Burlington McMaster Business School

[HAMRetrofit]

This project should be moved across the street from the Family Medicine Center project. Forget about Burlington already they are probably pipe dreaming of landing a U of T campus.

[raisethehammer]

and now taking away the best transit line in the city from campus. Mac is concerned about one thing...people paying their parking rates.

[SteelTown]

^ Mac spent thousands of dollars to install parking gates to all of the parking lots, increased the rates because of it. So soon you'll have no choice but to pay in order to get inside to park.

The gates haven't been activated yet. That's like thousands and thousands of transponders for cars to get inside.

[HAMRetrofit]

If they are injecting that money back into the community by expanding post secondary education then who honestly cares how much they charge for parking.

[fastcarsfreedom]

What no one here seems to realize is that Mac is this city (and this region's) future. Primary industry is fading--but you may notice that the lost jobs are being replaced at an even greater rate in the health care field. Construction is booming on Mac's campus, the Innovation Park proposal is going ahead--and HHS, which Mac is affiliated with is the city's largest employer. I would love to see the new campus downtown--and I would've preferred it be in downtown Burlington if it had to be in Burlington at all. That being said--I'm sure there are reasons they've chosen the site in question--namely exposure and allowing the PT executive MBA program greater exposure in the big bad market east of Burlington.

I'm not going to involve myself in the parking discussion--one day you people hate free parking, the next day you hate having to pay. Banning street parking in the residential district around the campuses is commonplace and benefits the neighborhood as well as the university. If you like to walk you can always park in the University Gardens subdivision in Dundas and make the trek through the West Campus and over the Cootes Drive bridge.

[BCTed]

Originally Posted by fastcarsfreedom

... one day you people hate free parking, the next day you hate having to pay.

I noticed that as well.

[BCTed]

Originally Posted by raisethehammer

and now taking away the best transit line in the city from campus. Mac is concerned about one thing...people paying their parking rates.

I don't agree with moving buses out of campus either, but I am pretty certain that McMaster's sole motivation is not to convince people to park. The university has generally been in a parking crunch and has been happy to have people come in to campus by bus or bicycle or foot.

[BCTed]

Originally Posted by raisethehammer

no, your parking comment is in the 'retail news' thread.
If you're ever looking for any of your own (or anyone else's) posted comments, just click on the little green circle next to their name and it will give you the option to find all comments made by that person.

Thanks for the tip --- I am actually pretty well versed in navigation of the forums and know about that "all comments" feature, but just did not see the parking comment pop up when I did that search.

[BCTed]

Originally Posted by BCTed

I don't agree with moving buses out of campus either, but I am pretty certain that McMaster's sole motivation is not to convince people to park. The university has generally been in a parking crunch and has been happy to have people come in to campus by bus or bicycle or foot.

From http://act.mcmaster.ca:

Created in 2002, the ACT Office (All-modes Commuting & Transportation) exists to inspire McMaster faculty, staff and students to bike, hike, take transit and share the ride to campus.

Our mandate is to reduce the demand for parking at McMaster and in surrounding neighbourhoods through increased awareness of alternatives and enhanced services and infrastructure.

We plan events, draft policy, conduct research, develop programs, provide information and work with campus and community partners - including the transit agencies that serve McMaster - to better meet your transportation needs.

[highwater]

Originally Posted by realcity

I could care less if it's the most expensive parking in the city, but the City didn't have to make it illegal to park on the street anywhere within a square kilmeter of campus. FORCING everyone to pay the ridiculous rates at Mac.

As a Westdaler, I can tell you that parking within a kilometer of the campus is most assuredly NOT illegal.

[highwater]

Originally Posted by BCTed

I don't agree with moving buses out of campus either, but I am pretty certain that McMaster's sole motivation is not to convince people to park. The university has generally been in a parking crunch and has been happy to have people come in to campus by bus or bicycle or foot.

There's only one reason why Mac is banning some buses from its campus: pure spite. They are in a snit because the city is finally putting its foot down over their illegal use of residential streets for heavy trucks.

[highwater]

Originally Posted by fastcarsfreedom

What no one here seems to realize is that Mac is this city (and this region's) future.

If that's true, then God help us. One of the main reasons why our tax base continues to stagnate is because our two biggest employers are public institutions that pay much less municipal tax than private corporations. Well-known socialist John Dolbec cautions against putting too much hope for our future on universities and hospitals.

http://www.thespec.com/article/315920

[highwater]

Originally Posted by DC83

Mac is really bugging me lately.
First they get rid of their Downtown Burlington Campus plans, then eliminate all buses from their Westdale Campus, THEN decide to put their Burlington Campus in a virtually inaccessible (by foot or transit) area? What is going on with them?

I had to take BT (Burlington Transit) yesterday, and it is by far the WORST service I have experienced in any city I have ever taken public transit in (incl. Mississauga & St Catharines).

Ridiculous.

Mac is governed by a very suburban mentality. Have you ever been in their student centre? It has all the ambience of a food court, complete with fast food joints. You'd never know you were in an institution of higher learning.

[fastcarsfreedom]

Interesting point Highwater--having spent time in several university's in the province I can assure you that as Student Center's go, Mac's is among the least institutional I've visited. It's probably also worth noting that the presence of fast food establishments is fairly commonplace amongst centers of "higher learning".

As for having a "suburban mentality"...well...I'm not even sure what that is, I should probably figure it out because I've been accused of having it myself. If you haven't noticed, Mac's campus isn't exactly "urban"--never has been. There is more to the future than Mac--I was speaking strictly on job creation. Pardon my ignorance--but is John Dolbec seriously a socialist? And if so, why is he running the CofC?

Bottom line here is that although there are some "issues" with Mac and Mac's growth--the institution's presence is a huge image booster for the city--and everyone ought to be damn thankful that there is such a dynamic institution in the city.

[raisethehammer]

Originally Posted by BCTed

From http://act.mcmaster.ca:

so now I know why groups like Mac waste their time publishing stuff like this. People like you actually believe them.
Here's a little insight into how I live my life - actions speak louder than words.
I don't care if they design the worlds largest sign, lit up so bright that people in Toronto can read it as it flashes - "MCMASTER WANTS TO ENCOURAGE TRANSIT USE AND WALKING AS MODES OF TRANSPORTATION".
Their actions say otherwise. Trying to remove transit from campus is the true flashing sign. Not some cute, idiotic sentence on their website. Next thing you'll be doing is telling us who to vote for based on what the politicians lawn sign says.

[BCTed]

Originally Posted by raisethehammer

so now I know why groups like Mac waste their time publishing stuff like this. People like you actually believe them.
Here's a little insight into how I live my life - actions speak louder than words.
I don't care if they design the worlds largest sign, lit up so bright that people in Toronto can read it as it flashes - "MCMASTER WANTS TO ENCOURAGE TRANSIT USE AND WALKING AS MODES OF TRANSPORTATION".
Their actions say otherwise. Trying to remove transit from campus is the true flashing sign. Not some cute, idiotic sentence on their website. Next thing you'll be doing is telling us who to vote for based on what the politicians lawn sign says.

You can see through charades better than I can and are much less gullible than I am. Great.

But McMaster pretty much has more demand for parking than it can supply. People have been forced to park in ridiculous not-for-parking spaces at times. That is real. There is no need to make a push to have more people parking on campus.

[BCTed]

Oh, and there appears to be a fair bit of action behind the words on that site. There appears to be an ACT office, a person who is apparently a full-time ACT co-ordinator, a McMaster "Car Free Day", a carpooling/ridesharing match board, transit tours, bike tours, pages upon pages of information on alternative forms of transportation, etc.

There seems to be a heck of a lot of work in creating what you seem to indicate is essentially nothing more than a ruse from a university that is hungry for more parkers.

[raisethehammer]

that's all nice and dandy....please remind me of that when I'm being dropped off in the middle of Main St hell instead of the campus on our so-called new and improved rapid transit route.

[BCTed]

Originally Posted by raisethehammer

that's all nice and dandy....please remind me of that when I'm being dropped off in the middle of Main St hell instead of the campus on our so-called new and improved rapid transit route.

What you say is also all nice and dandy, but I have already agreed with you that moving buses off-campus seems silly.

The whole crux of the discussion was that you claimed that parking was the sole reason for removing these buses: "and now taking away the best transit line in the city from campus. Mac is concerned about one thing...people paying their parking rates."

My response was that I believe parking is not the reason for the removal of buses.

You make it very difficult to engage in discussion/debate with you because you never concede anything and because your logic always falls apart at one or many places.

Let's do a little recap (paraphrased, obviously):

RTH: The only reason why buses are moving off-campus is because Mac wants more people paying for parking.

BCT: I don't like seeing the buses move off-campus either, but I don't believe that parking is the reason. Mac is in a parking crunch and is encouraging people to not drive to school or to share rides.

RTH: That encouragment is just a smokescreen with lots of words and no actions. I can see through it and you can't. That's the way I live my life.

BCT: Yes, but what about this action and this action and this action and this action?

RTH: Great, but buses still won't be coming on campus.

BCT: You can never be wrong. Your logic always breaks down.

RTH (prediction): As usual, you have added nothing of value here. How do I put you on ignore?

[raisethehammer]

haha..I should put you on ignore after that stupid recap. We agreed that the buses being moved is wrong, yet you still want to credit Mac for being so friendly to other modes of transportation. Suit yourself. Trying to harm the transit service to campus says otherwise. And lo and behold we hear from Steeltown that parking rates are going up soon. hmmm. I'm no rocket scientist but........