Calgary International Airport II

[Johnny Aussie]

Originally Posted by YYCFlier

AC may be making permanent changes to YYC as a hub for TB service. Heck, PHX was CR9 when WS was double daily on 737s and I think the O&D YYC-PHX is higher than YVR. Most of that service has shifted to YVR. YYC got a single CR9 to LAX with YVR 3x daily on 7M8. YYC is AC's smallest hub and just got smaller.

Yes. Considering the changes AC is making elsewhere YYC continues to be whittled down. I think WS is slowly turning the screws on other carriers.
It’s not just the revised summer schedule but it’s how it’s been slowly reduced while adding at their three main hubs.
YVR-LAX is actually going to be 5 daily 7M8 this summer
AC used to fly between 10-12 daily in the summer (was 10 daily summer 2019, 12 daily summer 2018)
UA used to fly 11-12 daily during the summer scheds of which 6-7 were mainline.
A rather large reduction for Star Alliance TB
Other US carriers have reduced their capacity as well except AA seems to be holding steady. DL has gone from 8 daily to 3 but with larger AC on MSP. AS from 3 to 2 daily to SEA.
Of course the pandemic is still affecting any rebounds but the AC cuts appear to be the most pronounced.
In contrast of course is Westjet pretty much maintaining capacity - even at YVR they will be at 85% of TB capacity from summer 2019.

[bigbrain.airliner]

flair air is far superior to all other airlines; a god amongst mortals one may say. far superior to westjet and air canada. I have put all my life savings into flair tickets and one day you will all work for me. DADDY FLAIR FOREVER.

[PPAR]

Originally Posted by Johnny Aussie

Of course the pandemic is still affecting any rebounds but the AC cuts appear to be the most pronounced.
In contrast of course is Westjet pretty much maintaining capacity - even at YVR they will be at 85% of TB capacity from summer 2019.

We are in a new era. Not just because the pandemic is resulting in airlines rebuilding from the ground up, but because of the relative financial state of WS and AC.

WS used to be an "upstart" operating in the more cyclical western part of the country, whilst Air Canada was the big, stable, national carrier. Given this reality, AC maintained competition vs WS in the knowledge that at worst they could keep Westjet from using YYC revenues to become a bigger competitor, and at best grow market share.

Fast forward to 2022. WS is owned by Onex, with financial resources that are essentially unlimited, and AC is suffering the financial carnage of the pandemic. The math has changed for AC. Why fight WS at YYC? No way we can outmuscle them. Best to fall back to 3 hubs to prevent Onex from building a bigger airline.

[hollywoodcory]

This month WS adds 2nd daily flights on select days to LAX, IAH, SEA.
Also AA increases to 2x daily with 738 replacing 319.

Upcoming route resumptions/start dates:

WS LGW May 1
AC EWR May 1
AA ORD May 5
WS FCO May 7
WS DUB May 8
WS DEN May 22
Y6 FRA May 23
UA SFO June 3
WK ZRH June 12
WS BOS June 30

[thenoflyzone]

Originally Posted by Denscity

Crazy it's that low considering oil is back above $100 a barrel like the good old days.

That's a double edged sword for Alberta.

Yes, the price of oil gaining ground is good for the Albertan economy, but its not good for airlines, especially those that don't hedge fuel prices, like AC (and most airlines for that matter). Fuel is one of the largest expenses an airline has, and if the cost of fuel goes up, certain routes can instantly become unprofitable.

[LO 044]

I had the chance to fly through YYC on our way down to MCO 2 weeks ago. If any of the YYC big wigs occasionally come on here, you have some work to do. I put a bit of a review on the YEG thread. Not impressed with connecting at YYC or WestJet for that matter. Maybe it was just a bad day but the connection times need to be longer because we barely made it onto the YYC-MCO flight without stopping during the connection. YYC really needs to push CATSA to fire the lot and get new staff. I know YYC only has so much control here but there is a lot that could be improved.

[Johnny Aussie]

Air Canada’s latest longhaul changes has them swapping the 77L for a 789 on YYC-FRA for the summer scheds.
The 77L is set to resume 1 Sept.
Capacity almost a wash but a much smaller J cabin.

[People_talking]

It's too bad Condor is gone this season, I would've loved to see their new "Beach Towel" livery fly in. Definitely a controversial livery, reminds me of when Flair reveals their OG green and black colours.

https://www.flightradar24.com/blog/condor-unveils-bold-new-livery/

[Johnny Aussie]

Originally Posted by People_talking

It's too bad Condor is gone this season, I would've loved to see their new "Beach Towel" livery fly in. Definitely a controversial livery, reminds me of when Flair reveals their OG green and black colours.

https://www.flightradar24.com/blog/condor-unveils-bold-new-livery/

Wouldn’t be surprised if they’re gone from YYC for good.
Westjet will continue to really make it tough for new entrants.
I realise we are still in pandemic recovery mode but seeing what’s happening elsewhere it’s quite evident there is a Westjet effect.

[hollywoodcory]

I'd argue Eurowings was more responsible for the loss of Condor than WS.
I believe Condor has come and gone previously, so I wouldn't say their gone for good.

YYC still has more capacity to Europe this summer than they did in 2019 with 3 new routes including the only non-stop to Italy in Western Canada and Eurowings only Western Canadian destination (and first in all of Canada).

[thenoflyzone]

Originally Posted by PPAR

Why fight WS at YYC? No way we can outmuscle them. Best to fall back to 3 hubs to prevent Onex from building a bigger airline.

YYC is still important for AC, in terms of a mid-continent hub. Connecting traffic from Western Canada to points east. AC sees the success the US3 have with their mid-continent hubs (DEN, SLC, MSP, etc) and will emulate that as best they can from YYC.

As far as international routes go, YYC is not a priority for AC. So on this latter point, yes, they are letting WS have at it. But on the domestic front, they are holding their own, and have no intention to "de-hub".

[YYCFlier]

Originally Posted by thenoflyzone

As far as international routes go, YYC is not a priority for AC. So on this latter point, yes, they are letting WS have at it. But on the domestic front, they are holding their own, and have no intention to "de-hub".

Pre-pandemic, AC was actually the dominate TATL carrier with daily 789/788 flights to LHR and FRA year round. WS is weaker as most service is seasonal or not daily even in summer. Even KL was stronger in winter. AC should resume year round service. WS dominates in sun service hands down.

Where AC is weaker is trans-border. Domestically, it was pretty bad in the pandemic but normal service is respectable (in the pandemic WestJet withdrew YVR service to YYC and AC did the opposite). Even traditional markets like PHX are weak at the moment.

[hollywoodcory]

Even right now AC leads the way in TATL at YYC with daily FRA / 5x weekly LHR (Total 12x weekly). KL and WS both equally have 7 weekly flights.

I don't think it is until late May/early June that WS surpasses AC for the summer.

[YYCFlier]

Originally Posted by hollywoodcory

Even right now AC leads the way in TATL at YYC with daily FRA / 5x weekly LHR (Total 12x weekly). KL and WS both equally have 7 weekly flights.

I don't think it is until late May/early June that WS surpasses AC for the summer.

Right. And you can see the focus difference. Flying to multiple TATL locations 2-3 days a week seasonally screams leisure. Daily, year-round service says business. I would much rather have reliable connections to AMS/FRA/LHR hubs year round then trying to figure out WestJet's destinations du jour and frequency.

[Johnny Aussie]

Originally Posted by YYCFlier

Pre-pandemic, AC was actually the dominate TATL carrier with daily 789/788 flights to LHR and FRA year round. WS is weaker as most service is seasonal or not daily even in summer. Even KL was stronger in winter. AC should resume year round service. WS dominates in sun service hands down.

Where AC is weaker is trans-border. Domestically, it was pretty bad in the pandemic but normal service is respectable (in the pandemic WestJet withdrew YVR service to YYC and AC did the opposite). Even traditional markets like PHX are weak at the moment.

Yes. Looking at fwd summer schedules / capacity AC transborder at YYC is being stripped to minimal - not focusing on hubbing but focusing on three of the larger O&D markets only (PHX and LAS being mainly leisure they are pulling out this summer). AC offering less than 360 transborder seats per day from YYC this summer.
In a sharp contrast, as I mentioned Westjet is restoring approx 85% of pre-pandemic transborder capacity at YVR this summer.

[hehehe]

I think it's realistic to see AC resume all their pre pandemic transborder flying from YYC (besides maybe PDX but WS increased capacity on that route anyways). I think by the winter or S23 AC will fully resume tb from YYC. At the end of the day YYC has a ton of service for its size and AC is definitely not going to terminate LAS, PHX, IAH from YYC. The fact that AC won't resume it this summer doesn't really mean much at all.

Originally Posted by hehehe

The fact that AC won't resume it this summer doesn't really mean much at all.

These are my thoughts. I'm not quite ready to say AC is fully bending over for WS when these minor RJ routes that people seem worried about, routes they are still making money on since their JV partner is flying them anyway with much better equipment, are scrubbed. Wait it out.

Anybody who has had the misfortune of flying to IAH on the RJ is not overly depressed.

[thenoflyzone]

Originally Posted by ace.yyc

These are my thoughts. I'm not quite ready to say AC is fully bending over for WS when these minor RJ routes that people seem worried about, routes they are still making money on since their JV partner is flying them anyway with much better equipment, are scrubbed. Wait it out.

Anybody who has had the misfortune of flying to IAH on the RJ is not overly depressed.

AC and UA don't operate a transborder JV. A few years ago they announced their second attempt at it. The first one was approved around 2012, but with 14 route carveouts, including YYC-ORD/IAH/SFO. They didn't follow through with the JV back then, and are now attempting another approval, to try and get more favorable terms. I doubt it will work.

[hehehe]

Originally Posted by ace.yyc

These are my thoughts. I'm not quite ready to say AC is fully bending over for WS when these minor RJ routes that people seem worried about, routes they are still making money on since their JV partner is flying them anyway with much better equipment, are scrubbed. Wait it out.

Anybody who has had the misfortune of flying to IAH on the RJ is not overly depressed.

I did that a few years ago to IAH and it was absolutely one of the worst flying experiences I've had. Both SFO and IAH are way too long of a flight to bear the CRJ for.

Originally Posted by hehehe

I did that a few years ago to IAH and it was absolutely one of the worst flying experiences I've had. Both SFO and IAH are way too long of a flight to bear the CRJ for.

Exactly. It's a small victory for travelers on this route. I expect it to be back in 2023, though.