HomeDiagramsDatabaseMapsForum About
     

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > Canada


Closed Thread

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
     
     
  #20021  
Old Posted Jun 8, 2023, 11:17 PM
chowhou's Avatar
chowhou chowhou is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: East Vancouver (No longer across the ocean!)
Posts: 3,792
Quote:
Originally Posted by swimmer_spe View Post
Can you explain it?
Wikipedia can probably do better than I can.

The basic idea is to have one tax rate for land and one tax rate for property. Taxing property is bad, and we should minimize this because it disincentivizes renovations and new constriction and incentivizes land speculation and underdeveloping land.

As an example, right now in the CoV the property tax rate is 2.78‰ on the total assessed value. A split rate tax would look something like

5‰ on land
2‰ on structures

Take a look at the assessed value for BC Place:

Total Value: $222,916,000
Land: $55,422,000
Buildings: $167,494,000

If we treated BC Place as a typical residential lot under the current tax scheme, you'd tax:

$222,916,000 * 2.78‰ = $619,706/yr

If we used the above example a split rate tax, we'd tax:

$55,422,000 * 5‰ +
$167,494,000 * 2‰ =
$612,098/yr

This takes some tax liability off the building structure and places it on the land. Any future structure improvements would thereafter be taxed at a lower rate.

In the future, if tax rates must increase they should increase for land more than for buildings, and if tax rates go down for whatever reason they should drop for buildings more than for land and eventually we should aim for a 0‰ rate on buildings.
     
     
  #20022  
Old Posted Jun 8, 2023, 11:44 PM
goodgrowth goodgrowth is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 2,226
It's like ~61 units per hectare...that's actually pretty dense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wigs View Post
The Milton-ization of Niagara continues
3,800 unit subdivision to start construction in 2026 in Welland





https://www.wellandtribune.ca/news/counc...e22c2d0-5531-5c7b-9266-b867ccf66182.html
     
     
  #20023  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2023, 2:18 PM
WhipperSnapper's Avatar
WhipperSnapper WhipperSnapper is offline
I am the law!
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Toronto+
Posts: 22,892
Yeah, I don't think it's possible to squeeze 25 single family homes in one acre. However, Milton's subdivision master plans include a fair amount of multi-family in different housing options. The designs fail on improving walkability from typical single family plans from 30 years ago.. Milton-ization may refer to that.
     
     
  #20024  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2023, 3:15 PM
rbt rbt is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 1,387
Quote:
Originally Posted by WhipperSnapper View Post
Yeah, I don't think it's possible to squeeze 25 single family homes in one acre. ...
It is, and you can see neighbourhoods with closer to 50 SFH's per acre around Tokyo (0.01 acres per house is somewhat common), but not with our bylaws and building code and expectations about driving straight to your house rather than walking for a bit from the street (houses behind houses).
     
     
  #20025  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2023, 3:25 PM
swimmer_spe swimmer_spe is offline
BANNED
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 10,743
Quote:
Originally Posted by rbt View Post
It is, and you can see neighbourhoods with closer to 50 SFH's per acre around Tokyo (0.01 acres per house is somewhat common), but not with our bylaws and building code and expectations about driving straight to your house rather than walking for a bit from the street (houses behind houses).
What if they built a parking garage and then on top were what look like SFH? Then you could have smaller units, but still have the parking requirement met?
     
     
  #20026  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2023, 3:36 PM
goodgrowth goodgrowth is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 2,226
Quote:
Originally Posted by WhipperSnapper View Post
Yeah, I don't think it's possible to squeeze 25 single family homes in one acre. However, Milton's subdivision master plans include a fair amount of multi-family in different housing options. The designs fail on improving walkability from typical single family plans from 30 years ago.. Milton-ization may refer to that.
Well hopefully this proposal includes a decent amount of commercial...
     
     
  #20027  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2023, 6:22 PM
Innsertnamehere's Avatar
Innsertnamehere Innsertnamehere is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 12,867
the design of it is mostly townhouses and apartment buildings by the looks of it:

     
     
  #20028  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2023, 6:28 PM
goodgrowth goodgrowth is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 2,226
Quote:
Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere View Post
the design of it is mostly townhouses and apartment buildings by the looks of it:

Makes sense @ ~61 units/hectare...
     
     
  #20029  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2023, 9:05 PM
Wigs's Avatar
Wigs Wigs is offline
Great White North
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Niagara Region
Posts: 16,464
Milton-ization means cookie cutter blandness, no walkability, huge developments with thousands of units built at once. A sea of vinyl in beige, grey, taupes and browns. Although this particular project appears to have a higher percentage of townhouses and apartments or condos to SFH.

If people ride bikes they will get exercise at least with a bridge connecting across the old canal to Merritt Island bike path trails.

According to Stats Can, Welland was 55,750 people in 2021. It was almost 45k in 1971 so growth has been between stagnant to anemic until quite recently.
In 2023, Welland has about 57,000 people. This 3,800 unit project alone will add at least 7,000 people to Welland's population in a short time period.

Last edited by Wigs; Jun 9, 2023 at 10:56 PM.
     
     
  #20030  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2023, 11:01 PM
LightingGuy LightingGuy is offline
Closed account
 
Join Date: Jun 2022
Location: KW
Posts: 728
Milton actually has a lot of grade separated biking lanes.

It has a lot of SFHs, but no more than anywhere else in the GTA.

The main thing lacking there is services, and infrastructure capacity, because it grew so damn fast.
     
     
  #20031  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2023, 11:14 PM
Wigs's Avatar
Wigs Wigs is offline
Great White North
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Niagara Region
Posts: 16,464
Quote:
Originally Posted by LightingGuy View Post
Milton actually has a lot of grade separated biking lanes.

It has a lot of SFHs, but no more than anywhere else in the GTA.

The main thing lacking there is services, and infrastructure capacity, because it grew so damn fast.
Yes, ultra fast suburban style growth. MolsonExport would say endless sprawl and big box fart shopping plazas. Monotonous cookie cutter look.
     
     
  #20032  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2023, 11:26 PM
theman23's Avatar
theman23 theman23 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Ville de Québec
Posts: 6,334
So 150k PRs admitted to Canada in Q1 2023.

On top of that, we had 400k non permanent residents enter. in Q1. Followed by another 183k in April. Granted that not all of these will stay and some others may have left, but it seems certain that we'll shatter last year's growth of 1 million.
__________________
For entertainment purposes only. Not financial advice.

Last edited by theman23; Jun 10, 2023 at 12:28 AM. Reason: According to this: https://twitter.com/BenRabidoux/status/1667117077922996225?s=20
     
     
  #20033  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2023, 11:37 PM
craner's Avatar
craner craner is offline
Go Tall or Go Home
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Calgary
Posts: 7,405
     
     
  #20034  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2023, 11:52 PM
chowhou's Avatar
chowhou chowhou is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: East Vancouver (No longer across the ocean!)
Posts: 3,792
Quote:
Originally Posted by craner View Post
Huh. Is he trying to lose the suburbs? Ultimately this feels more like a vibe check than any actual ideas. No path forward to make this viable just "we will make cities build more".
     
     
  #20035  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2023, 12:05 AM
Wigs's Avatar
Wigs Wigs is offline
Great White North
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Niagara Region
Posts: 16,464
Quote:
Originally Posted by theman23 View Post
So 150k PRs admitted to Canada in Q1 2023.

On top of that, we had 400k non permanent residents enter. in Q1. Followed by another 183k in April. Granted that not all of these will stay and some others may have left, but it seems certain that we'll shatter last year's growth of 1 million.
At least landlords like lio have a near inexhaustible amount of new tenants to exploit
     
     
  #20036  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2023, 12:18 AM
theman23's Avatar
theman23 theman23 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Ville de Québec
Posts: 6,334
Quote:
Originally Posted by chowhou View Post
Huh. Is he trying to lose the suburbs? Ultimately this feels more like a vibe check than any actual ideas. No path forward to make this viable just "we will make cities build more".
The Liberals (and NDP) are the parties most likely to pull the taxation levers to quell demand in this country, but their 8 year track record has shown that they are not willing to do so. The Cons will likely never introduce a land or property value tax either. That rules out that route of addressing the problem.

Incentivizing municipalities to build more is something the Liberals have adopted, but it's not clear how serious they are. See the recent City of Calgary vote where they rejected all the recommendations from their affordability task force, but still expected to qualify for federal housing funding. I suppose the success of this will depend on how serious the feds are, but it doesn't seem like the cities are taking the Liberals very seriously at this point.

The Cons are the party most likely to reduce the flow of immigrants to this country. They won't campaign on it though so it's hard to say for sure. Hell would freeze over before the Liberals or NDP start reducing these numbers.

I think when you start breaking it down that way, there really isn't a better option on the housing portfolio than the Cons. They may not have a great plan, but the two other guys are the problem.
__________________
For entertainment purposes only. Not financial advice.
     
     
  #20037  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2023, 1:06 AM
swimmer_spe swimmer_spe is offline
BANNED
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 10,743
Quote:
Originally Posted by craner View Post
Sell 6000 federal government buildings.....

Kind of sounds like what Harper did to balance the budget that got Trudeau elected.
     
     
  #20038  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2023, 1:44 AM
kwoldtimer kwoldtimer is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: La vraie capitale
Posts: 26,220
Quote:
Originally Posted by chowhou View Post
Huh. Is he trying to lose the suburbs? Ultimately this feels more like a vibe check than any actual ideas. No path forward to make this viable just "we will make cities build more".
What federal red tape relates to housing permits/construction? Selling more surplus federal buildings/land would not raise much objection, one would think.
     
     
  #20039  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2023, 1:53 AM
swimmer_spe swimmer_spe is offline
BANNED
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 10,743
Quote:
Originally Posted by kwoldtimer View Post
What federal red tape relates to housing permits/construction? Selling more surplus federal buildings/land would not raise much objection, one would think.
How would that open up more housing?
     
     
  #20040  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2023, 2:03 AM
kwoldtimer kwoldtimer is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: La vraie capitale
Posts: 26,220
Quote:
Originally Posted by swimmer_spe View Post
How would that open up more housing?
I'm assuming they would be sold for the purpose of building housing, no? Otherwise PP would not have mentioned it.
     
     
This discussion thread continues

Use the page links to the lower-right to go to the next page for additional posts
 
 
Closed Thread

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > Canada
Forum Jump



Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 3:01 AM.

     

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2026, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.