The future of Hamilton's public transit

[ShavedParmesanCheese]

Great news!

[Innsertnamehere]

The lane will only exist for like 2 years anyway until LRT construction starts and permanently changes King St in a much larger way.

[swimmer_spe]

It is only controversial to those who are car centric.

[matt602]

And of course there will be all sorts of people opposed to this cause they feel they absolutely have to have the right to drive in the farthest right lane for 800m even though theres THREE other lanes to the left of it that can be used (which are largely empty for 80% of every day).

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by matt602

And of course there will be all sorts of people opposed to this cause they feel they absolutely have to have the right to drive in the farthest right lane for 800m even though theres THREE other lanes to the left of it that can be used (which are largely empty for 80% of every day).

I tend to keep to the right unless I am passing you. However, loosing 1lane on that road will be irrelevant.

[mikevbar1]

Hello everyone, I come today with some images I found in the Hamilton Rapid Transit Study (1970) which I found at my University Library with the help of @ShavedParmesanCheese. I think this is more than enough for all of us to feast on for a while. Lots to dissect, discuss, and consider about these various proposals!

Up first is Pattern 1.


Pattern 2.


Pattern 3.


Pattern 4.


Pattern 5.


Pattern 6.


Pattern 7.


Pattern 8.


The report discusses the importance of downtown and creating a downtown-oriented network. Some of the plans do skirt around downtown, but as you can all see this is limited. Most curious is how far they contemplated the routes to extend (I believe a '14km distance' was the preferred extent of any line), presumably because Hamilton would have sprawled to reach the furthest extents sooner than they did. Do keep in mind these are 'complete' plans as well; all iterations were intended to be phased.

Do note this final Integrative map for 'Proposal A' which is a modified version of Pattern 8 I believe. It seems to indicate the Linc going further east and west than it currently does, and includes a hovercraft line to Toronto that goes up the escarpment. There are also other oddities like that GO Train routing and a variety of plans for new downtown transit terminal(s), some of which would have torn down Hunter St. Station. Didn't snag any pictures, though.



If people like this stuff, I can go back and grab some more pictures!

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by mikevbar1

Hello everyone, I come today with some images I found in the Hamilton Rapid Transit Study (1970) which I found at my University Library with the help of @ShavedParmesanCheese. I think this is more than enough for all of us to feast on for a while. Lots to dissect, discuss, and consider about these various proposals!

Up first is Pattern 1.


Pattern 2.


Pattern 3.


Pattern 4.


Pattern 5.


Pattern 6.


Pattern 7.


Pattern 8.


The report discusses the importance of downtown and creating a downtown-oriented network. Some of the plans do skirt around downtown, but as you can all see this is limited. Most curious is how far they contemplated the routes to extend (I believe a '14km distance' was the preferred extent of any line), presumably because Hamilton would have sprawled to reach the furthest extents sooner than they did. Do keep in mind these are 'complete' plans as well; all iterations were intended to be phased.

Do note this final Integrative map for 'Proposal A' which is a modified version of Pattern 8 I believe. It seems to indicate the Linc going further east and west than it currently does, and includes a hovercraft line to Toronto that goes up the escarpment. There are also other oddities like that GO Train routing and a variety of plans for new downtown transit terminal(s), some of which would have torn down Hunter St. Station. Didn't snag any pictures, though.



If people like this stuff, I can go back and grab some more pictures!

Very cool find. It would be interesting to overlay them with the old streetcar lines and the BLAST Network and see how they compare.

[ScreamingViking]

Would have been interesting to see how the city may have evolved had one of these ideas come to be.

They were predicated on explosive growth of the 1950s and 1960s, and Hamilton's industrial might had yet to begin to fade. There were tens of thousands of people working in the north end factories of Stelco, Dofasco, Proctor & Gamble, Firestone, and others. I think the steel industry alone employed more than 50,000 people at its peak. And the city's population had been growing at a high rate.

The economic restructuring would still have occurred. So would that have made some of those lines ill-timed? (particularly for patterns 2, 7, 8, and the integrative plan); would Hamilton's stagnant period in the 1980s and '90s have meant the entire system was underused? Or would it have spurred positive change faster? The business parks on the periphery had yet to be developed, so they would have required extensions, and more recently the airport (pattern 5 would have served it well), but transportation networks evolve so there would have been additions.

The saddest thing is more than 50 years on we're finally getting something akin to one piece of many of those patterns.

And yes please -- if there are more, I'd appreciate seeing them! Thank you for sharing these.

[TheRitsman]

I really appreciate this stuff. I've seen maps from the 60s that show my house where a highway off ramp would have been planned. I'm not sure if it was posted earlier. Would definitely be interested to see more, thanks for sharing.

I'd really like to see the LRT in future spur off down York Blvd to Plains in Burlington. I actually think that would get more use than the planned A-Line. A dream A-Line would go from the airport down James, to York and turn toward Burlington.

[Beedok]

Where they planning a tunnel under the bay to connect to Burlington? That seems… expensive for the amount of people in the area.

[TheRitsman]

Originally Posted by Beedok

Where they planning a tunnel under the bay to connect to Burlington? That seems… expensive for the amount of people in the area.

They were a bit looser with funding back then, and the public broadly trusted the government back then, so if the government said it was a good idea, people would be more likely to support it, even if it was incredibly expensive. See: Hamilton's expensive and failed downtown urban renewal.

[Innsertnamehere]

Originally Posted by Beedok

Where they planning a tunnel under the bay to connect to Burlington? That seems… expensive for the amount of people in the area.

I imagine the thought at the time is that there would be substantially more people in Burlington than there are today to support it. This is 1960's planning when they should that industrial cities like Hamilton would just keep expanding and expanding extremely rapidly.

[craftbeerdad]

I'd just be happy if they brought back the 101 bus to Burlington since it's been abandoned during the Pandemic. The #1 Burlington bus is always busy both to and from Hamilton and obviously there's a lot of people going between Ikea/Mall and Appleby GO. So extending the LRT to Burlington in some future state would be cool but I doubt Burlington cares at this time.

[ScreamingViking]

Originally Posted by craftbeerdad

I'd just be happy if they brought back the 101 bus to Burlington since it's been abandoned during the Pandemic. The #1 Burlington bus is always busy both to and from Hamilton and obviously there's a lot of people going between Ikea/Mall and Appleby GO. So extending the LRT to Burlington in some future state would be cool but I doubt Burlington cares at this time.

An express bus service could (and should) be established.

The HSR and Burlington Transit could also collaborate on some version of the BLAST network L line... instead of going up Hwy 6, could it run to Aldershot GO/VIA and up Waterdown Rd, with a BT connection at the train station into central Burlington?

[mikevbar1]

As per the latest HSR changes for what was 'Rapid Ready' we have some real juicy stuff. "BLAST" has been updated to the following:




Lots to go on about here. The current 5A, C, E, and 52's routes have been amalgamated in the map as the new 'T Line', acting as the western N/S route to travel the escarpment and reach Dundas.

At Mohawk, the T Line diverts from the old alignment and instead of going downtown, closes the N/S gap on the east Mountain at a new terminal. Here, the S Line and new (second) L Line meet.

The S Line now uses the Red Hill Valley Parkway to reach Parkdale Station, now interchanging with the new E Line and the modified T Line.

The B Line's bus extensions have been rearranged. With the new T Line going to Dundas, the B Line will instead go all the way to Winona rather than ending in Stoney Creek.

The old T and L Lines now compose the same, heavily interlined line going from Waterdown to downtown, Mohawk College, Limeridge, then back into the lower city via Kenilworth to Centre Mall at Barton (a great location for a future GO Station).

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by mikevbar1

As per the latest HSR changes for what was 'Rapid Ready' we have some real juicy stuff. "BLAST" has been updated to the following:




Lots to go on about here. The current 5A, C, E, and 52's routes have been amalgamated in the map as the new 'T Line', acting as the western N/S route to travel the escarpment and reach Dundas.

At Mohawk, the T Line diverts from the old alignment and instead of going downtown, closes the N/S gap on the east Mountain at a new terminal. Here, the S Line and new (second) L Line meet.

The S Line now uses the Red Hill Valley Parkway to reach Parkdale Station, now interchanging with the new E Line and the modified T Line.

The B Line's bus extensions have been rearranged. With the new T Line going to Dundas, the B Line will instead go all the way to Winona rather than ending in Stoney Creek.

The old T and L Lines now compose the same, heavily interlined line going from Waterdown to downtown, Mohawk College, Limeridge, then back into the lower city via Kenilworth to Centre Mall at Barton (a great location for a future GO Station).

Moving buses to follow the proposed BLAST routes even without upgrades is a good start. Hopefully it can highlight how much it is needed.

[RaginRonic]

For those here who wish to take a look at some of what HSR is thinking about, Joey Coleman (@JoeyColeman on Twitter) uploaded these links to Twitter....I don't know how to downsize pics here, but if anyone here can, can you please help me with that, especially with the last 3 links?

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FsZo3HiWwAAV-Qg?format=jpg&name=4096x4096

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FsZpJf7XwAU3457?format=jpg&name=4096x4096

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FsZpWKjXgAY35Wk?format=jpg&name=4096x4096

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FsZpZA2X0AEVxLL?format=jpg&name=4096x4096

=)

[matt602]

I honestly love the proposed changes to the BLAST network and existing bus routes. I really like how the main idea is to use the GO and LRT stations as feeder hubs instead of just having most of the bus routes in the city go into downtown along East/West routes. Getting from the lower city to the mountain will also be easier as there will be more transfer points from the LRT at downtown, Ottawa, Parkdale and Eastgate. Also really liking how the 8/9 routes will imrpove going North/South in the lower city by restoring/adding service to Sherman and Gage Ave.

It's probably gonna be hard to get used to for the first year but I think once every does this is gonna be a game changer and neighborhoods near the LRT and GO stations are gonna explode over the next decade. Queenston and Parkdale in particular should be pretty interesting to watch.

[thistleclub]

Will be interested to see how this blue sky concept emerges from the multiple stages of review, funding, and service standards. Looks like we won’t see any practical changes for the next year (Q1 2024) which suggests that budget changes will likely appear in the 2025-26 cycle.

Also interested to see on-demand service (71) entering the lower city. Typically that’s an exurban phenom, not one in areas with transit-supportive density.

[Innsertnamehere]

I like the transit plan - I question why Barton is seemingly perennially forgotten in these transit plans though. It's the second busiest route for HSR and it still isn't deemed important enough for an express bus? I get that they expect some ridership to divert to the LRT, but still.

The Waterdown connection is also odd to me, an express bus running basically non-stop from downtown just to make a single stop in the middle of nowhere off of Highway 6. It at the very least needs to run down Dundas St through Waterdown to the east end of the town, ideally to the Dundas/407 Park and Ride in Burlington.

The other gaps which remain still are Binbrook and the Stoney Creek Waterfront. Binbrook doesn't even get on-demand service still, and Stoney Creek waterfront may work with on-demand service for now, but has 3-4,000 condo units in delivery right now which will change that profile.

The other big question of course is funding here. There are some very ambitious frequencies outlined here, most of which exceed existing services by a decent margin. What's the cost of implementing this network, exactly?

Other smaller things I like:

- Downtown Burlington bus is extended to Burlington GO

- Service finally extended to Winona

- continuous service through Ancaster from McMaster providing direct transit connections to the LRT

- rationalization of bus routes through downtown

- much better connections to West Harbour