still marches on.

You mention where you get your information, until the last post it was the voices playing in your head and that was disinformation. Why you would want to troll a Canadian venture at this time in our history is beyond me.

[Calgarian]

I'm trolling because I posted an article where the CFL commissioner says that 7 of 9 teams aren't profitable? You're kind of special aren't you.

[Hackslack]

Originally Posted by Calgarian

I'm trolling because I posted an article where the CFL commissioner says that 7 of 9 teams aren't profitable? You're kind of special aren't you.

Wow, offensive, thats kind of a douche reply

16 of 29 MLS teams operate at a loss (easy google search if you’re willing to be a big boy)… that league hanging on by a thread too?

[EnvisionSaintJohn]

Originally Posted by Hackslack

Wow, offensive, thats kind of a douche reply

16 of 29 MLS teams operate at a loss (easy google search if you’re willing to be a big boy)… that league hanging on by a thread too?

The league with the biggest football star in history is doing just fine...

It's just too bad that they call it a soccer league, when most of the teams call themselves football clubs.

The CFL and the MLS just are not comparable leagues... many MLS clubs are worth upwards of a billion or more. The entire CFL isn't even worth a single billion.

Originally Posted by elly63

Now you're just getting ridiculous. Get something shipped on Intelcom, they show an animation of a truck going across Canada. To depict Toronto they have the CN Tower and the Skydome and in Montreal it's the cross on Mont Royal and the Olympic Stadium. Here's your postcard

The Biosphere is often used to represent Montreal too.

I think Olympic Stadium deserves a proper renovation... and a football/soccer specific renovation makes a lot of sense.

However, what wouldn't make sense is for the stadium to simply sit for most of the year, while the Montreal Football Club of the MLS plays their games at Saputo Stadium with Olympic stadium in the background.



They were able to install grass at Olympic Stadium for a single friendly versus AC Milan ... and once they have the roof situation figured out, they should also be able to figure out solutions to have real turf available for MLS games.

I don't think it makes sense to spend all this money on refurbishing Olympic Stadium if it's only going to be used sporadically. Montreal's Olympic Stadium has the potential to be the biggest and best football/soccer stadium in all of Canada.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by EnvisionSaintJohn

I think Olympic Stadium deserves a proper renovation... and a football/soccer specific renovation makes a lot of sense.

However, what wouldn't make sense is for the stadium to simply sit for most of the year, while the Montreal Football Club of the MLS plays their games at Saputo Stadium with Olympic stadium in the background.

They were able to install grass at Olympic Stadium for a single friendly versus AC Milan ... and once they have the roof situation figured out, they should also be able to figure out solutions to have real turf available for MLS games.

I don't think it makes sense to spend all this money on refurbishing Olympic Stadium if it's only going to be used sporadically. Montreal's Olympic Stadium has the potential to be the biggest and best football/soccer stadium in all of Canada.

You are making reasonable points so I will respond reasonably. Unfortunately you are raising some points that we have been through before and aren't reasonably possible even if I wish they could happen.

It is too expensive to try and keep turf indoors. As I said the Jays commissioned a big study and trials through Guelph and they decided it wasn't practical or worth the cost. And that is with a roof that opens not a fixed roof like Montreal.

The stadium is too big for both the Als and CFM who need a sub 30k rightsized rectilinear stadium. CFM will not go back to playing on artificial turf and the costs are too prohibitive to try and grow grass on a permanent basis. The cost for a one game turf installation can be from 700k to one million dollars.

It can't be the best football or soccer venue as the seats are too far away from the field and there are too many seats when CFM are drawing 16k and the Als 20k

As for being used sporadically that's the whole idea of the roof refurb, to get dates because of the dates they were losing in the winter because of the unreliability of the roof.

The article I posted earlier about BC Place stated how single events are more profitable than the games with their regular tenants. The tenants get a preferred rate compared to one offs. It also showed how a building can be successful without having core tenants.

I agree with all your wishes and dreams except the practicality. I wish they could happen too but they won't (unless something drastic happens).

[elly63]

Originally Posted by Calgarian

I'm trolling because I posted an article where the CFL commissioner says that 7 of 9 teams aren't profitable? You're kind of special aren't you.

You've been posting misinformation and trolling all along until you finally posted one article from a creditable source. The only people who troll CFL are NFL and TFC fans, which are you because I've never run into a generic MLS fan.

[Hackslack]

Originally Posted by elly63

You've been posting misinformation and trolling all along until you finally posted one article from a creditable source. The only people who troll CFL are NFL and TFC fans, which are you because I've never run into a generic MLS fan.

I wouldn’t even say true NFL fans troll the CFL so much, rather it’s the NFL fantasy football “fans” that only watch the NFL if their players are playing.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by Hackslack

I wouldn’t even say true NFL fans troll the CFL so much, rather it’s the NFL fantasy football “fans” that only watch the NFL if their players are playing.

True, a football fan is a football fan who will enjoy all levels

[logan5]

Having only 20% of your CFL teams being profitable is a lot different than having 45% of MLS teams being profitable, but more importantly, MLS is trending upwards. Ten years ago, MLS as a whole, was losing money. Today the league is profitable, with team valuations skyrocketing, averaging 700 million. That rise in value indicates that the sports industry has huge confidence in the league.

Contrast that to the CFL where team values have stagnated or dropped steadily for many years now. The CFL commissioner has admitted that this direction the league continues to go in is not sustainable, as in the league is headed to folding.

The rule changes are drastic, but the CFL is clearly desperate and this is really its last gasps to survive.

I'll admit that I am not a CFL fan, and I would love to have an NFL team in Vancouver, so if the CFL were to die...

BC Place meets NFL standards so there is a suitable venue, and I know people will say the money isn't there, but with an ownership group, the money is there.

The NFL would certainly want to tap a new NFL crazy market of 40 million people.

[Hackslack]

Originally Posted by logan5

Having only 20% of your CFL teams being profitable is a lot different than having 45% of MLS teams being profitable, but more importantly, MLS is trending upwards. Ten years ago, MLS as a whole, was losing money. Today the league is profitable, with team valuations skyrocketing, averaging 700 million. That rise in value indicates that the sports industry has huge confidence in the league.

Contrast that to the CFL where team values have stagnated or dropped steadily for many years now. The CFL commissioner has admitted that this direction the league continues to go in is not sustainable, as in the league is headed to folding.

The rule changes are drastic, but the CFL is clearly desperate and this is really its last gasps to survive.

I'll admit that I am not a CFL fan, and I would love to have an NFL team in Vancouver, so if the CFL were to die...

BC Place meets NFL standards so there is a suitable venue, and I know people will say the money isn't there, but with an ownership group, the money is there.

The NFL would certainly want to tap a new NFL crazy market of 40 million people.

Wait, so the MLS was in a position of almost folding, only 10 years ago?

Hamilton was valued at $50 million in 2022, surely Winnipeg and Saskatchewan are more, and who knows what the new BC owner paid and Esks paid. Are you saying that they were valued even more than $50 million it the not too distant past? I wouldn’t think so… nothing compared to a MLS team, but it’s not a big 4 or big 5 league, so comparing makes no sense.

The NFL already has Canada market tapped. It already draws massive viewership numbers, more than the CFL, they don’t need a team in Canada to get the market, cause they already have the market. NFL is tv revenue driven, and they already get the viewers.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by logan5

The rule changes are drastic, but the CFL is clearly desperate and this is really its last gasps to survive.

Totally untrue, but at least you admit your bias.

Also how do these rule changes add revenue. Nobody has proven that point yet. Many of the fantasy pool NFL "fans" hate the CFL primarily because they are not knowledgeable about the level of the play. So if the rule changes are meant to attract these morons it will be futile.

We all know the Argos lose money, the amount of money they lose on the Argos amounts to the salary of one NBA player in other words a drop in the bucket to the corporation.

So two questions, if there isn't value in the CFL ie for MLSE and TSN why do they continue to be involved and name a team that is in actual financial peril and not able to pay the bills. You can't because there isn't one.

[EpicPonyTime]

Originally Posted by logan5

BC Place meets NFL standards so there is a suitable venue, and I know people will say the money isn't there, but with an ownership group, the money is there.

There’s likely a huge distinction between “meets NFL standards” and “is suitable for a permanent team”. BC Place would be the smallest stadium in the NFL by 8K, likely more once the Bears figure out their move.

[jonny24]

Originally Posted by logan5

The rule changes are drastic, but the CFL is clearly desperate and this is really its last gasps to survive.

I'll admit that I am not a CFL fan, and I would love to have an NFL team in Vancouver, so if the CFL were to die...

BC Place meets NFL standards so there is a suitable venue, and I know people will say the money isn't there, but with an ownership group, the money is there.

The NFL would certainly want to tap a new NFL crazy market of 40 million people.

The CFL owners certainly seem motivated for a big shakeup, but I have suspicions that it's chasing a T V or Private Equity payoff, and not because they are inherently unsustainable right now. I think they are playing up the "last gasp" to justify something else. Taking that at face value shows either a lack of critical thinking or a lack of knowledge of CFL history. It's been in much, much worse shape before this.

Owners love to cry poor, but the two teams that are public aren't. Most ownership groups are substantially stronger over the last 10 years - Doman, PKP, Stelco and others buying into Hamilton. Tragic that Edmonton's owner passed away, but that was also a strong step forward.

MLSE and CSEG should be strong owners, if they actually cared to put in the effort. I believe that they are the "foxes in the henhouse" driving whatever is the background play to the rule changes.

I'm not sure about the NFL - they aren't really gaining a 40 million market - most football / sports fans already watch NFL / pay for the TV channels that it's on. and Canadian TV contracts can't come close to the American ones - I don't think it would be a net gain for them to have to pay out a share to Canadian teams.

Individual owners could make money off NFL teams in Tor/Van/Mtl if there was no CFL, but then why would the other owners be going along with that?

[EnvisionSaintJohn]

Originally Posted by jonny24

The CFL owners certainly seem motivated for a big shakeup, but I have suspicions that it's chasing a T V or Private Equity payoff, and not because they are inherently unsustainable right now. I think they are playing up the "last gasp" to justify something else. Taking that at face value shows either a lack of critical thinking or a lack of knowledge of CFL history. It's been in much, much worse shape before this.

Owners love to cry poor, but the two teams that are public aren't. Most ownership groups are substantially stronger over the last 10 years - Doman, PKP, Stelco and others buying into Hamilton. Tragic that Edmonton's owner passed away, but that was also a strong step forward.

MLSE and CSEG should be strong owners, if they actually cared to put in the effort. I believe that they are the "foxes in the henhouse" driving whatever is the background play to the rule changes.

I'm not sure about the NFL - they aren't really gaining a 40 million market - most football / sports fans already watch NFL / pay for the TV channels that it's on. and Canadian TV contracts can't come close to the American ones - I don't think it would be a net gain for them to have to pay out a share to Canadian teams.

Individual owners could make money off NFL teams in Tor/Van/Mtl if there was no CFL, but then why would the other owners be going along with that?

Here's an idea for a big shakeup... every CFL team starts an Association Football (soccer) club in addition to their currently existing Canadian Football teams.



The best football stadium in Canada should be home to both a football and a soccer team called the Saskatchewan Roughriders.



If Real Madrid and FC Barcelona can also be basketball teams... then the Saskatchewan Roughriders and Winnipeg Blue Bombers could also be soccer teams!