Highways in Canada

[FrAnKs]

Originally Posted by eternallyme

The highway through New Brunswick I believe was essentially complete in 2006 or so. Before the 1990s, however, it was largely a 2 lane highway that was narrow and winding - and VERY dangerous.

I believe the first section - Amherst to Moncton - was built in the early 1990s, and Moncton to Sussex around 1998 (part of that was itself bypassed). Other sections were added in the late 1990s and early 2000s, with the last section completed in 2007.

Once we get to 2020, it should be a TCH freeway from Renfrew to Antigonish, a distance of about 1,700 km.

Thanks !

Considering this, would you say Quebec is late with A85 ?

[eternallyme]

Originally Posted by FrAnKs

Thanks !

Considering this, would you say Quebec is late with A85 ?

Somewhat, but they have been working on it for many years and also that area is less influential within Quebec being far from the main population centres. Ontario is much farther behind...and BC is also far behind as well...

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by eternallyme

Somewhat, but they have been working on it for many years and also that area is less influential within Quebec being far from the main population centres. Ontario is much farther behind...and BC is also far behind as well...

I agree with that sentiment. I know that upgrading the highway infrastructure in the GTA region probably should have priority, but I find it frustrating that northern Ontario has been so neglected. AADT should not be the only thing to be considered in the decision to divide a highway. Safety considerations should be equally as important, especially when you are talking about highways which are part of the national highway system with heavy truck traffic. A two lane (or super two) highway with heavy truck traffic can be a nightmare in the winter time.

[FrAnKs]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

I agree with that sentiment. I know that upgrading the highway infrastructure in the GTA region probably should have priority, but I find it frustrating that northern Ontario has been so neglected. AADT should not be the only thing to be considered in the decision to divide a highway. Safety considerations should be equally as important, especially when you are talking about highways which are part of the national highway system with heavy truck traffic. A two lane (or super two) highway with heavy truck traffic can be a nightmare in the winter time.

Distances ? Distances are so big in that country that building a dual-carriageway is a ''think about'' when you're outside of the biggest metro areas.
I understand that, but I don't agree with it.

[eternallyme]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

I agree with that sentiment. I know that upgrading the highway infrastructure in the GTA region probably should have priority, but I find it frustrating that northern Ontario has been so neglected. AADT should not be the only thing to be considered in the decision to divide a highway. Safety considerations should be equally as important, especially when you are talking about highways which are part of the national highway system with heavy truck traffic. A two lane (or super two) highway with heavy truck traffic can be a nightmare in the winter time.

Also in BC the area is mostly very mountainous and the curves can often be quite difficult. That said, that is a VERY expensive area to build in - one short section of the highway through Kicking Horse Canyon is going to cost over $700 million as it literally has to sit on mountainsides...

[Stingray2004]

Originally Posted by eternallyme

Also in BC the area is mostly very mountainous and the curves can often be quite difficult. That said, that is a VERY expensive area to build in - one short section of the highway through Kicking Horse Canyon is going to cost over $700 million as it literally has to sit on mountainsides...

Yep. The remaining Phase 4 - 4 km section of the Kicking Horse Canyon section of Hwy 1 in the far eastern section of BC - relatively close to the AB border. Cost estimates for this section have been even as high as $1 billion.

Requires major rock cuts, bridges/viaducts, snowsheds, tunnels, etc.

Might even broken up into sub-phases in terms of future construction -whenever that will be.

• Video Link

[FrAnKs]

Awesome !

[eternallyme]

Originally Posted by Stingray2004

Yep. The remaining Phase 4 - 4 km section of the Kicking Horse Canyon section of Hwy 1 in the far eastern section of BC - relatively close to the AB border. Cost estimates for this section have been even as high as $1 billion.

Requires major rock cuts, bridges/viaducts, snowsheds, tunnels, etc.

Might even broken up into sub-phases in terms of future construction -whenever that will be.

• Video Link

The western Phase 4 (Golden urban section) is pretty easy so there is no real reason why they can't start it separately now, especially when the cost for that section isn't too high.

I don't think the canyon part can be subdivided though?

Given that Yoho National Park lies under federal jurisdiction, the next section for BC to do would be Golden to Donald and up to the east gate of Glacier National Park. Ideally, they would have built it on a new alignment on the west bank of the Columbia River (wide enough to build with a grass median and 120 km/h design speed) but with sections already underway or constructed, they are pretty much stuck with the existing alignment.

[sa230e]

My latest video of the Herb Gray Parkway in Windsor
• Video Link

[manny_santos]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

I agree with that sentiment. I know that upgrading the highway infrastructure in the GTA region probably should have priority, but I find it frustrating that northern Ontario has been so neglected. AADT should not be the only thing to be considered in the decision to divide a highway. Safety considerations should be equally as important, especially when you are talking about highways which are part of the national highway system with heavy truck traffic. A two lane (or super two) highway with heavy truck traffic can be a nightmare in the winter time.

I have never agreed with the twinning of (most) of Highways 69 and 11 and I still do not agree with what has been done. At great cost to the province, ridings represented by Ernie Eves and adjacent to Mike Harris got twinned highways where traffic volumes didn't warrant, and where there were adequate rail and air services between both North Bay and Toronto, and Sudbury and Toronto. Many local people in those regions didn't want twinned highways, especially after one section of Highway 11 was built around Trout Creek that devastated the local economy. These projects would never have happened without Eves and Harris. There were other projects in Northern Ontario that could have taken higher priority, such as proper highway connections through the North Bay, Sault Ste. Marie, and Timmins areas.

There are tons of safety improvements and small bypasses of towns that could have been constructed without building massive superhighways that are almost completely empty - and might I add probably very costly to maintain in the winter based on the amount of snow that region gets. I drove Highway 11 from Toronto to North Bay last year and couldn't believe even on a long weekend how little traffic there was once I was north of Huntsville.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by manny_santos

I have never agreed with the twinning of (most) of Highways 69 and 11 and I still do not agree with what has been done. At great cost to the province, ridings represented by Ernie Eves and adjacent to Mike Harris got twinned highways where traffic volumes didn't warrant, and where there were adequate rail and air services between both North Bay and Toronto, and Sudbury and Toronto. Many local people in those regions didn't want twinned highways, especially after one section of Highway 11 was built around Trout Creek that devastated the local economy. These projects would never have happened without Eves and Harris. There were other projects in Northern Ontario that could have taken higher priority, such as proper highway connections through the North Bay, Sault Ste. Marie, and Timmins areas.

There are tons of safety improvements and small bypasses of towns that could have been constructed without building massive superhighways that are almost completely empty - and might I add probably very costly to maintain in the winter based on the amount of snow that region gets. I drove Highway 11 from Toronto to North Bay last year and couldn't believe even on a long weekend how little traffic there was once I was north of Huntsville.

These projects are not because of various politicians. The 4 laning is occuring because the people who travel these highways pressured the government to make them safer. When you have idiot drivers trying to get to their cottage to see the sunset http://windsor.ctvnews.ca/windsor-driver...s-speeding-to-catch-the-sunset-1.2494846 Or other stupid things, we want to keep them on their side. If they left it 2 laned and just put a median, that may have been better.

It would be nice to see Highways 11 and 17 twinned to Thunder Bay and 17 twinned to the MB border.

[Innsertnamehere]

twinning across the province is pointless, and a ridiculously large project, over 2,000 km of highway to twin just to get 17 twinned.

Even getting 17 twinned from Ottawa to Sault Ste Marie would require over 800km of new highway, or a roughly $8 billion dollar project.

Most Northern Ontario highway twinning efforts have been on Highway 11 and 69, but I bet that will shift to 17 soon. 11 finished twinning in 2012, 69 is supposed to be done in 2019ish, after that I bet you efforts will shift to the Ottawa valley and around Sudbury and North Bay to begin upgrading Highway 17.

[Tone]

Originally Posted by FrAnKs

Génial ! Comme je t'envie, j'aimerais beaucoup assister à ce genre de travaux étant donné que le domaine des routes me passionne.

C'est ma passion aussi, quand j'étais jeune, je passais une bonne partie de mes étés en vélo à regarder les travaux des différentes phases de la 20 autour de Rimouski du Bic jusqu'à Mont-Joli en rêvant de pouvoir travailler un jour sur des futures phases de la 20 de Cacouna au Bic et sur la 85. Aujourd'hui, je me pince à chaque jour d'avoir la chance de vivre mon rêve et de participer à la construction de ma région, c'est un sentiment inexplicable...

...Mais dit moi, toi qui est dans le domaine... nous savons tous que nous avons un problème de routes et/ou de conception au Québec. Peux tu affirmer ou observer directement ce que nous faisons de mal et/ou de différent au chantier comparé aux autres provinces/États qui pourrais expliquer cela ? En fin de compte, quelle est ta théorie là-dessus ?

C'est difficile pour moi de répondre parce que je n'ai pas travaillé sur d'autres projets dans d'autres provinces. Peut-être que les standards d'acceptation de matériaux, les pourcentages de compaction du sol ou la qualité de l'enrobé bitumineux ainsi que les épaisseurs et la quantité des couches sont différents par exemple. En voyant les plans et devis de d'autres projets ailleurs on pourrait comparer si les spécifications sont les mêmes ou non.

Tu as de la chance concernant la construction d'autoroutes dans ta région en effet !... je ne veux en rien diminuer le poids ou l'importance de ta région, mais à 200 000 habitants, je crois qu'en effet vous ne pouvez pas vous plaindre ... c'est essentiellement dû au fait que votre région est située au carrefour de routes permettant de relier les maritimes. Met le même 200 000 dans le grand nord ( Exemple Abitibi ) et votre situation serait fort différente. Donc vous profitez de cela.

Effectivement on est extrêmement chanceux d'avoir deux autoroutes en développement en simultané! La 85 oui elle est en grande partie pour les maritimes mais la 20 est pour nous (et la Gaspésie)!

J'ai lu dernièrement que les travaux de la dernière phase de l'A85 commenceraient en 2017. J'espère que tu aura la chance d'y travailler

Merci mon ami! On a optenu deux tronçons soit Saint-Louis-du-Ha! Ha!/Cabano et Cabano/Notre-Dame-Du-Lac et j'espère qu'on aura une autre part du gâteau restant.

Dernière question, à ce stade-ci, est-ce que les travaux s'étendent même jusqu'à Trois-Pistoles ? ... J'imagine qu'entre Trois-Pistoles et Le Bic rien ne se passe encore ?

Merci.

Franks.

Comme je te disais, le tronçon qui va ouvrir en novembre se rend pratiquement jusqu'à Trois-Pistoles mais effectivement il n'y a rien entre Trois-Pistoles et le Bic pour l'instant. J'espère une annonce dans un avenir pas trop lointain.

[toaster]

Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere

twinning across the province is pointless, and a ridiculously large project, over 2,000 km of highway to twin just to get 17 twinned.

Even getting 17 twinned from Ottawa to Sault Ste Marie would require over 800km of new highway, or a roughly $8 billion dollar project.

Most Northern Ontario highway twinning efforts have been on Highway 11 and 69, but I bet that will shift to 17 soon. 11 finished twinning in 2012, 69 is supposed to be done in 2019ish, after that I bet you efforts will shift to the Ottawa valley and around Sudbury and North Bay to begin upgrading Highway 17.

Many in the North-east region want 11 twinned up to Temsikaming Shores (some, especially in the Cochrane district, want it twinned up to the 11/101 split). Also, highway numbers (and especially truck #s) on this stretch are higher in terms of AADT than a lot of 17.

[Stingray2004]

Originally Posted by eternallyme

The western Phase 4 (Golden urban section) is pretty easy so there is no real reason why they can't start it separately now, especially when the cost for that section isn't too high.

I don't think the canyon part can be subdivided though?

Given that Yoho National Park lies under federal jurisdiction, the next section for BC to do would be Golden to Donald and up to the east gate of Glacier National Park. Ideally, they would have built it on a new alignment on the west bank of the Columbia River (wide enough to build with a grass median and 120 km/h design speed) but with sections already underway or constructed, they are pretty much stuck with the existing alignment.

Just speculation and conjecture on my part. But I have read somewhere that BC MoTI was looking at breaking up Phase 4 into around 3 sections for construction purposes.

I would expect that the twin-tunnel (with adjoining snow & rock sheds) would be a stand-alone component as it is not only a big-ticket item but I understand takes considerable time to construct.

I can also see the segment from Yoho Bridge to the major snow shed built in one section.

Since a 4th lane was added to the existing 3-lane Golden Hill section a few years back (as an interim measure), down to the Hwy 95 intersection, I expect that segment will be lowest priority.

And yeah, looks like the existing alignment west of Golden to Donald will be utilized.

BTW, BC MoTI has now announced contiguous 4-laning east of Kamloops to Chase. At least some progress.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by toaster

Many in the North-east region want 11 twinned up to Temsikaming Shores (some, especially in the Cochrane district, want it twinned up to the 11/101 split). Also, highway numbers (and especially truck #s) on this stretch are higher in terms of AADT than a lot of 17.

Truck traffic heading west from Toronto or Ottawa usually will use Highway 11 due to it being flatter for most of it's length.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere

twinning across the province is pointless, and a ridiculously large project, over 2,000 km of highway to twin just to get 17 twinned.

Even getting 17 twinned from Ottawa to Sault Ste Marie would require over 800km of new highway, or a roughly $8 billion dollar project.

Most Northern Ontario highway twinning efforts have been on Highway 11 and 69, but I bet that will shift to 17 soon. 11 finished twinning in 2012, 69 is supposed to be done in 2019ish, after that I bet you efforts will shift to the Ottawa valley and around Sudbury and North Bay to begin upgrading Highway 17.

Only Ontario and British Columbia's main Trans Canada routes are not fully divided. Parts of Nova Scotia and Newfoundland's TCH are also not twinned.

They should twin Highway 17 to Sault St Marie's International crossing.

Highway 11 is the one that should be twinned to Thunder Bay and beyond.

Have you ever driven those routes?
http://globalnews.ca/news/1121806/watch-camera-captures-incredible-near-miss-on-ontario-road/
If you were this driver, you would change your mind. Just imagine this was able to happen on the 401?

[jmt18325]

The roads aren't bad at all, actually. They do need more eastbound passing lanes from Thunder Bay to Winnipeg, though.

[craner]

Originally Posted by Stingray2004

Just speculation and conjecture on my part. But I have read somewhere that BC MoTI was looking at breaking up Phase 4 into around 3 sections for construction purposes.

I would expect that the twin-tunnel (with adjoining snow & rock sheds) would be a stand-alone component as it is not only a big-ticket item but I understand takes considerable time to construct.

I can also see the segment from Yoho Bridge to the major snow shed built in one section.

Since a 4th lane was added to the existing 3-lane Golden Hill section a few years back (as an interim measure), down to the Hwy 95 intersection, I expect that segment will be lowest priority.

And yeah, looks like the existing alignment west of Golden to Donald will be utilized.

BTW, BC MoTI has now announced contiguous 4-laning east of Kamloops to Chase. At least some progress.

I really hope they keep up the "continuous" 4-laning from Kamloops to the Alberta border. The KH Phase 4 project looks spectacular in that video - here's hoping that gets funded soon (maybe a federal election promise ).
I just drove #1 from highway 97 east through to Calgary and I have to say the stretch west of Golden to Donald looks like much easier terrain to twin (relatively speaking) so shouldn't be as expensive or take as long as east of Golden.

[craner]

eternallyme
9 should be realigned to meet Stoney Trail NE at the bend north of Country Hills Boulevard, running on a new alignment to Kathryn/Keoma, for quicker and simpler access from the northeast (as far as Saskatoon). It probably only needs to be 2 lanes at this time, but protection for a wider corridor should be made.

Funny you mention this, I was recently looking at a map of Alberta and seeing how they could re-route highway 9 to connect with highway 7 in Sask to create a more major/direct link between Saskatoon and Calgary. Likely wont be required for a while yet but the way both cities are growing it's probably going to be required at some point.
Do you know if the province has done any studies of AB highway 9 ?