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  #2841  
Old Posted May 10, 2011, 2:23 PM
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CorbeauNoir CorbeauNoir is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fenwick16 View Post
Here is the link to the survey - link.

It is interesting to note that only 34% either disagree or completely disagree. So the ratio of in favour versus against is almost 2:1 (5% had no opinion regarding a stadium, and because of rounding errors the result adds up to only 99%).
The first-past-the-post system in action!
     
     
  #2842  
Old Posted May 11, 2011, 3:34 AM
fenwick16 fenwick16 is offline
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I have spent the past 5 - 6 weeks playing around with SketchUp in my spare time. This is my fantasy stadium for Halifax.

Of all the stadiums that I have looked at on the internet over the past 18 months (a couple of hundred at least), I like the Stanford design the most - it is compact, economical (50,000 seats at $90 million dollars), and practical. It is a basic design that is arranged to give good sight-lines and the Stanford design looks quite good, in my opinion. So that is what I based my imaginary design on.

These sketches show some ideas that I think would give an economical stadium design with lots of versatility (such as being easy to convert seating areas to club seats or luxury boxes). The design is based on repeating 50 foot wide sections (only the corners are a bit of an exception), double, unheated concourses connect to central washrooms and concessions on both sides, which are essentially separate but integrated buildings. The roof would only cover the upper tier, while people in the lower tier could go under the upper tier for shelter from the rain and sun. The roof is based on the Kansas City Wizards Stadium design which I think is a fairly basic cantilever roof design (as an interesting side note, it looks similar to a design in this 105 year old book - link). I imagine a fairly modest overhang of about 60 feet (minimizing the unsupported overhang will reduce the roof cost). Under the back of the roof there is space which could be used (in the future) for additional club seats.

In the fully built configuration it would seat 42,000 (below). I didn't draw the roof covering, just the supports to show the size. (I also haven't shown the tunnel to the change-rooms from the center sidelines) One way to reduce the seating capacity would be to cut out the upper corner seats and one end, then the layout would look similar to the Princeton Stadium.


Another way to reduce the capacity from 42,000 down to 25,000 is with a layout like the one below. Although not the least expensive layout for 25,000 seats, it would provide cover, either under the roof or under the stands, for all spectators. It would also lend itself to be easily expanded to ~30,000 by completing the horseshoe. Then by completely enclosing the field it could be expanded to the final capacity of 42,000. The layout below is somewhat like the Boise, Idaho Brono's stadium.
(this is just how I imagine a stadium might be - the possibilities are endless).


The lower seating bowl could be built so that the top couple of rows could be converted from general seating to club seating/luxury suites, and preferably should include 1% of the total stadium capacity as wheelchair accessible seating plus guest(s) (i.e. have portable chairs for guests of wheelchair spectators). The National Building Code requires fewer than this but new stadium designs such as the renovated Ottawa Landsdown proposal are providing 1%. All wheelchair accessible seating would be at street level to minimize ramps, and avoid costly elevators. Since this is a sunken bowl design, street level is the first concourse level between the lower and upper bowl. The wheelchair accessible areas are elevated (double row height) and two rows wide so that people in wheelchairs can see over the heads of standing spectators and have easy access. The 50 foot wide repeating segments are built so that the seats can go right to the top of the lower bowl, or have a row of wheelchair accessible seating plus club-seat boxes at the top of the lower bowl, or two rows of wheelchair accessible seating at the top of each lower bowl segment. The three options are shown in the following image (three 50 foot segments with alternate seating arrangements):


If there is ever a need, the top of the upper tier (under the back of the roof) could be opened for additional club seats/luxury suites all around (like Lambeau Field)


The double level, open air concourses, would lead to the centralized washrooms and concessions (the white block in front which would have two levels of washrooms and concessions while the basement would contain player changerooms). The open-air concourses would be unfinished but would provide lots of space for spectators to get cover from the rain and move around the stadium. There would be about 4 square feet of concourse space for every spectator which is in line with the current industry recommended standard of 3.5 - 4 square feet of circulation space per spectator.


This the first level of the concourse near the centralized washrooms and concession area (it would be functional with sufficient washroom and concession space):


This is the 2nd concourse level which would have similar washroom and concession areas as the first level. The 2nd level is at the 2nd tier vomitorium level . There would be 4 large men's washrooms and 4 large women's washrooms for 25,000 seats (more would be added at the ends if expanded). There are 8 centralized concession areas on both sides of the stadium.

Last edited by fenwick16; Jun 4, 2011 at 1:53 PM. Reason: added a couple of images
     
     
  #2843  
Old Posted May 11, 2011, 1:06 PM
icetea93 icetea93 is offline
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Love that design! I hope they build something like this...
     
     
  #2844  
Old Posted May 11, 2011, 1:51 PM
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Wow! I love that too! Great combination of practicality, economy & attractiveness. I have to agree with your modular idea. This could be the finished product after a couple of successful CFL seasons with open end zones! I really think you have nailed the need for moderate beginnings while incorporating the infrastructure for future growth.
     
     
  #2845  
Old Posted May 11, 2011, 11:30 PM
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Fantastic Design Fenwick! I am really impressed with your designs. This looks like a solid stadium without all the expensive frills. The steering commitee would be wise to look at this model when proposing a design.
     
     
  #2846  
Old Posted May 14, 2011, 2:32 PM
fenwick16 fenwick16 is offline
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Thanks for the comments icetea93, Northend Guy, q12, halifaxboyns and Empire.



I checked the halifax.ca stadium link and I see that the municipality has a facebook page and a twitter account set up. Here are the links:

twitter link PS:It seems like you need to click the link and then click refresh in order to see this HRM link (is this a problem with Twitter?).

facebook link

PS: Now that the Halifax Regional Municipality has a halifax.ca stadium website - link, a Twitter account and facebook page, I have taken my website halifaxstadium.ca offline and have a message recommending that people go to the HRM website. This is to prevent any confusion between my old website and the municipality website. I didn't do much of a job of adding new information to it

Last edited by fenwick16; May 21, 2011 at 1:11 PM.
     
     
  #2847  
Old Posted May 15, 2011, 7:05 AM
halifaxboyns halifaxboyns is offline
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Wow Fenwick - that's an impressive design and you did a lot of thinking in terms how to accommodate everyone (including those with disabilities). It's a solid design and I agree, the committee would be wise to have a look at it.

I didn't see a like button on the facebook page; I'll have to go back and see if it has one.
     
     
  #2848  
Old Posted May 15, 2011, 12:29 PM
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This is a great design. Very compact and the roof seems to work better than an oval. Press boxes and club suites could be built in or added later which is a great feature of the design.
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  #2849  
Old Posted May 21, 2011, 1:15 PM
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Pros and Cons of Stadium Sought
thechronicleherald.ca/Metro/1244449.html
     
     
  #2850  
Old Posted May 21, 2011, 1:16 PM
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Pros, cons of stadium sought

http://thechronicleherald.ca/Metro/1244449.html
Sat, May 21 - 4:54 AM

Do you support the concept of a multi-use stadium in the Halifax region? Or is such a notion unpalatable?

A city hall consultant is conducting a $100,000 feasibility study on the proposed project. The municipality wants to hear from citizens on the pros and cons of a stadium, a release Friday said.

Open houses are going to be hosted next month. Each session is to run for two hours.

A report and recommendation from the city’s stadium steering committee will go to Halifax regional council this summer, at which time council is to decide if the municipality will move on to the second phase — site selection, design, a building schedule and detailed facility costing.

Halifax Regional Municipality officials have said a stadium could cost about $60 million. Mayor Peter Kelly has said funding for the proposed venue would come from the three levels of government and private sector. He’s said the bottom line is unknown at this point.

The steering committee is working with timelines provided by the Canadian Soccer Association, which is preparing for the FIFA Women’s World Cup in Canada 2015. A test event prior to the World Cup is planned.

Open house dates and times are as follows:

•June 6: 6:30-8:30 p.m., Maritime Hall at the Halifax Forum, 2901 Windsor St.

•June 8: 6:30-8:30 p.m., Cole Harbour Place, 51 Forest Hills Pky.

•June 9: 6:30-8:30 p.m., Lion’s Den, LeBrun Recreation Centre, 36 Holland Dr.
     
     
  #2851  
Old Posted May 21, 2011, 1:16 PM
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I just checked the HRM Halifax Stadium Twitter account and see that there are open houses planned for June. The municipality really seems to be serious about building a stadium. The news about Winnipeg getting an NHL team again has created a lot of excitement in that city. I think that Halifax building a stadium and getting a CFL team would create some similar excitement in the Halifax area. (I just noticed that q12 also simultaneously posted a story with the same posting time)

(source: http://www.halifax.ca/mediaroom/pressrelease/pr2011/110520StadiumAnalysisConsultations.html )
Quote:
NEWS RELEASE

Stadium Analysis Consultations Underway, Open Houses Coming Up

(Friday, May 20, 2011) - Public consultations will begin shortly to help determine if there is a viable business case for a stadium in Halifax Regional Municipality.

Open house sessions with the general public and consultations with key stakeholders are being led by Sierra Planning and Management, the consultants hired to help the Council-appointed Stadium Analysis Steering Committee during Phase 1 of the stadium consideration.

The citizen-based Steering Committee is meeting regularly and working closely with Sierra Planning throughout this first phase. Phase 1 includes a business planning and feasibility analysis, incorporating input from citizens, sports and recreation groups and potential partners.

“We are thoroughly committed to the job we have undertaken and intend to bring forward the best possible information about the potential for a stadium in our region,” said Steering Committee Chair Kim Mason. “It will be crucial to speak with individuals who can help us fully understand the opportunities a stadium presents for our community.”

A report and recommendation from the Steering Committee will go to Regional Council this summer at which time Council will determine if the municipality will move on to Phase 2: Site selection, building program, design and more detailed facility costing. Public consultation would also be included as part of Phase 2. Phase 3, the construction phase, would only proceed with Council’s further approval.

The Steering Committee is working to timelines provided by the Canadian Soccer Association (CSA) which is currently preparing for the FIFA Women’s World Cup in 2015. The CSA plans to choose a minimum of six cities to host a coast to coast soccer championship. A stadium would need to be built to a minimum FIFA standard should Halifax be chosen as a site.

The upcoming Open House dates and times are as follows:
June 6, 2011, 6:30 - 8:30 pm
Maritime Hall at the Halifax Forum, 2901 Windsor St., Halifax

June 8, 2011, 6:30 - 8:30 pm
Cole Harbour Place, 51 Forest Hills Parkway, Cole Harbour

June 9, 2011, 6:30 - 8:30 pm
Lion’s Den, LeBrun Recreation Centre
36 Holland Dr., Bedford

To learn more about the stadium considerations or share your views please visit Halifax.ca/stadium or visit Halifax Stadium on Facebook or follow Halifax Stadium on Twitter.
PS: It would be good to see more people sign up to follow the municipal Twitter account . The link is here
     
     
  #2852  
Old Posted May 21, 2011, 1:19 PM
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fenwick we posted this the exact same time.
     
     
  #2853  
Old Posted May 21, 2011, 4:53 PM
fenwick16 fenwick16 is offline
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I went to a Blue Jays game Thursday night and took some pictures (I am a Blue Jays fan, although it is frustrating at times). I sat in the 500 level along the 3rd base line (and I took a measuring tape).

The 500 level is as steep as you can get and still have the aisle steps meet building codes. I would hope that the Halifax Stadium not be this steep, if it has an upper tier, since it will be unnerving to some spectators. According to the National Building Code, which Nova Scotia uses, it is stated in section 3.3.2.5- 11) "the riser of a step in an aisle shall be: b) not more than 200 mm (7.87") high". So with 3 steps the height between rows can't be more than 3 x 200 mm = 600 mm maximum height (23.6") between rows. The Rogers Centre 500 level (highest tier level) is 23 inches between rows, according to my quick measurement. (As a sidenote, there isn't sufficient row-width for more than 3 steps per row)

Lower, less steep tiers (such as the 100 level at the Rogers Centre) can get by with only 2 steps but row heights would have to be under 400 mm (15.68"). The two-step configuration is likely the safest for spectators but will not produce a great field viewing angle for the upper tiers of a multi-tier stadium unless the upper tiers are moved further away from the field. So increasing the upper tier steepness will allow a more compact, intimate stadium. A stadium with a single tier and only 2 steps between rows is the new Cardiff City Stadium - http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4a/Inside_Cardiff_City_Stadium.jpg . There are advantages to such a design such as lower cost and a shallower angle seating tier, and disadvantages such as less versatility to add wheelchair accessible seating and it is more difficult to incorporate club/luxury boxes.

This picture shows the steepness of the 500 level at the Rogers Centre. It also shows the aisle step and vomitorium configurations.


I found this structure to be fascinating. Although this is the lighting support structure and not the roof, it extends out by about 12 - 13 rows. A partial roof at a Halifax Stadium that extends out by 20 - 22 rows would have to be
at least twice as massive as this (probably more than twice since it will have to support a snow load during the winter).



The Rogers Centre has some interesting nooks and crannies at the top, as shown below. PS: The Rogers Centre appears to be mostly poured in place concrete construction as opposed to precast concrete (the seating risers and rakers might be precast or they might also be poured in place with forms?). Basically, just the retractable roof and light supports are of steel construction.

Last edited by fenwick16; Jun 2, 2011 at 8:31 AM.
     
     
  #2854  
Old Posted May 21, 2011, 7:27 PM
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I would imagine Rogers' steepness has something to do with a relatively limited site size given it's in the middle of downtown...?

When in Vancouver last month I got to go to a Whitecaps game at Empire Field. Great atmosphere, especially given that it's a temporary stadium (though spectator circulation outside the stadium proper in some spots is atrocious...). I think something of a similar scale would work really well here, though obviously built as a permanent venue.
     
     
  #2855  
Old Posted May 21, 2011, 7:33 PM
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Commonwealth Stadium in Edmonton also has steep upper decks to compensate for the lower decks being farther from the sidelines than most other football stadiums because of the track.
     
     
  #2856  
Old Posted May 21, 2011, 7:44 PM
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As far as the Skydome (I refuse to call it Rogers) is concerned, sometimes your purpose in life is to serve as a bad example. That is a horrible stadium, the last of the 70's/80s multipurpose donuts that are now dinosaurs.
     
     
  #2857  
Old Posted May 21, 2011, 7:44 PM
fenwick16 fenwick16 is offline
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I think the 500 level steepness is necessary in order to keep the stadium compact to minimize the size of the roof and keep the seats close to the field. The stadium has several seating levels and club seat levels so the first row of the 500 level is quite high above the field. I wasn't criticizing the Rogers Centre design (I think it is an amazing structure, and good baseball venue) but simply pointing out that a 2 tier stadium wouldn't require such a steep upper tier. Maybe the 2nd tier of the BMO field would be a good seating angle for the second tier of a Halifax stadium (I haven't been to BMO Field yet, so I am just basing my conjecture on internet images).

Last edited by fenwick16; May 22, 2011 at 1:54 AM.
     
     
  #2858  
Old Posted May 21, 2011, 7:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keith P. View Post
As far as the Skydome (I refuse to call it Rogers) is concerned, sometimes your purpose in life is to serve as a bad example. That is a horrible stadium, the last of the 70's/80s multipurpose donuts that are now dinosaurs.
Whoops! Thanks for the hint, I had better stop calling it the Rodgers Centre and start calling it the Rogers Centre (maybe I should go back to calling it the Skydome)

I have to disagree with you regarding the Rogers Centre being a horrible stadium. I think it was built primarily for baseball and therefore is an excellent baseball venue. (I don't know how good a football venue it is.) It doesn't have the nostalgia factor of a Camden Yards, but as far as baseball goes, it certainly is not a horrible multipurpose stadium and is designed differently than most of the cookie-cutter 70's era stadiums. The Rogers Centre was built about 15-20 years after most of the cookie style stadiums of the late 60's early 70's.

The Rogers Centre layout has most of the seats close to the field. In my opinion, this is still an amazing structure and great for baseball. I think it is Toronto's version of the Roman Coliseum. I hope that Toronto will keep using the Rogers Centre for baseball for the next hundred years (or longer). Maybe it will still be standing in 2,000 years as an ancient Toronto stadium (probably by then the roof will be long gone, just as the Roman Coliseum roof is long gone).

PS: Although I like the Rogers Centre, I hope that Halifax will build an economical stadium specifically for football/soccer.


Last edited by fenwick16; May 22, 2011 at 12:17 PM.
     
     
  #2859  
Old Posted May 24, 2011, 10:21 PM
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The open houses regarding the stadium will be coming up soon:

(Source: http://www.halifax.ca/mediaroom/pressrelease/pr2011/110520StadiumAnalysisConsultations.html )
The upcoming Open House dates and times are as follows:
June 6, 2011, 6:30 - 8:30 pm
Maritime Hall at the Halifax Forum, 2901 Windsor St., Halifax

June 8, 2011, 6:30 - 8:30 pm
Cole Harbour Place, 51 Forest Hills Parkway, Cole Harbour

June 9, 2011, 6:30 - 8:30 pm
Lion’s Den, LeBrun Recreation Centre
36 Holland Dr., Bedford


How many on this forum plan to attend? Are the open houses being advertised in the local newspapers? If the attendance at the open houses is very low then it will give the impression that it is not worth proceeding with the stadium construction. It is also possible that people such as Bruce DeVenne will disrupt the proceedings with their opposition. I am hoping that there will be a strong turn-out of people in favour.
     
     
  #2860  
Old Posted May 25, 2011, 9:57 PM
fenwick16 fenwick16 is offline
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On the Halifax Stadium Twitter account, people are being asked to describe what they consider to be the ideal stadium. Here is the link - http://twitter.com/#!/halifaxstadium
     
     
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