PHILADELPHIA | Highrise Development Thread X

[DeltaNerd]

Originally Posted by Redddog

It's tough to quantify.

I commuted to Boulder Co for about a year recently and there is a MAJOR homeless issue there. And that town is 1/100th the size of Phlly. I will say that they were the nicest, most polite homeless people I've ever experienced. That group here (with the exception of Hip Hop - my man outside the 7-11 in Old city) are mean and aggressive when they're not in the depths of a fentanyl zombie state.

I think that the homeless locate in tourist areas for obvious reasons - tourists are generally more likely to give them cash. Homeless have stepped up their presence in these areas but the response has not addressed that. The tourist that comes to Philly regularly sees the absolute worst of Philly from that perspective.

Tough situation and tough solutions.

We need more jobs especially in the Philadelphia, I'm talking Philadelphia, Northeast Philadelphia and not just center city. Even if we got rid of the wage tax today that's not going to instantly bring in more jobs. This has to be a regional approach where we need other nearby cities like Camden creating jobs. That is one of many ways of fixing our homeless problem.

[cardeza]

Originally Posted by fairmounter

I recently moved to San Francisco from Philly and I can say for certain that the homeless/panhandling situation is far far worse here. This is not city vs city - all cities have their pros and cons - but I think Philly is doing better in this area than many believe.

Im confused, you say Philly is doing better than most people realize but you also said its way worse than SF.

[PurpleWhiteOut]

Originally Posted by El Duderino

There are some models here that look similar to the rendering at the end of this article on 3.0 Univ. Place: https://www.ocfrealty.com/naked-philly/w...lace-tops-out-in-west-philly-4-0-up-next

Ty! I didn't see these models before. Even though it was still kind of generic, the old design for 3.0 looked a lot better than the ugly design we ended up with.

[mja]

Originally Posted by DeltaNerd

We need more jobs especially in the Philadelphia, I'm talking Philadelphia, Northeast Philadelphia and not just center city. Even if we got rid of the wage tax today that's not going to instantly bring in more jobs. This has to be a regional approach where we need other nearby cities like Camden creating jobs. That is one of many ways of fixing our homeless problem.

I question how much homelessness is tied to the job market or the wage tax, etc. This is a behavioral health issue that goes far beyond anything this city can do. People generally aren't living on the streets because they can't find a job / housing, they are living on the streets because they are dealing with significant mental health issues and/or addiction. I lost a cousin to addiction, and it wasn't because he couldn't find work. He was self-medicating to cope with childhood trauma and just got caught up in a bad scene in high school and was never able to get out of it.

Originally Posted by cardeza

Im confused, you say Philly is doing better than most people realize but you also said its way worse than SF.

I was confused at first, too, but here = San Fran, not Philly, because he's in San Fran now.

[SEFTA]

"The gap between the rich and the poor is growing.
In the US, income inequality reached a record high in 2018, with the richest 1% of households averaging more than 84 times as much income as the bottom 20%.
The gap is most prevalent in wealthy coastal states and areas with "widespread poverty".
The top 10% of earners are the only ones to have their income share grow since 1979, leading to less overall spending and a loss of about $309 billion in yearly economic growth.
The Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development (OECD) reports that in its 34 member states, the richest 10% of the population earn 9.6 times the income of the poorest 10%.
The number of people living in communities at the extreme ends of the income scale has increased threefold in recent decades, and more than half of the change is due to increases in income inequality at the national level"

[3rd&Brown]

Originally Posted by mja

I question how much homelessness is tied to the job market or the wage tax, etc. This is a behavioral health issue that goes far beyond anything this city can do. People generally aren't living on the streets because they can't find a job / housing, they are living on the streets because they are dealing with significant mental health issues and/or addiction. I lost a cousin to addiction, and it wasn't because he couldn't find work. He was self-medicating to cope with childhood trauma and just got caught up in a bad scene in high school and was never able to get out of it.



I was confused at first, too, but here = San Fran, not Philly, because he's in San Fran now.

I agree. We desperately need more jobs but it's to address the issue of poverty and as a byproduct, violence. I don't think it will do anything to help homelessness and addiction.

On another note, I'm tired of handling the addiction problem with kid gloves. It's time to introduce some sticks into the solution, and not just a bunch of carrots. In the Riverwards at least, our litter problem is almost entirely linked to addicts who roam the streets on trash night and rip open trash bags ad nauseum I assume to find — they can sell or pawn for drugs.

I watched a crackhead walk down the street in Northern Liberties last week and open every single trash bag on the block, rummaging for junk.

Arrest him. I'm over it. If you do drugs in public you are committing public indecency. If you tear open trash bags everywhere you are disturbing the peace. I'm not saying the arrest should follow these people around forever but there needs to be more friction with the system to jolt some of them to get off the streets. Ideally, the arrested would be triaged and put into some sort of treatment, but I know that's not going to happen either.

In any case. It's time for something new. I'm over it.

[Frontst17]

Anecdotally, a friend of mine just visited from SF, lives right downtown paying 4500/month, commented how much cleaner Philly was than SF (as trash literally was blowing down my street). Significantly less homeless people and less visible as in not actively shitting on the sidewalks. He was punched in the face by some guy in an encampment outside his 4500/month apartment building. He regularly sends videos of “street life” as he walks around. He still loves it there but after shitting on Philly his whole life he sees it in a totally different light now. Just an example but we need to shake off this ugly stepchild fear we have.

[PhilliesPhan]

I'll be visiting SF for the first time in a few weeks, so this conversation is fascinating. I also don't want to start a city vs city; however I do agree that, while the homeless are definitely more visible in Center City than they used to be, other places have it worse. Downtown LA has a homeless problem that most Philadelphians can't even begin to comprehend. I stayed at a hotel on Pershing Square and got the full Skid Row experience. San Diego, while not as bad as DTLA, also has more visible homeless in its downtown area. The city that surprised me the most, however, was Denver. My fiancée, future in-laws, and I had our lives threatened by a homeless guy as soon as we stepped out of the rental car. 16th Street Mall, the underground bus station, and the area in front of the Colorado State Capital were all a mess and looked worse than anything in CC.

Since I work in CC four days a week, I'm familiar with some of the homeless. While some of them can be aggressive, most of them are pretty tame. I find that the most belligerent of the bunch tend to congregate on the El.

[Raja]

Originally Posted by PhilliesPhan

I'll be visiting SF for the first time in a few weeks, so this conversation is fascinating. I also don't want to start a city vs city; however I do agree that, while the homeless are definitely more visible in Center City than they used to be, other places have it worse. Downtown LA has a homeless problem that most Philadelphians can't even begin to comprehend. I stayed at a hotel on Pershing Square and got the full Skid Row experience. San Diego, while not as bad as DTLA, also has more visible homeless in its downtown area. The city that surprised me the most, however, was Denver. My fiancée, future in-laws, and I had our lives threatened by a homeless guy as soon as we stepped out of the rental car. 16th Street Mall, the underground bus station, and the area in front of the Colorado State Capital were all a mess and looked worse than anything in CC.

Since I work in CC four days a week, I'm familiar with some of the homeless. While some of them can be aggressive, most of them are pretty tame. I find that the most belligerent of the bunch tend to congregate on the El.

Denver is the only place that's ever shocked me in this regard. Maybe Portland, but it has a reputation that Denver (for whatever reason) doesn't have. SF varies a lot by neighborhood. You'll have a great time.

[Inquizative]

Recently, I entertained guest from NYC for a weekend. I rented an Airbnb for them, got them a modern 2 bedroom apartment with a backyard in UCity for $400 Fri-Sun. They can't wait to come back, they plan for September for more fun. Philly people self-impose themselves into the shadow of NYC. While New Yorkers themselves look on in bewilderment. We don't realize what we have here.
I've seen many "Negadelphians" leave Philly, and then over 90% come back, when they realize how green our grass is.

[Justin7]

In their book, Homelessness Is a Housing Problem, the University of Washington professor Gregg Colburn and the data scientist Clayton Page Aldern demonstrate that “the homelessness crisis in coastal cities cannot be explained by disproportionate levels of drug use, mental illness, or poverty.” Rather, the most relevant factors in the homelessness crisis are rent prices and vacancy rates.

Colburn and Aldern note that some urban areas with very high rates of poverty (Detroit, Miami-Dade County, Philadelphia) have among the lowest homelessness rates in the country, and some places with relatively low poverty rates (Santa Clara County, San Francisco, Boston) have relatively high rates of homelessness.

Read and link to your lefty NIMBY friends: https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/arc...-housing-crisis-democrats-causes/672224/

Touches on many of this current discussions on this forum.

[3rd&Brown]

Originally Posted by Justin7

Read and link to your lefty NIMBY friends: https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/arc...-housing-crisis-democrats-causes/672224/

Touches on many of this current discussions on this forum.

I think at the end of the day one benefit of many Philadelphians owning their home is that people have extended family that will let them crash when times are hard.

[jaysb]

Originally Posted by Inquizative

Recently, I entertained guest from NYC for a weekend. I rented an Airbnb for them, got them a modern 2 bedroom apartment with a backyard in UCity for $400 Fri-Sun. They can't wait to come back, they plan for September for more fun. Philly people self-impose themselves into the shadow of NYC. While New Yorkers themselves look on in bewilderment. We don't realize what we have here.
I've seen many "Negadelphians" leave Philly, and then over 90% come back, when they realize how green our grass is.

Had my brother and his wife in from Boston 2 weekends ago. He's been here a lot but she's from SD originally and has only been here a few times for work conferences. They absolutely loved it, esp compared to Boston. They took engagement photos on a famous old street in Boston, and she remarked that nearly every street in Society Hill is like that one street.

I've talked to several other NY transplants and their take was all the same; Philly has nearly all the same stuff as NY but on a 1/10th scale. But you'll never be able to do all of that stuff anyhow (esp with kids). And as good as the subway is, it can still be a hassle getting across town, Philly is a lot more doable in that sense.

With the more flexible working arrangement there is no reason the influx will slow.

[TK2001]

Philadelphia skyline from Our Lady of Lourdes Hospital by Philly SkyGuy, on Flickr

Philadelphia skyline from Our Lady of Lourdes Hospital by Philly SkyGuy, on Flickr
Philadelphia skyline panorama from Our Lady of Lourdes Hospital by Philly SkyGuy, on Flickr

Philadelphia skyline from the Camden Waterfront by Philly SkyGuy, on Flickr

[TempleGuy1000]

Nice set TK. IMO, the angle of the skyline that is most improved over the last decade is the East to West view. Having the FMC, Arthaus, and Laurel stick up out of the center city west historic cluster really elevates our skyline

[TK2001]

Philadelphia skyline March 1988 by Philly SkyGuy, on Flickr
Found this '88 shot last night, and features a perspective from NJ I've wanted to see in the past. This view is just south of Phoenix Park in Camden. In the shot, City Hall is under scaffolding, One Liberty was recently completed, and the core and cranes for the Independence Blue Cross Tower are poking out above 1818 Market

[TK2001]

Philadelphia skyline fall 1988 by Philly SkyGuy, on Flickr

Philadelphia skyline fall 1988 UPSCALED by Philly SkyGuy, on Flickr

Found this one as well! Here you can see Bell Atlantic Tower rising in front of One Liberty, along with IBX having it's facade closed up. I found this by simply searching Philadelphia skyline on Google Photos, and there was a skyline option under the search bar with this photo as the thumbnail. I haven't seen it until now, but apparently it's been on the internet since 2007!

[TonyTone]

You killed these photos TK. You are the king of those panoramas.

[SEFTA]

I'm wondering of the status of the "— Building" project.
Anyone?
— Building Development by

[mcgrath618]

Originally Posted by SEFTA

I'm wondering of the status of the "— Building" project.
Anyone?
— Building Development by

Well underway. No pics to show, unfortunately.