Ottawa Macdonald-Cartier International Airport (YOW/CYOW) 1.0

[YOWflier]

Those longing for such discussions can propose an appropriately named new thread (if they’re unhappy about random) to mods and let’s please have it down in General where it belongs. Ottawa should be the focus of Ottawa.

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by YOWflier

Well the more I think of it we already have “Random Discussions” thread down in General. That’s where I’d punt all such chatter if I were in command. If skyscrapers in Kitchener are appropriate for that thread (and they are) then so are airports elsewhere.

Let’s let Ottawa breathe in its main threads.

Originally Posted by YOWetal

Your idea of a thread on the nuts and bolts of the airport makes sense but discussions of flights from Ottawa and the like don't seem like they are the same as random discussions. Splitting the thread maybe makes more sense?

Originally Posted by YOWflier

Those longing for such discussions can propose an appropriately named new thread (if they’re unhappy about random) to mods and let’s please have it down in General where it belongs. Ottawa should be the focus of Ottawa.

I don't spend a whole lot of time on this thread, so I'll let the conversation between the regulars continue for a few days and see if you all come to a consensus.

The random thread is for one off discussions mostly, but these off-topic-for-this-thread discussions seem to be common occurrence, so I'm not sure if that's where they belong. It sounds like we want this thread to be for the Airport infrastructure, operations, numbers and another for general aviation? Is that right?

[YOWflier]

It’s cool. I don’t view this as complicated… It’s a thread about Ottawa airport. It should be about developments relating to Ottawa airport and corresponding lands. This includes YOW commercial/cargo air service developments and discussions, YOW commercial/private(FBO)/military/government/cargo real property developments and discussions, YOW passenger facilities developments and discussions, and so on.

Other stuff is lounge-y type general discussion.

[YOWflier]

AC490 A333 diverting to YOW right now. Reason unknown.

[RomanR27]

Originally Posted by YOWflier

AC490 A333 diverting to YOW right now. Reason unknown.

Storm I'm guessing? AC667 (A220) also diverted.

[YOWflier]

That was my first guess but I looked at weather radar and didn’t see any obvious issues in YYZ.

[caetura]

Originally Posted by fanofYOW

For real. Apparently a year ago the excuse to not getting LHR back was because they needed to increase operations and recover what was lost in their hubs first. Then the excuse was there are no frames available. Over the past few months I’ve seen nothing but brand new routes implemented. I guess these new routes are much more important than re-establishing what once was in YOW furthering the speculation they are moving more towards the hub-spoke system. That’s fine though, my money goes to the airlines that do not consider YOW an afterthought.

It is starting to feel a bit petty now. I do wonder if there is some lingering resentment from AC towards “Ottawa” over COVID policy destroying a good chunk of their business. It doesn’t make logical business sense, but even corporations can make emotional decisions.

[RomanR27]

Originally Posted by YOWflier

That was my first guess but I looked at weather radar and didn’t see any obvious issues in YYZ.

They diverted from YUL, not YYZ.

[YOWflier]

Woops. Thought it was going to YYZ but I read it backwards. Definitely weather in Mtl.

[fanofYOW]

Originally Posted by caetura

It is starting to feel a bit petty now. I do wonder if there is some lingering resentment from AC towards “Ottawa” over COVID policy destroying a good chunk of their business. It doesn’t make logical business sense, but even corporations can make emotional decisions.

I wouldn’t call it petty however I would be lying if I said my opinion towards AC isn’t at least partly emotional. Reality is we are not going to see any new routes or expansions from carriers such as AC or WS as it looks right now. So why not support carriers such as Porter if they currently offer an overlapping destination? I don’t know about everyone else, but for myself, it’s more about supporting the ones that have focused on my airport of choice to help with their goals and confidence in YOW rather than “punishing” the others. A massive airline such as AC will not care about my measly $300 YOW-YVR booking, but I feel good putting that money towards Porter as they continue to grow and base their planes here. I’m also happy choosing AF this summer as I presume it will send a message to other international carriers if successful.

[DTcrawler]

Originally Posted by fanofYOW

I wouldn’t call it petty however I would be lying if I said my opinion towards AC isn’t at least partly emotional. Reality is we are not going to see any new routes or expansions from carriers such as AC or WS as it looks right now. So why not support carriers such as Porter if they currently offer an overlapping destination? I don’t know about everyone else, but for myself, it’s more about supporting the ones that have focused on my airport of choice to help with their goals and confidence in YOW rather than “punishing” the others. A massive airline such as AC will not care about my measly $300 YOW-YVR booking, but I feel good putting that money towards Porter as they continue to grow and base their planes here. I’m also happy choosing AF this summer as I presume it will send a message to other international carriers if successful.

They were calling AC petty, not you

[hehehe]

Yeah YOW is losing some service from AC (like YYT/YYG/BOS/reduction in DCA etc) and PD seems like YOW's only hope.

But year round CDG on AF is HUGE.

[Dominion301]

Today’s departure count: 69

Today’s cancellation count (so far): 5

Thunderstorms are forecast for this afternoon.

[Jay31]

Originally Posted by fanofYOW

I wouldn’t call it petty however I would be lying if I said my opinion towards AC isn’t at least partly emotional. Reality is we are not going to see any new routes or expansions from carriers such as AC or WS as it looks right now. So why not support carriers such as Porter if they currently offer an overlapping destination? I don’t know about everyone else, but for myself, it’s more about supporting the ones that have focused on my airport of choice to help with their goals and confidence in YOW rather than “punishing” the others. A massive airline such as AC will not care about my measly $300 YOW-YVR booking, but I feel good putting that money towards Porter as they continue to grow and base their planes here. I’m also happy choosing AF this summer as I presume it will send a message to other international carriers if successful.

If you're a frequent flyer and manage to get status... or even tend to buy ACs higher end tickets, they offer a lot that Porter doesn't. Porter is an airline that aims to please everyone while getting you where your going. AC is an airline that aims to be please their frequent flyers and business class passengers...a lot, and for everyone else just get them where they're going (while treating them like cattle). Different business models... I did wonder if AC might increase presence in Ottawa at some point to avoid losing to Porter with their expansion here..though it could also be that AC just lets that market share go. I recall when I used to fly on the routes to LHR and FRA, business class upgrades always seemed much easier to come by to/from Ottawa then if I left out of YYZ/YUL... I wonder if the reason those flights haven't come back yet, is that Ottawa passengers are simply less likely to buy up an international J cabin that is a substantial part of the profit of these routes?

I realize now this is quite off topic from the original thread purpose though... feel free to move, delete this. I do think many of the side discussions are relevant to YOW's business and development environment (along with flight activity), but they are different from discussions on airport capital projects.

[Tesladom]

Originally Posted by YOWflier

It’s cool. I don’t view this as complicated… It’s a thread about Ottawa airport. It should be about developments relating to Ottawa airport and corresponding lands. This includes YOW commercial/cargo air service developments and discussions, YOW commercial/private(FBO)/military/government/cargo real property developments and discussions, YOW passenger facilities developments and discussions, and so on.

Other stuff is lounge-y type general discussion.

Well it get complicated because all other threads divert into lounge-y type general discussions as well, you know Claridge bashing, NIMBY-ism etc.....

[originalmuffins]

Originally Posted by fanofYOW

I wouldn’t call it petty however I would be lying if I said my opinion towards AC isn’t at least partly emotional. Reality is we are not going to see any new routes or expansions from carriers such as AC or WS as it looks right now. So why not support carriers such as Porter if they currently offer an overlapping destination? I don’t know about everyone else, but for myself, it’s more about supporting the ones that have focused on my airport of choice to help with their goals and confidence in YOW rather than “punishing” the others. A massive airline such as AC will not care about my measly $300 YOW-YVR booking, but I feel good putting that money towards Porter as they continue to grow and base their planes here. I’m also happy choosing AF this summer as I presume it will send a message to other international carriers if successful.

Agreed. We are better off supporting the ones who are giving us direct and better transfers. That means Porter, Flair, and now Air France.

[originalmuffins]

Originally Posted by Jay31

If you're a frequent flyer and manage to get status... or even tend to buy ACs higher end tickets, they offer a lot that Porter doesn't. Porter is an airline that aims to please everyone while getting you where your going. AC is an airline that aims to be please their frequent flyers and business class passengers...a lot, and for everyone else just get them where they're going (while treating them like cattle). Different business models... I did wonder if AC might increase presence in Ottawa at some point to avoid losing to Porter with their expansion here..though it could also be that AC just lets that market share go. I recall when I used to fly on the routes to LHR and FRA, business class upgrades always seemed much easier to come by to/from Ottawa then if I left out of YYZ/YUL... I wonder if the reason those flights haven't come back yet, is that Ottawa passengers are simply less likely to buy up an international J cabin that is a substantial part of the profit of these routes?

I realize now this is quite off topic from the original thread purpose though... feel free to move, delete this. I do think many of the side discussions are relevant to YOW's business and development environment (along with flight activity), but they are different from discussions on airport capital projects.

I don't think this is offtopic, you are talking about AC routes to and from Ottawa and AC not serving YOW. If that doesn't have to do with YOW, then nothing else here does either.

[YOWetal]

Originally Posted by YOWflier

It’s cool. I don’t view this as complicated… It’s a thread about Ottawa airport. It should be about developments relating to Ottawa airport and corresponding lands. This includes YOW commercial/cargo air service developments and discussions, YOW commercial/private(FBO)/military/government/cargo real property developments and discussions, YOW passenger facilities developments and discussions, and so on.

Other stuff is lounge-y type general discussion.

I'd say at this point discussions of runway number 3 being repaved or even flights diverted is more off topic.

[YOWflier]

Runway number 3 being repaved would indeed be off topic. There is no runway 3 at YOW.

Diversions are among the various opportunities for spotting unique aircraft at YOW. They, like interesting FBO visitors (e.g. rarely/never seen private aircraft, the Embraer E2 demonstrator last winter, the Honeywell 757), visiting foreign dignitaries, hockey charters, etc. utilize the airfield and airside services at YOW. On topic.

Driving one’s private vehicle to another city to fly to Cuba is lounge talk.

[Dominion301]

Today’s departure count: 57

Today’s cancellation count (so far): 5