Quebec, the French Language, and Quebecois Identity

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

there was this chess club at my high school (in Montreal) that was called the squareheads. The members were all, to the letter, survivors of the terrible abuse meted out by their Quebecois overlords. The elite members were called Goddamned English, while the apprentices were called blokes. As an act of penance, each day they gathered in a circle and spoke the following words (baragouinaient en français):

I suppose that could conceivably exist, in a self-deprecating way! (Though I assume you're joking. At first I thought you might be serious.)

[MonctonRad]

I propose that, as an act of solidarity and rapproachment, the the BQ change their name to the Bloke Quebecois.

[lio45]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

As an act of penance, each day they gathered in a circle and spoke the following words

It was plausible until that part ^

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

I propose that, as an act of solidarity and rapproachment, the the BQ change their name to the Bloke Quebecois.

That would actually be a great name for one of those new anglo protest parties!

[MolsonExport]

He may have been Quebecois de souche, but in my mind, the biggest bloke of all was this man:

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

He may have been Quebecois de souche, but in my mind, the biggest bloke of all was this man:

You forgot to include the requisite "by jove!" in your post.

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by Acajack

You forgot to include the requisite "by jove!" in your post.

As soon as I saw the photo, "By Jove" was the first thing that came to my mind!

[New Brisavoine]

Originally Posted by Acajack

You forgot to include the requisite "by jove!" in your post.

• Video Link

[lio45]

Anglo Quebec was certainly at some point British enough that "by Jove!" would have been a normal expression, no?

In the Franco-Belgian BD classic "Buck Danny", in one of the early episodes, the authors have Buck use a super-British expression (as they quickly get more familiar with America, they'll never repeat that mistake in the entire series), which is something that only struck me re-reading as an adult who's familiar with the Anglosphere. Not 100% sure from memory but I'm pretty sure it's actually "By Jove!". A Continental Francophone writer in the late 1940s could easily make that mistake (they're familiar with it from exposure to English, but can't know Yanks don't use it.)

An American would just absolutely not say something like that.

It's like if you had a novel set in 1700s Paris, and one of the characters when pissed off goes "Criss de tabarnak!"

[Acajack]

I loved Les Sentinelles de l'Air as a kid! It was produced by the same puppet animation company.

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by lio45

Anglo Quebec was certainly at some point British enough that "by Jove!" would have been a normal expression, no?

In the Franco-Belgian BD classic "Buck Danny", in one of the early episodes, the authors have Buck use a super-British expression (as they quickly get more familiar with America, they'll never repeat that mistake in the entire series), which is something that only struck me re-reading as an adult who's familiar with the Anglosphere. Not 100% sure from memory but I'm pretty sure it's actually "By Jove!". A Continental Francophone writer in the late 1940s could easily make that mistake (they're familiar with it from exposure to English, but can't know Yanks don't use it.)

An American would just absolutely not say something like that.

It's like if you had a novel set in 1700s Paris, and one of the characters when pissed off goes "Criss de tabarnak!"

Recognized and sometimes used, but not "normal" in the sense of common.

[New Brisavoine]

^^Nothing can beat Tintin.

As for "By Jove", continental Europeans know it's used in Britain, not America. And it's a cliché we like to throw at them when they throw at us the stupidest "Sacrebleu" cliché (for some reason the notions of French culture and language held by many Brits stopped at some point around 1900).

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by New Brisavoine

^^Nothing can beat Tintin.

As for "By Jove", continental Europeans know it's used in Britain, not America. And it's a cliché we like to throw at them when they throw at us the stupidest "Sacrebleu" cliché (for some reason the notions of French culture and language held by many Brits stopped at some point around 1900).

By Jove and Sacrebleu seem like good equivalents.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by New Brisavoine

^^Nothing can beat Tintin.

.

Oh, Tintin rules for me too, even if lots of people - including Lio on here - remind me that the humour in Astérix is much more intelligent and refined.

I know it's caricatural view of the world, but I loved the idea of a young reporter travelling the world and being involved in all sorts of adventures.

One of a number of things that gave me the travel bug early on.

I read Astérix too of course, but Tintin was much more satisfiying than Gaulois beating up on Roman centurions. Though it's true that Astérix et Obélix did travel as well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tYseHTv9Xx0&t=57s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dn2vyORpuyw&t=97s

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by lio45

Anglo Quebec was certainly at some point British enough that "by Jove!" would have been a normal expression, no?

In the Franco-Belgian BD classic "Buck Danny", in one of the early episodes, the authors have Buck use a super-British expression (as they quickly get more familiar with America, they'll never repeat that mistake in the entire series), which is something that only struck me re-reading as an adult who's familiar with the Anglosphere. Not 100% sure from memory but I'm pretty sure it's actually "By Jove!". A Continental Francophone writer in the late 1940s could easily make that mistake (they're familiar with it from exposure to English, but can't know Yanks don't use it.)

An American would just absolutely not say something like that.

It's like if you had a novel set in 1700s Paris, and one of the characters when pissed off goes "Criss de tabarnak!"

Funny also how "bloke" in Quebec is a slur for anglophones, whereas in the UK and Australia it just means "guy" or "dude".

AFAIK we're the only place in the world where it's a slur - even if extremely rarely heard these days.

France has other slurs for the English and the British, like "rosbif", right?

[lio45]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Oh, Tintin rules for me too, even if lots of people - including Lio on here - remind me that the humour in Astérix is much more intelligent and refined.

The golden era of Colonel Clifton by Turk & de Groot is even better than Astérix for intelligent and refined humor, IMO (incidentally, now that's a character who does say "by Jove!" )

Tintin doesn't rank very high (though Hergé was definitely a pioneer, so we have to factor that in). I wouldn't be hard-pressed to find better. But finding something with higher-quality humor than anything by René Goscinny requires some thought!

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Funny also how "bloke" in Quebec is a slur for anglophones, whereas in the UK and Australia it just means "guy" or "dude".

AFAIK we're the only place in the world where it's a slur - even if extremely rarely heard these days.

France has other slurs for the English and the British, like "rosbif", right?

I assume that English Canada would be the only place where "Pepsi" has been used as a slur.

[New Brisavoine]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Oh, Tintin rules for me too, even if lots of people - including Lio on here - remind me that the humour in Astérix is much more intelligent and refined.

I know it's caricatural view of the world, but I loved the idea of a young reporter travelling the world and being involved in all sorts of adventures.

One of a number of things that gave me the travel bug early on.

I read Astérix too of course, but Tintin was much more satisfiying than Gaulois beating up on Roman centurions. Though it's true that Astérix et Obélix did travel as well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tYseHTv9Xx0&t=57s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dn2vyORpuyw&t=97s

Tintin has the charm of an old Europe that has unfortunately mostly disappeared. Many French people still long for that old Europe though, when people were polite, cities beautiful, ladies had class.

[lio45]

Originally Posted by kwoldtimer

I assume that English Canada would be the only place where "Pepsi" has been used as a slur.

Something to keep in mind should I ever write a novel set in Dickensian London in which there's a Frenchman

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by lio45

Something to keep in mind should I ever write a novel set in Dickensian London in which there's a Frenchman

If it's set in London, keep in mind that "peasouper" relates to the weather...