Ottawa's Byward Market

[J.OT13]

We got ourselves one new rendering! No idea where that is. The real Starbucks location (permanently closed now) does not match the image location.


https://twitter.com/MathieuFleury/st...81555654238211

[Capital613]

Originally Posted by phil235

Timeout Markets are definitely destinations (or at least they were pre-Covid). I've only been to the ones in Montreal and Boston. The Montreal one is right downtown, so it draws lots of office workers and shoppers, but the Boston one is out of the core and still had big crowds. When I was there they had live music and some sort of yoga event outside, and it was absolutely packed. No question the same idea would work well in the Market here, especially given that it is surrounded by more and more residential.

I just don't understand your argument about residential building being packed in the area. Could you clarify it? IMO, with the new LRT just a few blocks away, linked to viarail, soon linked to the airport, in a strategic touristic place, plus the fact they are going to rebuild all the area and a new destination market plus with a denser and denser population around it, seems to me it would be successful.

[Capital613]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

We got ourselves one new rendering! No idea where that is. The real Starbucks location (permanently closed now) does not match the image location.


https://twitter.com/MathieuFleury/st...81555654238211

The trees in the rendering might give us a clue. Didn't find it. Might be at the corner of parent and murray looking south, but it's missing a tree there.

[phil235]

Originally Posted by Capital613

I just don't understand your argument about residential building being packed in the area. Could you clarify it? IMO, with the new LRT just a few blocks away, linked to viarail, soon linked to the airport, in a strategic touristic place, plus the fact they are going to rebuild all the area and a new destination market plus with a denser and denser population around it, seems to me it would be successful.

I was agreeing with you. I do think that you need a reasonably dense local population to ensure that the place is viable during times when there aren't as many people coming to the area from outside. There is no question that exists around the Market. But more importantly, a TimeOut Market would be an attraction that draws people from beyond the local area. The one in Boston was a good demonstration of that.

[rocketphish]

City council OKs $129M proposal to revitalize ByWard Market

By: OBJ staff
Published: Jan 27, 2021 5:41pm EST



City council gave a unanimous thumbs-up Wednesday to a $129-million plan to revitalize the ByWard Market that would see pedestrian plazas set up along major streets and a “destination building” replace the Clarence Street parking garage.

According to a city report, the latest proposal aims to be a “roadmap” for reimagining the Market as a more walkable, less traffic-congested neighbourhood.

The plan calls for six “big moves” to reinvigorate the area’s streets and public spaces. Among them are proposals to create large “pedestrian promenades” on the north side of York, George and Clarence streets, build a permanent pedestrian corridor along William Street that links Clarence Street with the Rideau Centre and construct a new “destination building” and civic square on what is now the site of a municipal parking garage at 70 Clarence St.

The motion includes funding for various studies and a national design competition for the Rideau-Sussex portion of the project, but the city says it will need millions in additional money from other levels of government.

Still, councillors voiced their full support for the proposal on Wednesday, arguing that a thriving Market will pay dividends for the entire community.

“It is a front-facing look at the City of Ottawa,” Gloucester-Southgate Coun. Diane Deans said. “If you kill your core, you kill your city.”

Meanwhile, Mayor Jim Watson also zeroed in on Market in his annual state of the city address.

Watson said he will chair an organizing committee that will plan a celebration of the Market’s 200th anniversary in 2027, even floating the possibility of bringing the fire-breathing mechanical dragons of La Machine ​– the production that wowed crowds at Ottawa’s Canada 150 festivities three years ago ​– back for another go-round.

In other moves Wednesday, council approved extending the temporary mandatory mask bylaw to April 29. The bylaw requires face coverings to be worn in all enclosed public spaces, on all forms of public transit and in the common areas of condos and apartment buildings as a means of trying to curb the spread of COVID-19.

<snip>

https://www.obj.ca/index.php/article...-byward-market

[Kitchissippi]

I predict by the time the trees get this big, the area will have gone through two more make-overs. I think Rideau has been done thrice since the 1980s.

[JayBuoy]

Originally Posted by Kitchissippi

I predict by the time the trees get this big, the area will have gone through two more make-overs. I think Rideau has been done thrice since the 1980s.

say what you will about paving stones and no grade separation on recent street redesigns, but it does make it easy for future priority changes. Maybe 10 or 15 years from now city council wants to make pedestrian space bigger, just move some metal poles around to redistribute the space.

Like removing "flex space" in the future to accommodate larger sidewalks.

[rocketphish]

ByWard Market renewal is good for tourists, consumers and business
For once, a significant sum of money could be spent to promote human happiness and urban joy — plus significant bottom-line improvements for local merchants.

Brigitte Pellerin
Publishing date: Jan 31, 2021 • 3 hours ago • 3 minute read

On Jan. 27 city council approved a $129-million proposal to revamp the ByWard Market, which, as you’ll know if you’ve set foot downtown in the last year, could sure use a little zip. It’s a good plan, too. Rideau-Vanier Coun. Mathieu Fleury called it “worthwhile,” which is high praise indeed in a government town. However, despite approval from council, it’s not entirely clear how committed we are to seeing it through. It’s driving me bonkers.

We have no problem spending $112 million to upgrade three measly kilometres of suburban road in Barrhaven, or $95 million to widen a tiny, three-kilometre stretch of the Queensway for no good reason because of that thing called induced demand – that is, every time you widen a road you create more traffic, thereby negating the benefit of a wider road. If you can call the destruction of habitat and mangling of neighbourhoods to add more asphalt a benefit, that is.

At some point, we’re going to have to stop approving massive spending for roads and think about better ways to spend our shared money, for instance by providing real benefits to the largest number of people, very much including business owners, by making it more likely human beings will purchase goods and services from them. Because in case you hadn’t noticed, cars are terrible customers.

Go have a look at the video accompanying the Citizen’s article on the Market proposal or look at “ByWard Market” in Google Maps using the satellite view. Zoom in until you can see individual cars. Can you count how many private vehicles you can see parked there? Now zoom in some more and try to count how many humans you can see. Good luck. It would be more accurate for the giant letters on York Street to spell #AUTOWA.

And we haven’t talked yet about making sure our city, the capital of all Canadians, is as spiffy as can be so that when travel is allowed again tourists will flock to us to be dazzled by something more unique and attractive than lots of asphalt.

Who ever told a visiting friend or relative: You know what you can’t miss while you’re here? Never mind Parliament or tulips or BeaverTails. You have to check out this stretch of suburban road near the giant Costco. Nobody, is who. But look at the pictures showing what a refurbished Market would look like (I especially recommend the William Street concept on page 53 of the document prepared by the city), with people mingling and trees and lots of seating and multi-purpose areas — plus shops and restaurants.

Imagine yourself bringing your guests from out of town to an accessible, person-oriented urban jewel where you can explore sights and smells without worrying about dodging cars darting out of everywhere. Doesn’t that sound like a dream?

This plan has been in the works for years and it aims to ensure “the ByWard Market remains a unique, pedestrian friendly destination,” said Court Curry, manager, Right-of-Way, with the city. The thing about friendly pedestrian destinations is that they work: people browse and buy things, laugh and play, relax and enjoy themselves. Anyone who claims we don’t need that right now has no clue how to read a room.

For sure, $129 million is serious money. But for once a significant sum of money would be spent to promote human happiness and urban joy — plus significant bottom-line improvements for local merchants — instead of enriching suburban housing developers and car dealerships. It is such a no-brainer it hurts.

I have no wish to be casual about spending over $100 million in tax dollars, but if you’re going to spend over $100 million in tax dollars, spend it where the highest number of people will benefit. Bonus points if those people are not sitting inside a private metal box.

Making the Market, one of our most iconic destinations, a people-friendly place, is “worthwhile” indeed.

Brigitte Pellerin is an Ottawa writer.

https://ottawacitizen.com/opinion/pe...s-and-business

[Harley613]

The Byward Market will never reach it's full potential until they relocate two or more of the shelters. It's a big city now, they don't have to be in the historical and touristic centre. There are plenty of great underutilized lots along the Queensway on Catherine Street between Bank and Bronson that would be perfect locations for one or more of the shelters. City of Ottawa Social Services is already there, it's the same street as the Ottawa Police Headquarters, the YMCA, and Adult High School. There is far easier access for emergency services, it is easy walking distance from Pharmacy, Grocery, Beer Store and LCBO, the bus station is right there, there is a new large affordable housing project being built further West on the street for next step accommodation...

[silvergate]

Originally Posted by Harley613

The Byward Market will never reach it's full potential until they relocate two or more of the shelters. It's a big city now, they don't have to be in the historical and touristic centre. There are plenty of great underutilized lots along the Queensway on Catherine Street between Bank and Bronson that would be perfect locations for one or more of the shelters. City of Ottawa Social Services is already there, it's the same street as the Ottawa Police Headquarters, the YMCA, and Adult High School. There is far easier access for emergency services, it is easy walking distance from Pharmacy, Grocery, Beer Store and LCBO, the bus station is right there, there is a new large affordable housing project being built further West on the street for next step accommodation...

What potential is it losing out on through? It's not like walking on king edward or st patrick is really fun anyways

[Harley613]

Originally Posted by silvergate

What potential is it losing out on through? It's not like walking on king edward or st patrick is really fun anyways

The parts of the market that ARE supposed to be fun/beautiful/worth visiting full of drug addicts and panhandlers. These people need a place, but I don't think the Market should be that place. In fact, I think it's the last place in this city that the less fortunate people who need special attention and services should be.

[silvergate]

Originally Posted by Harley613

The parts of the market that ARE supposed to be fun/beautiful/worth visiting full of drug addicts and panhandlers. These people need a place, but I don't think the Market should be that place. In fact, I think it's the last place in this city that the less fortunate people who need special attention and services should be.

It's the same story worldwide, panhandlers and hustlers will congregate in high traffic areas. Moving the shelters may not convince everyone of their ilk to abandon the area. Until a real housing first strategy can be implemented, that's not going away.

[acottawa]

Originally Posted by silvergate

It's the same story worldwide, panhandlers and hustlers will congregate in high traffic areas. Moving the shelters may not convince everyone of their ilk to abandon the area. Until a real housing first strategy can be implemented, that's not going away.

Most cities don’t put three large shelters within a few hundred metres of their main tourist area. Yeah you’ll still get panhandlers, but not nearly as many.

[Harley613]

Originally Posted by acottawa

Most cities don’t put three large shelters within a few hundred metres of their main tourist area. Yeah you’ll still get panhandlers, but not nearly as many.

Exactly. I Have travelled extensively in North and South America, Asia and Europe, and I have visited 6 of the 7 G7 Capitals, yet I have never seen a situation quite like Ottawa where there are four homeless shelters in an 'old city, centro historico, tourist district' etc. Panhandlers and homeless people exist in virtually all cities, but here it is pervasive in an area that we are presenting as the face of our city culturally. I'm not saying we should hide and ignore our housing, addiction and mental health crisis. I'm saying we need to move this crisis to the best place for it to be addressed and get it away from the Byward Market.

[OTownandDown]

I can attest that taking a leisurely stroll in the market right now is fraught with people screaming, following, staring, and generally loitering. In the daytime. Forget about parking your car in a garage and actually keeping your windows.

In the evening last week I was followed several blocks by a very aggressive person shouting and getting too close and threatening to punch me and my partner. Not fun. We'll be avoiding the market until the pandemic is over and there's other people around for protection.

[ars]

Originally Posted by Harley613

The Byward Market will never reach it's full potential until they relocate two or more of the shelters. It's a big city now, they don't have to be in the historical and touristic centre. There are plenty of great underutilized lots along the Queensway on Catherine Street between Bank and Bronson that would be perfect locations for one or more of the shelters. City of Ottawa Social Services is already there, it's the same street as the Ottawa Police Headquarters, the YMCA, and Adult High School. There is far easier access for emergency services, it is easy walking distance from Pharmacy, Grocery, Beer Store and LCBO, the bus station is right there, there is a new large affordable housing project being built further West on the street for next step accommodation...

I completely agree, the homeless shelters handicap the market's growth potential. Unfortunately, there doesn't seem to be much political will to address it right now, we all remember the “Save Our Market” petition a few years back.

[rocketphish]

Tourist potential and grim reality on a walk to the ByWard Market
Once down on Rideau Street, I am accosted by panhandlers, or screamed at by the mentally ill.

Kerry-Lynne Wilson
Publishing date: May 15, 2021 • 7 hours ago • 3 minute read

I am a walker, not a driver. I like to patronize small local businesses rather than big-box stores. I live in a central neighbourhood of Ottawa. You might say that I am the city of Ottawa’s ideal citizen, its stated ambition being to see more intensification of the downtown core, increased use of public transit, and an overall reduction in the city’s climate footprint.

I have long cast a shadow on the ByWard Market. The district has some great anchors — La Bottega, Lapointe Fish, Saslove’s Meat Market, ByWard Fruit Market, Zak’s Diner, Le Moulin de Provence, as well as, further over on Clarence Street, the elegant Paper Papier — just to name a few of my personal favourites. In this year of COVID-19, I wish them all well. New apartment towers are springing up all around. I feel optimistic that they will bring new clientele to area businesses. And the market is, after all, a prime tourist destination.

I skirt the Rideau Centre at the top of my street and head north/northwest. A few different routes lead from my place to the market. A block from my Sandy Hill apartment, a group gathers at the entrance to the Community Health Centre at the corner of Nelson and Rideau streets. They are drug addicts after their medication. For a while, these patients spilled over onto property across the road, but the owner of the low-rise apartment block must have complained; the area was fenced off.

Adjacent is the Pizza Pizza lot, always littered with trash. Across Rideau, people sit in the entrance to the ByTowne Cinema, closed due to COVID. Loitering is forbidden inside the Loblaws corridor.

So, I may take Besserer Street for a block or two. I’ll arrive at a spot where once a bench was set among rose bushes. Drug dealers and their customers congregated there, so the bench was removed. Stairs leading down to the rear of the Shoppers Drug Mart originally were constructed of separate stones, but these proved to be a good hiding place for drugs, so the staircase was redesigned in iron. Still, discarded needles and rubbish are strewn about.

Once down on Rideau Street, I am accosted by panhandlers, or screamed at by the mentally ill. One man wears a heavy wool coat in the terrible heat of summer. Discarded fast food packaging and plastic bags fill up the bus shelter. I had to alert Scotiabank’s Rideau branch to a situation involving their ATM vestibule. It was obvious someone had occupied the space overnight and fouled the room. (The bank responded quickly by locking the door at night.) As I write this, due to the latest COVID-inspired lockdown, the ByWard Market Square building is closed, so washrooms are inaccessible.

The Waller Mall pedestrian walkway linking Rideau and George streets has long been closed. Drug dealers took over the space and the city couldn’t keep up with the complaints (in its words). It seemed at first unfair that everyone was to pay for the behaviour of a few, but the site is under construction (like the entire downtown), and we may get the passageway back.

One summer morning, I discovered an entire block of George Street transformed into an open-air dormitory with half-naked men and women in sleeping bags. In front of the Home Hardware branch (closed and much missed), spreading over to a shuttered nightclub next door, was a makeshift livingroom with chairs and blankets and food supplies for people and their pets.

On Murray Street one warm summer day, I came upon a boy huddled and shivering in a hedge. I have often wondered if handing over a few coins will help change the world. I walk on. I witness. I wish I could fly.

Kerry-Lynne Wilson is a fifth-generation Ottawa resident.

https://ottawacitizen.com/opinion/wi...-byward-market

[bartlebooth]

I don't understand how this was published. It's awful.

[eltodesukane]

There's a 10 year waiting list for community housing.
No wonder some are homeless.
And all we can do to help is remove benches?

[YOWetal]

Originally Posted by eltodesukane

There's a 10 year waiting list for community housing.
No wonder some are homeless.
And all we can do to help is remove benches?

Not much overlap between the downtown homeless and waiting list for community housing I'm afraid. Addiction and mental health the overwhelming factor.