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  #4621  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2022, 4:47 PM
Via Chicago Via Chicago is offline
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"crime" is a red herring, esp when its coming out of KG's mouth

of course chicago has more cases as its a much bigger city than Miami population wise. but the overall violent crime rate isnt that much different.



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  #4622  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2022, 4:52 PM
OrdoSeclorum OrdoSeclorum is offline
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Originally Posted by pip View Post
I get that there are many cities in the same boat but I have always thought of Chicago as a Tier 1 city above those. But I got to tell you with 5,6,7, i forget which, people shot so far this year nearby my place in Lakeview, in addition to reports of shots fired a lot, then fights fights and fights - I hear them at night on Broadway, groups of people fighting, last weekend a block away the fights got so bad they called in assistance from other districts but couldn't get enough manpower. The CTA is a hooka lounge now. Two people were robbed a block away the other night at 11:30pm and badly beaten - this is all the time. And then the cars and bikes with no mufflers racing around lakeview all night. There is very little good news no matter what the topic. It's just too much.
I've lived in Chicago since '97 and it feels like it's better every year. Not sure what's going on with you personally, but I can assure you that if these issues are especially front-of-mind for you right now here, I'd definitely recommend staying away from Miami.
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  #4623  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2022, 4:58 PM
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MayorOfChicago MayorOfChicago is offline
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Originally Posted by OrdoSeclorum View Post
I've lived in Chicago since '97 and it feels like it's better every year. Not sure what's going on with you personally, but I can assure you that if these issues are especially front-of-mind for you right now here, I'd definitely recommend staying away from Miami.
Been here since 2001 and up through early 2020 I thought every year was a bit better, but the past two years or so have been really really rough. I live on the northwest side and tons more shootings around here than I remember, many close to home. Just the stuff downtown, the CTA's severe decay into unreliable and unsafe feeling service. A lot of it is trauma from shutting down and work from home and the past two years, I really hope we can start to get things back to the way they were. I think a lot of the problems came from a void of people on the buses, trains and downtown.

I love Chicago but there are very serious problems here right now and you can't ignore that. Especially if you just want to focus on the flashy areas of the city and the downtown and tourist market.
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  #4624  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2022, 5:01 PM
Via Chicago Via Chicago is offline
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Originally Posted by pip View Post
There is very little good news no matter what the topic. It's just too much.
because its easier to focus on the negative, esp in a social media driven world. you have tons of people walking around with Citizen on their phone getting real time notifications for every little report (regardless of whether its even substantiated or not), and in turn creating a dopamine feedback loop in their brain driven on fear and anxiety. the entire business model of that company is to get people so f'ing paranoid that theyre wiling to pay for private security (which of course they will be all too happy to sell in and provide).

its a big city. bad things are going to happen. it dosent excuse the violence problems plaguing Chicago, but for all too long no one gave a shit because they created this fantasy in their minds that its only something that happens in poor brown and black neighborhoods so who gives a shit. this attitude has been consistently prevalent among north siders, and this forum in general. this ignores the fact that virtually every north/NW side neighborhood is in fact phenomenally better off than they were 20-30 years ago. our country has major issues it is grappling with in terms of inequality, race relations, housing, etc...and yes its coming to a head. but its not somehow just a Chicago problem. this isnt a healthy country at the moment.
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  #4625  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2022, 5:06 PM
thegoatman thegoatman is offline
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People on the reddit thread, Twitter, and even on here are coping hard acting like this is a good thing lmao. 3 fortune 500 companies left in what, a single month? Terrible. Boeing, Caterpillar, and now Citadel. We got Kellogg's, but they're not moving anybody here. Pritzker, Lightfoot, and the rest of the state's/city's politicians should be enraged right now and should immediately start taking action to stop this exodus. Citadel was major for Chicago as a financial hub.

I don't see New York losing companies like this. There was just ANOTHER drive by shooting in River North last night and a shooting on north ave beach 2 days ago, absolutely ridicolous. And Lightfoot acts like this isn't a massive issue. The #1 thing that comes up when you ask somebody about Chicago is crime. Every single fucking weekend its the same headline, 40+ shot, 10 killed. You guys think these CEO's and other people don't look at this and decide to look elsewhere? And like Pip said, the CTA is god awful nowadays. Shootings and fights happening consistently, drivers getting attacked, people getting robbed, trains not coming, etc. Fire Dorval Carter, he's fucking garbage. I have never in my life seen him on the CTA.

I don't see these same headlines in New York, LA, Miami, DC, Boston, SF, etc. We 100% need a leadership change, february 28th, 2023 can't come soon enough. And of course the cook county court system is an absolute dumpster fire with them giving criminals a slap on the wrist. The shit that flys in Chicago would never fly in Dupage County. But thats another conversation for another time...

Okay rant over Love Chicago but we can do better

Last edited by thegoatman; Jun 23, 2022 at 7:34 PM.
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  #4626  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2022, 5:23 PM
Via Chicago Via Chicago is offline
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Originally Posted by thegoatman View Post
I don't see New York losing companies like this. There was just ANOTHER drive by shooting in River North last night and a shooting on north ave beach 2 days ago, absolutely ridicolous. And Lightfoot acts like this isn't a massive issue. The #1 thing that comes up when you ask somebody about Chicago is crime. Every single fucking weekend its the same headline, 40+ shot, 10 killed. You guys think these CEO's and other people don't look at this and decide to look elsewhere? And like Pip said, the CTA is god awful nowadays. Shootings and fights happening consistently, drivers getting attacked, people getting robbed, trains not coming, etc. Fire Dorval Carter, he's fucking garbage. I have never in my life seen him on the CTA.

I don't see these same headlines in New York, LA, Miami, DC, Boston, SF, etc.
miami had a higher muder rate than chicago in 2021

you dont "notice" because youre not paying attention to the news in miami, and Chicago has more instances since its a much bigger city, so the raw numbers are easier to play up
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  #4627  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2022, 5:31 PM
KOgc KOgc is offline
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I don't know too much about Citadel or Griffin. But it does seem like he donated a pretty substantial amount of money to a few amenities the city has to offer. I'm sure there will be some financial ripple effect with his firm moving, but I'm also a little worried about losing some of his future philanthropic donations for things that the city can brag about - like the bike path and museum work among others.
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  #4628  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2022, 5:35 PM
twister244 twister244 is offline
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Originally Posted by Via Chicago View Post
miami had a higher muder rate than chicago in 2021

you dont "notice" because youre not paying attention to the news in miami, and Chicago has more instances since its a much bigger city, so the raw numbers are easier to play up
Exactly. For sure, city/state leaders need to work on getting crime down back to 2019 levels. And for sure, LL/Pritzker need to work on keeping businesses here and propping up Chicago as a world class city. But to pretend increased crime is a Chicago only issue is silly. Things are worse in all major cities in the country right now. We don't need to go down the rabbit hole on the why/how, but I feel like Citadel is using Crime as some sort of excuse to cover up the real reason they are leaving.
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  #4629  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2022, 6:19 PM
Chisouthside Chisouthside is offline
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Wouldnt be surprised if alot of the senior level positions camped out in south florida during the pandemic and then just decided to stay down there.
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  #4630  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2022, 6:51 PM
marothisu marothisu is offline
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Originally Posted by pip View Post
I get that there are many cities in the same boat but I have always thought of Chicago as a Tier 1 city above those. But I got to tell you with 5,6,7, i forget which, people shot so far this year nearby my place in Lakeview, in addition to reports of shots fired a lot, then fights fights and fights - I hear them at night on Broadway, groups of people fighting, last weekend a block away the fights got so bad they called in assistance from other districts but couldn't get enough manpower. The CTA is a hooka lounge now. Two people were robbed a block away the other night at 11:30pm and badly beaten - this is all the time. And then the cars and bikes with no mufflers racing around lakeview all night. There is very little good news no matter what the topic. It's just too much.
I'm not going to lie, even though I lived here for awhile before the media and apps like Twitter and Citizen made me question whether I should live in certain areas or hang out in them upon moving back. Before we moved, for a long time actually, I was looking at Twitter, various outposts, Citizen, etc. Especially as we secured a place I started honing in on Citizen in that area. When I moved back here, same thing and I noticed my mental health as a result was suffering a bit. A bit later, I stopped opening up those things as much as started living my life (especially since we were juggling a lot back then)

Let's think back even 5 years ago. Citizen was not a thing, at least in Chicago. Outposts like CWB had way less followers (it was their infancy I think 5 or 6 years ago). Most people typically relied on the major news for the events, or their friends, or maybe one of the unlucky few who had it happen to them or witnessed it.

With that being said, there's a ton of nuance to what's going on right now and most people are not actually telling the whole truth (does nuance "sell"? Probably not). Anyone saying "crime is up!" or "crime is down!" without actually going into which type and where has probably either not given it much though or trying to sell a specific narrative. This goes for the government and media alike.

We have to keep all of the above in mind, and be smart about things instead of falling prey to those who are using every single one of us for their agendas one way or another. There are a lot of partial truths being spewed out there in the ether.

Here's a few example of absolute truths:

1) Shootings are up in downtown and have bled into a few other parts of the city.
2) Homicides are up a lot
3) Carjackings are up a lot

Here's a few examples of things more nuanced:

1) Violent crime (homicide, robbery, aggravated assault, aggravated battery, and rape) incidents in The Loop and Near North Side combined in 2021 were actually lower than they were in 2019, slightly. However, violent crimes where a gun was present is up a lot compared to 2019. However this is still lower in terms of total incidents (and of course rate) than 20 years ago when downtown had many less people.

Nuance here is that it depends on what type of crime you're talking about and even the characteristic of how it was. Violent crime being down in this area is a truth, but so is the fact that shootings are up and crimes with a gun are up even while total violent crime is less. More people weren't robbed necessarily but perhaps more robberies were committed in the presence of a gun.

2) Carjackings are a type of robbery. There were 102 fewer robberies in Near North Side+The Loop in 2021 than there were in 2019. There were, however, 43 more carjackings in 2021 than 2019. I hate to call it a fad, but there were less people being robbed in these 2 areas than even 2019, but there was a crazy increase of carjackings. Carjackings made up 8.85% of all robberies in 2021 but only 1.2% in 2019. This is a crazy increase but still relatively small. Does robberies being less in 2021 than 2019 but carjacking way up indicate that criminals are probably realizing that robbing cars might further advance various things for them better than just someone's wallet? Just my theory. There's a nuance - more people in some areas aren't necessarily being robbed but perhaps an uptick in those who are robbed violently while in their cars (still a relatively low percentage of the overall robbery picture).

Also interestingly, the number of carjackings in the city in 2001 and 2002 was nearly identical to 2020. Unfortunately 2021 was more. Still interesting though that 20 years ago this type of crime was "in".

3) In the news in the last month have been a few muggings, robberies, etc in Lincoln Park. What's the truth - is it much higher, or even any higher than years past? Not really. I'm not sure what the deal with 2021 was but here's thru 6/15 of each year for robberies in Lincoln Park

2022: 52 robberies thru 6/15
2021: 26
2020: 48
2019: 49
2018: 64
2017: 54
2016: 59
2015: 45
2014: 47
2013: 51
2012: 51
2011: 77
2010: 59
2009: 76
2008: 76
2007: 75
2006: 72
2005: 56
2004: 75
2003: 84

Minus the weird number of 2021, the number for 2022 is pretty much in range of most years especially between 2010 and 2020.




My suggestion is, especially if you live in the city - try and live like you did 5 or 10 years ago before everyone had news in their phone going off 24/7 down to a micro level and making every extremely afraid. Try it for a week or 2 and take note of your mental state after it.
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  #4631  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2022, 7:32 PM
Handro Handro is offline
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Originally Posted by thegoatman View Post
People on the reddit thread, Twitter, and even on here are coping hard acting like this is a good thing lmao. 3 fortune 500 companies left in what, a single month? Terrible. Boeing, Caterpillar, and now Citadel. We got Kellogg's, but they're not moving anybody here. Pritzker, Lightfoot, and the rest of the state's/city's politicians should be enraged right now and should immediately start taking action to stop this exodus. Citadel was major for Chicago as a financial hub.

I don't see New York losing companies like this. There was just ANOTHER drive by shooting in River North last night and a shooting on north ave beach 2 days ago, absolutely ridicolous. And Lightfoot acts like this isn't a massive issue. The #1 thing that comes up when you ask somebody about Chicago is crime. Every single fucking weekend its the same headline, 40+ shot, 10 killed. You guys think these CEO's and other people don't look at this and decide to look elsewhere? And like Pip said, the CTA is god awful nowadays. Shootings and fights happening consistently, drivers getting attacked, people getting robbed, trains not coming, etc. Fire Dorval Carter, he's fucking garbage. I have never in my life seen him on the CTA.

I don't see these same headlines in New York, LA, Miami, DC, Boston, SF, etc. We 100% need a leadership change, february 28th, 2023 can't come soon enough. And of course the cook county court system is an absolute dumpster fire with them giving criminals a slap on the wrist. The shit that flys in Chicago would never fly in Dupage County. But thats another conversation for another time...

Okay rant over
Kellogg might not be bringing many people but then Boeing didn’t have a big presence here either, so it doesn’t make sense to downplay Kellog and play up Boeing. Caterpillar was a Peoria company that in retrospect was just preparing for their bigger move when they shifted some executives to Deerfield (note: not Chicago) a few years ago.

Legacy cities will not be able to compete with cities in red states that artificially keep their taxes low with huge federal support. Some business leaders-of whom Griffin is a great example-have tunnel vision, and in true Chicago School of Econ fashion, they care only about maximizing payouts for shareholders and executives. Not that companies like McDonalds and Kellogg are great corporate citizens, but clearly there are PR, talent, and cultural issues that taken into account for their headquarters locations.

Griffin citing crime for the move shows what a POS he is. He was clearly destined to leave Chicago for years if he wasn’t able to buy the government, and that little parting shot at the city was a nice “fuck you” to his nemesis Pritzker/Lightfoot. Shows what a good Chicagoan he was that he would try to further harm the cities reputation for his petty politics.
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  #4632  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2022, 7:38 PM
galleyfox galleyfox is offline
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Originally Posted by OrdoSeclorum View Post

On the other hand, I feel a lot less bad about a departure to Miami than to a peer city or up-and-comer region. If an org or person chooses to be in Florida, then they simply don't have a thought process I can relate to.

The thought process is not that difficult.

Chicago is a popular destination for the age 20-40 middle class and upper middle class.



Miami is the most popular destination for the middle aged wealthy and super-wealthy who worry about taxes.



That’s how you can reconcile the trend of unhappy CEOs going to Florida with the apartment construction boom in Chicago.

Personally, I think Chicago is going to do quite well in the upcoming years, since WFH and housing shortages will diminish the role of CEO residence for professional jobs.

Last edited by galleyfox; Jun 23, 2022 at 11:11 PM.
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  #4633  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2022, 7:58 PM
galleyfox galleyfox is offline
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Originally Posted by KOgc View Post
I don't know too much about Citadel or Griffin. But it does seem like he donated a pretty substantial amount of money to a few amenities the city has to offer. I'm sure there will be some financial ripple effect with his firm moving, but I'm also a little worried about losing some of his future philanthropic donations for things that the city can brag about - like the bike path and museum work among others.
Philanthropic donations are the least of concerns. There’s probably been more money from a Wal-Mart heir on that front.

Quote:
Now, Walton's foundation, Builders Initiative, is starting to take the wraps off its emergence as a philanthropic force in Chicago, disclosing it's pledged $2 billion over the last three years, while not identifying the biggest recipients. It says $200 million has gone to COVID relief, $40 million of it in Chicago.

Compared to Builders' $2 billion, Chicago's largest foundation, the John D. & Catherine T. MacArthur Foundation, doled out $900 million in the three years ended in 2020.
https://www.chicagobusiness.com/nonp...itiative-plans
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  #4634  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2022, 8:02 PM
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Originally Posted by marothisu View Post
I'm not going to lie, even though I lived here for awhile before the media and apps like Twitter and Citizen made me question whether I should live in certain areas or hang out in them upon moving back. Before we moved, for a long time actually, I was looking at Twitter, various outposts, Citizen, etc. Especially as we secured a place I started honing in on Citizen in that area. When I moved back here, same thing and I noticed my mental health as a result was suffering a bit. A bit later, I stopped opening up those things as much as started living my life (especially since we were juggling a lot back then)

Let's think back even 5 years ago. Citizen was not a thing, at least in Chicago. Outposts like CWB had way less followers (it was their infancy I think 5 or 6 years ago). Most people typically relied on the major news for the events, or their friends, or maybe one of the unlucky few who had it happen to them or witnessed it.

With that being said, there's a ton of nuance to what's going on right now and most people are not actually telling the whole truth (does nuance "sell"? Probably not). Anyone saying "crime is up!" or "crime is down!" without actually going into which type and where has probably either not given it much though or trying to sell a specific narrative. This goes for the government and media alike.

We have to keep all of the above in mind, and be smart about things instead of falling prey to those who are using every single one of us for their agendas one way or another. There are a lot of partial truths being spewed out there in the ether.

Here's a few example of absolute truths:

1) Shootings are up in downtown and have bled into a few other parts of the city.
2) Homicides are up a lot
3) Carjackings are up a lot

Here's a few examples of things more nuanced:

1) Violent crime (homicide, robbery, aggravated assault, aggravated battery, and rape) incidents in The Loop and Near North Side combined in 2021 were actually lower than they were in 2019, slightly. However, violent crimes where a gun was present is up a lot compared to 2019. However this is still lower in terms of total incidents (and of course rate) than 20 years ago when downtown had many less people.

Nuance here is that it depends on what type of crime you're talking about and even the characteristic of how it was. Violent crime being down in this area is a truth, but so is the fact that shootings are up and crimes with a gun are up even while total violent crime is less. More people weren't robbed necessarily but perhaps more robberies were committed in the presence of a gun.

2) Carjackings are a type of robbery. There were 102 fewer robberies in Near North Side+The Loop in 2021 than there were in 2019. There were, however, 43 more carjackings in 2021 than 2019. I hate to call it a fad, but there were less people being robbed in these 2 areas than even 2019, but there was a crazy increase of carjackings. Carjackings made up 8.85% of all robberies in 2021 but only 1.2% in 2019. This is a crazy increase but still relatively small. Does robberies being less in 2021 than 2019 but carjacking way up indicate that criminals are probably realizing that robbing cars might further advance various things for them better than just someone's wallet? Just my theory. There's a nuance - more people in some areas aren't necessarily being robbed but perhaps an uptick in those who are robbed violently while in their cars (still a relatively low percentage of the overall robbery picture).

Also interestingly, the number of carjackings in the city in 2001 and 2002 was nearly identical to 2020. Unfortunately 2021 was more. Still interesting though that 20 years ago this type of crime was "in".

3) In the news in the last month have been a few muggings, robberies, etc in Lincoln Park. What's the truth - is it much higher, or even any higher than years past? Not really. I'm not sure what the deal with 2021 was but here's thru 6/15 of each year for robberies in Lincoln Park

2022: 52 robberies thru 6/15
2021: 26
2020: 48
2019: 49
2018: 64
2017: 54
2016: 59
2015: 45
2014: 47
2013: 51
2012: 51
2011: 77
2010: 59
2009: 76
2008: 76
2007: 75
2006: 72
2005: 56
2004: 75
2003: 84

Minus the weird number of 2021, the number for 2022 is pretty much in range of most years especially between 2010 and 2020.




My suggestion is, especially if you live in the city - try and live like you did 5 or 10 years ago before everyone had news in their phone going off 24/7 down to a micro level and making every extremely afraid. Try it for a week or 2 and take note of your mental state after it.
Two things. My mental state is fine and I don't follow crime or much of anything on social media. I actually block out Chicago news.

A month and a half ago walking down Broadway at maybe 2pm in Lakeview to get some to go food I came across a shooting that happened maybe 20 mins before, a grandmother walking her granddaughter was shot. Someone driving by decided to shoot for no reason. I do hear gun shots from my back stair/balcony occasionally. I can hear the fights in the street at night. I can hear the cars speeding like hell, I can hear the no mufflers and the squealing tires. I don't want to end up like my neighbor who got robbed and beaten and now has his mouth wired shut for it to heal. It is not safe. People are getting robbed at like 8pm. The CTA when I have ridden it, sucks.

Yeah I know there are worse cities for crime but there are plenty that are better. I have always figured that Chicago being a top tier city would do better and not be just another place.
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  #4635  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2022, 8:20 PM
Mr. Chicago Mr. Chicago is offline
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Mr. Chicago here,
Of course the topic in NYC is crime. The city is getting a handle on it by taking the guns off the streets. As for the business climate in NYC---what business climate? There is no business in NYC. Only three major banks left in NYC. and ,I believe, the NY Merc is owned by the Chicago Merc. Lord knows who owns the NY Stock Exchange. Charlotte too is a financial capitol now. Media? The big three --CBS, NBC, and ABC are still there but the industry has reinvented itself into fox and others. The garment district is no more. Over 300,000 manufacturing jobs lost in NYC. Believe it or not , the main competition to Chicago as a trade center is from Atlanta ,(ICE), not NYC. The point here is Chicago is undergoing that ,(and I loathe to say this), the process of creative destruction. The Fulton district is a sign of the times. I like Chicago and I believe it has terrific potential. Play the the potential of Chicago as a major tech. hub, a cosmopolitan center of retail trade and a center of agro trade which is much in the news lately. No time to morn.
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  #4636  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2022, 8:54 PM
marothisu marothisu is offline
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Originally Posted by thegoatman View Post
People on the reddit thread, Twitter, and even on here are coping hard acting like this is a good thing lmao. 3 fortune 500 companies left in what, a single month? Terrible. Boeing, Caterpillar, and now Citadel. We got Kellogg's, but they're not moving anybody here. Pritzker, Lightfoot, and the rest of the state's/city's politicians should be enraged right now and should immediately start taking action to stop this exodus. Citadel was major for Chicago as a financial hub.
Not to be too technical, but Citadel is not a F500 company. Their revenue would put them barely in the F500 were they public - maybe in the 480s or 490s. A few years ago they wouldn't have qualified. Regardless, it's a big company but they aren't leaving Chicago. It's their HQ - they already mentioned that a bunch of people already left to go to Miami, NYC, etc. If you look on their website, you'll see around 30 jobs listed, and something like 65% of them have Chicago listed as an office to work at. The CBOE, CME, etc is too important for them to literally abandon Chicago. HQ wise is symbolic and has taxes. I think this one hurts for Chicago not because of HQ necessarily but because of the loss of pretty high paid workers and a lot of talent for them. But yeah, anybody who thinks Citadel is completely abandoning Chicago is a bit weird. They still have numerous job openings for Chicago. Ultimately this is a "fuck you" from Ken to Pritzker/Lori Lightfoot and other politicians.


Quote:
I don't see New York losing companies like this.
I mean in Chicago this is a little much in a short period of time but yes, things happen adversely in NYC too. Did we forget about Amazon pulling out of NYC for its co-HQ (aka HQ2)?

KG is not the only hedge fund billionaire who has moved to Florida with their company you know, right? I don't think you're paying attention.

Carl Icahn moved his company, which has a higher revenue than Citadel to the Miami area very recently. And until recently, he was also wealthier than KG:

https://www.local10.com/news/local/2...i-dade-county/

Multi Billionaire Paul Singer moved Elliott Management to the Miami area recently too:
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ers-to-florida

AllianceBernstein moved from NYC to Nashville:
https://nypost.com/2022/05/12/allian...es-80m-a-year/


Multi Billionaire Daniel Sundheim moved to the Miami area with many execs, though the company is still HQ in NYC:
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ove-to-florida

El Al Airlines is also moving their US HQ to Miami from NYC as of 1 month ago:
https://www.thenextmiami.com/israels...ters-to-miami/

Goldman Sachs is moving a bunch of bankers from NYC to Miami area:
https://nypost.com/2021/06/15/goldma...rs-to-florida/

Virtu Financial shrinking NYC office by 75% for Florida:
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...es-wall-street


Unicorn LoadSmart moved from NYC to Chicago. OH shit, was I supposed to not mention this?
https://www.bizjournals.com/chicago/...m-unicorn.html



And perhaps we can bring up California and the Bay Area which had about the same number of F500 companies as Chicago for awhile (vying for #2):


Oracle moved HQ from the Bay Area to Austin:
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/12/11/orac...tin%2C%20Texas.

Tesla moved HQ from Palo Alto to Austin:
https://www.businessinsider.com/tesl...n-musk-2021-12

Schwab moved its HQ from San Francisco to near Dallas:
https://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/ch...jan-1/2514658/

Hewlett-Packard Enterprise moved HQ from Bay Area to Houston area:
https://apnews.com/article/houston-c...954de11fa3c8a7


AECOM (F500 company) moved HQ from Los Angeles to Dallas recently:
https://www.constructiondive.com/new...dallas/605248/


CBRE officially moves HQ from Los Angeles to Dallas:
https://www.latimes.com/business/sto...eles-to-dallas

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There was just ANOTHER drive by shooting in River North last night and a shooting on north ave beach 2 days ago, absolutely ridicolous. And Lightfoot acts like this isn't a massive issue. The #1 thing that comes up when you ask somebody about Chicago is crime.
Yes, downtown is an issue with the gun violence lately. Lightfoot is not doing a good job. The crime thing as far as being brought up is nothing new. This has literally been the case since Obama even started running for president. I moved to Chicago the first time in 2009 and it was the #1 thing people asked me about back then too. And it continued in

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Every single fucking weekend its the same headline, 40+ shot, 10 killed. You guys think these CEO's and other people don't look at this and decide to look elsewhere?

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And like Pip said, the CTA is god awful nowadays. Shootings and fights happening consistently, drivers getting attacked, people getting robbed, trains not coming, etc. Fire Dorval Carter, he's fucking garbage. I have never in my life seen him on the CTA.
Seems like it's certain lines and in general a personnel issue. I take the Brown Line and it's been pretty on time with no smokers. Pretty tame.

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I don't see these same headlines in New York, LA, Miami, DC, Boston, SF, etc. We 100% need a leadership change, february 28th, 2023 can't come soon enough. And of course the cook county court system is an absolute dumpster fire with them giving criminals a slap on the wrist. The shit that flys in Chicago would never fly in Dupage County. But thats another conversation for another time...

Okay rant over Love Chicago but we can do better
We can do better and I am not a LL fan at all. I think she'll lose handedly. If she doesn't then I'd be shocked. But you have to live in those other places to even understand the differences. I moved back from NYC just under a year ago. There are no scanner Twitter accounts there. There is no CWB type of outlet there either. Some people use Citizen but it's still a small percentage. There are local news outlets that report on everything from restaurant and bar openings to crime and they only report the notable crimes. Since 2020, they started reporting more and it's made people to believe that NYC is going crazy with crime and super bad even though it's not. There are a lot of fearmongers in NYC for sure of late but Chicago just takes the cake. Some of these accounts like scanner accounts and what not may think they're doing good, and sometimes they do by telling people some trends (i.e. bunch of purse snatchings lately).

The last area we lived at in NYC had a bunch of heads of foreign consulates and diplomats. One of our neighbors was the head of a consulate for a small European country in NYC. We had a shooting directly in front of our building and another one just down the street a few months before that left a person dead. There were a few others down there too and a few others about a half mile away. There were a few armed robberies near us too in a short period of time. I noticed that last month there was a shooting infront of another building in the general neighborhood over the sale of a Playstation. Mind you, 1 bedroom condos next to us go for $1.3M+ and there's a bunch of wealthy people here.

People carried on with their lives but of course the online comments on Facebook, Twitter, etc were pretty terrible and proclaimed that everything was a hell hole. Our neighborhood was nice and continued to be so after that - you would never attribute those words to that neighborhood.

Chicago has a lot of problems and the increase of gun violence downtown is definitely concerning as well as increase of homicides (hopefully at this rate this year we end up with way less - but alas it's summer now..) but there is a lot of things in the news that's thrown around that nobody is telling the full truth about (i.e. there were more robberies downtown in 2019 than 2021, but reading some of the news you'd think the opposite).
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Last edited by marothisu; Jun 23, 2022 at 9:20 PM.
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  #4637  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2022, 9:11 PM
marothisu marothisu is offline
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Originally Posted by pip View Post
Two things. My mental state is fine and I don't follow crime or much of anything on social media. I actually block out Chicago news.

A month and a half ago walking down Broadway at maybe 2pm in Lakeview to get some to go food I came across a shooting that happened maybe 20 mins before, a grandmother walking her granddaughter was shot. Someone driving by decided to shoot for no reason. I do hear gun shots from my back stair/balcony occasionally. I can hear the fights in the street at night. I can hear the cars speeding like hell, I can hear the no mufflers and the squealing tires. I don't want to end up like my neighbor who got robbed and beaten and now has his mouth wired shut for it to heal. It is not safe. People are getting robbed at like 8pm. The CTA when I have ridden it, sucks.

Yeah I know there are worse cities for crime but there are plenty that are better. I have always figured that Chicago being a top tier city would do better and not be just another place.
I'm glad to hear about your mental state and I'm sorry to hear that you came upon that. I know what incident you're talking about and I hope your neighbor gets better.

The underlying point in all of this - and someone else made this point - is that for a long time people especially on the north side were used to thinking that crime somehow never happened in their neighborhoods. And the point is, that's not true. I have friends who were beaten and robbed in Lakeview, Lincoln Park, and Lincoln Square around 2014. The levels at which this happens is not much different than many years previous. We do hear about it more though which leads people to believe that some of these crimes are increasing when they have pretty much always been going on at these frequencies.

Aggravated Assault and Aggravated Batteries for Lake View from 1/1 to 6/15 every year. These are the more serious ones typically with a weapon (whether a gun, knife, etc):

2022: 58
2021: 63
2020: 50
2019: 73
2018: 57
2017: 52
2016: 64
2015: 38
2014: 50
2013: 55
2012: 71
2011: 49
2010: 60


So again - case in point - this is nothing new. What's new is people finding out that their area has had these crimes happening well, forever. But what a lot of the media isn't doing is putting it into context or they're selectively putting it into context. Literally the chances of you being the victim of an aggravated assault or battery in Lakeview 7 years ago is really about the same as it is today, statistically.




And yes, the world has gone crazy and many here. Chicago does need a leadership change and it goes way beyond what we're talking about here. I believe LL will handedly lose but I have no idea who's actually viable enough to get all the votes. I just think a lot of people are fed up in general and she's managed to piss literally every group of people off somehow.
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  #4638  
Old Posted Jun 24, 2022, 1:31 AM
Rizzo Rizzo is offline
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We can come up with all sorts of reasons why Citadel's move is ridiculous based on reasons mentioned, or perhaps justifiable from a business perspective. As much as I've picked away at this issue in my head today, my takeaway is lost tax revenue is a really bad thing for Illinois.

I had this hunch a year ago that a lot of companies sat in limbo whether they'd be returning to the workplace, going full remote or felt their centralized office had become detached enough that the an HQ could go anywhere in the US..or world and it wouldn't matter where their employees were.
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  #4639  
Old Posted Jun 24, 2022, 12:48 PM
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glowrock glowrock is offline
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Thanks to everyone for all of the detailed crime information over the last decade and for the proper perspective, especially marothisu, the work you've put into the number crunching is commendable!

I just wanted to point out that it finally seems like CTA is getting better in terms of security on the L trains. The Blue Line has been much more peaceful as of late, even the Red has been improved over what it has been for the last year or two. Honestly, I'd say it's more a matter of increased ridership making it less convenient for stupidity to take place, but extra sets of eyes always help as well.

Lastly, the citizen app is a complete disaster, it's only purpose is to make everyone paranoid of their own shadows. Hyper focus on every instance of crime will turn people into psychos! I'd citizen based here or something? I've never lived in a city where everyone bashes their own city with such reckless abandon as I have here! It's as if everyone takes pride in referring to their city as a shithole. Honestly it's pretty sad.

Meanwhile, I'll still continue to live here, enjoy my time, and be pleased every day I don't live in a suburban nightmare. Heh

Aaron (Glowrock)
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  #4640  
Old Posted Jun 24, 2022, 1:42 PM
CaptainJilliams CaptainJilliams is offline
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Lastly, the citizen app is a complete disaster, it's only purpose is to make everyone paranoid of their own shadows. Hyper focus on every instance of crime will turn people into psychos! I'd citizen based here or something? I've never lived in a city where everyone bashes their own city with such reckless abandon as I have here! It's as if everyone takes pride in referring to their city as a shithole. Honestly it's pretty sad.
This! I've lived in other major cities (NYC, DC, and Houston) and had never heard of Citizen until moving to Chicago, and boy what a mess it is. It's more harmful than helpful in my opinion, especially with the unverified crime reports.

In my short time here, I've noticed just how obsessive the community is over every little crime that happens. In sharp contrast to my last home, Houston, I'd hear about many (and unfortunately experience) crimes from friends and neighbors that never made the local news, including some shootings. While going to the other extreme isn't good, there definitely needs to be more balance in Chicago when it comes to reporting crime. As others have shown, we can acknowledge that there are crime issues in the city as well as understanding the city isn't the warzone/nightmare so many make it out to be.
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