DENVER | Main Development Thread #7

[SirLucasTheGreat]

Yeah I haven't heard anything for those lots. I wouldn't mind another commuter rail station around that area, perhaps near 29th Street with a pedestrian bridge that would serve the people on Brighton, Denargo Market, as well as the people on the south side of the tracks.

[laniroj]

Originally Posted by TakeFive

Somebody wake up laniroj; Colorado's about to spend $400 million on affordable housing

What’s in Colorado’s new $400 million housing proposal?
January 31, 2022 By Andrew Kenney - CPR News

So what's the plan look like?

I'm a(woke)n, thanks. We can throw all the money we want at the problem, but it won't fix the crux of the issues which have been well covered on this forum.

Since I'm "in the know" about this effort more than just reading the news, it's sad to me that the republicans and democrats aren't working together more. The democrat efforts on funding joined up with the republican efforts on pro-growth policy directives would really help bring about wholesale change and maybe just make a dent in the housing production issue (I refuse to call it housing affordability issue anymore because it's all about production). At this point in time, it's anyone's guess if the dems will allow the pro-growth stipulation of the reps into the bill for a vote.

[laniroj]

Originally Posted by midwestcowboy

As a new-ish Denverite, I have a question:

I was on a run yesterday and found myself entering the parking lots between Blake and the RR tracks at 33rd street (I assume these are Rockies lots). I proceeded to run all the way down to Park Ave, and the amount of empty space there just blew me away.

Has there ever been a realistic proposal for that area? It seems as if the footprint of the Larimer/Walnut/Blake could almost be doubled with development there. Gameday parking could likely be solved with the construction of one or two additional parking garages adjacent to the stadium.

Issue is the land is owned by the rockies stadium district. They got one parking garage approved and built maybe 7 or 8 years ago and it's there just west of 27th/Blake. If the district was smart, they would construct an entertainment district adjacent to the stadium and put the parking north of Broadway.

[bunt_q]

Originally Posted by laniroj

I'm a(woke)n, thanks. We can throw all the money we want at the problem, but it won't fix the crux of the issues which have been well covered on this forum.

Since I'm "in the know" about this effort more than just reading the news, it's sad to me that the republicans and democrats aren't working together more. The democrat efforts on funding joined up with the republican efforts on pro-growth policy directives would really help bring about wholesale change and maybe just make a dent in the housing production issue (I refuse to call it housing affordability issue anymore because it's all about production). At this point in time, it's anyone's guess if the dems will allow the pro-growth stipulation of the reps into the bill for a vote.

Do we still have Republicans in Colorado? My my, I had forgotten. I think the bill will have exactly what the majority wants it to have; nothing more, nothing less. There is no need to compromise anymore.

I suspect this money will all go to the couple areas that have affordability problems and who have shovel-ready projects that don't make other democrats mad (i.e. 50 units projects roughly 20 miles outside of resort towns - close enough that service workers (brown democrats) can get in, but far enough that wealthier residents (white democrats) do not have to have them nearby). And maybe some in Adams County.

Denver County and Boulder County will see not a dollar of this. Because it is not wanted. Or maybe a couple 10 unit projects each, probably built at $1,000,000 per unit. That's my prediction.

Also, $40 million for an "innovative housing incentive program that will support the prefabricated housing industry, from mobile home construction to 3D printing and other technologies that can speed up construction while lowering the cost" is the stupidest thing I have ever heard. It's very Polis. A man who literally is the bureaucracy that causes the problems he wants to solve, but who still thinks that sprinkling in a little tech can solve everything. It's like if Elon Musk became President. The manufactured housing industry does not have any problems other than being allowed to deploy their products! Which we will never, ever allow at scale.

[TakeFive]

Pandemic Pandemonium

When the Pandemic hit in 2020 we experienced a year of constipation and confusion. The pace of construction slowed down and many/most ground breakings were put on hold.

Originally Posted by Arapahoe

XD2 wont be ready until late 2023 according to the X Co. website.

This makes sense given the number of stories, the overall size and complexity of the project.

I actually have no idea if any of the projects named will be done this year. I hedged my bet by suggesting "nearing completion."

Originally Posted by TakeFive

Only two projects come to mind that are near completion: The Fitzgerald and The Citizen.

So the obvious question that pops up is "what is the current state of rents and vacancy in Denver?"

Apartment Construction Rates in Denver Down by 46% Compared to Last Year
August 19, 2021 - Mile High CRE

Note: this is comparing 2021 to 2020 as the date indicates.

Apartment construction rates in Denver Metro are down by 46% compared to last year.

• Denver Metro is expected to add 5,581 new units on the market by the end of the year, almost half of the apartments delivered in 2020.
• At the city level, the Mile High City is expected to add a total of 3,363 new units, being the main contender in the metro’s apartment projections. In the first half of the year, around 2,300 apartments were completed.

Fortunately (in a way) the population growth of Denver/metro also slowed down last year.

Denver rents continue to skyrocket, mirroring those of pricey East Coast cities
Oct. 26, 2021 By Kyle Harris/Denverite

Rent prices have shot up in Denver and in most of the country.

This was in effect the bounce-back from the pandemic blues.

Denver’s more like a hot East Coast market than other Mountain West cities.

Big cities throughout the Mountain West, including Boise, Salt Lake City and Phoenix, have followed the national trends with quickly rising prices, while Denver, which saw a huge dip in prices at the beginning of the pandemic, is now breaking records with all-time highs.

------------------

Originally Posted by laniroj

Tech certainly is raging and drives much of this apartment development because it brings the high paying jobs and has the halo effect of creating more high paying jobs which ultimately occupy these buildings.

With the rental market remaining relatively tight, it looks like developers are in the Cat Bird Seat with respect to getting a good return.

It's possible that with the opening of new projects in the latter part of last year that they are still in process of 'renting up' but with only the Fitzgerald and The Citizen apartments opening soon it would appear that the rental market will remain tight for some time.

[TakeFive]

.. .. .. ..

Originally Posted by bunt_q

Do we still have Republicans in Colorado? My my, I had forgotten. I think the bill will have exactly what the majority wants it to have; nothing more, nothing less. There is no need to compromise anymore.

Given what I've read about the Republican stronghold of El Paso County where the Trump acolytes run rampant and where their focus is more on eating their own, yes, it doesn't appear that they are yet capable of put forth a cogent message for the wider electorate.

I don't know the specifics of their so-called pro-growth position but guessing it's more free market anti-limiting of growth (including sprawl).

Originally Posted by bunt_q

I suspect this money will all go to the couple areas that have affordability problems and who have shovel-ready projects that don't make other democrats mad (i.e. 50 units projects roughly 20 miles outside of resort towns - close enough that service workers (brown democrats) can get in, but far enough that wealthier residents (white democrats) do not have to have them nearby). And maybe some in Adams County.

Given this is state allocated money I did guess they'd want to spread the love around to include resorts as well as outlying towns.

That said, you have to believe the 'metro' area will see their share of funds and since it's for 'designated affordable' housing that shouldn't be a problem to spend but Adams County may well get a nice boost from this.

This was a definite head-scratcher

Originally Posted by bunt_q

Also, $40 million for an "innovative housing incentive program that will support the prefabricated housing industry, from mobile home construction to 3D printing and other technologies that can speed up construction while lowering the cost" is the stupidest thing I have ever heard. It's very Polis. A man who literally is the bureaucracy that causes the problems he wants to solve, but who still thinks that sprinkling in a little tech can solve everything. It's like if Elon Musk became President. The manufactured housing industry does not have any problems other than being allowed to deploy their products! Which we will never, ever allow at scale.

Well said!

[gopokes21]

Originally Posted by midwestcowboy

As a new-ish Denverite, I have a question:

I was on a run yesterday and found myself entering the parking lots between Blake and the RR tracks at 33rd street (I assume these are Rockies lots). I proceeded to run all the way down to Park Ave, and the amount of empty space there just blew me away.

Has there ever been a realistic proposal for that area? It seems as if the footprint of the Larimer/Walnut/Blake could almost be doubled with development there. Gameday parking could likely be solved with the construction of one or two additional parking garages adjacent to the stadium.

And it would make for a really interesting (alluring even) linear TOD if RTD added a station at Broadway/Brighton.

However, no those lots have been off-limits forever. I would assume the Rockies themselves will play a big role in their redevelopment someday, akin to McGregor Square.

[gopokes21]

Originally Posted by TakeFive

Yes, despite substantial neighborhood opposition, the DCC approved a redevelopment plan of the old CDOT HQ site off Colorado Blvd back in January of 2018. The problem here is Kentro Group is waiting in line to receive LIHTC's for the agreed to affordable housing. They were passed over again in November with the latest round of LIHTC awards.

Actually, the State's reports show the applicant as some Lexton McDermott group, different than Kentro.

[Arapahoe]

New, very tall, Arapahoe Square Development in the works!

I received a notification that an assemblage of 8 lots off of Lawrence and 21st St. went under contract. This is the other side of 21st Street from Kenect/XD2/and Point 21, and directly across Lawrence from the 2020 Lawrence apartments. (small buildings and parking lot)

When I looked up in epermits, I found this description:
"Assemblage of 8 commercial lots. 36 story mixed use project. 180 unit apartment/condo, 300 unit hotel building with 20,000 sf of ground floor retail and 400 parking spaces."

36 stories means a point tower! The AS-20+ zoning only allows that kind of height with max 10,000 sq ft floor plate and then it can go upwards of 30 stories to max 375 ft. The other towers to be built (XD2,Kenect) are 22 stories maxing out the zoning at 250 ft for a non-point tower.

So now we are talking three towers within a few 100 feet of each other.

[Robert.hampton]

Originally Posted by Arapahoe

New, very tall, Arapahoe Square Development in the works!

I received a notification that an assemblage of 8 lots off of Lawrence and 21st St. went under contract. This is the other side of 21st Street from Kenect/XD2/and Point 21, and directly across Lawrence from the 2020 Lawrence apartments. (small buildings and parking lot)

When I looked up in epermits, I found this description:
"Assemblage of 8 commercial lots. 36 story mixed use project. 180 unit apartment/condo, 300 unit hotel building with 20,000 sf of ground floor retail and 400 parking spaces."

36 stories means a point tower! The AS-20+ zoning only allows that kind of height with max 10,000 sq ft floor plate and then it can go upwards of 30 stories to max 375 ft. The other towers to be built (XD2,Kenect) are 22 stories maxing out the zoning at 250 ft for a non-point tower.

So now we are talking three towers within a few 100 feet of each other.

Finally A Square starting to take off.

[Arapahoe]

Originally Posted by Robert.hampton

Finally A Square starting to take off.

when I dug into to the epermit for that land a bit deeper, that 36 story tower concept for the lot looks stale in that it hasn't been updated since 2020. Might be a vapor-concept, marketing ploy by the seller. In any case, somebody bit.

[laniroj]

Originally Posted by Arapahoe

when I dug into to the epermit for that land a bit deeper, that 36 story tower concept for the lot looks stale in that it hasn't been updated since 2020. Might be a vapor-concept, marketing ploy by the seller. In any case, somebody bit.

The good ole Buzz Geller black magic trick. Seems to be a pretty fail-proof strategy for him!

[wong21fr]

Originally Posted by Arapahoe

when I dug into to the epermit for that land a bit deeper, that 36 story tower concept for the lot looks stale in that it hasn't been updated since 2020. Might be a vapor-concept, marketing ploy by the seller. In any case, somebody bit.

DenverInfill did a post on this project back in 2020. Says it was a conversation starter with the city about what a rezoning could look like:

https://denverinfill.com/2020/03/36-story-tower-planned-for-2099-lawrence.html

[TakeFive]

Interesting!

Originally Posted by gopokes21

Actually, the State's reports show the applicant as some Lexton McDermott group, different than Kentro.

So this would be the affordable project developer then; the McDermott name rings a bell, Lexton not.

[Agent Orange]

Excited to see all the Arapahoe Square action (even if the point tower discussed fizzles out thanks to Buzz Geller's denial fetish.) Would love to see the city get a head start in planting street trees in this area ahead of the inevitable development wave to make this area a nicer neighborhood. This area feels extremely barren but greenery would go a long way to making it a pleasant neighborhood in the future. Not to mention that it'd help a bit with urban heat island effect by at least giving some shade to pedestrians.

[laniroj]

Originally Posted by Agent Orange

Excited to see all the Arapahoe Square action (even if the point tower discussed fizzles out thanks to Buzz Geller's denial fetish.) Would love to see the city get a head start in planting street trees in this area ahead of the inevitable development wave to make this area a nicer neighborhood. This area feels extremely barren but greenery would go a long way to making it a pleasant neighborhood in the future. Not to mention that it'd help a bit with urban heat island effect by at least giving some shade to pedestrians.

I have long advocated that if the City could buy a whole or half block in AS, it would prime AS for incredibly fast development. I could envision 5 30-40 story 300+ unit apartment towers surrounding the periphery of a park like this. It would cost tens of millions but the payback (new tax revenues) would likely only be about 15 years - incredibly fast by municipal standards. It's too bad Cities sometimes don't think like for-profit entities. Having a real AS park would also make downtown a much more family friendly place to live - one of downtown's greatest downfalls. Lawson Park is great, but Broadway is a hard barrier that completely disconnects Lawson from AS, not to mention the homeless and transitory presence seemingly omni-present in that area.

[Arapahoe]

Originally Posted by wong21fr

DenverInfill did a post on this project back in 2020. Says it was a conversation starter with the city about what a rezoning could look like:

https://denverinfill.com/2020/03/36-story-tower-planned-for-2099-lawrence.html

Thanks! Will keep my eye on this parcel and see what gets submitted now that the land is changing hands. Hopefully not a buy and sit investor. Would love a point tower but anything beats the parking lots on 21st Street.

[jhwk]

Originally Posted by laniroj

I have long advocated that if the City could buy a whole or half block in AS, it would prime AS for incredibly fast development. I could envision 5 30-40 story 300+ unit apartment towers surrounding the periphery of a park like this. It would cost tens of millions but the payback (new tax revenues) would likely only be about 15 years - incredibly fast by municipal standards. It's too bad Cities sometimes don't think like for-profit entities. Having a real AS park would also make downtown a much more family friendly place to live - one of downtown's greatest downfalls. Lawson Park is great, but Broadway is a hard barrier that completely disconnects Lawson from AS, not to mention the homeless and transitory presence seemingly omni-present in that area.

The federal government (GSA) owns two large parcels on the two blocks between California, Welton, 21st, and 22nd. It looks like they use them for vehicle repair. Seems like a good place to start.

[wong21fr]

Utility crews were at 1900 Lawrence doing disconnects. Project keeps on moving forward.

[Arapahoe]

Originally Posted by jhwk

The federal government (GSA) owns two large parcels on the two blocks between California, Welton, 21st, and 22nd. It looks like they use them for vehicle repair. Seems like a good place to start.

YES! Also let's get the 5280 trail built on 21st St, originally it was slated to be the first section to get built, now golden triangle is getting the first section. Probably cuz we have the worst council person in all of recorded history.