HomeDiagramsDatabaseMapsForum About
     

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > Canada


Reply

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
     
     
  #41  
Old Posted Jun 20, 2021, 7:34 PM
ue ue is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 9,475
Quote:
Originally Posted by biguc View Post
Honestly, the better move would be getting rid of the stroad under the Gardiner. Lake Shore makes the Gardiner ten times worse and limits what you can do with the space underneath.
Indeed.



Some other Ontario stroads:

Sheppard, North York


Hurontario, Mississauga


Queensway, Etobicoke


King, Cambridge


King, Hamilton


Main, Hamilton


Wellington, Ottawa


Carling, Ottawa
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #42  
Old Posted Jun 20, 2021, 8:14 PM
SignalHillHiker's Avatar
SignalHillHiker SignalHillHiker is online now
I ♣ Baby Seals
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Sin Jaaawnz, Newf'nland
Posts: 36,120
Outside Empire Avenue (our WWII-era "ring road"), just about everything commercial is a stroad. A few of the worst...

Kenmount Road, St. John's


Commonwealth Avenue (main drag), Mount Pearl


Main Road (main drag), Conception Bay South


Topsail Road, Mount Pearl


Topsail Road, Paradise


Thorburn Road, St. John's


Elizabeth Avenue (closest one to the core), St. John's


Torbay Road, St. John's


Stavanger Drive, St. John's
__________________
Note to self: "The plural of anecdote is not evidence."
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #43  
Old Posted Jun 20, 2021, 9:55 PM
Truenorth00 Truenorth00 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 28,370
Basically every arterial in Canada. What sucks is how much residential we often have along arterials.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #44  
Old Posted Jun 20, 2021, 10:09 PM
SignalHillHiker's Avatar
SignalHillHiker SignalHillHiker is online now
I ♣ Baby Seals
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Sin Jaaawnz, Newf'nland
Posts: 36,120
But people love it. That Torbay Road example above? The number of early-20s mothers gleefully walking their 200-lbs Primary School-age kids across the street to Wendy's on Saturdays is crazy. I end up on Torbay/Stavanger maybe twice a year and I see a half dozen every time lol
__________________
Note to self: "The plural of anecdote is not evidence."
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #45  
Old Posted Jun 20, 2021, 11:02 PM
Drybrain Drybrain is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 4,499
I've always thought of Calgary's Macleod Trail as the ne plus ultra of all stroads. It just goes on in spectacular stroad fashion through the entire bottom half of the city.






Halifax's Young Street is pretty good (bad) example too. Much shorter, but right in the middle of the city. It goes from this very urban streetscape to the below within a couple of blocks. A real pox on the North End.

Reply With Quote
     
     
  #46  
Old Posted Jun 21, 2021, 3:01 AM
Architype's Avatar
Architype Architype is online now
♒︎ verified human
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: 🍁 Canada
Posts: 13,849
I think stroads must have a minimum of four traffic lanes in order to quality.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #47  
Old Posted Jun 21, 2021, 3:23 AM
Franco401 Franco401 is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Fredericton
Posts: 1,232
You also can't call it a stroad if there's no sidewalk or properties fronting it. Then it's just a road.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #48  
Old Posted Jun 21, 2021, 6:12 AM
ue ue is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 9,475
I agree with both assessments. I think most examples shown have adhered to both points. My Connors Rd example on the first page I even noted may not qualify. Some of SHH's examples are also narrower secondary streets in suburban areas.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #49  
Old Posted Jun 21, 2021, 7:50 AM
kool maudit's Avatar
kool maudit kool maudit is offline
video et taceo
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Stockholm
Posts: 14,355
It might look very Jane Jacobs compared to some of the more suburban examples in this thread, but in its context, Rue St-Urbain definitely functions as a stroad with its one-way, high-speed traffic.

Reply With Quote
     
     
  #50  
Old Posted Jun 21, 2021, 11:06 AM
Innsertnamehere's Avatar
Innsertnamehere Innsertnamehere is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 12,736
I feel like a lot of posts here are confusing what a stroad is - it isn’t just a big arterial - it’s a road that tries to pretend it’s pedestrian friendly while really not being so at all. Confederation Parkway in Mississauga is a prime example. Lake Shore in Toronto, not so much, as that doesn’t pretend to be anything but an arterial road.


Plains Road in Burlington, Highway 7 in Markham, Yonge Street in North York are other good examples of stroads as they try to look pedestrian friendly while in reality are totally car focused. That’s a Stroad.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #51  
Old Posted Jun 21, 2021, 11:11 AM
SignalHillHiker's Avatar
SignalHillHiker SignalHillHiker is online now
I ♣ Baby Seals
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Sin Jaaawnz, Newf'nland
Posts: 36,120
If we're getting it confused, it isn't just us. Almost everything that comes up in image searches for stroads look pretty much like what we're posting here?
__________________
Note to self: "The plural of anecdote is not evidence."
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #52  
Old Posted Jun 21, 2021, 1:50 PM
hipster duck's Avatar
hipster duck hipster duck is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Toronto
Posts: 4,749
Quote:
Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere View Post
I feel like a lot of posts here are confusing what a stroad is - it isn’t just a big arterial - it’s a road that tries to pretend it’s pedestrian friendly while really not being so at all. Confederation Parkway in Mississauga is a prime example. Lake Shore in Toronto, not so much, as that doesn’t pretend to be anything but an arterial road.


Plains Road in Burlington, Highway 7 in Markham, Yonge Street in North York are other good examples of stroads as they try to look pedestrian friendly while in reality are totally car focused. That’s a Stroad.
That's definitely one kind of stroad - the kind that's masquerading as a street.

I also thought that a stroad could also be the kind that's masquerading as a road. This would be a suburban arterial that does a poor job at moving large volumes of traffic quickly or efficiently because there are tons of curb cuts and access/egress points, as well as a lot of traffic lights which have left turn cycles that add a lot of time.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #53  
Old Posted Jun 21, 2021, 1:56 PM
hipster duck's Avatar
hipster duck hipster duck is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Toronto
Posts: 4,749
It's not in my city, but one of my least favourite stroad experiences was crossing Kelowna on Hwy 97. It's effectively the only through route in the Okanagan, so it mingles local traffic with drivers who are passing through Kelowna (from Vernon to Penticton, for example).

This is a stroad that really should be a road, specifically a grade separated highway.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #54  
Old Posted Jun 21, 2021, 2:30 PM
MolsonExport's Avatar
MolsonExport MolsonExport is online now
Pass me the Vomit Bag.
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Otisburgh
Posts: 50,829
^that stretch is terrible. everything in the central Okanagan Valley funnels through that stroad.
__________________
The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts. (Bertrand Russell). Sweet Loretta fart thought she was a cleaner, but she was a frying pan. (John Lennon)
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #55  
Old Posted Jun 21, 2021, 2:50 PM
jigglysquishy's Avatar
jigglysquishy jigglysquishy is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Saskatchewan
Posts: 3,326
One of the things I notice about stroads is the unpleasant amount of wind.

Fast vehicles close to sidewalks generates lots of noise, fumes, and "wind". It can be a bit disorienting as a pedestrian, particularly when the buildings are plastered with signage. It's a barrage on your senses.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #56  
Old Posted Jun 21, 2021, 2:55 PM
Aylmer's Avatar
Aylmer Aylmer is online now
Still optimistic
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Montreal (C-D-N) / Ottawa (Aylmer)
Posts: 5,407
Quote:
Originally Posted by hipster duck View Post
That's definitely one kind of stroad - the kind that's masquerading as a street.

I also thought that a stroad could also be the kind that's masquerading as a road. This would be a suburban arterial that does a poor job at moving large volumes of traffic quickly or efficiently because there are tons of curb cuts and access/egress points, as well as a lot of traffic lights which have left turn cycles that add a lot of time.
Exactly. It's a space which is trying to make two contradictory promises to its users. It's saying that it's an access street (meant to facilitate access to adjacent stores, houses, local streets) AND it's a flow road (meant to facilitate fluid movements of people). Both can't be true in the same space, so it ends up doing a poor job of both.

The one way you can make it work is with multiway boulevards, which separate the access and flow functions: you've got the high-speed, high-flow lanes in the middle which allow vehicles to move without getting bogged down by local intersections, parking, turning cars, patios etc.; and on either side, you have the low-speed (20-30 km/h) slip lanes which allow for all these things to happen safely and comfortably.

Nijmegen's Oranjesingel is a good example of this: a major regional traffic and truck route that you can clear at a good clip and good flow...




... but on which you can comfortably enjoy a coffee on a patio, park without getting rear-ended, and let your kids walk and bike on.




This kind of separation isn't just for massive road ROWs either: The nearby S105/Sint Annastraat is only 21m wide, about the same as the average 4-lane+sidewalk stroad in Canada.





The Netherlands is known for bicycle infrastructure, but what people tend to be surprised by is just how great a place it is to drive. In fact, it's consistently rated one of the best in Europe. I think a big reason for this is because the street design never makes false promises. You'll never have a wide lane that reads 70, but is posted 40 - the design will make it clear. You're never surprised by a school zone - the design will remind you to slow down.
In the case of stroads, the street will never promise you free flow then get you stuck behind an uncontrolled left-turning minivan trying to get to the McDonalds. Or it won't promise you street parking, but then have too much traffic flow to actually pull in or out. Instead, the street tells you clearly: this part is very slow, but you can park or make deliveries; this part is fast, but you have to be going straight ahead. And as a driver, the clarity makes driving easy, comfortable, efficient, and so much less stressful.
__________________
I've always struggled with reality. And I'm pleased to say that I won.

Last edited by Aylmer; Jun 21, 2021 at 3:22 PM.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #57  
Old Posted Jun 21, 2021, 3:53 PM
MonkeyRonin's Avatar
MonkeyRonin MonkeyRonin is offline
¥ ¥ ¥
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 10,545
Interesting. Those don't exactly look like the most pleasant street environments, but still, seems like a great way to retrofit stroads into something that are safer & more efficient for moving both cars & people.
__________________
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #58  
Old Posted Jun 21, 2021, 4:02 PM
Innsertnamehere's Avatar
Innsertnamehere Innsertnamehere is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 12,736
Netherlands has actually very, very good road infrastructure too, which a lot of people don't realize. They just offer good other infrastructure like transit and active transportation which means people don't feel the need to drive as much. But if you do want to drive roads are generally quick, efficient, and traffic free. They also do spend a fair bit on road infrastructure too, regularly widening highways and building new ones. It just doesn't come at the expense of other infrastructure like it does in the US or Canada.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #59  
Old Posted Jun 21, 2021, 4:11 PM
Aylmer's Avatar
Aylmer Aylmer is online now
Still optimistic
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Montreal (C-D-N) / Ottawa (Aylmer)
Posts: 5,407
Quote:
Originally Posted by MonkeyRonin View Post
Interesting. Those don't exactly look like the most pleasant street environments, but still, seems like a great way to retrofit stroads into something that are safer & more efficient for moving both cars & people.
Not the most pleasant, but not unpleasant either. I've sipped drinks on these streets when I lived in Nijmegen, and it was fine. Not Las Ramblas-level, selfie-worthy amazing where the street itself adds to the experience - just that the street didn't take away from being able to enjoy my drink and conversation. The traffic noise wasn't too loud, I didn't feel at all in danger, and it was convenient to park/walk/bike to get there.

It may not sound like much, but let's remember that considering the type and volume of traffic that these streets transport, 'fine' is an unparalleled achievement! Anyone in their right mind would hardly walk along any of the stroads in this thread, let alone willingly stop there for any length of time, let alone have that not be a terrible experience.
__________________
I've always struggled with reality. And I'm pleased to say that I won.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #60  
Old Posted Jun 21, 2021, 4:34 PM
JHikka's Avatar
JHikka JHikka is offline
ハルウララ
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Toronto
Posts: 12,853
The Nijmegan example is nice. Anywhere that protects pedestrians from fast-moving cars is a plus in my book. The trees add a nice mental barrier between the road and where pedestrians would be and provides good protection along with the parked cars.

I'm sure Holland has our equivalent of power centre development, though. I'd be interested in seeing how they handle that. I know Belgium is supposedly a hell-hole drive-through for most of Europe, so I guess that could be another good indicator.

A lot of stroads in Canada are simply not intended for pedestrian use at all, either in how the road is designed or how the area is designed. Walking through seas of parking lots or along four-to-eight lane roads is not for people.
Reply With Quote
     
     
This discussion thread continues

Use the page links to the lower-right to go to the next page for additional posts
 
 
Reply

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > Canada
Forum Jump



Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 9:23 PM.

     
SkyscraperPage.com - Privacy Statement - Top

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2026, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.