How many cities still have downtown department stores?

[Wigs]

Originally Posted by JManc

There was at least one in Houston. It was Neiman's/ Nordstrom level of fancy.

Thanks Jman

On Twitter it was like someone important died
"Not Lord & Taylor. Say it ain't so!"

[Wigs]

Originally Posted by iheartthed

Lord & Taylor was more upscale than Macy's, but not quite as upscale as Bloomingdale's. My sense is that the spectrum in order of least-to-most expensive goes something like this:

Macy's -> Lord & Taylor -> Nordstrom's -> Bloomingdale's -> Saks

I don't think I've ever been into Neiman Marcus, and have only been to Nordstrom's once or twice.

Damn, I had no idea American retail had so many levels

[JManc]

Originally Posted by AviationGuy

You're talking about where you're working in CA, right? Not much less expensive in Austin unless you want to live in a ghetto, which is expensive as well. People in my neighborhood who are paying over $1M for a basic 3-br ranch aren't spending a lot on furnishings. They're stretched just to be able to live in a reasonably safe area.

There's no reason Austin should be that expensive. It's still Austin. I am waiting for the other shoe to drop. Texas has an ever increasingly property tax unlike California so if someone from the Bay Area and Austin bought their houses for $500k and they're now worth 3x that now, Californians pay tax on the $500k while Texans pay based on the current $1.5 million value.

Houston has plenty of high paying jobs and wealth too but housing market still less than half what it is in Austin. However, million dollar houses in Houston are typically furnished with high end appliances and furniture.

[Comrade]

Originally Posted by Wigs

Comrade, City Creek may be one of the nicest looking shopping centres in North America.

It is very nice and infinitely better than what it replaced:

[Buckeye Native 001]

Originally Posted by Wigs

Buckeye, I'm glad you're the unofficial SSP historian. There's so many gems like this that I've forgotten

I can remember that, but hell if I know where I parked my damn car (I'm 39...)

[MolsonExport]

Very little is left of the once great collection of downtown department stores in Canada. We still have Hudson's Bay in many of the big cities, but many have closed (86 locations, down from 99 a few years ago), and their footprints have been shrinking. There is also Simon's (debatable whether it is a true department store as the only department seems to be clothing, despite some stores being on multiple levels), but these are in only a few select cities. Ditto for Holt Renfrew. There are a smattering of Nordstoms. London used to have one of those grand old family-owned department stores (Kingsmills) but it shuttered about a decade ago. Now there is nothing but chains and big box barf.

I hate big box barf.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

Very little is left of the once great collection of downtown department stores in Canada. We still have Hudson's Bay in many of the big cities, but many have closed (86 locations, down from 99 a few years ago), and their footprints have been shrinking. There is also Simon's (debatable whether it is a true department store as the only department seems to be clothing, despite some stores being on multiple levels), but these are in only a few select cities. Ditto for Holt Renfrew. There are a smattering of Nordstoms. London used to have one of those grand old family-owned department stores (Kingsmills) but it shuttered about a decade ago. Now there is nothing but chains and big box barf.

I hate big box barf.

Eaton's to me was the classic Canadian department store, and when they were around they pushed The Bay (Hudson's Bay) to be better.

[Don't Be That Guy]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

Very little is left of the once great collection of downtown department stores in Canada. We still have Hudson's Bay in many of the big cities, but many have closed (86 locations, down from 99 a few years ago), and their footprints have been shrinking. There is also Simon's (debatable whether it is a true department store as the only department seems to be clothing, despite some stores being on multiple levels), but these are in only a few select cities. Ditto for Holt Renfrew. There are a smattering of Nordstoms. London used to have one of those grand old family-owned department stores (Kingsmills) but it shuttered about a decade ago. Now there is nothing but chains and big box barf.

I hate big box barf.

It looks like there are still Bay stores in downtown Victoria, Vancouver, Calgary, Banff, Toronto, Saskatoon, Regina, Ottawa, and Montreal, and every other location is a suburban mall - Le Cite in Quebec being kind of in-between. So not bad compared to the US.

Kind of surprised that there are no Bay stores in the Maritimes outside of Nova Scotia.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Don't Be That Guy

It looks like there are still Bay stores in downtown Victoria, Vancouver, Calgary, Banff, Toronto, Saskatoon, Regina, Ottawa, and Montreal, and every other location is a suburban mall - Le Cite in Quebec being kind of in-between. So not bad compared to the US.

Kind of surprised that there are no Bay stores in the Maritimes outside of Nova Scotia.

I always thought that too but it makes sense when you consider that the Hudson's Bay Company is strongly associated with Canada's westward and northwestward expansion, initially starting from Montreal.

These people weren't really looking eastwards (to the Maritimes) back then.

[MolsonExport]

Originally Posted by Don't Be That Guy

It looks like there are still Bay stores in downtown Victoria, Vancouver, Calgary, Banff, Toronto, Saskatoon, Regina, Ottawa, and Montreal, and every other location is a suburban mall - Le Cite in Quebec being kind of in-between. So not bad compared to the US.

Kind of surprised that there are no Bay stores in the Maritimes outside of Nova Scotia.

downtown banff? I wasn't aware that there was such a thing. Winnipeg lost its flagship Hudson's Bay, and it is one of the larger cities in the country. This does not auger well for smaller places.

[austlar1]

I'd be curious to know how many times in the past 12 months SSP forumers have actually shopped in a department store. I'm not talking about shopping at Target, but rather a real traditional department store. Doesn't matter whether the store is a downtown store or in a mall. I bought (and returned) a chair from Macy's here in Austin at a suburban mall. That's the extent of my department store purchases in the past 12 months. Almost everything else that I've purchased has been through Amazon or some other online shopping option.

[edale]

Originally Posted by austlar1

I'd be curious to know how many times in the past 12 months SSP forumers have actually shopped in a department store. I'm not talking about shopping at Target, but rather a real traditional department store. Doesn't matter whether the store is a downtown store or in a mall. I bought (and returned) a chair from Macy's here in Austin at a suburban mall. That's the extent of my department store purchases in the past 12 months. Almost everything else that I've purchased has been through Amazon or some other online shopping option.

I shop at Nordstrom pretty regularly, both online and in store. That's it, though. Haven't been to a Macy's in years.

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by austlar1

I'd be curious to know how many times in the past 12 months SSP forumers have actually shopped in a department store. I'm not talking about shopping at Target, but rather a real traditional department store. Doesn't matter whether the store is a downtown store or in a mall. I bought (and returned) a chair from Macy's here in Austin at a suburban mall. That's the extent of my department store purchases in the past 12 months. Almost everything else that I've purchased has been through Amazon or some other online shopping option.

I shopped in a department store twice this spring/summer, and that was easily the most time I've spent in any department store since 2019.

[JManc]

Originally Posted by austlar1

I'd be curious to know how many times in the past 12 months SSP forumers have actually shopped in a department store.

This forum is mostly guys so probably not many but if you're married, your wife is so dragging your ass down to Macy's to look at kitchen appliances and bedspreads...then make you languish in awkwardness in the intimates section while she shops for bras.

[pdxtex]

I was in a Nordstrom two weeks ago. I work next to a now defunct mall and I'd check out the Macy's fairly regularly. Im at Costco every weekend tho!

[LosAngelesSportsFan]

I shop at nordstrom / nordstrom rack pretty regularly, around once every couple of months.

Dept stores in DTLA currently

Macys

Do these count?

Target
Nordstrom Rack
Burlington

[austlar1]

Nordstrom Rack, Burlington, Target, etc. doesn't cut it. Just traditional full service department stores. Checking out the stores doesn't cut it either. Who has actually been shopping (as in buying something) in a full service department store in the past year or so.

[austlar1]

Originally Posted by JManc

This forum is mostly guys so probably not many but if you're married, your wife is so dragging your ass down to Macy's to look at kitchen appliances and bedspreads...then make you languish in awkwardness in the intimates section while she shops for bras.

So, have you personally purchased anything at a real department store in the past year or two? If your wife does shop in real department stores, I guess that counts, but I'm really interested in forum member shopping habits. I'll cop to an agenda. I think traditional department stores (and I used to love them) are dinosaurs, and I doubt very many will still be around in malls or down-towns in another decade or so, except in the very largest cities. It's going to be Target, Walmart, and Costco for the basics, and online for the rest, notwithstanding a few trendy stores in neighborhood shopping districts. Hell, a Hermes store just opened on South Congress here in Austin, a neighborhood better known for crack and hookers just a few decades ago. I don't think this is predictive of a retail revival in downtown Austin or downtown anywhere really.

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by austlar1

So, have you personally purchased anything at a real department store in the past year or two? If your wife does shop in real department stores, I guess that counts, but I'm really interested in forum member shopping habits. I'll cop to an agenda. I think traditional department stores (and I used to love them) are dinosaurs, and I doubt very many will still be around in malls or down-towns in another decade or so, except in the very largest cities. It's going to be Target, Walmart, and Costco for the basics, and online for the rest, notwithstanding a few trendy stores in neighborhood shopping districts. Hell, a Hermes store just opened on South Congress here in Austin, a neighborhood better known for crack and hookers just a few decades ago. I don't think this is predictive of a retail revival in downtown Austin or downtown anywhere really.

I don't think department stores are dead, but there will be far fewer physical locations in the future. The surviving locations will be in the most high-profile and/or geographically convenient locations of a metro area, like they were originally intended to be. To use Metro Detroit as an example, about a decade ago there were about 9-10 Macy's locations in the Detroit area. Today there are 6, and I suspect that they will ultimately settle on having about 3-4 locations in that market by 2030 (assuming Macy's doesn't go under). I suspect most metros will see a similar consolidation.

[austlar1]

Once upon a time, shoppers (men and women) routinely went to department stores to buy virtually every category of item. As a male shopper, I usually bought suits, sport coats, dress slacks, neckwear, casual slacks, jeans, dress shirts, casual shirts, jackets, sweaters, shoes, socks, underwear, bedding, including mattresses, sheets, duvets, duvet covers, pillows, towels, home furnishings like sofas, chairs, and tables, and even appliances. I moved frequently back in the day. I was a regular shopper at Macy's on both coasts, Robinson's in LA, Woodward and Lothrop and Hecht Company in DC, Nordstrom in DC and Austin, and a bunch of other department stores that mostly no longer exist. Department stores were the reflex go-to place for most people to shop, and there were stores to reflect every budget. Those days are long gone. The only reason I would shop in a department store today might be to buy a good suit, dress shirts, or neckwear. I'd look online or go to a specialty store for just about anything else. I think I am pretty typical of today's shopper, although I might represent an aging demographic. Department stores (except maybe online) don't much figure in my shopping calculations today.