[Saint John] Uptown Thread

[UptownJeff]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

There is a "First Nations" business park in Moncton, across the TCH from the Caledonia Industrial Park. They purchased the land and had it consecrated as reserve land, hence, although it is within the city of Moncton, there is no property tax. Nevertheless, they negotiated an agreement with the city to pay money "in kind" for municipally supplied services, including fire and policing, so it amounts to the same thing (more or less).

Thanks - interesting.

[UptownJeff]

Originally Posted by cdnguys

It’s almost 50,000 square feet with large parking lot. Be curious what proposal is. Would that mean zero tax property tax revenue for city? These types of places do draw some out of town visitors so good for restaurants and hotels to a certain degree. Went to play pool at Doolys and was shocked to see 95% of their business was from huge VLT zone and they all looked like zombies lol. Take business from them for sure but kinda scary the addiction that is kinda hidden from plain sight. So yea mixed feelings on this one ….

The ABSOLUTE LAST thing we need is a casino. This property is on the edge of some of the most "high priority" neighbourhoods in the province. Walking distance to a casino will, in my opinion, not be an asset that will contribute in any positive way to these neighbourhoods - we have addiction issues, food security issues and high poverty rates - gambling will only magnify this. While it is totally up to the owner who they sell to - I hope The City will look long and hard at allowing a casino on the property as I believe they would have power regarding zoning etc.

[cdnguys]

Originally Posted by UptownJeff

The ABSOLUTE LAST thing we need is a casino. This property is on the edge of some of the most "high priority" neighbourhoods in the province. Walking distance to a casino will, in my opinion, not be an asset that will contribute in any positive way to these neighbourhoods - we have addiction issues, food security issues and high poverty rates - gambling will only magnify this. While it is totally up to the owner who they sell to - I hope The City will look long and hard at allowing a casino on the property as I believe they would have power regarding zoning etc.

I think it would make for a good car dealership with the huge bay doors and warehouse on bottom level and parking lot.

[sailor734]

I believe there is a deal with Ottawa whereby First Nations can buy land and "add" it to their reserve as recompense for lands that were taken from them in the past. As reserve lands I don't believe they would pay any property tax.

[adamuptownsj]

Absolutely revolting idea. Union St has enough problems. A casino paying zero taxes would be a massive transfer of money from our poorest citizens and gambling addicts to a reserve on the other end of the St John River.

[MonctonRad]

If a FN buys the property however, and has the land declared as reservation lands, then this might circumvent the ability of the city to do anything about this proposed casino from a rezoning point of view.

[UptownJeff]

Originally Posted by adamuptownsj

Absolutely revolting idea. Union St has enough problems. A casino paying zero taxes would be a massive transfer of money from our poorest citizens and gambling addicts to a reserve on the other end of the St John River.

100% - I hope JDI says thanks but NO THANKS

[Franco401]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

If a FN buys the property however, and has the land declared as reservation lands, then this might circumvent the ability of the city to do anything about this proposed casino from a rezoning point of view.

They don't just get to buy the land and unilaterally declare it reserve land.

https://www.sac-isc.gc.ca/eng/1332267668918/1611930372477

Notable section:



Be fun if anybody bothered to check stuff before playing into the usual fearmongering about native land grabs, a classic Conservative tactic to scare landowners.

There's a process for this, and a fantasy casino on the edge of a business district isn't really what it gets used for.

[UptownJeff]

Originally Posted by Franco401

They don't just get to buy the land and unilaterally declare it reserve land.

https://www.sac-isc.gc.ca/eng/1332267668918/1611930372477

Notable section:



Be fun if anybody bothered to check stuff before playing into the usual fearmongering about native land grabs, a classic Conservative tactic to scare landowners.

There's a process for this, and a fantasy casino on the edge of a business district isn't really what it gets used for.

Thanks for posting the process but it was the chief who said they were looking at it for a casino. Is it a scare tactic? Don’t know but it’s not a fantasy or conservative tactic. Plain and simple there is a process.

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by Franco401

They don't just get to buy the land and unilaterally declare it reserve land.

I'm aware. The FN which established the urban reserve in Moncton for the business park actually worked very closely with the city (to mutual benefit). This is what should happen.

It might not be the same in SJ. The FN wants to build a casino, which I imagine might be unpopular with city hall. Obviously the process to establish the reserve will have to be cooperative. I have difficulty imagining there will be a meeting of the minds on this issue.

[nwalbert]

Originally Posted by UptownJeff

100% - I hope JDI says thanks but NO THANKS

I am generally pro development, but agree that this would not be a good site for this type of development.

[bridgeoftea]

Originally Posted by nwalbert

I am generally pro development, but agree that this would not be a good site for this type of development.

No idea why anyone would want a "entertainment" zone away from hotels/restaurants. If Saint John had a gun to it's head and needed a Casino. At least put it in Market Square or build a little hotel/casino combo in the empty lot next to Harbour Station where it can connect to the pedway so you can make some SeaDog/Concert + Casino package deals etc.

But overall don't really want a casino in uptown Saint John.

[adamuptownsj]

I may as well give an update on my own project, since it's been quiet lately.

We have basically finalized footprint and massing, and have a package of variances almost ready to go to the city. The variances you are all likely interested in are height (~70 ft, which is pretty cool for a 5 story) and setback (none). Everything else is procedural.

Still hoping to start construction this fall and winter.

[darkharbour]

Originally Posted by bridgeoftea

No idea why anyone would want a "entertainment" zone away from hotels/restaurants. If Saint John had a gun to it's head and needed a Casino. At least put it in Market Square or build a little hotel/casino combo in the empty lot next to Harbour Station where it can connect to the pedway so you can make some SeaDog/Concert + Casino package deals etc.

But overall don't really want a casino in uptown Saint John.

I'm not a fan of the casino in the city either, but continuing your train of thought, is it possible that an idea such as this (if it were to move forward) might include an on-site hotel? We're in desperate need of more hotel rooms in the core, Union Street seems like a good place for one.

[gtsoc]

Signage has gone up on the building at 7 Market Sq for the new craft beer and pizza restaurant that will be opening shortly. This is the former HSBC location.

[cdnguys]

[IMG][/IMG]

[DyAm00394]

A new CTV article was published yesterday about preparations being underway for the Area 506 Festival this summer that includes changes to the container village. There will be a bigger capacity expected this year thanks to a staggering amount of early-bird ticket sales. They will be expanding on the bar area, they will have something that is covered for people wanting to get out of the rain, and part of Water Street will be closed to make room for more pop-up vendors.

https://atlantic.ctvnews.ca/area-506-festival-preparations-underway-in-saint-john-n-b-1.6379482

[RaginRonic]

My take on a possible Saint John casino...

...if Higgs wants one that bad, then it can be built ONLY on the former Exhibition Park track. Nowhere else. Period.

o.o

[DyAm00394]

The city posted a new updated video tour showcasing what the public spaces on the waterfront will look like.

• Video Link



And here’s May 2023’s update on the project from the shapeyourcitysj website.

“May 2023 update:
- First signs of the new stage have appeared, and structural steel supports have been established that will later be used to support the new stage roof.

- Construction of the stage continues to develop with preparations underway for accessible washrooms and mechanical and electrical rooms.

- Three wood forms have been built that will soon be turned into islands that make up part of the winter skating rink and offer year-round seating. The perimeter of the islands will be lit up by LED lights and one of the three island formations will include a sound booth for use during stage shows.

- Preparations have been made to begin work later this month on the tidal steps.

- The existing washroom facilities building has been relocated and is enroute to its final destination, Rockwood Park.

- Planning for the temporary restaurant patios has been ongoing. The patios are anticipated to be open by June 30, in time for the Canada Day holiday weekend.

- New renderings will be unveiled showcasing new and improved patio designs and more.

- All public spaces are still anticipated to be completed by the end of 2023”.

https://shapeyourcitysaintjohn.ca/fundy-quay-development-project

[RR Drummer]

Excellent video, was just about to post the link but wasn’t quick enough haha. I look forward to getting some great use out of the new spaces and I trust many others will too, both residents & visitors alike.