Ottawa Macdonald-Cartier International Airport (YOW/CYOW) 1.0

[fanofYOW]

Originally Posted by YOWhopeful

Do new hangars translate to new routes from YOW?

Probably! New private hangars definitely mean some type of investment between the airline and airport.

Such exciting news. Can’t wait to see what will be said on Nov 1. Even if it’s not the announcement of routes, anything will be good news as it signals YOW’s importance for Porter.

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by YOWhopeful

Do new hangars translate to new routes from YOW?

Not always. If it's Porter. Then maybe. If it's the other sectors, or military or government building new hangars, there won't be new passenger services.

Aside from Porter, the military is planning to renovate 14 Hangar.

[rocketphish]

Is there any business case to fly these ungainly birds around here, or does this only work for flights to places like Comox or Baie-Comeau?

Air Canada to Acquire 30 ES-30 Electric Regional Aircraft from Heart Aerospace

News provided by Air Canada

Sep 15, 2022, 08:00 ET

Electric-hybrid aircraft advances carrier's 2050 net-zero emission goal

• Battery powered aircraft will have capacity for up to 30 passengers
• Electric 200 km range extends to 400 km with reserve hybrid architecture
• Agreement includes equity investment by Air Canada in Heart Aerospace

Editor's note: A video demonstration of this aircraft is available here.

MONTREAL, Sept. 15, 2022 /CNW Telbec/ - Air Canada today announced a purchase agreement for 30 ES-30 electric-hybrid aircraft under development by Heart Aerospace of Sweden. The revolutionary regional aircraft, expected to enter service in 2028, will generate zero emissions flying on battery power and yield significant operational savings and benefits. Under the agreement, Air Canada has also acquired a US$5 million equity stake in Heart Aerospace.

"Air Canada has taken a leadership position in the industry to address climate change. The introduction into our fleet of the ES-30 electric regional aircraft from Heart Aerospace will be a step forward to our goal of net zero emissions by 2050," said Michael Rousseau, President and Chief Executive Officer of Air Canada. "Already, Air Canada is supporting the development of new technologies, such as sustainable aviation fuels and carbon capture, to address climate change. We are now reinforcing our commitment by investing in revolutionary electric aircraft technology, both as a customer for the ES-30 and as an equity partner in Heart Aerospace."

The ES-30 will allow Air Canada to serve regional and commuter routes more sustainably, providing low-emission connectivity to local communities over the medium-to-long term. It will be capable of carrying 30 passengers seated three across (in a 2X1 configuration), with a galley and lavatory. Air Canada has placed a purchase order for 30 ES-30.

"Air Canada is a strategically important partner for Heart Aerospace. The company has one of the world's largest networks operated by regional turboprops, and it is also a progressive, future leaning company especially in the green transmission," said Anders Forslund, founder and CEO of Heart Aerospace. "With the ES-30 we can start cutting emissions from air travel well before the end of this decade."

The aircraft will be powered by lithium-ion batteries, and will be quieter, have better operational parameters, be more reliable, and have a smaller environmental footprint than conventional turbo-prop aircraft. It will also be equipped with reserve-hybrid generators that can use sustainable aviation fuel. Fully loaded, the ES-30 is projected to have an all-electric, zero-emission range of 200 km. This can be extended to 400 km with power supplemented by the generators, and up to 800 km if the load is restricted to 25 passengers. Charging time for the aircraft is expected to be 30-to-50 minutes.

https://www.newswire.ca/news-releases/ai...raft-from-heart-aerospace-873505575.html

[MountainView]

Originally Posted by rocketphish

Is there any business case to fly these ungainly birds around here, or does this only work for flights to places like Comox or Baie-Comeau?

If they use the 200 km fully battery operated model, I think they will place them on routes such as Vancouver to Victoria, Nanaimo, Comox, and Campbell River. Some of these do work well on the Q400, but this electric commuter plane would work great on these routes.

Not likely to happen, but the Kingston (YGK) is in range of YOW with the 200 km range model.

[YOWflier]

Originally Posted by YOWhopeful

Do new hangars translate to new routes from YOW?

If the hangar(s) are to be occupied by Porter as part of a jet maintenance base, it would be unusual to have that decoupled from a significant base of commercial operations. So yes, more routes, almost assuredly.

[Zmonkey]

Originally Posted by fanofYOW

Probably! New private hangars definitely mean some type of investment between the airline and airport.

Such exciting news. Can’t wait to see what will be said on Nov 1. Even if it’s not the announcement of routes, anything will be good news as it signals YOW’s importance for Porter.

It just means the maintenance yard is in Ottawa. The original plan with porter was YYZ but couldn't find the space. Flair has a biggest maintenance facility in Calgary and its their 4 largest market.
Hangers don't always mean new routes or it will be your biggest market. Routes chase dollars.

[fanofYOW]

Originally Posted by Zmonkey

It just means the maintenance yard is in Ottawa. The original plan with porter was YYZ but couldn't find the space. Flair has a biggest maintenance facility in Calgary and its their 4 largest market.
Hangers don't always mean new routes or it will be your biggest market. Routes chase dollars.

Yes but Calgary is a route base for them. Not the biggest but still a base. We don’t know how large of a route base YOW will be for Porter yet, but it’s safe to say at this point that we will not be left out.

[Dominion301]

Originally Posted by Zmonkey

It just means the maintenance yard is in Ottawa. The original plan with porter was YYZ but couldn't find the space. Flair has a biggest maintenance facility in Calgary and its their 4 largest market.
Hangers don't always mean new routes or it will be your biggest market. Routes chase dollars.

Yep. TUL is a major maintenance base for AA but while I believe AA are the largest carrier at TUL, it's not like they have a massive operation there.

I think by the end of the decade, PD will have at least 50 YOW departures per day.

If you look at PD's job listings, there's a YYZ hub manager position listed. However, PD have designated the 4 jet bases as 'hubs' in literature. I think it'll be a given that PD will be pumping at least some connections through YOW, whether it's like AC with a focus city where flights happen to connect here or whether it's two or more actual banks of flights.

Today's departure count: 57

Today's cancellation count: 1

[Zmonkey]

Originally Posted by fanofYOW

Yes but Calgary is a route base for them. Not the biggest but still a base. We don’t know how large of a route base YOW will be for Porter yet, but it’s safe to say at this point that we will not be left out.

Calgary isn't a base for Flair yet. They are expected to to open one in 2023 but its still not a operational base for them. Edmonton is their Alberta staff base.

Flair's current bases are Edmonton, Abbotsford, Vancouver, KW & Toronto. Flair's main maintenance facility is Calgary and that is really because they outsourced it to HeavyAero.

Tuscan will be a US base and Calgary is expected to be a base in 2023.

[fanofYOW]

Originally Posted by Zmonkey

Calgary isn't a base for Flair yet. They are expected to to open one in 2023 but its still not a operational base for them. Edmonton is their Alberta staff base.

Flair's current bases are Edmonton, Abbotsford, Vancouver, KW & Toronto. Flair's main maintenance facility is Calgary and that is really because they outsourced it to HeavyAero.

Tuscan will be a US base and Calgary is expected to be a base in 2023.

Where’s YOW in your list? The point is, it’s very unlikely to have a maintenance facility/hangar in an airport and have no commercial operation.

[hehehe]

Originally Posted by Dominion301

I think by the end of the decade, PD will have at least 50 YOW departures per day.

That's quite ambitious (but still possible nonetheless) considering YTZ is at 50-60 departures a day this winter for weekdays.

[Dominion301]

Originally Posted by Zmonkey

Calgary isn't a base for Flair yet. They are expected to to open one in 2023 but its still not a operational base for them. Edmonton is their Alberta staff base.

Flair's current bases are Edmonton, Abbotsford, Vancouver, KW & Toronto. Flair's main maintenance facility is Calgary and that is really because they outsourced it to HeavyAero.

Tuscan will be a US base and Calgary is expected to be a base in 2023.

YOW is also an F8 base. YUL is supposed to be a base soon too.

Today’s departure count: 60

[Dominion301]

Originally Posted by hehehe

That's quite ambitious (but still possible nonetheless) considering YTZ is at 50-60 departures a day this winter for weekdays.

Pre-pandemic in peak season PD were at around 23 departures a day. This summer I think PD were back up around 17 on weekdays. Another 30-40 between now and 2029 seems realistic...some of those could be DH4s too.

[Zmonkey]

Originally Posted by hehehe

That's quite ambitious (but still possible nonetheless) considering YTZ is at 50-60 departures a day this winter for weekdays.

I don't want to to say its not going to happen, but I think people need to remember people actually need to fill these planes and book tickets. The average person likely isn't flying that much to add in 50-60 planes in from one carrier unless they can really figure out how to Hub Ottawa.

Vancouver, Calgary, Toronto and Montreal are all doing fine as airports because they have carriers who Hub there, have big business and tourist demand. I don't know if Ottawa will ever really turn into a massive Hub with Toronto and Montreal right there. Why would those people in those markets connect in Ottawa vs flying direct from there own market.

[hehehe]

Originally Posted by Zmonkey

I don't want to to say its not going to happen, but I think people need to remember people actually need to fill these planes and book tickets. The average person likely isn't flying that much to add in 50-60 planes in from one carrier unless they can really figure out how to Hub Ottawa.

Vancouver, Calgary, Toronto and Montreal are all doing fine as airports because they have carriers who Hub there, have big business and tourist demand. I don't know if Ottawa will ever really turn into a massive Hub with Toronto and Montreal right there. Why would those people in those markets connect in Ottawa vs flying direct from there own market.

I agree, we could (or will) certainly see a non insignificant number of connections happening (eg YQB/YQM/YFC-YOW-—) but I don't think Ottawa will become some sort of a major hub. With Porter I mostly see markets out of YOW that might've worked on AC or WS, eg LAS/LAX, maybe SFO and seasonal PHX, and some Caribbean and Mexican destinations.

[Dominion301]

Originally Posted by Zmonkey

I don't want to to say its not going to happen, but I think people need to remember people actually need to fill these planes and book tickets. The average person likely isn't flying that much to add in 50-60 planes in from one carrier unless they can really figure out how to Hub Ottawa.

Vancouver, Calgary, Toronto and Montreal are all doing fine as airports because they have carriers who Hub there, have big business and tourist demand. I don't know if Ottawa will ever really turn into a massive Hub with Toronto and Montreal right there. Why would those people in those markets connect in Ottawa vs flying direct from there own market.

I don’t think anyone here is under an illusion of a massive hub here, but a 60ish departures per day with say two east/north and two west/south banks of 8-12 flights each, plus 15 YTZ daily departures type operation is realistic…then more in the 2030s after PD order 20 XLRs. ;-) Pre-pandemic, AC we’re at about 60 daily departures in summer and about 57 in winter.

Saturday’s departure count: 60

[hehehe]

Originally Posted by Dominion301

I don’t think anyone here is under an illusion of a massive hub here, but a 60ish departures per day with say two east/north and two west/south banks of 8-12 flights each, plus 15 YTZ daily departures type operation is realistic…then more in the 2030s after PD order 20 XLRs. ;-) Pre-pandemic, AC we’re at about 60 daily departures in summer and about 57 in winter.

Saturday’s departure count: 60

That does sound reasonable. I'd also expect PD to increase Q400 flights at YOW to more regional destinations too (maybe YQG, YXU, YQB, YYG, YSJ etc)

[MountainView]

If Porter were announcing routes on November 1st, as rumoured, you'd think that their social media team would start to hype up the announcement with some teasers or something like that. You would think they would do that early this upcoming week if they were making a significant route announcement.

This rumoured announcement could simply be an acknowledgement that they are building a new hangar at YOW and have partnered with the Airport Authority on an aspect of it. Would be a great photo op if they could get their Porter-painted E2 up here for the announcement too.

I still believe that their initial E2 routes are going to be from YYZ. YOW would likely get a YOW-YYZ flight on the E2, but perhaps not more than that initially.
Again...I have no idea on their delivery schedule, but I can't image they ramp up too quickly. When we know how many frames they are scheduled to have by, let's say May 1, then it will be easier to speculate potential routes.

I do have my fingers crossed for YOW, but my expectations for anything big to happen on Nov 1 are tempered. It would also be strange to have an announcement in YOW with routes focused from YYZ... also why I am thinking this isn't about routes. BUT they should announce some soon, because a lot of carriers are releasing the summer 2023 schedules now, and price conscious people book early.

[hehehe]

Originally Posted by MountainView

If Porter were announcing routes on November 1st, as rumoured, you'd think that their social media team would start to hype up the announcement with some teasers or something like that. You would think they would do that early this upcoming week if they were making a significant route announcement.

This rumoured announcement could simply be an acknowledgement that they are building a new hangar at YOW and have partnered with the Airport Authority on an aspect of it. Would be a great photo op if they could get their Porter-painted E2 up here for the announcement too.

I still believe that their initial E2 routes are going to be from YYZ. YOW would likely get a YOW-YYZ flight on the E2, but perhaps not more than that initially.
Again...I have no idea on their delivery schedule, but I can't image they ramp up too quickly. When we know how many frames they are scheduled to have by, let's say May 1, then it will be easier to speculate potential routes.

I do have my fingers crossed for YOW, but my expectations for anything big to happen on Nov 1 are tempered. It would also be strange to have an announcement in YOW with routes focused from YYZ... also why I am thinking this isn't about routes. BUT they should announce some soon, because a lot of carriers are releasing the summer 2023 schedules now, and price conscious people book early.

I think others mentioned that PD wants to launch flights this year, but the timeline is looking more and more unrealistic, especially if there's no announcement on Nov 1 about routes

[MountainView]

Originally Posted by hehehe

I think others mentioned that PD wants to launch flights this year, but the timeline is looking more and more unrealistic, especially if there's no announcement on Nov 1 about routes

I have also heard "others" mention things like this... but no actual source.

The E2 still is not certified by Transport Canada yet either.

If any flights happen this year (before end of 2022) it will be training flights YYZ-YOW/YUL to orientate the crew.