The Official Moncton, NB Project Thread

[OliverD]

Originally Posted by Feneant

How about they remove double taxation on non owner occupied units -only- when the owner resides in NB? Keep it for out of province so that it pushes tenants towards NB owned units so we support our own people instead of allowing all these faceless numbered companies to price out the locals.

Not really a fan of this approach in general and I think there would still be loopholes. Whether or not the owner lives in NB can be obfuscated in numerous ways so it seems like there would be a lot of overhead to administer and enforce these rules. It also wouldn't be fair to tenants to have one determinant of their rental cost be where the owner of their building lives.

If we were coming up with a property tax system from scratch today there's absolutely no way we would tax rental properties more than owner occupied properties. It makes zero sense to subsidize home ownership even further at the expense of people who are renting.

So why are we okay with the status quo? To spite REITs? Let's instead figure out how to level the playing field between rented properties and owner occupied properties so that renters do come out ahead.

If we're going to argue that cutting property tax rates won't reduce rents in the short term (which is debatable), why can't the province make a deal with a handful of the largest landlords in the province to only cut property taxes if they reduce rent by a certain amount? Others would surely follow suit to remain competitive.

Another thing that constantly gets ignored in this debate is that lower property taxes would surely result in more units of housing getting built. There's no way you can convince me that some projects that aren't currently feasible would suddenly make sense. And while we're currently in a hot market and expensive units seem to be rented out as quickly as they're built, that won't last forever, and it's possible that new construction will dry up because most projects suddenly aren't financially feasible.

[OliverD]

Originally Posted by JHikka

I mean, the alternative is people living without housing. Seems more unfair, IMO.

And if IZ substantially cuts the number of new units that are built, even more people are without housing.

[Nashe]

I'm glad I got out of landlording. Lots of grief for very little gain. You really have to have 10+ units to make it worthwhile for many of the reasons above.
The cost of any major repair gets spread out over the pool of units, at least.

[monctonian]

Follow the taxes:

NB provincial tax rates are regulated by the Real Property Tax Act. The 2021 tax rate for residential housing was $1.1233 per $100 of the assessed value. Assume the rate for 2022 is unchanged.

Example: A residential rental property is assessed at $100,000 per unit the Provincial property tax (residential) would be $1,123.30 ($93.61 per month).

In calculating taxable income for an apartment building, the Provincial property tax is an eligible expense.
So using the example above, the Province gets to collect $1,123.30 per unit, any part of which then it does not have to share with with the federal government.

If the provincial property tax was eliminated then the amount would increase the net taxable income where Canada and New Brunswick would collect their respective income taxes.

Would New Brunswick then net less tax revenue?

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by monctonian

[B]If the provincial property tax was eliminated then the amount would increase the net taxable income where Canada and New Brunswick would collect their respective income taxes.

Would New Brunswick then net less tax revenue?

Interesting question.

Anytime I am confronted with tax policy and implications thereof in terms of tax benefits and liabilities my head hurts and I get a nosebleed.

[Taeolas]

It seems like our Rental Property Taxation system is similar to our Public Transit funding system; out of sync with the rest of the country in some ways, and long overdue for a proper study and overhaul to make it equivalent/similar to the rest of the country.

Really these are both symptoms of some overall growing pains, as the province gets bigger and has to deal with more people, bigger cities and the requirements those people bring with them (and the wants those people have). For a long time we were able to coast along as a meddling province, but now we're getting a lot more attention (good and bad), and it's time we stepped up and started modernizing. We'll be looking at a Million Population milestone soon (within a generation), and we need to be ready to support it and beyond.

[Riberview]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

Interesting question.

Anytime I am confronted with tax policy and implications thereof in terms of tax benefits and liabilities my head hurts and I get a nosebleed.

Same.

[habs33]

Not construction related but Brunswick news has been sold to PostMedia
Postmedia to Acquire Brunswick News Inc.

[MonctonRad]

Indeed a shocker.

Everyone used to complain about the Irving media monopoly, but I'm not sure if this is a positive move or not.

Ownership will now not be local. There may not be the same commitment to local new coverage. Will three dailies for the province continue? Or, will there be a move to create a single "provincial" daily newspaper.

A whole new set of biases will come into play as well. Post Media is well known for conservative leaning journalism. Irving tended to be more opportunistic in it's endorsements.

Interesting times.........

[OliverD]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

Indeed a shocker.

Everyone used to complain about the Irving media monopoly, but I'm not sure if this is a positive move or not.

Ownership will now not be local. There may not be the same commitment to local new coverage. Will three dailies for the province continue? Or, will there be a move to create a single "provincial" daily newspaper.

A whole new set of biases will come into play as well. Post Media is well known for conservative leaning journalism. Irving tended to be more opportunistic in it's endorsements.

Interesting times.........

I think a single provincial daily is inevitable.

[Irish1]

Originally Posted by OliverD

I think a single provincial daily is inevitable.

Not “inevitable”. It already exists.

Ten years ago determination and approval of all editorial opinions of all newspapers were switched to Jamie Irving’s direct control; more than seven years ago he centralized all editing and newspaper layout in Saint John. Almost all local editors were removed and replaced with a central editor system in Saint John under Jamie Irving’s control.

Irving hired a newspaper designer who changed the individual style of all the newspapers so all were identical. The only thing that’s different is the nameplate. Every day the content is simply reorganized by the Saint John crew to make it look like it’s different.

Each city newspaper — daily or weekly — has been operating as a bureau of Saint John.

All the photographers were fired about seven years ago, virtually all reporters were let go or reduced by attrition so there are less than a handful left in Moncton and Fredericton.

Only the printing is done outside of Saint John, and that’s only because it would cost too much to move it from Moncton.

The internet has been used as an excuse, but don’t be fooled: what has devastated the newspapers is a complete lack of content worth the money to buy it.

Will the switch to Postmedia be better? I certainly won’t be any worse!!!

[Franco401]

I don't know enough about Postmedia itself to really know how to feel about the actual news side of things, but if I had to choose between:

1. Being under the thumb of region's richest family with immense influence on the political process and known for using a print media monopoly protect the rest of their empire
2. Having no good daily newspapers since they're owned by a national company that doesn't care about the region and just wants to spread its own political agenda, whether you agree with it or not

I think I go with option 2. This is a rare move by the Irvings: They are known as the types to spend a lot of money, or in this case lose money running unprofitable papers, to keep the influence that Brunswick News carries. Instead, they've made a pretty safe financial decision.

[MonctonRad]

I'm concerned about the weakness of the news media in this province.

- CTV and Global are run out of Halifax, and give lip service coverage to news stories from NB. They don't really have news bureaus in the province any more. I'm pretty sure the local reporters work out of their homes now.
- CBC Radio is good, but CBC TV is a hollow shell compared to their operations in both NS and PEI. Our evening news is only 1/2 hour, and we don't even have a CBC weathercaster in NB (even Charlottetown does).
- Local private radio stations only do the minimum required for local news coverage in order to maintain their CRTC licensure.
- Our press monopoly is about to be outsourced to Toronto, with almost certain further downsizing to occur in the province. A single provincial paper with nominal reporting from the three cities (and the north) is inevitable. What will we end up with? 1-2 reporters per city? Will editorial content be decided locally or in Toronto? Will the paper be filled with wire service stories from the rest of Canada and around the world, no local interest or local sports coverage?

I've got a bad feeling about this........

I can see it now. There will be a big announcement for the New Brunswick Sun newspaper, probably based out of Saint John, with a hollow promise for "province wide" reporting.

[Franco401]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

I'm concerned about the weakness of the news media in this province.

Journalism in this province has been a joke for decades. There is no scenario (as it concerns this deal) where that does not remain the case. I honestly prefer the papers being run by an arm of the same enormous company harming journalism nationwide; rather than having the papers controlled by the company that's already the biggest player in many industries and in politics.

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

I can see it now. There will be a big announcement for the New Brunswick Sun newspaper, probably based out of Saint John, with a hollow promise for "province wide" reporting.

Absolutely. A province-wide paper's relationship with New Brunswickers will be a microcosm of The Globe and Mail's relationship with all of Canada.

[MonctonRad]

I have an online subscription to the T&T. I what I fear actually transpires, I will certainly be cancelling my subscription.

I have the subscription primarily for local news content. If there is to be none (or next to none) in a province wide daily, then there is no reason to continue. SSP is better for local development news than the T&T anyway..........

[Franco401]

Does the T&T actually feature good (or passable) local news coverage? I frequently pick up a print edition of the Daily Gleaner and the local section is like a local radio station website reporting on the stories that were too boring for CBC plus a single paragraph about something that actually mattered.

[Taeolas]

I haven't looked at our "local" papers in ages, probably not since the paywalls went up. But from glances at the checkouts occasionally, the sameness from seeing the DG and TJ side by side with identical stories on the front pages is very obvious. They're clearly the same paper with different titles and have been for a long time.

[Nashe]

I suspect this has to do with (IMHO) dwindling consumption of local, especially paper news at the expense of increasingly popular, well-established FREE online presences (cbc.ca, cnn, bbc, etc). I haven't read a "NB paper" in years (online or otherwise). If Irving doesn't NEED that local clout anymore, no sense handing on to a sinking ship.

[Irish1]

It has less to do with consumption of news and information than the willingness to pay for that information. The appetite for news and information remains the same as it always was. And the interest increases depending on the proximity and relevance of the information (that may seem intuitive, but it’s the opposite of the direction Jamie Irving has taken since assuming control in 2008.).

For example, people living in the west end in Moncton are passingly interested in that’s happening in Europe, somewhat interested in what’s happening in the US, more interested in what’s happening in Canada. They are increasingly interested in New Brunswick and more so in southeast New Brunswick. Much more in Moncton news and definitely interested in what’s going on in their section of the city and extremely interested in their own neighborhood. It’s a narrowing interest focus that holds true no matter where you live. The only exceptions are items that effect you specifically or in which you are personally interested.

As an aside, readers are especially interesting in topics discussed in these forums (new businesses, closing retailers, restaurants, and great local sales deals) — because it effects them personally.

So if you have a product that’s full of items that are important and interesting to people, they will pay for it.

[Lobster chucker]

Originally Posted by Irish1

It has less to do with consumption of news and information than the willingness to pay for that information. The appetite for news and information remains the same as it always was. And the interest increases depending on the proximity and relevance of the information (that may seem intuitive, but it’s the opposite of the direction Jamie Irving has taken since assuming control in 2008.).

For example, people living in the west end in Moncton are passingly interested in that’s happening in Europe, somewhat interested in what’s happening in the US, more interested in what’s happening in Canada. They are increasingly interested in New Brunswick and more so in southeast New Brunswick. Much more in Moncton news and definitely interested in what’s going on in their section of the city and extremely interested in their own neighborhood. It’s a narrowing interest focus that holds true no matter where you live. The only exceptions are items that effect you specifically or in which you are personally interested.

As an aside, readers are especially interesting in topics discussed in these forums (new businesses, closing retailers, restaurants, and great local sales deals) — because it effects them personally.

So if you have a product that’s full of items that are important and interesting to people, they will pay for it.

This deal has nothing to do with news, content or future of News papers. It has everthying to do with the distribution system for flyers and products that exist already