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  #2921  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2008, 5:57 PM
Bogue Bogue is offline
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Springdale's been in decline since the late 80's when I was a kid. I think they probably did a prudent thing in changing the interstate-facing side of it into a main-line shopping center. The part on the other side has gotten a bit better, though, than it was.

I think the ones that'll take the worst hit are the old shopping centers west of the interstate. If their better stores opt for Bell Air there'll be almost a mile-long stretch of restaurants backed by half-empty strip malls. The shopping corridor for that kind of shopping for the western suburbs is Schillinger and if the folks from the northern suburbs (and further, don't forget the 70,000 or so folk in the 4 AL counties just north of Mobile that send a ton of shoppers into town) aren't coming into town to buy things at BAM they can get the lower-end stuff in their own area. Midtown has lots of those businesses already scattered around it... just seems like the demographic as they are and as they're trending don't support that as a commercial area long-term. Might be in the area's best interest to bulldoze one of those big developments and build a large apt. complex to increase local residents. On the plus side, traffic in that area could get easier.

If I'm not mistaken, doesn't the condo plan for the old Gayfers building incorporate retail into its lower floors? Downtown Fairhope has a few nice boutiques as well in their area. I think such stores might work in the Springhill area in the near-term, but retail like that downtown might have to wait until all of these condo complexes come on-line and the residential mix is established. The folks in charge of store locations are probably going to want to be sure of a certain economic bracket and a certain level of foot traffic as well. I just tend to think that kind of thing is just a matter of time.

I also don't know what people are talking about when they say "there aren't enough wealthy people in Mobile" etc. Seriously? This is the coast, people! There are people living in multi-million-dollar houses all around the Bay and there's plenty of money in Springhill.

As for tourists there are soon to be 2 cruise ships permanently in rotation (not far off 200,000 tourists per year) and Mardi Gras is the single biggest tourism event in the state. The biggest tourism destination in the state is the beach area. That's not likely to be overtaken by Mobile proper, but a majority of those people still travel through here on their way there (for now). There's a handful of other things the city can do to increase tourism (which we have all gone over), but it's worth pointing out that the area is light-years ahead of the rest of the state in this facet of the economy and widening that gap every year as new stuff comes on-line. When the economy picks up again things will really take off.

My Ten Local Tourism Boosters: (in no particular order)

1. The Aquarium - Probably the most talked-about object of desire for tourism proponents. Some inkling that the city is pursuing this.
2. Amtrak - Need to make the city more accessible and we've seen w/ the whole mess that Carnival's had to go through re: busing people into Mobile that we're not well-enough-connected to mass transportation. This is more doable than a new airport b/c all the infrastructure is already in place.
3. Newer, Bigger Airport - See #2, but this one will require help from one of our sister cities in either MS or FL and neither seem capable of budging b/c of their states reticence to the idea.
4. A newer, larger Zoo - Great idea, but seems hard to find a location close-in to the city. May have to do like B'ham and put a bigger zoo in an adjacent community that's "sort of" close-in to town.
5. Waterpark - Probably would be successful and could be the most feasible of the projects, but location is again an issue.
6. National advertising campaign for Mardi Gras. I think this is already being done, but we need to amplify it a lot. This IS the original home of Carnival. We need to push our most successful tourism draw.
7. Downtown Marina - I don't mean one on the Mobile River in between some industrial cranes like the suggestion made by the development team. I mean put it where that pink hotel was on the Causeway. There's plenty of room there and if it has to be in conjunction w/ Spanish Fort then so be it. Putting one on piers jutting out into the bay from where the old gas station was on the side of the Causeway facing the Battleship would be even better. Making it quick & easy for downtown residents to sail or fish can be a draw for higher-end residents & having an attractive eastern entrance to the city makes the city as a whole more attractive. Plus it brings new people right up to the city.
8. A New Stadium - My only pie-in-the-sky objective. I'd like to replace the current Civic Center w/ a new open-air stadium done as a cooperative effort between USA & Mobile. The GMAC & Senior Bowl would get a new state-of-the-art place w/ the city's skyline as a backdrop. Just a new 40,000 seat facility with room to expand should that become necessary would be just about perfect. The old stadium could be sold to the school district.
9. An Opera Hall - Mobile has its own Symphony, Ballet Co., & Opera Co. and I believe they use a facility that is within the current Civic Center building. I think they would be better suited to having a concert hall of their own somewhere downtown. When the facility is not in use by one of the higher-level performing arts groups it could be available for small concerts like those put on in the Saenger at present or rented to churches/schools/civic groups for use in theatrical productions or events (graduations, speeches, etc.). These artists already draw a lot of people to the city and our artistic heritage is something for which we should be rightly proud.
10. Get the walkway over Water Street built. Simple, doable, and incredibly useful. They're working on it I suspect, but it sure seems to be taking forever.

Feel free to add your own.
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  #2922  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2008, 6:35 PM
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Excellent post, Bogue!
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  #2923  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2008, 7:22 PM
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Need some football tickets. Whats the new height of the Riverview since the crown has been added?
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  #2924  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2008, 7:57 PM
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Quote:
I also don't know what people are talking about when they say "there aren't enough wealthy people in Mobile" etc.
I just meant in comparison to markets where Saks currently has locations.

Quote:
If I'm not mistaken, doesn't the condo plan for the old Gayfers building incorporate retail into its lower floors?
There has been so much consolidation in department stores nationally. I wonder if it would be possible for someone with deep pockets to start a completely new department store that opened locations exclusively in downtown areas ?
I mean, it's really not *that* many years ago that our cities had functional downtown department stores, and downtowns everywhere appear to be starting to rebound.

Quote:
My Ten Local Tourism Boosters: (in no particular order)
I particularly like the aquarium, water park, and marina, because like planned Maritime Museum, they reflect Mobile's status as a waterfront city.
I think a water park on the order of Schlitterbahn would just about have to be in a suburban area, for the space consideration.
The aquarium, though, could be a nice downtown amenity tied in with the Maritime Museum, with some funky architecture to add to Mobile's current gems. I suggest not trying to be one of those "generic mega-aquariums" that tries to have a little bit of everything from around the world, so much as a place that really focuses on Mobile, Alabama, and the Gulf Coast.

I'm not keen on the zoo idea, not because I dislike zoos, but because I think it would be hard to find much "Mobile-specific" that other zoos everywhere haven't done already, and zoos can be expensive to do right.
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  #2925  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2008, 8:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bogue View Post

My Ten Local Tourism Boosters: (in no particular order)
I COMPLETELY agree with you!!! Took the words right outta my mouth!

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Originally Posted by Bogue View Post
1. The Aquarium - Probably the most talked-about object of desire for tourism proponents. Some inkling that the city is pursuing this.
There probably isn't enough room on this location, but I think that an aquarium here would do wonders for foot traffic throughout downtown.

http://maps.google.com/maps?utm_campaign...a-us-gm&utm_medium=mapshpp&utm_term=tour

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Originally Posted by Bogue View Post
2. Amtrak - Need to make the city more accessible and we've seen w/ the whole mess that Carnival's had to go through re: busing people into Mobile that we're not well-enough-connected to mass transportation. This is more doable than a new airport b/c all the infrastructure is already in place.
Well then, I guess it wasn't a good idea to tear down the old Amtrack station on Water Street

http://maps.google.com/maps?utm_campaign...a-us-gm&utm_medium=mapshpp&utm_term=tour

Then again, it was full of asbestos (I think). Maybe the can construct a new one adjacent to the cruise terminal. But I'm wondering, what about the other train traffic? How would they share the lines?

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Originally Posted by Bogue View Post
3. Newer, Bigger Airport - See #2, but this one will require help from one of our sister cities in either MS or FL and neither seem capable of budging b/c of their states reticence to the idea.
I AGREE! But I wish somehow they could combine a commercial and industrial airport into one (like the one in Hong Kong).
http://maps.google.com/maps?utm_campaign...a-us-gm&utm_medium=mapshpp&utm_term=tour

But we don't have the number of flyers, and I think that this area is just to small

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Originally Posted by Bogue View Post
4. A newer, larger Zoo - Great idea, but seems hard to find a location close-in to the city. May have to do like B'ham and put a bigger zoo in an adjacent community that's "sort of" close-in to town.
I think the land just north of the Orange Grove area is ideal.

http://maps.google.com/maps?utm_campaign...a-us-gm&utm_medium=mapshpp&utm_term=tour

I really would have liked this the OG area to get some mixed use...Retail/Residential. Kind of like the neighborhoods in Brooklyn.


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Originally Posted by Bogue View Post
5. Waterpark - Probably would be successful and could be the most feasible of the projects, but location is again an issue.
No ideas on this either...but, I think Prichard would be nice. Once the city cleans up SIGNIFICANTLY...This area will proseper due to it's proximity downtown. I wish they would realize this and work harder to reverse their image!

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Originally Posted by Bogue View Post
6. National advertising campaign for Mardi Gras. I think this is already being done, but we need to amplify it a lot. This IS the original home of Carnival. We need to push our most successful tourism draw.
NOLA is ALWAYS gonna battle us out on this one! They wouldn't dare let us steal their spolight! But I agree that we should. It IS the original home of Carnival.

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Originally Posted by Bogue View Post
7. Downtown Marina - I don't mean one on the Mobile River in between some industrial cranes like the suggestion made by the development team. I mean put it where that pink hotel was on the Causeway. There's plenty of room there and if it has to be in conjunction w/ Spanish Fort then so be it. Putting one on piers jutting out into the bay from where the old gas station was on the side of the Causeway facing the Battleship would be even better. Making it quick & easy for downtown residents to sail or fish can be a draw for higher-end residents & having an attractive eastern entrance to the city makes the city as a whole more attractive. Plus it brings new people right up to the city.
I like this idea! But then again there are the stupid hurricanes. GOD! If it wasn't for the hurricanes, we could have so much more development along the causeway.

http://maps.google.com/maps?utm_campaign...a-us-gm&utm_medium=mapshpp&utm_term=tour

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Originally Posted by Bogue View Post
8. A New Stadium - My only pie-in-the-sky objective. I'd like to replace the current Civic Center w/ a new open-air stadium done as a cooperative effort between USA & Mobile. The GMAC & Senior Bowl would get a new state-of-the-art place w/ the city's skyline as a backdrop. Just a new 40,000 seat facility with room to expand should that become necessary would be just about perfect. The old stadium could be sold to the school district.
At first I was SURE I was against this, then I read number 9!

I agree, but I just don't think this will happen until Mobile gets a pro team (which WILL happen). I mean, COME ON! How could an area that loves football SOOOO much not want/support a pro team??? You can quote me on this: IT WILL HAPPEN!!!! And an NBA team too! You don't believe me? Just wait and see.

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Originally Posted by Bogue View Post
9. An Opera Hall - Mobile has its own Symphony, Ballet Co., & Opera Co. and I believe they use a facility that is within the current Civic Center building. I think they would be better suited to having a concert hall of their own somewhere downtown. When the facility is not in use by one of the higher-level performing arts groups it could be available for small concerts like those put on in the Saenger at present or rented to churches/schools/civic groups for use in theatrical productions or events (graduations, speeches, etc.). These artists already draw a lot of people to the city and our artistic heritage is something for which we should be rightly proud.
I've been thinking about this as well.

http://maps.google.com/maps?utm_campaign...a-us-gm&utm_medium=mapshpp&utm_term=tour

Maybe if that church (sorry can't remember the name at the moment-adjacent to Space 301) to give up this surface lot...but I don't see that happening. Then again, there is space here on Dauphin

http://maps.google.com/maps?utm_campaign...a-us-gm&utm_medium=mapshpp&utm_term=tour

It's right around the corner from the Saenger. They could use the lot for the lobby, and loft the rest of the building over the other existing ones on the block. I've seen it done somewhere...I just can't remember where...


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Originally Posted by Bogue View Post
10. Get the walkway over Water Street built. Simple, doable, and incredibly useful. They're working on it I suspect, but it sure seems to be taking forever.
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  #2926  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2008, 10:06 PM
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I just meant in comparison to markets where Saks currently has locations.



There has been so much consolidation in department stores nationally. I wonder if it would be possible for someone with deep pockets to start a completely new department store that opened locations exclusively in downtown areas ?
I mean, it's really not *that* many years ago that our cities had functional downtown department stores, and downtowns everywhere appear to be starting to rebound.



I particularly like the aquarium, water park, and marina, because like planned Maritime Museum, they reflect Mobile's status as a waterfront city.
I think a water park on the order of Schlitterbahn would just about have to be in a suburban area, for the space consideration.
The aquarium, though, could be a nice downtown amenity tied in with the Maritime Museum, with some funky architecture to add to Mobile's current gems. I suggest not trying to be one of those "generic mega-aquariums" that tries to have a little bit of everything from around the world, so much as a place that really focuses on Mobile, Alabama, and the Gulf Coast.

I'm not keen on the zoo idea, not because I dislike zoos, but because I think it would be hard to find much "Mobile-specific" that other zoos everywhere haven't done already, and zoos can be expensive to do right.
Mobile technically has an aquarium. The estuarium is a pretty cool place. when I visited, it was very cool. It represented all of the species in Alabama and did specific studies of the different ecosystems in the state.

If Mobile builds one in downtown, it should represent all the ecosystems in Alabama. It doesn't need to have gigantic whale sharks or stupid stuff like that, it needs to bring together all that Alabama has. I think it would be cool to have like a river flowing through the entire length of the aquarium, and have the bottom of it made of thick gass so that wherever you are along the walking route you can look up and see all the different systems as the river gets closer to the gulf. THAT, I believe, would be something that no other aquarium has. Plus, it's more than doable.
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  #2927  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2008, 10:15 PM
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Mobile technically has an aquarium. The estuarium is a pretty cool place. when I visited, it was very cool. It represented all of the species in Alabama and did specific studies of the different ecosystems in the state.

If Mobile builds one in downtown, it should represent all the ecosystems in Alabama. It doesn't need to have gigantic whale sharks or stupid stuff like that, it needs to bring together all that Alabama has. I think it would be cool to have like a river flowing through the entire length of the aquarium, and have the bottom of it made of thick gass so that wherever you are along the walking route you can look up and see all the different systems as the river gets closer to the gulf. THAT, I believe, would be something that no other aquarium has. Plus, it's more than doable.

Now that is the best idea ever for an aquarium ! since we have one in N.O , ATL and Chatta. you idea would set it apart from the others !!
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  #2928  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2008, 10:28 PM
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I hope this doesn't come across as "bashing" Mobile, but I don't think Mobile is big enough or wealthy enough to support upper-end retail with its local market alone. I think you'd have to bring in a lot of tourists, whether it is downtown or anywhere else in metro Mobile. About the only somewhat small markets I can think of that have stores like Saks are places like Charleston, Sarasota, and Naples that attract significant numbers of wealthy tourists.
(I'll add that little San Marcos has big outlet stores for both Saks and Neiman Marcus )
Of course, mention the possibility of expanding tourism to many Alabamians, and the response you'll get is that "tourism creates only minimum-wage jobs."

I think mobile is wealthy enough ,almost every month there is a wealthy family moving in the Mobile area buying a 1.3 million dollar house or something on the bay. you would be seprised who would buy a pair of shoes from Saks and they don`t have to be wealthy either. Saks aren`t huge department stores like Dillards they are small so it shoulden`t be that hard to support it. My Girlfriend bought a pair of Purple colored Gucci shoes when she was in New York 2 years ago to visit family and we are college students. When I looked on the gucci web site I saw a pair of Chocolate colored Gucci shoes for men and I`m getting a pair for my birthday( Oct/25).
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  #2929  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2008, 11:36 PM
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Saks aren`t huge department stores like Dillards they are small so it shoulden`t be that hard to support it.
Saks doesn't locate in many metro areas with Mobile's population, though.
Whether they should is another topic for debate...

Quote:
Mobile technically has an aquarium. The estuarium is a pretty cool place. when I visited, it was very cool. It represented all of the species in Alabama and did specific studies of the different ecosystems in the state.

If Mobile builds one in downtown, it should represent all the ecosystems in Alabama.
I agree. I've been to the Estuarium a couple times, as well.
It's nice and I like its focus, but I'd like to see something a whole lot larger, like you mention.
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  #2930  
Old Posted Aug 9, 2008, 6:06 AM
NitekKetin NitekKetin is offline
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Originally Posted by Bogue View Post
Springdale's been in decline since the late 80's when I was a kid. I think they probably did a prudent thing in changing the interstate-facing side of it into a main-line shopping center. The part on the other side has gotten a bit better, though, than it was...
Gayfers, the largest department store in Alabama, was the reason Springdale Mall was able to hold its own against Bel Air for years. The acquisition of the chain by Dillards was the event that triggered the mall's eventual 'decline'.
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  #2931  
Old Posted Aug 9, 2008, 3:33 PM
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Originally Posted by NitekKetin View Post
Gayfers, the largest department store in Alabama, was the reason Springdale Mall was able to hold its own against Bel Air for years. The acquisition of the chain by Dillards was the event that triggered the mall's eventual 'decline'.
sigh......the death of a mall.....
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  #2932  
Old Posted Aug 9, 2008, 3:43 PM
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sigh......the death of a mall.....
This sounds so familiar...

Montgomery Mall (up here in Montgomery, AL) went through this exact type of scenario a number of years ago. I certainly hope the Bel Air Mall can avoid the same fate...
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  #2933  
Old Posted Aug 9, 2008, 7:05 PM
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Now that is the best idea ever for an aquarium ! since we have one in N.O , ATL and Chatta. you idea would set it apart from the others !!
OMG!!! Did I really just come up with a good idea for once!!?? Wow....
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  #2934  
Old Posted Aug 9, 2008, 10:49 PM
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I know this is off subject and has nothing to do with urban development but I was hoping yall might be able to help me out on this. I’ll be moving back to Mobile Co. in late Dec. or early Jan. I will need to join a gym. I’m actually from Citronelle so I have no idea what gyms are good in Mobile are where there are located. The only one that I could find online that looked good was World Gym. Any others that are better?
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  #2935  
Old Posted Aug 9, 2008, 11:33 PM
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OMG!!! Did I really just come up with a good idea for once!!?? Wow....
I liked your idea too. But I do wonder if you don't need all the typical high profile fish in your tanks to make it work (the big sharks, rays, exotics, etc). I know the point of such a place is to draw tourism, but I wonder if these places don't need the traffic of repeat locals using the place to make them really work over time. The kids wanna see the fish they only get to see on tv. Hell, same for me to tell you the truth. I'm an outdoors buff and love to freshwater fish in the rural areas here in NW Florida when I have rare free time, but I'm not sure how excited I'd be to go to a (more than once in a lifetime) tank filled with all the local bay/river/lake life that I or any other local can see every free weekend. So I think you probably have to have at least a tank filled with all the Supersized "wow-factor" McFish that every kid (and me and probably every northerner) expects to see to keep 'em coming back for more.
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  #2936  
Old Posted Aug 9, 2008, 11:44 PM
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I liked your idea too. But I do wonder if you don't need all the typical high profile fish in your tanks to make it work (the big sharks, rays, exotics, etc). I know the point of such a place is to draw tourism, but I wonder if these places don't need the traffic of repeat locals using the place to make them really work over time. The kids wanna see the fish they only get to see on tv. Hell, same for me to tell you the truth. I'm an outdoors buff and love to freshwater fish in the rural areas here in NW Florida when I have rare free time, but I'm not sure how excited I'd be to go to a (more than once in a lifetime) tank filled with all the local bay/river/lake life that I or any other local can see every free weekend. So I think you probably have to have at least a tank filled with all the Supersized "wow-factor" McFish that every kid (and me and probably every northerner) expects to see to keep 'em coming back for more.
I guess that is the overall purpose of an aquarium or zoo. To have visitors who feel like they're are really getting their money's worh, and want to come back. Although, I agree that a local emphasis should be made. What with the maritime museum and all. It kind of ties everything in together. If they can somehow build it the exploreum, then the Maritime Museum, the Exploreum, and the "aquarium" could be one Mega-Plex (so to speak) of learning.
And besides that, it'll look GREAT!

But they should definitely build it "right" if they're going to at all. Might as well get a large, decent, nice aquarium while they're at it.
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  #2937  
Old Posted Aug 9, 2008, 11:44 PM
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I liked your idea too. But I do wonder if you don't need all the typical high profile fish in your tanks to make it work (the big sharks, rays, exotics, etc). I know the point of such a place is to draw tourism, but I wonder if these places don't need the traffic of repeat locals using the place to make them really work over time. The kids wanna see the fish they only get to see on tv. Hell, same for me to tell you the truth. I'm an outdoors buff and love to freshwater fish in the rural areas here in NW Florida when I have rare free time, but I'm not sure how excited I'd be to go to a (more than once in a lifetime) tank filled with all the local bay/river/lake life that I or any other local can see every free weekend. So I think you probably have to have at least a tank filled with all the Supersized "wow-factor" McFish that every kid (and me and probably every northerner) expects to see to keep 'em coming back for more.
I agree
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  #2938  
Old Posted Aug 10, 2008, 5:33 AM
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phoenix...

I was referring to the GM&O as an intermodal facility next to the tracks. The additional traffic issue would need to be settled, but the infrastructure is still there... esp. the most expensive part (the tracks), though if an extra spur leading down from the main trunk line that Amtrak traditionally used is needed then it might be worthwhile to at least see how much that costs.

On the marina: A marina in the nature I'm suggesting would really be almost entirely made up of piers w/ a small, raised building in a traditional Gulf Coast style close to the land portion. I don't see the danger of a hurricane affecting such a structure as being more significant than one affecting Felix's or Oysterella's, etc. It would obviously be difficult to insure, but b/c it's not residential and the actual cost for replacement would be comparatively small (relative to other types of development) then it would be among the least-risky propositions for land use along that stretch.

I don't know where would be a "best" location for a waterpark, but I think perhaps where I-65 & -I-10 join might be good. That's sort of functioning as the western entrance to the city at present, it's convenient to most everyone, & there's still a lot of land that's unused or barely used in that area, though I think a lot of that is due to the geography of the area (meaning, I think it's swampy).

as far as my #8... it's a pie-in-the-sky thing & I said so, but there are lots of partnerships between local governments and college teams out there. (The University of Minnesota's building a beautiful new stadium right now that would be about the perfect type of design for what I had in mind.. Theirs is 50K but made to be easily expandable to over 80K & features a horseshoe-style design w/ the open end looking directly out on the skyline of Minneapolis).

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At first I was SURE I was against this, then I read number 9!
Not really sure what you mean by that.

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I mean, COME ON! How could an area that loves football SOOOO much not want/support a pro team?
You've been in Phoenix too long

Folks down here are bigger college football fans & while they've already got their teams picked from birth, the Sr. Bowl & GMAC generally do very well & I suspect USA will be good for around 20K or so at their home games if they market well. The Saints being in NOLA pretty much keeps Mobile out of the running for a NFL team, but the folks in NOLA seem to constantly be threatened by the owner over there about his moving the team to San Antonio. I'm not really a fan of his, to put it bluntly.

I'd also much rather have a MLB team than a NBA team. Baseball plays more home games and has more players so it'd make a greater impact on the area. Plus, it just fits the area's tradition better. I think only 2 cities have more people per-capita in the MLB HOF than Mobile.

On the Opera Hall - I like the idea of lofting it over structures, provided those structures don't interfere w/ the acoustics (like having a club downstairs, etc.)

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Druid:

I think the reason for the consolidations in the dept. store business is that they're not as profitable as they used to be. Even stalwarts like Macy's have had issues recently. It's not really the economy, but rather the focus shifting away from the "in-town general store" mentality that led to the rise of the dept. stores to the specialized shop ideology that you go to a certain store to buy a certain type of clothes that's designed to fit a certain iconography (A&F preps, Hot Topic emo kids, etc.). This is sort of the culmination of something the dept. stores kickstarted by focusing on clothing so much. You still have a few dept.'s in a dept. store, but the majority of the sales floor is devoted to clothes. In their heyday the dept. store sold everything. They were like Wal-Marts w/ multiple floors. General Stores on steroids. I think we're seeing the end of the dept. store era as we traditionally interpret it.

The zoo idea stems from the popularity of the zoo in/near Gulf Shores and the fact that most cities of a certain size have one. While I believe Mobile has one I don't think most of the citizenry even knows where it is located. It's more a relocation idea than a start-up in that sense. Mobile, due to its location and subtropical climate, lends itself to the possibility of becoming a great location for a large zoo. It would be very cool to be an eastern version of the San Diego Zoo, though the start-up expense would be massive. I see your point, I just disagree that it wouldn't be worthwhile to have something better than the current option. While it's great to have lots of things focused on local cultural aspects, sometimes certain amenities/attractions are universal. Every kid loves to see the lions, tigers, elephants, penguins, monkeys, & giraffe's etc. I agree that an aquarium would be a facet of the attractions that could successfully be geared towards the city, but zoos are almost always more about entertaining locals.

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Quote:
I think it would be cool to have like a river flowing through the entire length of the aquarium, and have the bottom of it made of thick gass so that wherever you are along the walking route you can look up and see all the different systems as the river gets closer to the gulf. THAT, I believe, would be something that no other aquarium has.
Great idea, but I believe that a similar (though less cool) version of that will be undertaken in the new Bass Pro Shop across the bay.

There are lots of interesting aquatic fauna in Alabama, but focusing too much on our state limits us needlessly. We are Mobile... the capital of old West Florida AND the original capital of Louisiana... Why not expand the fauna possibilities to our sister states to the east (FL) & west (MS & LA). That gives you a massive range of possibilities. I like the idea of the river system moving through the facility, but maybe do it in sections on the inward side of a downward spiral from an upper floor (windows looking out on the city on one side and exhibits on the inward side) and design the structure in a wide turret? That way you could also have a large central tank that was several stories high and could have clear tubular walkways leading through it at different levels in arcs around the perimeter. This would provide room for both types of exhibits w/o a lot of wasted space. Visitors would simply take an elevator to the top at the entrance to the building and start their walk down. It's worth pointing out also that the bottom two floors of the building would have to have their exhibits taken elsewhere should a hurricane come. Making a tall, cylindrical structure (perhaps 5 stories tall) would give you the possibility of putting the least-mobile exhibits (sharks, etc.) in the main tank (start it on the 3rd floor w/ strong support structure beneath it) and above, w/ the more mobile, smaller exhibits (like crabs, childrens exhibits, etc. in the two lowest floors. Having the buffer of a walkway area and the physical mass of the external exhibits (which could be equipped w/ roll-down metal storm shutters to protect them) would help protect the more expensive residents & structure of the main tank. It would be an expensive structure, but it would be unique & have all the things you'd ever want in an aquarium.

Quote:
Gayfers, the largest department store in Alabama, was the reason Springdale Mall was able to hold its own against Bel Air for years. The acquisition of the chain by Dillards was the event that triggered the mall's eventual 'decline'.
Yeah, but I think a lot of their sustainability was based on leeching customers off the much larger Bel-Air across the street. I also remember not being such a big fan of Springdale when I was a kid and Gayfers was still very much a going concern. Mom only went over there to go to that store, though. Now the only reason I ever go there is to go to Barnes & Noble or Best Buy.

Quote:
death of a mall
HAHA! That sounds like a band name.
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  #2939  
Old Posted Aug 10, 2008, 1:39 PM
nimsjus nimsjus is offline
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Some downtown news from the real estate column...
The city of Mobile is negotiating to buy a four-story building at 200 Government St., city officials said. The 25,000-square-foot building is listed for $1 million by developer Bernie Malkove .
In google street view this address pulls up the old WEAR3 building at Govt and Conception.
also...
Fowlkes McPherson Insur ance has purchased a 7,200-square-foot office building at 803 Government St., for $700,000, according to Frank Fowlkes , president of the company. The insurance firm has moved its offices there, and most of the two-story building is leased by Aerostar Environmental Services . Starke Irvine of the Irvine Co. in Daphne handled the transaction
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  #2940  
Old Posted Aug 10, 2008, 10:03 PM
phoenixboi08's Avatar
phoenixboi08 phoenixboi08 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bogue View Post
Not really sure what you mean by that.
What I meant was that everyone is so gung ho to get rid of the civic center and build a stadium, no ever thinks about the issue that it actually serves more for theater/auditorium type entertainment rather than sports, etc...
You took this into consideration (with the proposal of the Opera Hall).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bogue View Post
You've been in Phoenix too long

Folks down here are bigger college football fans & while they've already got their teams picked from birth, the Sr. Bowl & GMAC generally do very well & I suspect USA will be good for around 20K or so at their home games if they market well. The Saints being in NOLA pretty much keeps Mobile out of the running for a NFL team, but the folks in NOLA seem to constantly be threatened by the owner over there about his moving the team to San Antonio. I'm not really a fan of his, to put it bluntly.
I'd also much rather have a MLB team than a NBA team. Baseball plays more home games and has more players so it'd make a greater impact on the area. Plus, it just fits the area's tradition better. I think only 2 cities have more people per-capita in the MLB HOF than Mobile.
Hmmm...very true. I always seem to forget about baseball.
On one hand, I understand that the people here love college football. But I refuse to believe the notion that a pro team couldn't peak interest and earn a following.

I've benn living in Mobile long enough!


Quote:
Originally Posted by Bogue View Post
The zoo idea stems from the popularity of the zoo in/near Gulf Shores and the fact that most cities of a certain size have one. While I believe Mobile has one I don't think most of the citizenry even knows where it is located. It's more a relocation idea than a start-up in that sense. Mobile, due to its location and subtropical climate, lends itself to the possibility of becoming a great location for a large zoo. It would be very cool to be an eastern version of the San Diego Zoo, though the start-up expense would be massive. I see your point, I just disagree that it wouldn't be worthwhile to have something better than the current option. While it's great to have lots of things focused on local cultural aspects, sometimes certain amenities/attractions are universal. Every kid loves to see the lions, tigers, elephants, penguins, monkeys, & giraffe's etc. I agree that an aquarium would be a facet of the attractions that could successfully be geared towards the city, but zoos are almost always more about entertaining locals.
Attractions like zoos and museums attract the LOCALS. I mean sure, if it's the Smithsonian or the San Diego, you're gonna get your fair share of tourists...but one of the most important things is to stimulate the locals. That's how tourists come to be..they hear it from the locals. My point is that they really should invest in attempting to really tie these attractions into the downtown core. It helps sell the residential aspect of a city, when it has these kinds of amenities nearby.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Bogue View Post
There are lots of interesting aquatic fauna in Alabama, but focusing too much on our state limits us needlessly. We are Mobile... the capital of old West Florida AND the original capital of Louisiana... Why not expand the fauna possibilities to our sister states to the east (FL) & west (MS & LA). That gives you a massive range of possibilities. I like the idea of the river system moving through the facility, but maybe do it in sections on the inward side of a downward spiral from an upper floor (windows looking out on the city on one side and exhibits on the inward side) and design the structure in a wide turret? That way you could also have a large central tank that was several stories high and could have clear tubular walkways leading through it at different levels in arcs around the perimeter. This would provide room for both types of exhibits w/o a lot of wasted space. Visitors would simply take an elevator to the top at the entrance to the building and start their walk down. It's worth pointing out also that the bottom two floors of the building would have to have their exhibits taken elsewhere should a hurricane come. Making a tall, cylindrical structure (perhaps 5 stories tall) would give you the possibility of putting the least-mobile exhibits (sharks, etc.) in the main tank (start it on the 3rd floor w/ strong support structure beneath it) and above, w/ the more mobile, smaller exhibits (like crabs, childrens exhibits, etc. in the two lowest floors. Having the buffer of a walkway area and the physical mass of the external exhibits (which could be equipped w/ roll-down metal storm shutters to protect them) would help protect the more expensive residents & structure of the main tank. It would be an expensive structure, but it would be unique & have all the things you'd ever want in an aquarium.
I LIKE. Kinda like me proposal a few posts back (http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?p=3671991#post3671991 post #2455)...only I didn't extend the coulumn completely to the ground.









I'm no architect, but in MY world of physics, it could happen
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