New BC Political Discussion - POST BC Election 2017

[Metro-One]

Originally Posted by whatnext

Yeah and that "notoriety" along with that after Expo 86 did nothing but lead to escalating housing costs for those who actually live and work here.

No thanks.

These Bread & Circuses can increasingly be hosted by the corrupt authoritarian regimes that have no voters to answer to.

Umm, so you want Vancouver to be back how it was pre Expo 86?

Tired of this small town mentality.

The notoriety has also given us great success in our tourist industries, has helped given us the critical population needed to expand our infrastructure, and to attract other businesses.

The extreme cost of living is not due to international notoriety, especially seeing how many far more world class / celebrated cities around the world have much lower housing prices.

The housing prices are due to poor regulations in our realty / development industries (which have allowed unbridled speculation), and poor zoning from the cities.

Nice try though!

[Prometheus]

Originally Posted by whatnext

Yeah and that "notoriety" along with that after Expo 86 did nothing but lead to escalating housing costs for those who actually live and work here.

No thanks.

So, it is your desire that Vancouver be a quiet, forgotten, non-destination city that drifts into obscurity? Along with all the other economic and cultural benefits of being an exciting, dynamic destination city, you desire that the 10.3 million annual tourists, the $4.8 billion annual injection into the city’s economy and the 70 thousand full-time jobs it supports disappear? That’s your vision for Vancouver? That’s your counsel to our city?

https://www.tourismvancouver.com/media/c.../vancouvers-tourism-industry-fast-facts/

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by Metro-One

If you include very needed infrastructure that we are still benefiting from today. (The Canada Line, Sea to Sky upgrades, Convention Centre, Olympic Oval in Richmond, etc...) Even the Olympic Village is now a lived in community that acted as the anchor to redevelop the SEFC area.

If anything the Vancouver Olympics were among the most responsibly managed Olympics.

Helping host the FIFA World Cup would have been a very minimal cost for the benefit, especially seeing how we already have the infrastructure in place! Let's not forget the BC place just had 500 million dollars of renovations done, making it arguably our nations flagship soccer stadium...... and now we are not using it for the World Cup?

Not to mention the social sense of unity it would have brought participating in a North American wide event.

I can tell you that living in Japan the Olympics were a big boost to notoriety for Vancouver, and these events do help when people are planning where to have their school trips, conventions, etc...

The world already knows where Vancouver is (or so the Lotusland ultra-nationalists keep screaming). You want to bring the continent together and boost our city's image, there's better ways than by handing a blank cheque to the sporting equivalent of herpes.

Let's not forget that Chicago and Minneapolis backed out for much the same reasons.

[GMD]

I love soccer, and I love big events coming to town, but it's time people started to tell FIFA to take their garbage contracts and conditions to the 3rd world where that kind of stuff belongs, so good on the NDP for this one.

"Helping host the FIFA World Cup would have been a very minimal cost for the benefit, especially seeing how we already have the infrastructure in place! Let's not forget the BC place just had 500 million dollars of renovations done, making it arguably our nations flagship soccer stadium...... and now we are not using it for the World Cup?"

The cost was an unknown, so was the benefit. Can't have a flagship stadium for soccer without real grass (one of the conditions - that I actually agree with! - in the contract)

[mezzanine]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

Let's not forget that Chicago and Minneapolis backed out for much the same reasons.

Yeah, Minnie's out.

I wondered why BC was so cautious as we already have a great stadium, but I suspect the biggest worry is security costs, which I suspect would be huge and overbudget. And surprise, FIFA puts that on the host stadium/region.

Beare reiterated Wednesday that the most troubling aspect of the bid agreement was the clause that allowed FIFA to unilaterally change the terms of the deal at any point.

"That poses significant risk to B.C. taxpayers," she said.

She also cited concerns over the costs around installing a temporary grass field at BC Place. Although a new $1.3 million dollar artificial turf field was installed in the dome for the the 2015 Women's World Cup, FIFA requires natural grass for the men to play on.

As well, the bid agreement requires local governments to cover the entire cost of security, something that should make British Columbians wary after the 2010 Winter Olympic Games experience where the original security estimate of $175 million ballooned to an actual cost of $900 million.

......
Vancouver journalist Bob Mackin of The Breaker.News website has highlighted further government guarantees demanded in FIFA bid documents, including a 10 year tax holiday for FIFA, its subsidiaries and the organizing committee.

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

The world already knows where Vancouver is (or so the Lotusland ultra-nationalists keep screaming). You want to bring the continent together and boost our city's image, there's better ways than by handing a blank cheque to the sporting equivalent of herpes.

Let's not forget that Chicago and Minneapolis backed out for much the same reasons.

(somewhat OT - did you hear about coal)

[Prometheus]

Originally Posted by GMD

The cost was an unknown, so was the benefit.

The general costs & benefits were not unknown. Only the exact costs & benefits were unknown, an unavoidable fact for an event that doesn't take place for another 8 years.

Toronto, which needs to substantially expand BMO Field (unlike Vancouver, which has all the stadium infrastructure already in place), estimated the cost of hosting 3 to 5 matches at $30 - $45 million.

The general benefits were known too. We know that the Women's World Cup brought in $83 million to Vancouver in 2015. And according to the report commissioned for the 2026 World Cup bid, hosting games in 2026 would bring in $160 - $620 million:

Hosting the 2026 FIFA World Cup™ could generate more than $5 billion in short-term economic activity, including supporting approximately 40,000 jobs and more than $1 billion in incremental worker earnings across North America, according to a study done by The Boston Consulting Group (BCG), a leading global management consulting firm. The overall net benefit to the region would be $3 – $4 billion.

The study further estimates that individual host cities could expect to see approximately $160 – $620 million in incremental economic activity. That translates to a net benefit of approximately $90 – $480 million per city after accounting for potential public costs.

So, even excluding all the benefits that would accrue to Vancouver as a World Cup host city in the years leading up to and following the actual event, what does a basic cost/benefit analysis tell you?

[Pinion]

.

[Prometheus]

Originally Posted by Pinion

We are not bidding on the World Cup, no.

Yes, we did bid on the World Cup. The BC NDP made multiple bids. But unlike Ontario, Quebec and Alberta, the BC NDP failed to submit an acceptable bid before the deadline. All of the NDP's bids were rejected by the United 2026 bid committee, which has now dropped Vancouver (a city thought to be a clear favourite, prior to the province's failed, last-minute negotiations) from further consideration.

http://www.news1130.com/2018/03/14/vancouver-running-world-cup-host/

http://vancouversun.com/news/local-news/...orth-american-bid-to-host-world-cup-2026

http://www.660news.com/2018/03/14/vancouver-running-world-cup-host-2/

[mezzanine]

Edmonton's out.

The Alberta government says it will not throw its financial support behind the City of Edmonton in its participation in a joint bid to host the 2026 World Cup.

In a statement Thursday afternoon, Alberta Culture and Tourism Minister Ricardo Miranda said there wasn’t enough information available at this time to be able to determine the full impact that hosting the soccer event would have on provincial taxpayers.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Metro-One

Umm, so you want Vancouver to be back how it was pre Expo 86?

Tired of this small town mentality.

The notoriety has also given us great success in our tourist industries, has helped given us the critical population needed to expand our infrastructure, and to attract other businesses.

That's funny, in every other thread you and others complain non-stop about how are infrastructure is horribly behind and out of date.

[WarrenC12]

Let's not forget this is a North America wide bid. Vancouver would be lucky to host a qualifier or two, from countries people have little interest in, with little local population.

It's nothing like the Women's World Cup, where we and the USA have strong teams and some passionate fans that were able to travel here. Don't forget our team is led by a local star:
Christine Sinclair, arguably one of the best female players in the world for the last decade. Tons of local support.

Yes of course the men's game is a bigger deal, but Vancouver would be getting crumbs, while filling the pockets of corrupt FIFA officials with BC taxpayer dollars.

[CanSpice]

Originally Posted by Metro-One

Helping host the FIFA World Cup would have been a very minimal cost for the benefit, especially seeing how we already have the infrastructure in place! Let's not forget the BC place just had 500 million dollars of renovations done, making it arguably our nations flagship soccer stadium...... and now we are not using it for the World Cup?

So just to speak to BC Place, here are a few related reasons why it's a good thing Vancouver pulled out:

1) FIFA wouldn't guarantee how many games would be in Vancouver. It could have been three, it could have been two. A 33% swing in potential revenues with no guarantees isn't how you make deals.
2) FIFA would have the unilateral ability to change the agreement to use BC Place after the province would have agreed to commit to pay for increased costs.
3) FIFA would have required exclusive use of BC Place for nearly two months. Other events already scheduled at that time would have to be moved or cancelled, leading to increased costs to the province.

It was a completely shitty deal with no guarantees of stable revenue while delivering huge uncertainties about how much it would actually cost. It's a really fantastic thing that the BC NDP pulled us out of that mess.

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by Prometheus

So, it is your desire that Vancouver be a quiet, forgotten, non-destination city that drifts into obscurity? Along with all the other economic and cultural benefits of being an exciting, dynamic destination city, you desire that the 10.3 million annual tourists, the $4.8 billion annual injection into the city’s economy and the 70 thousand full-time jobs it supports disappear? That’s your vision for Vancouver? That’s your counsel to our city?

https://www.tourismvancouver.com/media/c.../vancouvers-tourism-industry-fast-facts/

LOL, tell us about how high-paying all those tourism jobs are.

I love how people who have no clue try to paint Vancouver pre-1986 as some sort of dismal hellhole.

[CanSpice]

Originally Posted by Prometheus

So, it is your desire that Vancouver be a quiet, forgotten, non-destination city that drifts into obscurity? Along with all the other economic and cultural benefits of being an exciting, dynamic destination city, you desire that the 10.3 million annual tourists, the $4.8 billion annual injection into the city’s economy and the 70 thousand full-time jobs it supports disappear? That’s your vision for Vancouver? That’s your counsel to our city?

https://www.tourismvancouver.com/media/c.../vancouvers-tourism-industry-fast-facts/

I'm sorry but is Vancouver in that position now without the benefit of hosting a couple of World Cup games? How does not having those games completely blow up the existing tourism industry? By rejecting them does Vancouver now have to blow up all of its hotels or something? Talk about hyperbole, Vancouver's tourism industry is not going to "drift into obscurity" because it rejected a couple of soccer games.

[Prometheus]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Vancouver would be lucky to host a qualifier or two, from countries people have little interest in, with little local population.

Yes of course the men's game is a bigger deal, but Vancouver would be getting crumbs...

This is not what a TSN host/analyst is hearing. According to Blake Price of TSN:

Some news regarding the lost World Cup bid is coming on the show next.. There was more coming to Vancouver than you think.

All indications are that Vancouver would have been tapped to host the FIFA World Cup draw (seen by tens of millions worldwide), the FIFA Congress, and numerous test matches in the years and months leading up. Means weeks of rent paid to both the conference centre and BC Place.

Source: https://twitter.com/BlakePriceTSN

[Prometheus]

Originally Posted by CanSpice

How does not having those games completely blow up the existing tourism industry?

It doesn't. What gave you that moronic idea? My comment was in response to the poster (which I quoted) who asserted Vancouver's current popularity is a cause of the city's affordability issues and has expressed a fondness for pre-Expo 86 fame. Care to guess how much less economic activity from tourism Vancouver enjoyed pre-Expo 86 than today?

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by CanSpice

So just to speak to BC Place, here are a few related reasons why it's a good thing Vancouver pulled out:

1) FIFA wouldn't guarantee how many games would be in Vancouver. It could have been three, it could have been two. A 33% swing in potential revenues with no guarantees isn't how you make deals.
2) FIFA would have the unilateral ability to change the agreement to use BC Place after the province would have agreed to commit to pay for increased costs.
3) FIFA would have required exclusive use of BC Place for nearly two months. Other events already scheduled at that time would have to be moved or cancelled, leading to increased costs to the province.

It was a completely shitty deal with no guarantees of stable revenue while delivering huge uncertainties about how much it would actually cost. It's a really fantastic thing that the BC NDP pulled us out of that mess.

There's also the fact it would occur in our peak tourism season anyway, and most of the hotels are full.

[Pinion]

.

[Prometheus]

Blake Price is now reporting on TSN Radio that Vancouver was going to be tapped as the international headquarters for all the official pre-World Cup FIFA events, such as:

FIFA World Cup Draw
FIFA World Cup Gala
FIFA Congress

Imagine the NFL Draft and NBA All-Star Weekend multiplied by a hundred.

In addition to numerous pre-World Cup test matches, Blake is also reporting that the Vancouver Convention Centre was going to be rented by FIFA for weeks and that:

It wasn’t just three to five World Cups games...likely four or five World Cup games, maybe even a quarter-final, was coming the way of Vancouver.

https://dailyhive.com/vancouver/vancouver-hub-city-2026-fifa-world-cup