Ottawa Macdonald-Cartier International Airport (YOW/CYOW) 1.0

[Dominion301]

Today’s departure count: 64

Today’s cancellation count: 1

[fanofYOW]

Originally Posted by FlyYOW

Ok so:

Routing: YOW-LHR(-XYZ)
Connections: 2-3 hours each way, if applicable
Comfort: state of the art aircraft just off the assembly line, conventional or above conventional seat pitch and amenities, lie-flat biz if that’s your thing.

Can we count on your support?

I know this question wasn't directed at me, but I would def pay a premium to use it rather than connect. UPDATE: Woops I read that wrong. If it was direct I mean I would pay premium out of YOW for sure.

[J.OT13]

Anyone know if/when the Germain Hotel will start construction in the near future?

[solo748]

Originally Posted by FlyYOW

We would need to know more details about your friend’s itinerary. If hers was already purchased and tried to make an itinerary change after the fact on what I guarantee is a basic fare no wonder AC tried to leach her. Otherwise, your friend could have and should have originally booked and flown via YYZ with nearly hourly Rapidair service; but it was probably $27 less to book through YUL or something with a 🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵 connection.

Life’s short, you do you. Complaining about an issue while contributing to its existence won’t earn you empathy from some of us. Happy trails.

Are you okay?? lol

Let's go through your post ...

She booked discounted business (P fare for basement experts, and chatboard tough gals).

She booked AC496 -> AC892 with an 88min cnx at YUL

She noticed the pathetic YOWYUL performance and asked me what to do as I travel frequently.

I told her if she misconnects, her only option will be if AC protects her on LH to MUC and not sure she'd get a flat bed, let alone the added hassle. Otherwise they'll put her on the next day's YULFCO. She'd lose a day and her $500/hotel night in Rome is gone too

She called and asked to me moved to the 3pm YOWYUL. AC wanted $1200

If you think this risk and hassle is worth saving a 90min drive to YUL, go for it.

You strike me as the person who has the time for a long-winded email to AC Ops when you misconnect to get your 10K aeropeso and 20% night flight voucher


Edited .... Just checking today's OPS on YOWYUL :

6am : CNX
1125a : 21 min late
310pm : minimum 1hr delay (scheduled in an hour)
510p : scheduled on time as of now.

[solo748]

Originally Posted by GeoNerd

People went from admitting to being cheap asses trying to save a few measly bucks by flying out of YUL instead of YOW to becoming international business people afraid of being late for important board meetings in Europe pretty quickly on here.

G Nerd,
Realize you don't know too much about airline pricing and likely dont have many places to be, but you'd be surprised how much more expensive YUL-🞵🞵🞵 nonstop is OFTEN priced vs YOW-YUL-🞵🞵🞵.

So, your post about saving a few measly bucks is ignorant for a large swath of travel patterns

[YOWflier]

Originally Posted by solo748

Are you okay?? lol

Yes I’m wonderful, thanks.

She booked discounted business…

and the rest doesn't really matter. It’s pretty clear in the fare rules that nobody reads that this fare is subject to change fees of $500 per direction + fare differences. So she wanted to execute an itinerary change before departure due to fear of misconnect on a tight connection… pony up. Or better yet, plan better next time.

You strike me as the person who has the time for a long-winded email to AC Ops when you misconnect to get your 10K aeropeso and 20% night flight voucher

I’m not an AC elite.

P.S. on a biz fare she could have also SDCd on the earlier YOW-YUL she wanted, avoiding that $1200 entirely (or paying a nominal fee nowhere near $1200…haven’t checked the rules lately). Space permitting of course.

[MountainView]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Anyone know if/when the Germain Hotel will start construction in the near future?

It's currently on hold. I know it's high on the Airport Authority's list of things to do... but we likely wouldn't see shovels in the ground until at least 2025-27, if not further. A lot would depend on YOW's traffic fully rebounding as well.

There is hope that the Community Improvement Plan might help this as well.

[solo748]

Originally Posted by FlyYOW

and the rest doesn't really matter.

I Put the fare class to clear up your assertion it was some "cheap, basic" fare

Originally Posted by FlyYOW

It’s pretty clear in the fare rules that nobody reads that this fare is subject to change fees of $500 per direction + fare differences.

ahh, you read all the Ts and Cs too. You must have a lot of spare time!! ..uh, I mean, How terrific!

Originally Posted by FlyYOW

So she wanted to execute an itinerary change before departure due to fear of misconnect on a tight connection… pony up. Or better yet, plan better next time.

You Got me again. She wanted to execute an itin change and sit around an airport for an extra 3 hours to protect her against the piss poor AC ops on this sector which she had no idea of.

And, you deem a 90min connection "tight", while also spouting off on people electing to forego the crapshoot of AC's express perfomance and get themselves to YUL

Originally Posted by FlyYOW

P.S. on a biz fare she could have also SDCd on the earlier YOW-YUL she wanted, avoiding that $1200 entirely (or paying a nominal fee nowhere near $1200…haven’t checked the rules lately). Space permitting of course.

Hey, thanks. Whoever told you reading all the fare rules and restricitons were a waste of time. Well aware of the SD standby policy.

After all the spouting and know it all chatter, you think an Ottawa traveller trying to get to Rome should "plan better" by booking a 3pm flight to YUL with a 3h31m connection.

[AuxTown]

Maybe a dumb question, but doesn't the airline have our home address EVERY SINGLE time we book a flight. I think they know exactly how many people drive from Ottawa to take off from Montreal and they just don't care. I don't think me booking a $500 25 minute flight YOW-YUL is going to make them any more likely to add more YOW destinations.

[YOWflier]

In summary it was indeed a basic fare albeit in the biz category (similar punitive restrictions), she wasn’t aware of the most basic of fare rules (change fees, which are displayed along with the same day standby rules when booking), didn’t plan well by researching flight options (esp. through better gateways with more frequent service and alternative overseas options in case of IRROPS), had buyer’s remorse after booking but didn’t want to pony up for the change she desired.

Most people learn the ropes eventually, usually the hard way.

Next time send her over to flyertalk she’ll get better, prompt advice from good people.

[YOWflier]

Originally Posted by AuxTown

Maybe a dumb question, but doesn't the airline have our home address EVERY SINGLE time we book a flight. I think they know exactly how many people drive from Ottawa to take off from Montreal and they just don't care. I don't think me booking a $500 25 minute flight YOW-YUL is going to make them any more likely to add more YOW destinations.

Yes they know your address. It’s not a lack of knowledge it’s about willingness to self transfer. Of course they don’t care given how many people are willing and do it (and then people come out of the weeds complaining about poor frequency on this sector). If the willingness were lower, they’d have no choice but to either add more flights to gateways or add nonstops. Gateways aren’t limitless in the capacity they can handle. We saw an epic failure of this during summer.

The connecting flight doesn’t normally cost anywhere close to that. In fact it’s historically been “free”, although COVID-time pricing has been anomalous at times in this regard.

[AuxTown]

Originally Posted by FlyYOW

Yes they know your address. It’s not a lack of knowledge it’s about willingness to self transfer. Of course they don’t care given how many people are willing and do it (and then people come out of the weeds complaining about poor frequency on this sector). If the willingness were lower, they’d have no choice but to either add more flights to gateways or add nonstops. Gateways aren’t limitless in the capacity they can handle. We saw an epic failure of this during summer.

The connecting flight doesn’t normally cost anywhere close to that. In fact it’s historically been “free”, although COVID-time pricing has been anomalous at times in this regard.

That might be the case if you want to stick to one airline (if possible) but you get hosed if you use two different ones. For example, my return flight to Doha in November is 2700 direct from YUL. Add in the connecting flight from Ottawa and the price is 5300 Talk about giving me a good reason to drive or take the train!

[Takingoff]

[QUOTE=FlyYOW;9743883]Yes they know your address. It’s not a lack of knowledge it’s about willingness to self transfer. Of course they don’t care given how many people are willing and do it (and then people come out of the weeds complaining about poor frequency on this sector). If the willingness were lower, they’d have no choice but to either add more flights to gateways or add nonstops. Gateways aren’t limitless in the capacity they can handle. We saw an epic failure of this during summer.

If people chose to not use AC when opting to drive to YUL to access European destinations, AC would have a reason to explore adding direct service from YOW to capture these 'lost' customers. Having a direct flight from YOW would become be a competitive advantage.

Taking connecting flights out of Ottawa only feeds the AC hub and spoke model. This leads to more connecting flights (frequency/capacity) being added, not more direct flights.

Enjoy your transfers in YYZ. I'll opt to fly out of YUL instead and connect in Europe if necessary. At least I know that the next flight (if bumped/missed connection) will be a lot sooner than waiting for the next transatlantic flight the following day.

[YOWflier]

I’m not an AC FF so I don’t find myself at YYZ very much at all. But until our TATLs come back, likely starting in 2024, the transfer in YYZ (vs YUL) is a no brainer with many benefits when going that way. When the TATLs come back that’s where you’ll find me.

[Takingoff]

Originally Posted by FlyYOW

I’m not an AC FF so I don’t find myself at YYZ very much at all. But until our TATLs come back, likely starting in 2024, the transfer in YYZ (vs YUL) is a no brainer with many benefits when going that way. When the TATLs come back that’s where you’ll find me.

Many benefits transfering through YYZ...are you actually being serious?

[YOWflier]

vs. transferring in YUL? Sure am.

[Takingoff]

Originally Posted by FlyYOW

vs. transferring in YUL? Sure am.

Hey, why don't we go back to my original point. DRIVE TO YUL! You won't need to worry about a missed connection...unless one of your "benefits" of connecting through YYZ includes being put up in a motel by the 401 when you miss your international flight.

[YOWflier]

If I want to inject misery into my travels as a reminder of how much better it can be maybe I’ll try that.

Speaking of motels along highways, which dive along the A520 do you park your car at?

[Takingoff]

Originally Posted by FlyYOW

If I want to inject misery into my travels as a reminder of how much better it can be maybe I’ll try that.

Speaking of motels along highways, which dive along the A520 do you park your car at?

I don't do the motel thing. More than happy to take a KLM/AF bus, or use discounted parking at the airport for my european travels.

And yes, you do seem to want to inject misery into your travels. Why else would anyone willingly want to connect in YYZ. Your responses are pretty clear on the matter.

Happy travels.

[YOWflier]

Thanks!