HomeDiagramsDatabaseMapsForum About
     

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > Canada > Alberta & British Columbia > Vancouver > Urban, Urban Design & Heritage Issues


Reply

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
     
     
  #401  
Old Posted Jan 19, 2011, 9:38 PM
mr.x's Avatar
mr.x mr.x is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Stockholm
Posts: 12,805
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smooth View Post
I also sent an email.

Anyone see the Frances Bula blog re: "Brigade of academics petition city hall not to raise heights in DTES, Chinatown"?
http://www.francesbula.com/
lol, I had one of those profs for a course last term.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #402  
Old Posted Jan 19, 2011, 10:47 PM
Metro-One's Avatar
Metro-One Metro-One is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Japan
Posts: 17,946
I just sent my e-mail as well, i hope more are going to do the same on here!
__________________
Bridging the Gap
Check out my Flickr: https://www.flickr.com/photos/30634635@N03/with/29495547810/ and Youtube channel https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCV0_0h9qKlhxXFxuAey_q6Q
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #403  
Old Posted Jan 19, 2011, 11:20 PM
SpongeG's Avatar
SpongeG SpongeG is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Coquitlam
Posts: 40,037
i skimmed through so maybe it was mentioned - i was watching global news a couple days back about the issue and one of the councillors - i don't know who she was but yay for her! she slammed the mayor saying something like the mayor wants to believe we live in some small provincial slow paced village and blah blah and she believes if we want to be world class we must build towers - thats basically what she said love her lol - anyway did anyone see it on TV?
__________________
belowitall
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #404  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2011, 3:01 AM
Canadian Mind's Avatar
Canadian Mind Canadian Mind is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,907
Q & A vids up:
Linkage
__________________
"you're eating chicken periods" - Vid
"I love eggs, especially the ones with runny yolks" - Me
"EWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW, you're disgusting!" - Vid
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #405  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2011, 3:59 AM
raggedy13's Avatar
raggedy13 raggedy13 is offline
Dérive-r
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Vancouver, BC
Posts: 4,450
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smooth View Post
I also sent an email.

Anyone see the Frances Bula blog re: "Brigade of academics petition city hall not to raise heights in DTES, Chinatown"?
http://www.francesbula.com/
Hmm... I've had 3 of those profs in the past, two of whom I respect greatly. I suddenly feel torn.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #406  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2011, 4:34 AM
giallo's Avatar
giallo giallo is online now
be nice to the crackheads
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 12,713
Feel free to post your letters/emails here. I'd like to read them.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #407  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2011, 3:53 PM
whatnext whatnext is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 27,720
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpongeG View Post
i skimmed through so maybe it was mentioned - i was watching global news a couple days back about the issue and one of the councillors - i don't know who she was but yay for her! she slammed the mayor saying something like the mayor wants to believe we live in some small provincial slow paced village and blah blah and she believes if we want to be world class we must build towers - thats basically what she said love her lol - anyway did anyone see it on TV?
Hmm, I'm guessing if she was slamming the mayor, it was the NPA's Suzanne Anton.

I heard on News1130 former mayor Mike Harcourt has come out against increasing height limits:
http://www.news1130.com/news/local/article/172230--mike-harcourt-against-higher-buildings-downtown
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #408  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2011, 9:20 PM
Metro-One's Avatar
Metro-One Metro-One is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Japan
Posts: 17,946
So I heard on the news they are going to extend the review period for the height increases, but in that story they kept on referencing the downtown east side height increases, so does this mean the CBD and Granville Bridge area height increases are still going to be decided today?

I honesty do not understand this city sometimes.... whether it is the anti height increase crowd, the keep east hasting the slum it is crowd or the anti sky train pro LRT crowd....

It still amazes me Vancouver has made it this far with so much idiocy in the populous.

We should honestly count our blessings that we have 3 150m+ towers and 3 grade separated mass transit lines.....and that we hosted the Olympics.
__________________
Bridging the Gap
Check out my Flickr: https://www.flickr.com/photos/30634635@N03/with/29495547810/ and Youtube channel https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCV0_0h9qKlhxXFxuAey_q6Q
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #409  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2011, 9:22 PM
Metro-One's Avatar
Metro-One Metro-One is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Japan
Posts: 17,946
Quote:
Originally Posted by giallo View Post
Feel free to post your letters/emails here. I'd like to read them.
Here was my email:

Hello

I am just sending this e-mail to show my support for the recommended tower height increases currently in debate.

For years Vancouver has suffered from a "table top" skyline. These changes will allow our skyline to become far more attractive from all angles and bring a higher sense of accomplishment to downtown Vancouver. It will help display Vancouver's transition from a regional centre to a world class city.

Many of those who are against these changes are misinformed and do not quite understand the proposal I find. Please do not let these sensationalists derail this very beneficial height increase.

One Wall Centre, The Shangri-La & now the Hotel Georgia tower have all positively added to the urban fabric of downtown Vancouver, and they are all 150m + towers. These towers are living proof that higher buildings in Vancouver are very desirable.

In closing, I believe that higher office and residential towers downtown (where our mass transit system in centred) are far more beautiful and beneficial than the construction of new sprawling office parks and townhouses. (I should also note that having the view cones of the mountains infringed upon by some taller towers is far better than having those mountains coated with subdivisions).

Sincerely yours

............
__________________
Bridging the Gap
Check out my Flickr: https://www.flickr.com/photos/30634635@N03/with/29495547810/ and Youtube channel https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCV0_0h9qKlhxXFxuAey_q6Q
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #410  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2011, 9:35 PM
EastVanMark EastVanMark is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,610
Quote:
Originally Posted by Metro-One View Post
It still amazes me Vancouver has made it this far with so much idiocy in the populous.

We should honestly count our blessings that we have 3 150m+ towers and 3 grade separated mass transit lines.....and that we hosted the Olympics.
You are not the only one who has wondered that. This city has made it this far despite its own ineptness. Note; at least 2 of the 3 things you mentioned were Provincial initiatives and actually both received some level of opposition and hostility from city council. Now we have a former mayor speaking out against these proposed zoning changes. You know what else this same former mayor opposed? A little known event called Expo 86.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #411  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2011, 10:13 PM
vansky vansky is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 928
Quote:
Originally Posted by Metro-One View Post
So I heard on the news they are going to extend the review period for the height increases, but in that story they kept on referencing the downtown east side height increases, so does this mean the CBD and Granville Bridge area height increases are still going to be decided today?

I honesty do not understand this city sometimes.... whether it is the anti height increase crowd, the keep east hasting the slum it is crowd or the anti sky train pro LRT crowd....

It still amazes me Vancouver has made it this far with so much idiocy in the populous.

We should honestly count our blessings that we have 3 150m+ towers and 3 grade separated mass transit lines.....and that we hosted the Olympics.
downtown eastside height increase could make the skyline look very wide, and big....which is probably better than more increase in height ont he west side...

Last edited by vansky; Jan 20, 2011 at 10:42 PM.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #412  
Old Posted Jan 21, 2011, 2:43 AM
jlousa's Avatar
jlousa jlousa is offline
Ferris Wheel Hater
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 8,371
There were two reports affecting heights going to council today, one was regarding the historic area, that one was yanked at the last minute, I was to be speaker 67 out of at least 80.
The other one is the one that most of you are concerned with but honestly is less important to the vitality of the city, it's the higher building/view protection report. That meeting is still ongoing now and will probably carry over to another date by the looks of things right now.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #413  
Old Posted Jan 21, 2011, 3:06 AM
Canadian Mind's Avatar
Canadian Mind Canadian Mind is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,907
Quote:
Originally Posted by jlousa View Post
There were two reports affecting heights going to council today, one was regarding the historic area, that one was yanked at the last minute, I was to be speaker 67 out of at least 80.
The other one is the one that most of you are concerned with but honestly is less important to the vitality of the city, it's the higher building/view protection report. That meeting is still ongoing now and will probably carry over to another date by the looks of things right now.
What's your opinion of building heights in the historic area? Should they be taller or shorter?
__________________
"you're eating chicken periods" - Vid
"I love eggs, especially the ones with runny yolks" - Me
"EWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW, you're disgusting!" - Vid
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #414  
Old Posted Jan 21, 2011, 3:39 AM
jlousa's Avatar
jlousa jlousa is offline
Ferris Wheel Hater
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 8,371
I am in support of what the planning dept came back with in their 93 page report. Height in Gastown remains at 75ft, Height in Chinatown increased from 60ft to the same 75ft limit. The shoulder areas seeing more height, Victory square allowed 90ft outright with possiblity for 120ft. Chinatown south at 90ft, with the main st corridor at 120ft with 3 sites at upto 150ft. It was a very thought out plan, I linked to it in the HAHR thread. While I'm sure some would've liked to see high rises in the area, I felt the proposed heights were respectful and added the needed density to create a healthier community mix.

I guess the one positive of today's delay is that the nimbys feel they won a battle and thus gives council more freedom to approve the additional height on the second report. We'll see how that plays out though. Back to the meeting now.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #415  
Old Posted Jan 21, 2011, 3:53 AM
Millennium2002 Millennium2002 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,742
I sent this long message to council. =O BTW does anybody know what has happened with the Higher Buildings in Downtown proposal?

Quote:
From: Allan Kuan
Sent: Thursday, January 20, 2011 11:07 AM
To: Correspondence Group, City Clerk's Office
Subject: Higher Buildings in Downtown Vancouver and Chinatown (In Support)

January 20th, 2011

SUBJECT: Higher Buildings in Downtown Vancouver and Chinatown (IN SUPPORT)

Dear Mayor Robertson and Vancouver City Council,

I’d like to express my approval for higher buildings in Downtown Vancouver by refuting the accusations being thrown out by anti-development groups against the proposal. In addition, I’d like to express one reservation I have at the moment about higher buildings in Chinatown.

To start off, I’ll introduce myself a little. I’m a Canadian of Chinese descent and currently a student at Simon Fraser University who resides in Vancouver with my parents and my older sister. Our family has lived in Vancouver ever since my parents immigrated here back in the 1970’s. Having just turned 18 in December, I see myself as being the representative of future generations of Vancouverites as well as the representative of people around my age.

The Truth about Higher Buildings in Downtown (from a progressive-looking point of view)

Speculation about the height increases and their effects have gone wild due to the efforts of the anti-height groups to stall the proposal through any means necessary. They offer misleading and sometimes entirely false accusations supporting their viewpoints. For example, one claim is that higher buildings are a form of “vertical sprawl” that would create “major changes to the city’s skyline”. However, the changes are not that extreme as some are exaggerating it to be; in fact some groups are claiming that the North Shore and West End will be affected, when clearly they are outside the study scope areas at the moment.

Another suggestion offered by opponents is that taller buildings will actually be less sustainable. However, it’d be wise to consider the other scenario. In the past few years, some new and old companies have located or relocated to suburban offices in neighbouring Burnaby and Surrey. In addition Surrey is planning to move ahead with more residential and industrial developments on what is currently farmland. Compared to the increased heights proposal, these offices and homes do considerably more environmental damage by taking up and covering more land and by forcing longer, congested car commutes through regional thoroughfares. I also have faith that the city will continue to require taller buildings to meet some sort of LEED requirements and a level of architectural prominence before they are approved.

A third claim is that higher buildings will be detrimental to city infrastructure by using everything up. However, I believe the region still has capacity for more growth and other cities in this region are using this to their full potential. In addition, developers are usually required by the city anyway during the approval process to contribute to improvements if necessary.

A fourth claim is that higher buildings will be detrimental to city finances. This is entirely false; on the contrary, the competition caused by the locating and relocating of offices and homes in places other than Downtown Vancouver threatens to erode the city’s image as a regional economic powerhouse on the business stage, which in turn may preclude the creation of new, local jobs and residents and therefore new sources of tax revenues. In addition, if people are concerned about a collapse of the tourist industry, the effects of tall buildings on that are generally negligible and are potentially offset by the fact that a potential diversification of job sources in Vancouver can possibly still help support the city even if one industry collapses. One only has to take a look at the local forestry industry to see the problems of doing otherwise: job losses happened in massive numbers over the past few decades and have never fully recovered since then, leaving areas once wholly dependent on the industry struggling to stay alive.

Finally, there are claims that higher buildings will damage the “character of Vancouver”. However, this depends on who you talk to. For some, generally well-off older individuals, Vancouver could be considered an exclusive all-season paradise and resort town that should be left untouched. But for the majority Vancouver is generally considered more like a busy working city with some natural touristic aspects included. I do not believe that Vancouver should pander more towards becoming more of a resort; although tourism is a generally stable and powerful industry at the moment, it only takes one or more events here and/or elsewhere to derail the whole machine and force the city to make do without it for some period of time. In addition, the touristic appeal of this city comes at a high cost: the strict protection of local communities and consequent lack of additional capacity in Vancouver for more homes and offices often causes property values to soar and precludes affordability for the rest of the population.

With these misconceptions thrown out of the window, the picture becomes clearer - higher buildings in Downtown:
- will help the city diversify its job sources away from tourism, while having few impacts on tourism itself
- can contribute to a net gain in city services, provided that developers contribute during approvals
- is environmentally responsible and sustainable compared to other suburban alternatives for growth
- can rely more effectively on public transport and less on congested roads, especially in easily accessible areas like Downtown Vancouver
- can generate new sources of tax revenue for the city’s often stretched budgets
- can help alleviate a housing and office shortage and possibly lower prices for both
- is compatible with the majority view of the “character of Vancouver”.

Historic Chinatown and Higher Buildings

In the case of higher buildings in Chinatown, however, I have one reservation about proceeding due to the area’s historic nature. The gentrification associated with these developments may push out older commercial tenants and create something that is “unauthentic”, or in other words not as occupied by Chinese businesses and residents as before. This is critical: although Chinatown needs many improvements to attract back customers and residents, the same efforts may come at the expense of a loss of character in the historic neighbourhood, which does not exist at just the architectural level but also extends down to the street atmosphere. I therefore suggest that the city does more to promote Chinese-Canadian residents and businesses towards this area.

I also believe that the city, in conjunction with the new policy, should enforce a new architectural policy in the area that requires new buildings to have historic-looking street-fronts to at least four stories before transitioning towards normal construction. An example of this (although in a much taller size) was recently built in New Westminster: http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4037/4525175476_4dbc4ff790.jpg (credits to ‘paradigm’ of SkyScraperPage Forums)

In conclusion, higher buildings are acceptable in Chinatown as long as they:
- encourage new Chinese businesses and residents to establish a presence and therefore preserve and enhance the neighbourhood’s historic culture
- blend in with the rest of the neighbourhood at street level with historic-looking facades (up to four stories at the least).

Conclusions

With the opposition rallying loudly and trying to stall Vancouver from moving forward with their false claims and rhetoric, I urge Vancouver City Council to unconditionally approve the Higher Buildings in Downtown policy. I also recommend that Vancouver City Council conditionally accept higher buildings in Chinatown while also continuing to address the concerns I raised above about gentrification, loss of culture and loss of heritage in the area.

In addition to the two proposals that are being debated on, I ask that the city continue to explore other areas where higher buildings could be built outside of Downtown, such as near existing SkyTrain stations and busy road corridors and intersections.

The City of Vancouver and its future depends on being able to grow efficiently on the limited amount of space remaining, and these two proposals are the first two steps towards that answer.

I regret that I have late classes tonight and therefore can not make it to the council meeting regarding the two higher building proposals, but I look forward for a positive outcome. Thank you for your time and patience in reading this long yet necessary message.

● Αllɑn Kuɑn
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #416  
Old Posted Jan 21, 2011, 5:20 AM
SpongeG's Avatar
SpongeG SpongeG is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Coquitlam
Posts: 40,037
Quote:
Originally Posted by whatnext View Post
Hmm, I'm guessing if she was slamming the mayor, it was the NPA's Suzanne Anton.

I heard on News1130 former mayor Mike Harcourt has come out against increasing height limits:
http://www.news1130.com/news/local/article/172230--mike-harcourt-against-higher-buildings-downtown
yes that was the name - god to know there is someone like her on council
__________________
belowitall
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #417  
Old Posted Jan 21, 2011, 5:23 AM
Locked In's Avatar
Locked In Locked In is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 1,977
^ Great letters guys, thanks for sharing.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #418  
Old Posted Jan 21, 2011, 7:19 AM
jlousa's Avatar
jlousa jlousa is offline
Ferris Wheel Hater
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 8,371
Just got back from the meeting ended at ~10:30. We'll have to wait until Feb 1 to know how council votes though as the debate was postponed. They did make it thru all the speakers though.

So if you haven't had a chance yet to email council or if you have additional comments for them, please take a moment and share them with council.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #419  
Old Posted Jan 22, 2011, 6:21 AM
Cypherus's Avatar
Cypherus Cypherus is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Surrey
Posts: 1,759
Great letters here, especially allan_kuan's. For being 18, you have very impressive writing skills and your counterarguments were solid.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #420  
Old Posted Jan 22, 2011, 4:48 PM
Rusty Gull's Avatar
Rusty Gull Rusty Gull is offline
Site 8 Lives
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Vancouver's North Shore
Posts: 1,285
Great context. I agree... You have to throw the nimbies a bone to get this done.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jlousa View Post
I am in support of what the planning dept came back with in their 93 page report. Height in Gastown remains at 75ft, Height in Chinatown increased from 60ft to the same 75ft limit. The shoulder areas seeing more height, Victory square allowed 90ft outright with possiblity for 120ft. Chinatown south at 90ft, with the main st corridor at 120ft with 3 sites at upto 150ft. It was a very thought out plan, I linked to it in the HAHR thread. While I'm sure some would've liked to see high rises in the area, I felt the proposed heights were respectful and added the needed density to create a healthier community mix.

I guess the one positive of today's delay is that the nimbys feel they won a battle and thus gives council more freedom to approve the additional height on the second report. We'll see how that plays out though. Back to the meeting now.
Reply With Quote
     
     
This discussion thread continues

Use the page links to the lower-right to go to the next page for additional posts
 
 
Reply

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > Canada > Alberta & British Columbia > Vancouver > Urban, Urban Design & Heritage Issues
Forum Jump



Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 6:29 PM.

     

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2026, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.